Found hairs that aren't mine.

[Pequeen1]

I think this is just one more confirmation that, as others have posited, he’s not going to change for anyone. If it were me and my sexual relationship with my wife was on the line, I’d be lining the damn pills up on the counter so she could see I’m taking them every day. But if he’s been divorced 3 times prior, I’m guessing he’s not changing for anyone at this point (not even to have sex with his wife). He’s not afraid of divorce.

 

It may not be a dealbreaker on its own, but I’d suspect that this should be one more factor in your decision-making. He’s making it clear that you take him or leave him, as-is. And his actions back up his words.

 

At this point I’m definitely leaning towards the opinion that you may not need much more proof of anything. He’s handed you what would be an unacceptable situation in my mind, with positive proof that it ain’t gonna change. You are still young; you could have an entire second life after him.

 

Ironic. I’ve always said the same thing about the medication. If it were me on the other side of this them I would be going out of my way to make sure he saw me take the meds and to earn trust back....especially if he had told me to my face that’s what was needed.

 

I’ve been home a few hours...he took care of dishes I purposely left in the sink and did laundry.

 

And I don’t know that he’s doing anything so proof is moot. But I agree he’s not going to change.

[Pequeen1]

Absolutely. It it was me, I would be doing exactly what was required to change the situation. So far, he has shown you with his actions that he is perfectly fine with the status quo.

 

The day that I have to plant a camera in my bedroom to monitor my husband's actions is the day that I know for sure that my marriage is dead.

 

People breathe new life into marriages all the time. I have been taking the time to decide if that’s something that is possible and if it’s something i could want.

 

The fact that he’s heard me say what I want and need from him and concerns I have and has done nothing to move towards addressing them is eye opening.

[standtall]

If your in the US...any state..., using a camera in the bedroom without the other parties consent is a criminal act. Be careful here.

[MJJean]

How are you, Prequeen? Processing, please wait?

Edited November 13, 2017 by MJJean

[Pequeen1]

He doesn't think you will do anything.

 

I'd move out...and file for divorce to see if he actually gets motivated to start participating in the marriage.

 

IF he doesn't then you have your answer.

 

Do you work? Do you have money set aside or access to money?

 

I know he doesn’t think I will.

 

 

I work, yes. I’m a middle school health and physical education teacher. Yes I have money set aside and am continually adding to it.

[Pequeen1]

How are you, Prequeen? Processing, please wait?

 

A lot on my mind

[PegNosePete]

People breathe new life into marriages all the time.

People... yes. Your husband... no.

 

It takes 2 to tango. You can't breathe life into the marriage all on your own. He has to be an active participant in the process. But he has shown you loud and clear that he is not going to breathe anything into anything.

 

The fact that he’s heard me say what I want and need from him and concerns I have and has done nothing to move towards addressing them is eye opening.

Couldn't have said it better myself.

 

Time to file for divorce. You're just wasting the rest of your life.

[elaine567]

I think you are wasting time too, he is 60 not 16, the time for spontaneous "change" is long past.

He likes the way things are and sees no need to change, he only changed his tactics temporarily in order to trap you, classic bait and switch, now I guess he thinks you are going nowhere so why would he need to bother changing anything?

[HiCrunchy]

Boy - this is a match up that really has all the statistical odds stacked against you.

 

NINETY THREE - 93%!! of all fourth marriages end in divorce. If someone says "I do" and promises to love and cherish FOREVER - four times over - well that shows you that those words, and their commitment, and their ability to make sound decisions on the matter are seriously lacking.

 

Then add a 27 year age gap? Boy the bookies would be paying out if a marriage like this lasted till death do us part.

 

Your odds are somewhere around 5 in a 100 for this to actually work out. Add a husband who won't communicate and isn't willing to put in the work.... Make that 99 to 1.

 

How much more of your life are you going to give to this failing endeavor?

 

I think you really need to look this over OP. Recent change made a very good point.

 

I have seen so many relationships and marriages end over sillier things, I think you have fought long and hard for your marriage.

You can do much much much better than an old man, that treats you like you're garbage.

 

You don't need to proof to be honest. His treatment of you is enough grounds for the divorce.

 

Best of luck to you.

[Pequeen1]

I think you really need to look this over OP. Recent change made a very good point.

 

I have seen so many relationships and marriages end over sillier things, I think you have fought long and hard for your marriage.

You can do much much much better than an old man, that treats you like you're garbage.

 

You don't need to proof to be honest. His treatment of you is enough grounds for the divorce.

 

Best of luck to you.

 

Was definitely interesting to see these stats. It helps to hear someone say I’ve fought for my marriage....

[Pequeen1]

Another check in the box.....

 

Last night my 6 year old told me girls do everything. I told him his uncle had just made dinner but he told me I had helped. Basically told me that it’s girls jobs to do everything and take care of everyone. We had a chat after that....felt like a bandaid but I asked him to elaborate. Told him that we’re a team and no one gets to sit around and he told me something along the lines of Dad does. Wow.....wheels are turning here.

