Why can't people be liked for who they are

[ZA Dater]

This is the part that really resonates with me and where I can give you a tidbit of advice.

 

Always be yourself, don't custom tailor yourself to your perception of someone else's whims, but do so with confidence. Be proud of who you are and have fun with who you are whether you're a nerd, a jock, a nerdy jock, or anything in between across the entire spectrum of introverts and extroverts. Embrace the fact that the absolute best thing about you, and your biggest advantage over everyone else, is that you are unique and there is no one else in this entire world who is exactly like you.

 

Try that on for size and go show the world what you have to offer.

 

 

Exactly that is the point I am trying to make, I once again sat last night and watched people I know well pretend to be something else to attract some ladies.

[anduina]

Is your lifestyle fundamentally who you are or is it your comfort zone?

[HiCrunchy]

We also aren't entitled to be loved.

Sometimes we have to change in order to make that happen.

[basil67]

I know a great number of people who ended up just settling.

 

In my experience, friends and acquaintances generally don't go about telling us that they "settled" when choosing a partner.

 

This makes me suspect that them having settled is a judgement call by you rather than fact. Is this the case?

[S2B]

I've grown and learn about myself a lot in the past twelve years since my long term marriage ended.

 

I like myself. I love my life and actually enjoy each day.

 

If I find someone interesting enough then I will date them - if not I'm happy all on my own! It's a win-win for me!

 

I don't "need" anyone to be happy...I already am happy each day.

 

 

As a side note - I know very few couples that are super happy with their marriage... so there's no reason to rush my thoughts about every getting married again.

[ZA Dater]

Sure, you are entitled to your opinion. However, you go online to share your opinion with others who obviously know much more about this sort of thing than you do, and you refuse to listen to any kind of reason. This is why myself and others suggest you get some sort of professional help because your thought processes on display here seem twisted.

 

We all have our own problems, but you sitting there acting like you are in the position to judge others who are happier and more successful in dating because you don't agree with their methods is just silly. Those people you are judging are likely far happier than you are, and they are living their lives while you can only observe.

 

I am actually far happier now that I realize I won't ever be able to find mutual attraction. Far happier now that I don't need try make myself be someone that I fundamentally am not.

 

Yes if the best for me is to observe I can be ok with that rather than playing a game which to me is illogical and just makes me unhappy. I am who I am if nobody likes that then so be it.

 

Do I regret not understanding it, yes, would have done things differently yes but that's irrelevant because I can't change those things now.

Edited June 3, 2018 by ZA Dater

[CrazyKatLady]

I was under the impression that "being yourself" was supposed to be good enough too...if people want to improve themselves, that is great too, though.

 

I never realized until last year that there were so many rules in dating...I never realized either that the world was so full of mean downers either, that would rather lie about who they are to be the "better" person, than to be there and actually enjoy their partners for who they are.

 

I think dating someone you like is supposed to be an enjoyable event, yet so many people have shown me that that isn't the case and that makes me sad if I ponder it for to long, so I don't and I just choose to forego dating. I know I deserved better than I ever got from the few men I dated in the past 8 years and I am content on my own now.

 

I am working on a career, God willing, and trying to provide my son with a better life, trying to be a better Christian woman, and it gives me pleasure to better my life for my son and I-it has nothing to do with dating. I've wasted enough tears and years on the people I chose in the past, but I hope to have learned from those experiences and I know they weren't right for me, just as I wasn't right for them.

 

I work hard to make my peace with this and not hold bitterness, which is the hardest part of dsting, to me. And I hope that for them too, concerning me as a part of their past and my desire is that we all grow in a better way. A life coach wouldn't interest me in changing, but my past dating experiences have inspired me to do better in the future in many areas of my life.

Edited June 3, 2018 by a LoveShack.org Moderator
Paragraphs

[guest569]

I 100% agree, you have to do these things for yourself, not with the sole purpose of getting a date or relationship.

[Eternal Sunshine]

In my experience, friends and acquaintances generally don't go about telling us that they "settled" when choosing a partner.

