xOW - an update I guess

[Poppy47]

That's really it in a nutshell isn't it? Sometimes I wonder if these guys have some kind of "vulnerable woman" radar. I remember mine asked me once why I didn't have a "spark". I wasn't sure what he was talking about but I found it kind of insulting. Later Blues said something along the same lines here that stuck with me - that he and men like him could zero in on a good target in a room filled with people, because women like us don't "glow".

 

I guess when a woman is happy and in a good relationship there is a spark or glow about her that lets men know she's unavailable. My theory anyway. Not being a man, I don't really understand.

 

UNfortunately, Jah, not everyone has the very good fortune of glowing with well being from a happy relationship as you were told.

 

It's also unfortunate that somebody doesn't inform us that we make prime targets for some men.

 

I had just lost my husband of many years to Alzheimers. I had been his carer for 10 years prior to that. It almost defeated me and it must have been very visible.

 

Hind sight is a wonderful tool.... if only it were foresight, Jah.

 

Season's Wishes,

 

Poppy.

[BaileyB]

UNfortunately, Jah, not everyone has the very good fortune of glowing with well being from a happy relationship as you were told.

 

It's also unfortunate that somebody doesn't inform us that we make prime targets for some men.

 

I had just lost my husband of many years to Alzheimers. I had been his carer for 10 years prior to that. It almost defeated me and it must have been very visible.

 

Hind sight is a wonderful tool.... if only it were foresight, Jah.

 

Season's Wishes,

 

Poppy.

 

I'm sorry Poppy.

 

I feel like it's the same for Serendipity. With the death of her husband, she was vulnerable and he recognized that and took advantage.

 

I remember how empty and lost I felt after my mother's illness and death... It's so easy to lose yourself and lose your joy, your hope for the future, your belief in all that is good and right after you've suffered a great tragedy.

[DKT3]

UNfortunately, Jah, not everyone has the very good fortune of glowing with well being from a happy relationship as you were told.

 

It's also unfortunate that somebody doesn't inform us that we make prime targets for some men.

 

I had just lost my husband of many years to Alzheimers. I had been his carer for 10 years prior to that. It almost defeated me and it must have been very visible.

 

Hind sight is a wonderful tool.... if only it were foresight, Jah.

 

Season's Wishes,

 

Poppy.

It's no magic trick, it's about boundaries. A guy will do something that should gain him an F off response, instead he get met with acceptance so he push again and again until you're in his bed.

 

Stand up married men never make those attempts so other women and married other women get stuck with scumbag MM who are looking for something outside of the marriage.

[Marc878]

You're on a merry go round and refuse to get off.

 

Maybe one day you'll wake up and figure out how much of your life you wasted on this but it is your life.

 

No one will care much except you in the end.

[jah526]

UNfortunately, Jah, not everyone has the very good fortune of glowing with well being from a happy relationship as you were told.

 

It's also unfortunate that somebody doesn't inform us that we make prime targets for some men.

 

I had just lost my husband of many years to Alzheimers. I had been his carer for 10 years prior to that. It almost defeated me and it must have been very visible.

 

Hind sight is a wonderful tool.... if only it were foresight, Jah.

 

Season's Wishes,

 

Poppy.

 

Yes, my mom was dying from cancer when I got involved with MM. His wife was pregnant and refusing him sex. I think he saw an opportunity and exploited it.

 

It makes me sad now that someone could be that heartless.

 

I guess we are a bit wiser now. I'm making a conscious effort these days to remove toxic people from my life and be around those that have my best interests at heart.

 

Wishing you a Merry Christmas, and better times ahead...

[sandylee1]

The problem is that you believe every bit of nonsense he says.

 

He's not a good man. Not by a long shot. He's telling you he'd be able to have a better marriage without you around...that you prevent his connection with his wife and that he refuses sex with her because of you.

 

I'm just wondering what goes through your mind when he says this? Especially the last point.

 

Assuming it's true.. imagine recently having a baby...hormones all over the place..... possibly still trying to lose the pregnancy weight and your husband knocks you back.... doing that when she may well be feeling insecure....and unattractive... what kind of man does that?

 

People like him have no business getting married.

[freengreen]

Serendipity,

 

Please.... if you can OPEN your eyes. You seem to be kind of innocent and he is very cunning. It is not going to end good on your side ( he hasnt got mercy), he will bleed every drop of you dry if you let him. You have a child, dont be foolish and get off the wagon to never look back. I really dont know what will ‘click’ this message into you...

 

Stay safe and keep your child safe

[Grey Cloud]

I just don’t buy for a second the whole no sex thing with his wife out of some so called loyalty for the AP. His wife who he has had a relationship with for 12 years comes on to him and he refuses to have sex? I don’t think so!

