Thought things were going well, now STBX is talking suicide...

[Unhappy_Nerd]

I have no idea how to handle this anymore. STBX is now talking about killing herself, and refusing to talk to a counselor about it. I can't get her to call a suicide hotline or discuss with anyone else...

 

She used to talk like this years ago. Always said that I'm the only reason for her to live etc. I have always HATED that she said that. Live for yourself, not for me.

 

She just sent this to me in messenger (excerpt from a longer conversation, where I was trying to talk her down:

Sean I have kept myself going for 3 people on thus earth. Gramma, mom, and you.

 

Her mother died in 2012, her grandma around 2007.

I replied, Maybe it's time to find a reason to live for you.

 

I don't want to. I'm really sorry.

I'm not trying to hurt anyone.

If I'm being selfish it's what I want.

I don't want to be alone. In debt. Struggling. Watching everyone around me happily take trips to Europe with their spouses.

That's exactly what I would be facing.

Really...why bother???

I got to be truly happy for a bit. Lasik. Dreams of Europe with you. Nearly out of CC debt.

I'm sorry...I don't know what to say.

 

 

I'm 99% sure she's not in any immediate danger...when she's talked about suicide before it was always a planned "peaceful" type event. I can't tell if this is just histrionics or what.

 

She said she's cancelling all of her scheduled doctor's appointments, to avoid any expenses, and asked if we can go ahead and file for the divorce this week (we hadn't decided our financial stuff yet, so have yet to file).

 

Do I risk making her very angry by telling all of her close friends and family to get on her butt about suicide? Or just hope this is just a passing phase?

[alsudduth]

She is manipulating you into feeling guilty, because she knows it works for her.

 

You can't let her get away with that anymore. She needs to see a counselor. Period. Even if you are feeling guilty (who wouldn't!) you can't show her that.

 

File for divorce and tell her you hope she will get help for herself. And then repeat in your head over and over, it is NOT your fault.

 

I personally believe this is just a cry for attention. Stay strong.

[Mr. Lucky]

Do I risk making her very angry by telling all of her close friends and family to get on her butt about suicide? Or just hope this is just a passing phase?

 

Of course you do. I'd get anyone and everyone involved to generate a wider safety net.

 

At this point, why would you be afraid of her anger?

 

Mr. Lucky

[PegNosePete]

Do I risk making her very angry by telling all of her close friends and family to get on her butt about suicide?

Yes, she might not like it but it's in her best interests.

 

And then you DO NOT talk about anything personal. Just stick to what communication is required for the divorce in a business-like manner. If she sends you any more stuff like this, ignore it. Again, it's in her best interests for her to unattach herself from you, and the best way to force her to do that is to not respond.

[salparadise]

From looking at your other thread it doesn't seem like she is fundamentally unstable. She can try and pin that responsibility on you, but you don't have to accept it... you must not accept it.

 

What she does is her choice, her responsibility. You need to be really clear on that and set a firm boundary. It's hard from your perspective to not know whether she has the capacity to attempt it. But, if you allow her to control via threat, well, that's exactly what you're left with. It will be much harder to break the pattern than to refuse to comply to begin with. If you allow it, she will hold you hostage indefinitely.

 

So how to proceed? Do you believe she's actually at risk, or is it manipulation? Either way, you cannot become complicit in her hostage-taking strategy.

 

Let her friends and family know and ask them to keep in close touch. Set up MH services for her even if she says she won't go. Let the people in charge of involuntary hospitalizations know about the situation. Be compassionate and don't cut her off cold. If she threatens self-harm, call in a wellness check or alert the MH agency and have them do it.

 

If she can support herself and has a social/support network the chances of SI are reduced significantly. Additionally, the inherent resistance to self harm, the instinct for self-preservation, would have to be overcome... and that's a big obstacle for most. It has to be acquired through some type of conditioning. Joiner's Theory

 

At some point you will have to cut the strings, and no one is saying that any of this will be easy. You have to set a similar boundary as those that MH providers set with patients. She must be clear that the hostage game will not work. But at the same time, don't call her bluff in a mean, careless way. Caring, compassionate, with firm boundaries, and a clear understanding as to where the ultimate responsibility lies.