 

This makes me suspect that them having settled is a judgement call by you rather than fact. Is this the case?

 

 

They may not have used the word "settled" but they make statements that make me believe that they did.

 

 

For example:

 

 

"He is not my great love but having had it before I don't need it again. I would rather stick with someone dependable and nice (like my H)". or

 

 

"We broke up many times due to my lack of physical attraction and I tried to date others but nothing stuck. So I went back to my now H and then decided that I am not getting any younger so I better stop fooling around". or

 

 

"I never was able to get men I truly wanted. So I decided if I want to ever get married, I may as well just pick the best option out of what I could get".

 

 

All of those statements to me imply settling. I simply wouldn't have gone with any of those situations. For me it's either "great love" or nothing. Hence I am still single hence I will likely end up with nothing, which to me is about million times preferable than forcing LTR or marriage.

 

 

I am not saying that ALL people in LTRs/marriage settled. There is a high % that didn't in younger demographic. It sharply declines as people get older. All in all, ignoring age, do I think that in most relationships at least one party settled? Absolutely.

[littleblackheart]

Not enough people in your real life have told you you are fine as you are; I'm guessing that's the crux of the matter, anyway.

 

There is a way of working around your victim/life is unfair/no one can see the diamond in the rough in between all the shallowness and fakeries of modern life current mindset. You were right in your previous thread (one of many on the same problem), you are plagued with a huge sense of insecurity, that you counterbalance with aggession and ready-made judgements as a means of self-defence.

 

ZA Dater, you are one in 7 billion people; others too have their problems, many a lot more serious than yours (sorry, I don't mean to trivialise your problems - I'm just trying to give you a sense of perspective).

 

You can start believing this and make a concerted effort to build yourself up from within - not by comparing yourself to others or by focussing on shallow things like body language abd drinking habits, but with one - one - one help from an objective, qualified person.

 

Or you can continue wondering why the world is so unfair, and you'll continue missing out on things.

 

It's your call.

[Veronica73]

I haven’t read your previous threads, but I thouroughly agree with littleblackheart.

 

And I saw a cognitive behavioral therapist for about six months and it completely changed my life for the better. He pointed out all my distortions and illogical thinking and accepted me for who I am. It was the best thing I have ever done for myself.

[ZA Dater]

 

Or you can continue wondering why the world is so unfair, and you'll continue missing out on things.

 

It's your call.

 

 

Its not unfair, its very fair if you want to spend everyday being someone you are not and tacitly conforming to what people think you should be. One glace on the shelf at a newsagent suggests this is still the case, people still buying into the notion of "I must be slim" "I must be Casanova".

 

 

Be who you want to be because you want to be it, not because someone tells you that you need to be it. For years I was unhappy, why because I went around and around in this pool of trying to date people, chasing what I wanted and ultimately never getting it. Last week I woke up and asked myself why I was trying to be who I wasn't and why? I'd find brief periods of hope where I did sometimes see myself getting closer to what I wanted but ultimately I always lost out to someone else, some who was more mainstream.

 

 

I couldn't answer those questions, its not like any of the improvements people have told me to make have brought any return at all.

 

 

I am simply not at sociable a guy, that's the reality of it and that's always going to be a huge red flag for any potential date, they want someone to show off to their friend and yes I suppose my indifference wouldn't be impossible to hide.

 

 

So yes for years I wanted what I thought I could get but one day last week I woke up and realised as much as I want I could never be the person people like that would like.

 

 

Sobering but true.

[Els]

Meh, relationships aren't for everyone. If you genuinely don't want a relationship, IMO it's totally fine to not be in one.

 

 

The whole over-the-top justification by trying to talk down everyone else is rather suspicious though - the lady doth protest too much, methinks. Generally people who don't wish to date just don't date, they don't go around trying to justify their decision by making derogatory comments about what (they presume) others are doing, because they don't feel the need to do that.

[thefooloftheyear]

I

 

 

I am simply not at sociable a guy, that's the reality of it and that's always going to be a huge red flag for any potential date, they want someone to show off to their friend and yes I suppose my indifference wouldn't be impossible to hide.