[MJJean]

Another check in the box.....

 

Last night my 6 year old told me girls do everything. I told him his uncle had just made dinner but he told me I had helped. Basically told me that it’s girls jobs to do everything and take care of everyone. We had a chat after that....felt like a bandaid but I asked him to elaborate. Told him that we’re a team and no one gets to sit around and he told me something along the lines of Dad does. Wow.....wheels are turning here.

 

My kids are 24, 19, and 16. Hindsight being 20/20, it's not anywhere near what you say and so much what you do and what they observe that forms them.

[BaileyB]

Another check in the box.....

 

Last night my 6 year old told me girls do everything. I told him his uncle had just made dinner but he told me I had helped. Basically told me that it’s girls jobs to do everything and take care of everyone. We had a chat after that....felt like a bandaid but I asked him to elaborate. Told him that we’re a team and no one gets to sit around and he told me something along the lines of Dad does. Wow.....wheels are turning here.

 

Kids are not stupid. They watch everything...

 

A child's strongest role model is the same sex parent. Knowing this, you have to ask yourself - what are your boys learning from your husband? What kind of men do you want them to be?

 

My boyfriend was in a very unhappy and unhealthy marriage. His son was 8 when they divorced. He was a single dad for four years before we started dating. We have a great relationship - we do things with/for each other, we laugh and play together, we respect each other... One day, early in our relationship, my boyfriend said to me "I'm so excited to have the opportunity to show my son what it is to have a healthy relationship because, he has never seen that before..." It still warms my heart, because he was so sincere.

 

It is so important. It changes their understanding of relationships.

Edited November 14, 2017 by BaileyB

[Pequeen1]

My kids are 24, 19, and 16. Hindsight being 20/20, it's not anywhere near what you say and so much what you do and what they observe that forms them.

 

Actions definitely speak louder than words.

[Pequeen1]

Kids are not stupid. They watch everything...

 

A child's strongest role model is the same sex parent. Knowing this, you have to ask yourself - what are your boys learning from your husband? What kind of men do you want them to be?

 

My boyfriend was in a very unhappy and unhealthy marriage. His son was 8 when they divorced. He was a single dad for four years before we started dating. We have a great relationship - we do things with/for each other, we laugh and play together, we respect each other... One day, early in our relationship, my boyfriend said to me "I'm so excited to have the opportunity to show my son what it is to have a healthy relationship because, he has never seen that before..." It still warms my heart, because he was so sincere.

 

It is so important. It changes their understanding of relationships.

 

Honestly one of my big fears is what things would be like if they were spending their time split between households. I don’t have a lot of confidence in how things would go at dads house and the things they would do and see. He lets them do whatever they want, he gives them what they want and he pays little attention to things like balanced meals most of the time. He lets them sit in front of a screen because it’s easy, he’s never taken them to the park or out for an activity. What would they learn during their time with him?!!! If same sex parent is role model then that would not be a better situation.

[BaileyB]

Honestly one of my big fears is what things would be like if they were spending their time split between households. I don’t have a lot of confidence in how things would go at dads house and the things they would do and see. He lets them do whatever they want, he gives them what they want and he pays little attention to things like balanced meals most of the time. He lets them sit in front of a screen because it’s easy, he’s never taken them to the park or out for an activity. What would they learn during their time with him?!!! If same sex parent is role model then that would not be a better situation.

 

I hear that and I understand your concern.

 

I will offer you my experience... my boyfriend's ex-wife has some mental health issues. In her home, there are no boundaries, his son does whatever he wants - he stays up until whatever time he wants to go to bed and plays video games most of the time he is there. She doesn't often take him out, she does not cook, she keeps him home from school when she is anxious and feeling unwell...

 

At his father's home, there are expectations - he is always at school on time, he is required to do his homework, he must help with the cleaning, he has a bedtime, he doesn't get to buy anything he wants... but, they do many things together and they have a lot of fun together.

 

Where does the child like to stay? My boyfriends home. He likes the structure and the expectations. He also has fun with his dad and he enjoys being at his house. Recently, he has started to vocalize that he would prefer to stay, he doesn't want to go to his mother's home. This makes us sad, for him and his mom. But, it's the reality of the situation. He is old enough now to say where he would like to live, he just doesn't realize this yet. Next year, he will start high school and the school is close to his dad's house. We are expecting that he will want to stay at his dad's more often, particularly as he begins to realize (which he already has) that his mom is not well. He has had no difficulty accepting me in the home because it's a happy, healthy, and stable home. He is gravitating toward that... which is why I say, kids know more than we think they know. They will understand the situation for what it is and you can't protect them from that... you can only help them to learn to deal with it.

[CautiouslyOptimistic]

Honestly one of my big fears is what things would be like if they were spending their time split between households. I don’t have a lot of confidence in how things would go at dads house and the things they would do and see. He lets them do whatever they want, he gives them what they want and he pays little attention to things like balanced meals most of the time. He lets them sit in front of a screen because it’s easy, he’s never taken them to the park or out for an activity. What would they learn during their time with him?!!! If same sex parent is role model then that would not be a better situation.

