Found out Dad I was interested in is married?!

[JJacobs]

I keep going back and forth about whether I should attend the game or not. I want to see him again, but my rational side tells me that now is the right time to take a step back. So much of mental seduction - the only kind he and I are going to have - is about knowing when to withdraw, strategically.

 

I think missing the game will allow for some emotional distance. This is a two-edged sword, though: some men would grow disinterested, others would step up their game and chase more arduously. If I can be both enticing and elusive at the same time, I can find out what kind he is. This kind of ambiguity is what makes men chase after a woman’s apparent unattainability. Will he?

 

Now that I think about it, I have done this somewhat. I think a dichotomy of a quality that goes against how you look is important in order to attract: I have an innocent face and air, but I have to admit that I’ve tried to create some depth and mystery by some naughty glances - it’s the kind of desire that is in the eyes only, but I think I’ve built in a kind of interesting depth that counters my “sweet” looks. I wanted to intrigue him, and I think I have.

 

I always think of Marilyn Monroe when I want to emulate this - she had the face and voice of a little girl, but something very sexual emanated from her at the same time. I think the trick is to make the second quality just a touch strong, barely noticeable - as if the man is just “sensing it”. Make the second quality too strong (in this case, naughtiness), and you risk looking schizophrenic! I think I’ve found a good balance.

 

But I’ve only interacted with him 5 times, and our interactions haven’t been that extensive. I have an idea of who he is, but I know better than to mistake a person’s appearance for reality. If I were to extend this seduction, which I won’t, I’d need a lot more time to find out who he is. Touch upon that basic need we all have, from which all of our desires stem. It would be interesting. But, it’s not meant to be.

 

Forgive my ramblings, I still have a couple of days to decide if I’m going to the game and my head is spinning!

[S2B]

May I ask why your marriage ended?

[JuneL]

I agree that the OP has done nothing at all to cross boundaries, but neither has the guy. In your earlier reply, you were adamant that the OP's intuition was proof that the guy has been flirting heavily in a subtle manner (I'm paraphrasing here), so why are you so sure that the guy does not have the intuition to see that the OP has been mentally rehearsing how to get the right balance to seduce him and has been wondering if he would act on his attraction by having sex with her once?

 

OP - I'm 'impressed' by the hypocrisy of the people bashing on you.

 

Remember - for your own sanity - you've done NOTHING wrong. You have been crushing on an attractive guy who has shown you clear signs of interest (YES clear, otherwise you wouldn't have noticed him). If anyone here is in fault - it is him, not you. Your only 'fault' is being more beautiful than most.

 

Having said that - for your own sanity, try to stay away from this guy. It is soap-opera-sh for now but will quickly turn into drama. You don't have the capacity of some people that break in other's families, so I'm afraid you'd get hurt... Keep busy and carry on.

[JuneL]

You know what, I somewhat agree with your assessment. If anything, this thread illustrates that you can't just be a bit friendly to a woman as a very good looking guy without being interpreted that you are romantically attracted to the woman.

 

OP JJ,

 

What most people don't realize is that being a physically beautiful person is a very lonely experience. It's not that you can't find a date or whatever (you easily could if you wanted to), but it's that you're not attracted to anyone else. The mating pool for you is a tiny fraction of what it is for the average person. It sucks.

 

You found someone who's attracted to you and also who you're attracted to at the same time? Congratulations!! It's so rare for that to happen.

 

Here's the other thing. Most of the advice you're getting here is coming from people who were damaged because they had an affair. But I bet they sure enjoyed it while they were doing it, don't you think?

 

It's like overeating your favorite food to the point of nausea and telling everyone you meet never to do that because you ended up so sick. Then meeting an emaciated, starving, homeless person and telling them not to dive into that free buffet sitting there right in front of them.

 

This married dude is into you, and you're into him. Go for it, life is short and way too lonely for certain people.

[No_Go]

You're right actually. He is probably sensing it too. When it comes to sexual responses, I do believe intuition gives us plenty of information. Signs of interest, regardless of how subtle they are, are hard to impossible to miss. So he must know as well.