 

So yes for years I wanted what I thought I could get but one day last week I woke up and realised as much as I want I could never be the person people like that would like.

 

 

Sobering but true.

 

This is a bunch of bs, dude...

 

I am living proof, so are a lot of other guys,and I am probably less sociable than you are...That statement proves you know very little about women..Most "normal" women don't show off their men, in fact that's behavior you would be more likely to see from guys with women that are good looking/sexy.....I am sure you have heard of the Trophy Wife, right?

 

Will some women find non sociable guys a turn off? Sure, but no more that would find a shorter guy, a guy with a shytty physique, etc...That's just life and guys do the same type of disqualifying with women...Practically no one is universally accepted/.liked...Its impossible,,,

 

Just seems like you are looking for a way to rationalize your lack of success in dating or with interpersonal relationships with women,,Stop thinking it's because you aren't "mainstream" as what you perceive others to be ,,,,It's NOT that...

 

TFY

[ZA Dater]

This is a bunch of bs, dude...

 

I am living proof, so are a lot of other guys,and I am probably less sociable than you are...That statement proves you know very little about women..Most "normal" women don't show off their men, in fact that's behavior you would be more likely to see from guys with women that are good looking/sexy.....I am sure you have heard of the Trophy Wife, right?

 

Will some women find non sociable guys a turn off? Sure, but no more that would find a shorter guy, a guy with a shytty physique, etc...That's just life and guys do the same type of disqualifying with women...Practically no one is universally accepted/.liked...Its impossible,,,

 

Just seems like you are looking for a way to rationalize your lack of success in dating or with interpersonal relationships with women,,Stop thinking it's because you aren't "mainstream" as what you perceive others to be ,,,,It's NOT that...

 

TFY

 

 

 

Irrespective there is always a bit of "oh look at my bf" whether its blatant or not it still is there. Again being the single one in the room I always see this, over and over again. I once asked a group of ladies what they liked in a guy and I wasn't terribly shocked by what I was told.

 

 

I think I can rationalise things anyway I want. As they say whatever makes you sleep better at night.

 

 

You are right nobody is universally accepted however some are far more accepted than others, I have spent time with these sorts of people, I even tried to be like them for a while with absolutely pathetic results, I took their word "do this and you will get that" and everything remained the same.

 

 

Sure, I can go onto any OLD platform you care to mention and I might find some matches but the universal truth is none of them are the ideal and before someone says ideal doesn't exist, it does for me, I have met ideal maybe 3 times but the problem is ideal doesn't like me ever so I sit with a choice, keep chasing ideal and be unhappy, force myself to like someone I don't, improve myself so ideal might like me and ultimately nothing changes or simply do nothing at all and rationalise the fact I am where I am.

 

 

I then look at ideal and figure out what ideal wants and frankly I am not it and not matter what I tell myself, what I do, I simply wont ever be that. Line me up with 10 other guys its not like I will be the pick of the bunch, that's happened many times and I am told 'oh she is lovely" despite the fact the person telling me this wouldn't date "she" for the tea in china.

[littleblackheart]

Its not unfair, its very fair if you want to spend everyday being someone you are not and tacitly conforming to what people think you should be. One glace on the shelf at a newsagent suggests this is still the case, people still buying into the notion of "I must be slim" "I must be Casanova".

 

 

Be who you want to be because you want to be it, not because someone tells you that you need to be it. For years I was unhappy, why because I went around and around in this pool of trying to date people, chasing what I wanted and ultimately never getting it. Last week I woke up and asked myself why I was trying to be who I wasn't and why? I'd find brief periods of hope where I did sometimes see myself getting closer to what I wanted but ultimately I always lost out to someone else, some who was more mainstream.

 

 

I couldn't answer those questions, its not like any of the improvements people have told me to make have brought any return at all.

 

 

I am simply not at sociable a guy, that's the reality of it and that's always going to be a huge red flag for any potential date, they want someone to show off to their friend and yes I suppose my indifference wouldn't be impossible to hide.