 

Serendipity - I have to agree with Imsosad. You are caught up in posting direct quotes of what your MM has said and analyse the meaning behind it. You’ve mentioned a couple of times now that your MM had told his best friend about the affair like it has some hidden meaning he is about to become more open about you. My xMM told his best mate as well and it means absolutely nothing!! He knew his friend wouldn’t tell and his mate was also cheating on his wife (found this out later!).

 

Also my xMM reacted similarly over a pregnancy scare and later admitted “it’s just something I can’t control”. He couldn’t control the situation if I was pregnant nor could he ever talk his way out of that with his wife! It’s all about self preservation.

 

I know it’s difficult to think rationally when you are in the middle of it all but from an outsider looking in its very obvious. You are attaching meaning to his words when there is none there in the first place. The reason why he contradicts himself is because he can’t even remember what he has told you or the lies he has told.

 

One day you will look back (as I do on my affair) and know it all meant nothing to him - just a bit of fun on the side. All this talk about who loves who more is irrelevant and again you are giving it meaning when there is none there - he is never ever going to leave his wife. You are not his first OW and you definitely won’t be the last!

Edited December 24, 2017 by Grey Cloud

[jjgitties]

OP, your back story and the "creepy" thing you picked up on. It could be you are in an affair with a psychopath. If you can't control yourself you should do everything you can not to let your child near this person. Because it's not his child, he may very well do something that a parent would never do. just my 2 cents.

 

Psychopath Definition May Be Different Than You Thought: 7 Facts About Psychopaths

 

There are many that are not violent in the way mass media portray them.

[Poppy47]

It's no magic trick, it's about boundaries. A guy will do something that should gain him an F off response, instead he get met with acceptance so he push again and again until you're in his bed.

 

Stand up married men never make those attempts so other women and married other women get stuck with scumbag MM who are looking for something outside of the marriage.

 

Hmm I wonder if this poster has ever been overtaken by an experience that took every part of the life he/she knew before and was left totally alone in the world???

 

Poppy.

[Poppy47]

OP, your back story and the "creepy" thing you picked up on. It could be you are in an affair with a psychopath. If you can't control yourself you should do everything you can not to let your child near this person. Because it's not his child, he may very well do something that a parent would never do. just my 2 cents.

 

Psychopath Definition May Be Different Than You Thought: 7 Facts About Psychopaths

 

There are many that are not violent in the way mass media portray them.

 

JJ

I agree with you. I have read that a great number of MM who cheat are narcissists or psychopaths. The personality disorder robs them of any conscience.

POppy.

[DKT3]

Hmm I wonder if this poster has ever been overtaken by an experience that took every part of the life he/she knew before and was left totally alone in the world???

 

Poppy.

 

A cardiologist doesn't have to experience a heart defect to understand what it is and how to fix it. I'm not saying I'm Dr Infidelity, but the bottom line is people get themselves into situation by making decisions. Of course you can blame others and other things but at the end of the day YOU made the decision and could have just as easily not made those choices.

[jah526]

A cardiologist doesn't have to experience a heart defect to understand what it is and how to fix it. I'm not saying I'm Dr Infidelity, but the bottom line is people get themselves into situation by making decisions. Of course you can blame others and other things but at the end of the day YOU made the decision and could have just as easily not made those choices.

 

True. However... these guys dangle friendship and empathy and a shoulder to cry on as bait, and if you are in a vulnerable position it's hard to resist. Then once they've got you hooked they start putting the pressure on. These guys are extremely good at manipulation. They are con men. Everyone has been conned at some point in their lives, and you look back and you say, wow, what an idiot I was. The important thing is that you got away from it and whether or not you learned from it.

[Poppy47]

True. However... these guys dangle friendship and empathy and a shoulder to cry on as bait, and if you are in a vulnerable position it's hard to resist. Then once they've got you hooked they start putting the pressure on. These guys are extremely good at manipulation. They are con men. Everyone has been conned at some point in their lives, and you look back and you say, wow, what an idiot I was. The important thing is that you got away from it and whether or not you learned from it.

 

Grief and difficult circumstances do not allow for perfection in judgement. That is being human Jah. It is all very well for others to rabbit on about making decisions. At some points in life, we just F... U because the decision making process is temporarily broken.

 

I am the first to say Mea Culpa and I messed up.

 

Did I get away? You bet I have. Complete NC forever.

 

Did I learn? You bet I did. I learned about Narcissism and how it can destroy lives and people. Con people are everywhere, always on the prowl, looking for a small weakness that can be of benefit to them.

 

Poppy.