 

So in that sense - I think this will escalate very quickly to sex if they happen to have alone time together, but since they are not - so far all is good.

 

I think we all have these cases of attraction where we imagine ripping the clothes of the other person right there and then, but 1/100 actually go to anywhere... So the best bet of OP is to stay in the other 99.

 

I agree that the OP has done nothing at all to cross boundaries, but neither has the guy. In your earlier reply, you were adamant that the OP's intuition was proof that the guy has been flirting heavily in a subtle manner (I'm paraphrasing here), so why are you so sure that the guy does not have the intuition to see that the OP has been mentally rehearsing how to get the right balance to seduce him and has been wondering if he would act on his attraction by having sex with her once?

[CautiouslyOptimistic]

You're right actually. He is probably sensing it too. When it comes to sexual responses, I do believe intuition gives us plenty of information. Signs of interest, regardless of how subtle they are, are hard to impossible to miss. So he must know as well.

 

So in that sense - I think this will escalate very quickly to sex if they happen to have alone time together, but since they are not - so far all is good.

 

I think we all have these cases of attraction where we imagine ripping the clothes of the other person right there and then, but 1/100 actually go to anywhere... So the best bet of OP is to stay in the other 99.

 

I think OP said basketball season is 3 months. My prediction is that this will escalate through technology once the season is over.....

[No_Go]

I think OP said basketball season is 3 months. My prediction is that this will escalate through technology once the season is over.....

 

Either that, or I think more likely will dissolve. Which will be for the better.

[JJacobs]

I’ve addressed my former marriage somewhat, but it ended basically because I got very tired of trying to fix a relationship that was unsatisfying to me - he was happy as a clam! And to be honest, he was a good man. But the sex wasn’t what I wanted, he was emotionally dependent, there was a lot about him I couldn’t deal with. I was married for 12 years, he was my first real relationship, and I just got tired. I deserved better. I’m doing so much better being free, even if the attraction issue still keeps me in a corner! I believe that the right man is out there.

 

As for Basketball Dad, I don’t know that I agree that things will escalate, or even that they would if we were alone. I mean, maybe he IS a good man who would just say no if given a choice to be with me. Maybe he would choose to be faithful.

 

Here’s the thing: seduction is a game of psychology, not of beauty. One does not need to be beautiful in order to seduce. And while my beauty probably helps, what I’m enjoying with him is this game of penetration of the mind... Not of private parts! This is the fun part, the expectation, the flirting, the wondering. In this sense, I don’t think anything physical would happen.

 

I definitely got vibes that he was showing off and trying to get my attention with his basketball antics and the undressing last time! ? It was pretty strong. And it’s something about the way he looks at me - it’s just different. But that doesn’t necessarily mean that he would sleep with me.

 

For example - his assistant coach, a male (Camera Watch is another one, but female), also flirts with me. He stares more than Basketball Dad, starts conversations, etc. His interest is very noticeable, but it doesn’t affect me at all. The way B-Dad does it is completely different. It’s more... dignified, refined... It’s more enjoyable. Of course, I’m more attracted to him too, but everything about him is more elevated.

 

I don’t know if the way he has acted so far means he is the kind of man who is open to being interested in another woman. I’m trying to keep myself grounded. I think a faithful man who has noticed I’m interested would avoid contact with me - be civil but stay away. He has not done this.

 

There’s this voice inside of me that says that a man who is committed to being faithful does not go out of his way to talk to an attractive woman, and stare at her, and show off, and throw suggestive looks and words her way. But, all of this is pretty mild. The guy hasn’t done anything wrong yet! The question is... would he? And how do I find out?

 

It won’t be tomorrow at the game. I’ve already set it up, my ex is taking my son. I’ll go to the morning game instead... So Tuesday will be my next day to look forward to. ?

[lana-banana]

I think a faithful man who has noticed I’m interested would avoid contact with me - be civil but stay away. He has not done this...There’s this voice inside of me that says that a man who is committed to being faithful does not go out of his way to talk to an attractive woman, and stare at her, and show off, and throw suggestive looks and words her way.