 

 

So yes for years I wanted what I thought I could get but one day last week I woke up and realised as much as I want I could never be the person people like that would like.

 

 

Sobering but true.

 

Apologies ZA but this post is all over the place; plenty of people ARE liked for who they are. A likeable person doesn't have to be sociable, they don't need to hook up with random people, they don't need to drink alcohol, they don't need to be fake or shallow or like to party or obey conventional rules or be popular or rich.

 

They don't need to be 'hot' or 'funny' or 'witty' (all these traits are subjective anyway) and a healthy society does not allow itself to be guided by magazine covers.

 

It's not a 'mainstream' vs 'outlier' problem; it's a self-esteem problem. It comes from within yourself. You need to be open to the possibility that your best course of action is therapy.

 

Even if you did secure a second date, you are not, realistically, in the right frame of mind to be a good life partner; you are too centered on your own self.

[ZA Dater]

Apologies ZA but this post is all over the place; plenty of people ARE liked for who they are. A likeable person doesn't have to be sociable, they don't need to hook up with random people, they don't need to drink alcohol, they don't need to be fake or shallow or like to party or obey conventional rules or be popular or rich.

 

They don't need to be 'hot' or 'funny' or 'witty' (all these traits are subjective anyway) and a healthy society does not allow itself to be guided by magazine covers.

 

It's not a 'mainstream' vs 'outlier' problem; it's a self-esteem problem. It comes from within yourself. You need to be open to the possibility that your best course of action is therapy.

 

Even if you did secure a second date, you are not, realistically, in the right frame of mind to be a good life partner; you are too centered on your own self.

 

 

 

Healthy society, from where I sit that doesn't seem to be the case, anorexia is on the increase, teenage suicide rates are increasing, fanaticism is on the increase. Hardly traits of a healthy society in my view. Social media continues to negatively influence the world in a raft of ways, its arrival has fundamentally changed how we view others and given some a soap box to preach unimaginable hate

 

 

As for therapy been there done that years ago, for me the whole experience is best characterised as one with zero return on investment.

 

 

I do the following often each day "walk a mile in another persons shoes" and if you walked a mile in mine I might suggest you would arrive at the same points of view I have.

 

 

Had I had some tangible success I might have thought differently and that is the crux of it, our own views are a by product of our own experiences.

[littleblackheart]

Healthy society, from where I sit that doesn't seem to be the case, anorexia is on the increase, teenage suicide rates are increasing, fanaticism is on the increase. Hardly traits of a healthy society in my view. Social media continues to negatively influence the world in a raft of ways, its arrival has fundamentally changed how we view others and given some a soap box to preach unimaginable hate

 

 

As for therapy been there done that years ago, for me the whole experience is best characterised as one with zero return on investment.

 

 

I do the following often each day "walk a mile in another persons shoes" and if you walked a mile in mine I might suggest you would arrive at the same points of view I have.

 

 

Had I had some tangible success I might have thought differently and that is the crux of it, our own views are a by product of our own experiences.

 

1. If you did therapy 'years ago' and are only in your 30s, it's time to give it another more earnest try.

 

2. No, our views are the products of education, observation and experience. All three matter.

 

3. I'm a divorced single autistic parent of 2 children, one being autistic. I don't live in my home country as my psycho exH has trapped me here. I've had 1 LTR in my life (marriage) which was traumatic mentally and emotionally, and extremely abusive. Yet I AM FINE. Why don't you walk in my shoes?

[Mentor99]

Yes, I accept that in cases where people are really not nice people they might not be universally liked but if we for a moment accept that most people are decent people.

 

 

So much of the advice given here is in no particular order.

 

 

1: Dating coach

2: Makeover

3: Therapist

4: Work on yourself

 

 

Perhaps I am over thinking but why is any of that important, none it changes who you are and none of it changes your fundamental personality.

 

 

This is why people might be making those suggestions:

 

 

1. Dating Coach. Dating is a skill that can be learned and a dating coach can help you learn. If you haven't had much success with dating, you might have to improve your skills with dating.