[DKT3]

True. However... these guys dangle friendship and empathy and a shoulder to cry on as bait, and if you are in a vulnerable position it's hard to resist. Then once they've got you hooked they start putting the pressure on. These guys are extremely good at manipulation. They are con men. Everyone has been conned at some point in their lives, and you look back and you say, wow, what an idiot I was. The important thing is that you got away from it and whether or not you learned from it.

 

That feeling you got when you knew things weren't right we're feelings you should have listened to. Con men or not, you were equipped to handle it but choose to ignore and stay. OP is at that point herself, NOW she is ignoring it, as do all OW/MW who continue down that path. Yes, women, in general are more likely to be emotionally driven, but never a slave to those emotions..

 

Sure, these guys aren't world class, but doesn't the fact that they are willing to cheat with you kinda clue you in to that fact? Women always have options, too many just aren't open to or willing to see them.

[wmacbride]

JJ

I agree with you. I have read that a great number of MM who cheat are narcissists or psychopaths. The personality disorder robs them of any conscience.

POppy.

 

I think that's quite an extreme view, and likley not the case.

 

Most mm are not psychopaths or narcissists. While a few may be, most are just like the rest of us, flawed humans being that tend to screw up from time to time.

 

Those that can keep an affair going for years are another story.

[jjgitties]

I think that's quite an extreme view, and likley not the case.

 

Most mm are not psychopaths or narcissists. While a few may be, most are just like the rest of us, flawed humans being that tend to screw up from time to time.

 

Those that can keep an affair going for years are another story.

I don't think the guy is a psychopath because he is a MM. He's a psychopath for intentionally targeting an emotionally vulnerable woman to get some pussy on the side. A normal mind in a male would show some sort of human empathy and understanding and, if he actually cared or loved or found the woman attractive as a human, would step back and realize this is not a good time in this persons life to put moves on her and come on to them.

 

It's kind of like being with a very drunk woman and taking advantage. A normal mind would step back and say this is obviously not consensual given the fact that she is **** faced drunk. I should not try to stick my dick in her.

 

but anyways, the point of my post is. i cant pass judgement on OP and her choice of mate. but it sounds like OP has a kid. so, if the back story of what she posted is true, then this guy does not sound like he has a healthy brain IMO and she might want to find ways to keep her child aware from him. a person that has no empathy towards a woman he is in an affair with probably has no empathy towards the child.

Edited December 24, 2017 by jjgitties

[Poppy47]

I think that's quite an extreme view, and likley not the case.

 

Most mm are not psychopaths or narcissists. While a few may be, most are just like the rest of us, flawed humans being that tend to screw up from time to time.

 

Those that can keep an affair going for years are another story.

 

They are the ones I was referring to.

Poppy.

[elaine567]

The big problem with all this "I was vulnerable", "He is a psychopath" is that defence falls down on one simple fact.

He is married.

That is not usually something that is withheld, all participants know from the start.

They also often know that he has no intention of leaving his wife either, so any pleas of "innocence" and being "manipulated", seem a bit disingenuous...

 

It is not rocket science.

Married, would be Lothario makes a play, woman shuts him down. End of.

But, no that doesn't happen and out come all the justifications for why it ended up the way it did.

 

It is not as if such married men are working under the radar, that no-one is aware of the games they play and that all are surprised, shocked and stunned to find out he is a cad and a rotter...

Is there not a old joke about "my wife doesn't understand me" whilst he chases anything in a skirt who is willing.

So I really do not get why women get so involved in the first place, unless they have an agenda of their own.

 

Serendipity has played for a long time at "getting rid", but it is never really successful as I guess she wants this man for herself, and I guess she is willing to play the long game.

[imsosad]

OP, I thought I'd add one more point.

You and MM are not together in this. Your expereinces are xompletely different.

For instance, while periods of NC are torture and heartbreak to you, they are part of the fun and drama for him.

He's not really scared he will lose you, so for him it's a cycle of contact/no contact. The periods of NC are just a build up for breaking it.

He is in this for the thrill, so all the things that make you miserable- the secrecy, the sneaking around, the instability, the tear filled conversations, the lack of commitment- are making him high.

NC is hard for you, but it's fun for him, because it's melodramatic. It's part of the thrill.

Please understand that while this is very real, meaningful,important and heartfelt for you, it is his fun and games.

Also, there is really no way he and his wife are not having sex because he feels committed to you.

Not happening.

Big, fat, manipulative lie.

Yes, I know there are sexless marriages, but this couple has a toddler and a baby, right? They're having sex, and as it seems she's doing most of the childcare and is probably exhausted, I'd go out on a limb and guess he's initiating most of it.

OP, you have suffered a terrible tragedy, but you have been married. You have a child. You have a carreer. You have an extended family and friends. You have yourself.