 

You are an attractive person who is used to (and enjoys at times) attention. So is he. Nothing you have posted here suggests anything beyond that. I wouldn't call anything he's done suggestive or even flirtatious, but suppose it was; so what? None of that means he has any interest in anything beyond flirting. Lots of people think flirting is totally harmless. He may not even realize he's doing it.

 

More to the point, why does any of his behavior matter? You are not going to have an affair.

 

Ogle him all you want, but he's a married man. He's off the market. If he wanted you, you'd know, but per your own admission nothing remotely untoward has happened. Which is fine, because he's *married*.

 

Minimariah gave you some excellent advice a few pages ago. It might be worth rereading.

[JJacobs]

This is a game of waiting - of creating anticipation and desire. I’ve decided not to follow through with it to the fullest extent, but his reactions so far are consistent with what men who are not used to extramarital affairs do. Only brutes and the unsophisticated are obvious and forceful early on.

 

I’m not short-sighted - his reactions can, and will, change overtime. Right now, they could go either way. But do you think I’m going to stop enjoying this process because of only a handful of times in which I’ve seen him?!

 

Rest assured:your comments do not discourage me in the least.

[lana-banana]

If you are looking for "encouragement" to pursue a married man (who has shown no actual romantic interest in you, at that), you may want to look elsewhere. Nobody on this board has good things to say about extramarital affairs. Seriously, check out the Other Man/Woman boards---they aren't pretty.

 

All I see is a woman creating melodrama and excitement out of thin air, probably due to boredom and loneliness. That would be fine except you're actively trying to involve these real-life people in your fantasy "games", and that's the line at which people can be embarrassed, hurt, or worse. Do whatever you please, but I'm pretty sure this all ends with you wishing you'd stuck to reorganizing Tupperware.

Edited January 19, 2018 by lana-banana

[JJacobs]

Lana, my dear, all you can do is stay tuned! ?

 

Meanwhile, I keep telling myself that Tuesday will be here soon enough and I’ll just enjoy my little one’s basketball prowess early tomorrow morning! I’ve had too much coffee this morning, so I’m a bit edgy, but volunteering for lunch service at my son’s school, then a spa visit will get me back on track.

 

I love weekends!! ?

[No_Go]

You summed it right up:

Here’s the thing: seduction is a game of psychology, not of beauty. One does not need to be beautiful in order to seduce. And while my beauty probably helps, what I’m enjoying with him is this game of penetration of the mind... Not of private parts! This is the fun part, the expectation, the flirting, the wondering. In this sense, I don’t think anything physical would happen.

 

The psychological game of uncertainty and desire, especially the one that most certainly won't materialize, is not for the faint of heart, but brings enormous rush of energy, nothing compares.

 

That's what I'm reading here, not a woman about to indulge into an affair, or a woman who is bored or whatever other insults were given to you. The manipulator behavior will be to ask him out and profess your deep undying feelings . [] Here I see just a controlled play of the mind, which is exhilarating and beats down any traditional relationship-y games involving end goals.

 

I'm the last person on earth to support relations of any kind with a guy with girlfriend or wife (shockingly - fully supported by actions), but here the game is 'seduction/attraction' not 'chase down a taken guy', the two are vastly different for these who can see...

 

P.S. I experienced similar attraction many years ago. Never acted on it. What do you think happened back then? The guy divorced wifey and knocked up his college gf 2 months later. Then divorced her as well and went back to the previous one. Your actions won't change the cheater's mind, staying away from physical is for your own self-respect and for his current woman, if he's the cheating type, he'll find a more easy target and go from there...

Edited January 19, 2018 by a LoveShack.org Moderator
Language

[JuneL]

So it's more noble to mind have an emotional affair with a married man?

 

p.s. Nothing in your example indicated the guy in your example has cheated.

Edited January 19, 2018 by a LoveShack.org Moderator
Redact full quote of immediately preceding post

[No_Go]

So it's more noble to mind have an emotional affair with a married man?