 

 

 

2. Makeover. This is what is referred to as "low hanging fruit". Changing your clothes or haircut is quite easy and low investment. If a makeover improves your confidence, why not do it?

 

 

3. Therapy. When people struggle with something, it is pretty much always because they have unhealthy thoughts and beliefs about the thing they're struggling with. And by unhealthy, I just mean they're thought patterns that prevent the person from being able to have success in whatever domain they're struggling with.

 

 

 

The hard part is that we tend to want to keep believing what we already believe whether it's helpful or not. People have likely noticed that you defend your unhealthy thoughts and beliefs regarding dating and relationships and know that therapy is often helpful in breaking down those thought patterns and helping establish new ones.

 

 

 

4. Work on yourself. Be the best version of yourself. If you're confident in who you are, you'll attract people that like the kind of person you are.

 

 

 

 

As someone who has spent time working on himself with no discernible difference in outcome I have begun to wonder "what for" in the broadest sense.

 

 

Why work on being the best version of yourself? That's sort of your whole "purpose" for existing! You're the only you that exists, so if you're not being your best version, you're depriving the world of your gifts!

 

 

I don't think a true match is tailoring yourself to the whims of someone else but rather being yourself and hoping someone likes you for you.

 

 

100% correct. If someone doesn't like you for you, they're clearly not a true match.

 

 

 

To me a lot of the above list intentionally tries to create a person who you are not in the hope that person is more marketable, much like wearing a bright green t shirt would make one stand out.

 

 

This is off the mark. None of the above is trying to change who you are. It's suggestions to learn the skill of dating, change your unhealthy thought patterns, and be the best version of YOURSELF (including the makeover part).

 

 

 

 

In other words its superficial and not fundamental in nature. The more I go out the more I am left with the feeling, all this does it make you even less marketable if you accept everyone wants something different if you accept everyone is similar then you simply acknowledge crowd mentality is an important dating criteria.

 

 

Remember what I mentioned about unhealthy thoughts before? This is an unhealthy thought which leads to the feeling you describe above. Looking at dating and relationships as transactional (i.e. like a marketplace) tends to prevent people from forming healthy relationships as they're looking what they "offer" and what a potential partner has to "offer".

 

 

 

Instead, dating is about finding a match. Somebody who wants to be with you for YOU (not what you have to offer them) and somebody you want to be with for THEM (and not what they offer you). In fact emotionally healthy love is definitely not transactional in nature. When you love someone, you want them to be happy. It's about their happiness, not what they can do for you.

 

 

 

So the sooner you lose this transactional mindset the better. Also, keep your expectations realistic; unrealistic expectations are another form of unhealthy thoughts and beliefs. And by realistic, I just mean understand that true matches are quite rare, so most dates aren't going to be matches. You can still enjoy yourself though.

 

 

The amount of selling out I see among people I know is staggering, people who change their entire life to try and woo people, is this really what one must do? Living something false in the hope someone will like that?

 

 

I would imagine that people who are lying about who they are to attract someone will have a very difficult time establishing a healthy relationship. Plus it's exhausting trying to be someone you're not!

 

 

 

I guess I am just overthinking everything.....as usual.

 

 

Overthinking is not helpful when those thoughts are unhealthy. Best to try to examine your thoughts and really see if they are helping you get what you're looking for.

[ZA Dater]

 

1. Dating Coach. Dating is a skill that can be learned and a dating coach can help you learn. If you haven't had much success with dating, you might have to improve your skills with dating.

 

 

 

2. Makeover. This is what is referred to as "low hanging fruit". Changing your clothes or haircut is quite easy and low investment. If a makeover improves your confidence, why not do it?

 

 

3. Therapy. When people struggle with something, it is pretty much always because they have unhealthy thoughts and beliefs about the thing they're struggling with. And by unhealthy, I just mean they're thought patterns that prevent the person from being able to have success in whatever domain they're struggling with.

 

 

The hard part is that we tend to want to keep believing what we already believe whether it's helpful or not. People have likely noticed that you defend your unhealthy thoughts and beliefs regarding dating and relationships and know that therapy is often helpful in breaking down those thought patterns and helping establish new ones.