Edited February 1, 2018 by salparadise

[standtall]

It is a last ditch attempt to keep you around, as she has lost any type of control what was left of the relationship.

 

I personally think it is an empty gesture, and I am with the rest of the posters...reveal it to everyone as it will to two things, intervene if it is a real threat, or make her face the consequences of such gestures if it is not a real threat.

[Summer08]

I have no idea how to handle this anymore. STBX is now talking about killing herself, and refusing to talk to a counselor about it. I can't get her to call a suicide hotline or discuss with anyone else...

 

She used to talk like this years ago. Always said that I'm the only reason for her to live etc. I have always HATED that she said that. Live for yourself, not for me.

 

She just sent this to me in messenger (excerpt from a longer conversation, where I was trying to talk her down:

Sean I have kept myself going for 3 people on thus earth. Gramma, mom, and you.

 

Her mother died in 2012, her grandma around 2007.

I replied, Maybe it's time to find a reason to live for you.

 

I don't want to. I'm really sorry.

I'm not trying to hurt anyone.

If I'm being selfish it's what I want.

I don't want to be alone. In debt. Struggling. Watching everyone around me happily take trips to Europe with their spouses.

That's exactly what I would be facing.

Really...why bother???

I got to be truly happy for a bit. Lasik. Dreams of Europe with you. Nearly out of CC debt.

I'm sorry...I don't know what to say.

 

 

I'm 99% sure she's not in any immediate danger...when she's talked about suicide before it was always a planned "peaceful" type event. I can't tell if this is just histrionics or what.

 

She said she's cancelling all of her scheduled doctor's appointments, to avoid any expenses, and asked if we can go ahead and file for the divorce this week (we hadn't decided our financial stuff yet, so have yet to file).

 

Do I risk making her very angry by telling all of her close friends and family to get on her butt about suicide? Or just hope this is just a passing phase?

 

She's in a lot of danger. She is about to lose the last person she cares about.

 

It sounds serious to me.

 

She's preparing to leave the earth. Canceling doctors appointments. Giving you a divorce. I wouldn't be surprised if she's cleaning the house and organizing paperwork. I'd take this very seriously.

[mikeylo]

If you've previously given her to these dramatic stuff, she is pulling the same cards.

 

Time for a change.

 

Remove yourself. Tell others.

[Unhappy_Nerd]

So I ratted her out to some of her family, and now I'm just trying to scrape together enough cash for an apartment.

 

Alternatively I could stay with my father or a while, but that adds 40min of travel time (each way) to my already long freaking days, so that's really my last resort.

 

And yeah, I'm going to have to learn to ignore the non-divorce related messaging.

[Mr. Lucky]

So I ratted her out to some of her family, and now I'm just trying to scrape together enough cash for an apartment.

 

Since it sounds like you've had one foot out the door for a while, how did the plan not include enough assets to start your own life?

 

Mr. Lucky

[Unhappy_Nerd]

Since it sounds like you've had one foot out the door for a while, how did the plan not include enough assets to start your own life?

 

Mr. Lucky

 

Because I didn't intend to actually ask her for a divorce.

 

When my unhappiness would get overwhelming, or I was at the end of my rope regarding some of her behaviors that I absolutely resent, I would get drunk on scotch and vent to my friends. One of my buddies, who happened to be in ministry earlier in his life, would always talk me back down from ever doing anything rash...

 

This all blew up when my STBX was eavesdropping on one of my late night conversations with my friend. She had been in bed for a couple hours already, but got up in the middle of the night for some decongestant that was in the hall closet outside of my hobby room, where I was on the phone.

 

She overheard me talking about my resentment and anger. She heard me say I wished I'd never married her. She heard me say that I wished I could have a divorce.

 

I had no intent, at the time of the phone call, to actually do anything about it. I'm a coward when it comes to emotional conflict. It's a serious failing. But the next morning, when I found out she had been listening to me, everything came out. Years of pent up frustration, resentment, anger, disappointment, guilt, etc.

 

So yeah, that's why there was no plan. Because there was no plan. It just happened.

 

Additionally, since I felt bad about how I've pushed the divorce on her out of nowhere, I made some early concessions: I let her clean out our savings to start her own bank account (only $4400, but still). Told her she could take the house. That I only wanted a fair distribution of our debts...because we really only have debt...both of us went to college later in life (non-traditional students), and are only recently in stable careers. So tons of student loans still, etc.; I cleaned out my 401K a couple years ago to pay for moving expenses when we relocated.