 

Where do you see emotional affair? She said nothing, done nothing.

 

p.s. Nothing in your example indicated the guy in your example has cheated.

Yeah, he hasn't to my knowledge, just skillfully rotated [wives]. I gave it as an example (irony) for a guy that I stayed away from to save his 'stable' marriage Edited January 19, 2018 by a LoveShack.org Moderator

[Cookiesandough]

Has OP hooked up with the MM yet. Omgoodness if looking at women was having an affair 99.9% of married men are cheaters.

[No_Go]

Has OP hooked up with the MM yet. Omgoodness if looking at women was having an affair 99.9% of married men are cheaters.

 

Nope, no hookup, professing luv, nothing. But she ‘must’ be lonely and bored or mentally sick because she is... a normal human able to experience attraction

[William]

Let's move away from scenarios that are off-topic to the thread and back to the reality of the thread starter's statements.

 

Also, I'll do a bit of editing of content which infringes upon our language policies and remind members of our civility and respect guidelines. This is moderation's second directive in the thread so moderation and suspension will be the next process.

[WorldInMyEyes]

JJ,

 

You have to try and get the digits. These things become exponentially more fun when email/texting shenanigans begin.

[CautiouslyOptimistic]

JJ,

 

You have to try and get the digits. These things become exponentially more fun when email/texting shenanigans begin.

 

Not for the betrayed spouse they don't.

[JJacobs]

Wow, I’m impressed. Thank you, No Go and others for the support. I find seduction exhilarating now that I’m divorced - it involved too much guilt for me when I was married, so I never let it escalate then - so I’ve been having lots of fun with him. Sex free fun, but fun.

 

World - He and I have emailed, about league things. He added his number to the end of his emails. I’ve never texted, I think I would die if I were to text a man first!!

 

Our emails have left me confused - he was very engaging and adding lots of extra info in some of them, a lot of exclamation points(in my experience men aren’t like this), and it would take him literally 60 seconds flat to reply to my emails. That is texting speed. It was actually one of the things that made me pay attention to him, in addition to his always starting conversations and in person by asking questions we had already discussed via email. But I left it alone. When he sends an email to the whole group, I just reply with something like “Thanks for the reminder!”. He doesn’t reply to these one-liners, so that made me think he’s really not interested.

 

(I would ask No Go if she might get back with the previously married guy she still remembers, but will heed William’s advice about sticking to the thread.)

 

Here’s something interesting : I’ve asked about this on another forum, guess what? Most of the women think I’m “dreaming” and “think too highly of myself thinking he’s interested”. The men? Overwhelmingly say “He wants to have sex with you!!”. Just like World! (I assume you’re male from your messages.)

 

I wonder why?!

 

It’s game morning and I feel excited, even though I’m not going to see him. One more step in our game, the strategic withdrawal. If nothing else, it will make me really look forward to the next time I see him! ?

[No_Go]

Here’s something interesting : I’ve asked about this on another forum, guess what? Most of the women think I’m “dreaming” and “think too highly of myself thinking he’s interested”. The men? Overwhelmingly say “He wants to have sex with you!!”. Just like World! (I assume you’re male from your messages.)

 

I wonder why?!

 

Eh JJ... This whole thread is quite interesting and thought provoking (especially the fact you stay in distance besides the temptation) but the piece that you wonder about is crystal clear. There are three layers: 1) most women are very territorial 2) many women consider snatching a bf/husband their foremost achievement in life 3) women hate visual competition more than anything.

 

1) and 2) overlap. If you think 'marrying X is the greatest thing I've done' (and sadly, the unspoken 'and...all I could achieve in life'), imagine the hurt if your prey can be taken by another female. Add the subtle nuance many of the 'moralizers' have broken into relationships of others in their past, so they know how easy it is, and that the threat is real. Then add 3): a woman who is beautiful and knows it - now this adds so many layers of envy (and statements: 'nah, she's average', 'but we're ALL beautiful ', 'well, then she's boring and lonely' etc).