 

 

4. Work on yourself. Be the best version of yourself. If you're confident in who you are, you'll attract people that like the kind of person you are.

.

 

 

 

Attract people, lets go with that one. I have been out often enough and observed enough to know there is so much embellishment inherent in this its not even funny and you know how it starts, before the person even leave their home and why

 

 

1: Lets dress in a different way, why? Assuming you look good why dress differently to go out, barring if its a formal event or there is a dress code.

 

 

2: Make things appear better than they are, this is inherent in every single interaction I have ever seen which has lead to some success. I have even done this , unfortunately for me I don't have the charm and a low cut dress doesn't make up for a lack of intellect.

 

 

Makeover, yes I agree on this PROVIDED you like the new style, if its sole purpose is to make you more attractive to others then its fruitless.

 

 

Guys wont ever get approached so intrinsically we don't have any power at all, the decision is made yay or nay on looks and nothing else. Again I have seen this first hand. What this forum doesn't understand is I haven't lived in a room, I have been out there, been out with people I know, see how this whole thing works in reality. They go out to have a good time, I go out to try and meet someone nice, they go out looking to get laid, I go out looking for someone to take to lunch next week it never works because I never connect with people because our objectives are not aligned.

 

 

The only power a guy has are his looks, perceived status and any charm flirting ability he might have, its the latter where the embellishment happens, the change in personality to tailor to ones company.

 

 

You know how I got out when I did go out? I simply go out as me, which is quiet and reserved, I don't pretend to be the life of the dinner because I am not, give me a chance to debate a point and I am there but talking about who was with who and drinking, that doesn't interest me and I simply switch off.

 

 

For all that I have met people I really enjoy spending time with but clearly that isn't mutual because rarely do they want to have anything to do with me.

 

 

The reason I went to therapy originally was because I never fitted in with others and had few friends, my viewpoints and interests didn't align with others and they still don't, I had to sit and be analysed by these people as they tried to impart what amounted to nothing more than conformist ideas, round and round we went, a whole lot of words about essentially nothing. You know what changed...yes nothing!

 

 

Mostly I just walk around feeling as much a misfit as I did then, the difference is now I embrace that and simply care less than before. I have had a few great moments, more because I think the people in question simply felt sorry for me.

 

 

I admire people who get some sort of success at this even though I think the methods used are sometimes dubious at best, I admire their charm, charisma, ability to flirt and the fact that maybe some of them some of the time go get what they want.

[Mentor99]

Guys wont ever get approached so intrinsically we don't have any power at all, the decision is made yay or nay on looks and nothing else.

 

 

This is true for women who are primarily attracted to guys based on their looks. While looks do play a role for nearly everybody, the level of importance is going to change from person to person. From what I've seen, women all differ in the importance that looks play in their attraction. The better looking a woman is, the more of a role looks will play in her attraction towards a mate (like attracts like). Also looks will play a more prominent role the less invested a relationship is. So for a one night stand, a woman probably almost exclusively cares about the way the guy looks, whereas for a longer term marriage style relationship, looks will only be one factor of many and therefore less important.

 

 

Also I'm not understanding how guys not getting approached inherently makes men powerless. Power is the ability to do something, so the very act of approaching gives people power whether it's men or women. Or looked at another way, men get to choose who they approach whereas women only get to choose from those approaching. Sounds to me like men have the power in that situation.

 

 

 

Again I have seen this first hand. What this forum doesn't understand is I haven't lived in a room, I have been out there, been out with people I know, see how this whole thing works in reality. They go out to have a good time, I go out to try and meet someone nice, they go out looking to get laid, I go out looking for someone to take to lunch next week it never works because I never connect with people because our objectives are not aligned.

 

 

I've seen the same thing. And yes, if someone is just looking to get laid and you're looking for a relationship, clearly not a good match.

 

 

The only power a guy has are his looks, perceived status and any charm flirting ability he might have, its the latter where the embellishment happens, the change in personality to tailor to ones company.