 

Are you sure that he's even going to want shared custody?

[Pequeen1]

Are you sure that he's even going to want shared custody?

 

He says all the time how they are his world. I’m sure that he will fight to have shared custody. Whether or not the reality of that will sit well with him is something else entirely.

[Pequeen1]

I hear that and I understand your concern.

 

I will offer you my experience... my boyfriend's ex-wife has some mental health issues. In her home, there are no boundaries, his son does whatever he wants - he stays up until whatever time he wants to go to bed and plays video games most of the time he is there. She doesn't often take him out, she does not cook, she keeps him home from school when she is anxious and feeling unwell...

 

At his father's home, there are expectations - he is always at school on time, he is required to do his homework, he must help with the cleaning, he has a bedtime, he doesn't get to buy anything he wants... but, they do many things together and they have a lot of fun together.

 

Where does the child like to stay? My boyfriends home. He likes the structure and the expectations. He also has fun with his dad and he enjoys being at his house. Recently, he has started to vocalize that he would prefer to stay, he doesn't want to go to his mother's home. This makes us sad, for him and his mom. But, it's the reality of the situation. He is old enough now to say where he would like to live, he just doesn't realize this yet. Next year, he will start high school and the school is close to his dad's house. We are expecting that he will want to stay at his dad's more often, particularly as he begins to realize (which he already has) that his mom is not well. He has had no difficulty accepting me in the home because it's a happy, healthy, and stable home. He is gravitating toward that... which is why I say, kids know more than we think they know. They will understand the situation for what it is and you can't protect them from that... you can only help them to learn to deal with it.

 

There are definite guidelines at home, expectations that my kids know. Please don’t think that my kids run rodshod. They are 6 and 3 and have appropriate chores and have expectations that they follow. The oldest is very rule oriented and will ask for reassurance that he’s meeting expectations.

[Pequeen1]

Talk is cheap. He has no action so I doubt he will make effort on his own to care for them if he sees them for even a day or two.

 

Offer daytime visitation.

 

You seem to be throwing up roadblocks - why aren't you willing to take action that changes things?

 

Not roadblocks...being realistic and fair. I have no interest in trying to destroy him.

[Pequeen1]

I don’t make snap decisions...that’s not just me. I analyze all angles and prepare. Just because I’m not going for the throat and walking away doesn’t mean I am not processing and looking at the situation as a whole as well as in minute detail.

[BaileyB]

There are definite guidelines at home, expectations that my kids know. Please don’t think that my kids run rodshod. They are 6 and 3 and have appropriate chores and have expectations that they follow. The oldest is very rule oriented and will ask for reassurance that he’s meeting expectations.

 

No, you didn't understand. I was saying that IF, you divorce your husband and he gets joint custody... IF there are no rules in HIS home as you have implied would be the situation, they may not like or respect that at all... They may actually prefer to stay with you because you will have expectations, you will do things with them, and with you, they will have a happy and stable home.

 

That was my point. No disrespect was intended.

[Pequeen1]

No, you didn't understand. I was saying that IF, you divorce your husband and he gets joint custody... IF there are no rules in HIS home as you have implied would be the situation, they may not like or respect that at all... They may actually prefer to stay with you because you will have expectations, you will do things with them, and with you, they will have a happy and stable home.

 

That was my point. No disrespect was intended.

 

I believe you are right and they would prefer to be with me. Also the fact that both still wake up in middle of the night and come find me would lend itself to that assumption as well.

[BaileyB]

I believe you are right and they would prefer to be with me. Also the fact that both still wake up in middle of the night and come find me would lend itself to that assumption as well.

 

If I may, the flip side of that coin may be...

 

IF you chose to stay and continue as such, they will learn that their father is a lazy, disrespectful man AND that their mother allows this unhealthy home life to continue... that she lacks the self worth and self respect to leave.

 

You may think that your ability to talk and explain how things are not good and how they "should" be is enough... but actions speak far louder than words. If things "should not be this way" - if Dad "should not behave this way..." then why do you allow this behavior to continue? That's what they will want to know, in a few more years.

 

They probably won't appreciate the personal sacrifice you are making - they will be angry that you BOTH created an unhappy and unhealthy home for them.

 

My boyfriend thought about staying until his son was older, but decided that he deserved to be happy and he wanted to teach his son what it was to be a good man, a good partner, a good father... He understood that there was nothing to respect about staying in an unhappy home thinking it was "in the best interest of his son." It was difficult to leave, but they are both happier now than they were during the marriage.

 

Eventually, you will get to the point where leaving is not as difficult as staying.

[road]

 

My boyfriend thought about staying until his son was older, but decided that he deserved to be happy and he wanted to teach his son what it was to be a good man, a good partner, a good father... He understood that there was nothing to respect about staying in an unhappy home thinking it was "in the best interest of his son." It was difficult to leave, but they are both happier now than they were during the marriage.

 

 

It can be also said that the dad taught the son that the vows where

it mentions "in sickness and.....: that part can be ignored.