Is this married man, father of 2 small children, really standing between you and your happiness? Do you really need him to be happy?

[Serendipity55]

I do want to leave it behind now - I just don't like to feel that I meant nothing or was a bit of fun. It hasn't been fun for either of us.

 

He has messaged me again just now..."Merry Xmas Eve. I wish I could see you today and spend time with you. This year has been special, looking forward to next year too".

 

I know some posters will 'tell me off' for quoting him AGAIN but I wonder if this is a genuine "let's just be friends / do right thing message" or because he's not heard from me for 48 hours. I want to believe he's a Jenkins and is now doing the right thing / trying to be cordial.

 

I know it doesn't matter. I know he's a contradiction and bottom line is this: (a) he's never going to leave because his wife is his family; and (b) I wouldn't want him anyway given he'd do same to me.

 

I just wanted to share the update.

[imsosad]

I do want to leave it behind now - I just don't like to feel that I meant nothing or was a bit of fun. It hasn't been fun for either of us.

 

He has messaged me again just now..."Merry Xmas Eve. I wish I could see you today and spend time with you. This year has been special, looking forward to next year too".

 

I know some posters will 'tell me off' for quoting him AGAIN but I wonder if this is a genuine "let's just be friends / do right thing message" or because he's not heard from me for 48 hours. I want to believe he's a Jenkins and is now doing the right thing / trying to be cordial.

 

I know it doesn't matter. I know he's a contradiction and bottom line is this: (a) he's never going to leave because his wife is his family; and (b) I wouldn't want him anyway given he'd do same to me.

 

I just wanted to share the update.

 

Sorry my dear. I do not presume to speak for Jenkins, but he has stated many times that he keeps complete and permanent NC with the ex OW.

THAT is how a man who is truly trying to do right behaves.

It is, first and foremost, the most decent thing to do by a BS, but also by the Ex OW/OM. Hoping to stay in contact while pretending to commit to a marriage is lying to everyone involved.

Wake up, sister. It was not an innocent, friendly messaged. It was a hook, a manipulation to plant the idea in your head that this will continue.

You seem to have a very distorted view of him anf your relationship. We can't end this for you, it is only up to you.

[wmacbride]

They are the ones I was referring to.

Poppy.

 

Ah,now I understand, and agree with you. How he can look at you in the face, look his wife in the face and feel okay lying to you both day after day I just can't get my head around. I can see how he was able to keep you off balance, not understanding how he could do it. It sounds like he knew just what t say to keep you hooked.

 

You now what though, maybe that's actually a good thing that you can't understand how he can be so cruel. That means you are nothing like him, you have empathy and also that you have the capacity to love someone so much.

 

Those are wonderful traits...please don't let him change that about you.

[wmacbride]

I do want to leave it behind now - I just don't like to feel that I meant nothing or was a bit of fun. It hasn't been fun for either of us.

 

He has messaged me again just now..."Merry Xmas Eve. I wish I could see you today and spend time with you. This year has been special, looking forward to next year too".

 

I know some posters will 'tell me off' for quoting him AGAIN but I wonder if this is a genuine "let's just be friends / do right thing message" or because he's not heard from me for 48 hours. I want to believe he's a Jenkins and is now doing the right thing / trying to be cordial.

 

I know it doesn't matter. I know he's a contradiction and bottom line is this: (a) he's never going to leave because his wife is his family; and (b) I wouldn't want him anyway given he'd do same to me.

 

I just wanted to share the update.

 

op,

please DO NOT take these as signs he cares. In fact, they are actually signs he doesn't care.

 

If he cared, he would leave you alone and not keep planting seeds of hope in you heart. Look at how he is making you feel. He is being cruel...and the worst part? He seems to feel just fine about doing it.

[jjgitties]

I do want to leave it behind now - I just don't like to feel that I meant nothing or was a bit of fun. It hasn't been fun for either of us.

 

He has messaged me again just now..."Merry Xmas Eve. I wish I could see you today and spend time with you. This year has been special, looking forward to next year too".

 

I know some posters will 'tell me off' for quoting him AGAIN but I wonder if this is a genuine "let's just be friends / do right thing message" or because he's not heard from me for 48 hours. I want to believe he's a Jenkins and is now doing the right thing / trying to be cordial.

 

I know it doesn't matter. I know he's a contradiction and bottom line is this: (a) he's never going to leave because his wife is his family; and (b) I wouldn't want him anyway given he'd do same to me.

 

I just wanted to share the update.

 

I/we have no right to judge you or your decision. You are an adult. Just keep your kid away from him. He is not the loving family centric husband father figure that he claim he believes he is.