[Mr. Lucky]

Additionally, since I felt bad about how I've pushed the divorce on her out of nowhere, I made some early concessions: I let her clean out our savings to start her own bank account (only $4400, but still). Told her she could take the house. That I only wanted a fair distribution of our debts...because we really only have debt...both of us went to college later in life (non-traditional students), and are only recently in stable careers. So tons of student loans still, etc.; I cleaned out my 401K a couple years ago to pay for moving expenses when we relocated.

 

UN, those aren't concessions, it's a capitulation. And you don't do either of you any favors by placing yourself in such financial jeopardy that it severely limits your options.

 

Have you talked to a lawyer?

 

Mr. Lucky

[Unhappy_Nerd]

UN, those aren't concessions, it's a capitulation. And you don't do either of you any favors by placing yourself in such financial jeopardy that it severely limits your options.

 

Have you talked to a lawyer?

 

Mr. Lucky

 

I do NOT want to get lawyers involved. It just costs far too much, and I doubt I end up in any better a situation.

 

Plus, I'm fine with capitulating on certain things. It helps assuage my guilt over everything. We're both reasonably well paid for the part of the country we now live in, so once I get my feet under me, I'm sure I'll be fine.

 

The only part of it that I regret was just signing over the savings. I should have given her half to start with. $2000 goes a long way in Indiana.

 

Honestly, I am more concerned with maintaining a modicum of goodwill, and not being seen as a monster by friends and family. Probably not the priority I should have, but that's where I'm at...

[somanymistakes]

Sometimes giving in is the better option if it gets things over and done with. Just be careful that you don't put yourself in an untenable situation. Make sure you know what things you DO need in order to get by, and don't budge on those points!

 

Also, make sure there's an actual AGREEMENT being reached, and not just you being pressured to give more and more in exchange for a freedom that never comes.

 

Giving more in exchange for a swift divorce is fine but make sure you actually get one!

[Happy Lemming]

STBX is now talking about killing herself, and refusing to talk to a counselor about it. I can't get her to call a suicide hotline or discuss with anyone else...

 

Please research "Baker Act" in your state??

 

I'm not sure it applies to this particular situation, but you may want to talk to a doctor. You have the texts, as proof.

 

Just my two cents...

Edited February 3, 2018 by Happy Lemming

[Mr. Lucky]

I do NOT want to get lawyers involved. It just costs far too much, and I doubt I end up in any better a situation.

 

Given your STBX's mental state, hard to foresee smooth sailing and rational discussion. YMMV, but I'd want an attorney's guidance.

 

Hope it works out...

 

Mr. Lucky

[Unhappy_Nerd]

Given your STBX's mental state, hard to foresee smooth sailing and rational discussion. YMMV, but I'd want an attorney's guidance.

 

Hope it works out...

 

Mr. Lucky

 

Fair enough. I do have access to legal consult through my company's EBP. But as I said, I just want things done.

 

As of yesterday, I moved out to my dad's farm, I still need to get most of my crap out of the house, but perhaps some space will let her calm down a bit...

[Happy Lemming]

As of yesterday, I moved out to my dad's farm, I still need to get most of my crap out of the house, but perhaps some space will let her calm down a bit...

 

That is a big step... I glad you found a place to go without committing to a long term lease.

 

Just my two cents...

[Unhappy_Nerd]

That is a big step... I glad you found a place to go without committing to a long term lease.

 

Just my two cents...

 

Yeah...I wanted to get an apartment, but it's just not viable right now...and it's not like a 45ish minute commute is the end of the world. I have plenty of coworkers who've driven further that that every day for years. I'll survive a month or two of it.

 

I guess my biggest hesitation was having to admit to my dad that I done screwed up. My adult siblings have lived with my dad for various periods of time (years in one case), and I was desperately trying to be the only one who had his...stuff...together enough to avoid it.

[Happy Lemming]

Take your Dad out for a big steak and say thank you.

 

I wouldn't worry to much about your perceived "I screwed up" theory. I'm sure he doesn't see it that way.

 

I would guess he is happy to help, as well.