 

It’s game morning and I feel excited, even though I’m not going to see him. One more step in our game, the strategic withdrawal. If nothing else, it will make me really look forward to the next time I see him! ��

 

Now, trust me here - you're entering a dangerous territory. The mental escalation is real and sometimes interferes with our sense of control of the situation. Here you're on the verge of a volcano explosion, not sure from each side - but you'd know soon who the least patient one is. Staying tuned to see what will happen, but remember - you're playing with fire, keep calm and keep your self-control.

Edited January 22, 2018 by No_Go

[JJacobs]

No Go, I agree with your assessment. I feel sorry for women who allow envy to color all of their interactions, but all I can do is consider the source - and discount the “advice”.

 

So as I had mentioned, I’ve posted about this on another forum, and a man whose username is fittingly “Don Juan” messaged me about my post. We’ve been talking, and he of course is convinced that basketball dad wants sex. I asked him to be my “relationship coach”, lol! He said yes and has been giving me tips. I told him about why I’ve been keeping my distance despite my interest - the moral dilemma, the guilt, avoidance of consequences, etc. - and he thinks basketball dad feels watched so he is either biding his time, or not sure of my interest (because men are socialized not to force themselves on women and be seen as creeps right away).

 

So Don Juan told me I should not only stare at basketball dad, but lick my lips as I do it! How do I do that without looking like I’m having a medical episode? Lol

 

Here’s the thing - acting interested in men is not something I’m used to. I’m very passive, not only because my husband was my first relationship when I was in my late teens, but because men have always done all the work. The man I was with after my divorce was not married, so he pursued me. This is completely new territory.

 

I don’t think I can be that suggestive in flirting. Thinking back on my interactions with basketball dad, I’d be very surprised if he knew I’m interested- I look away out of nervousness whenever I catch him staring, except for when he was taking off his sweatshirt - I stared then. (He has an incredible body. He was wearing a t-shirt but I could tell.) He’s always the one to start conversations, I only REact.

 

I planned on acting disinterested at the next practice, but Don Juan said that will probably only confuse basketball dad. I’ll see how I feel when I get there.

 

It’s tomorrow!!

[No_Go]

I told him about why I’ve been keeping my distance despite my interest - the moral dilemma, the guilt, avoidance of consequences, etc. - and he thinks basketball dad feels watched so he is either biding his time, or not sure of my interest (because men are socialized not to force themselves on women and be seen as creeps right away).

 

Abstracting from the moral dilemma here, Don Juan is probably right. I'm been ranting a lot about this conditioning of men that has brought me lots of confusion & heartbreak. I'm like you: I never initiate flirting, only react and even then I do it very subtly (hah, maybe it has to do with late 'exposure' - I had my 1st sexual partner in my late 20s! And both he and the subsequent two guys I had were VERY pushy, otherwise I'm sure they'd have been in the long list of 'missed opportunities' because I'd have never initiated myself). So I've recently discovered, maybe due to all the media noise, maybe out of fear, maybe out of intimidation - men EXPECT clear signal, like almost imposing yourself on them , to act. I still refuse doing it but I guess this leaves only the most confident men available. Here, add to this that your guy is (rightfully) scared because of his status, so he won't be in this 'most confident' group...

 

The question is what do you want out of it. I again agree with Don Juan if the goal is to get physical, but if it is just flirting - the push/pull can keep both of you on the edge (without consequences) for quite a while... basically until one of you gets too tired of it.

[JuneL]

This is a very convincing post coming from a very beautiful young woman (one who has posted many of her real pictures, instead of merely making some cheap talk on and on about how attractive she is).

 

Girl!!! I mean this in the best way possible but you might need some help with this. You’re pinning too much of your worth on looks. Most of the happiest marriages I know don’t have bombshell wives with makeup always on fleek and Botox in every wrinkle. Those are the ones who usually have failed marriages because wrong priorities. Happiest marriages when the women make their men HAPPY, loved, and emotionally supported. Looks are down the list of why marriages fail imo , and that’s even counting people who gain a lot of weight.