 

 

That would work for women that are mostly interested in their looks, status, and charm for sure. But women that are interested in a guy with integrity, intelligence, and a sense of humor, might not like those flirty guys as much and might see them as fake. They'd want to get to know a guy before feeling attracted based on superficial things. One is not better than the other, it's just everybody is different. Most women likely fall somewhere in the middles of those two sides, and will even change their attractors based on the situation they're in! People aren't static.

 

 

You know how I got out when I did go out? I simply go out as me, which is quiet and reserved, I don't pretend to be the life of the dinner because I am not, give me a chance to debate a point and I am there but talking about who was with who and drinking, that doesn't interest me and I simply switch off.

 

 

You sounds like an introvert. Small talk is not your thing; you're more interested in deeper conversations. I'm the same way. There are plenty of women who can relate to that too I'm sure.

 

 

 

I will caution about quiet and reserved though as that can be a defense mechanism to avoid having to show people your personality and risking people not liking you. As an introvert you'll likely do much better with one on one conversations. Not everybody likes "the life of the party", in fact some people are repelled by that personality type.

 

 

For all that I have met people I really enjoy spending time with but clearly that isn't mutual because rarely do they want to have anything to do with me.

 

 

How do you know they don't want anything to do with you? Do you ask them to hang out some time and they say no?

 

 

The reason I went to therapy originally was because I never fitted in with others and had few friends, my viewpoints and interests didn't align with others and they still don't, I had to sit and be analysed by these people as they tried to impart what amounted to nothing more than conformist ideas, round and round we went, a whole lot of words about essentially nothing. You know what changed...yes nothing!

 

 

No doubt, finding the right therapist can be challenging. I would say if your viewpoints and interests don't align with the people in your group, you're hanging out with the wrong people. You don't have to change who you are. You would do well to find others though that share your values.

 

 

Mostly I just walk around feeling as much a misfit as I did then, the difference is now I embrace that and simply care less than before. I have had a few great moments, more because I think the people in question simply felt sorry for me.

 

 

These are your thoughts; can you see why they're unhealthy?

[Veronica73]

You haven’t replied to a single thing I have said. Not sure if it’s because what I have said has been worthless, or because of my name you know that I’m a woman so you just discount whatever I say. Because you certainly seem to have a chip on your shoulder about women.

 

But whatever. It is hard to find the right therapist. A lot of them are downright awful. I saw.... At least 5 that I can remember... could have been more...before I found the right one. But he seriously changed my life for the better.

 

I really think the right therapist could help you immensely.

[ZA Dater]

I haven’t read your previous threads, but I thouroughly agree with littleblackheart.

 

And I saw a cognitive behavioral therapist for about six months and it completely changed my life for the better. He pointed out all my distortions and illogical thinking and accepted me for who I am. It was the best thing I have ever done for myself.

 

 

 

To comment on this and your last post. I am not interested in walking down this road again, I have an absolute disdain for the entire profession and its not based on just my own experiences but that of others. I am happy it helped you though.

 

 

I cant find much value in sitting talking to someone about largely irrelevant things and person who doesn't know me from a bar of soap, regaling my life story and being asked a million questions that usually begin with "Why".

 

 

It would be a different matter if there was some practical value but I never found any. As for being who I am, after my foray in trying to be something else I am quite happy to be me again.

[ZA Dater]

You haven’t replied to a single thing I have said. Not sure if it’s because what I have said has been worthless, or because of my name you know that I’m a woman so you just discount whatever I say. Because you certainly seem to have a chip on your shoulder about women.

 

But whatever. It is hard to find the right therapist. A lot of them are downright awful. I saw.... At least 5 that I can remember... could have been more...before I found the right one. But he seriously changed my life for the better.

 

I really think the right therapist could help you immensely.

 

 

The bold isn't true. Other I know have had great experiences, well some at least, mine have all been ultimately disappointing so I tend to look at things based on those experiences as reference points.

 

 

For me though the whole fundamentals of what apparently one needs to do make the entire game a non starter.

[ZA Dater]

This is true for women who are primarily attracted to guys based on their looks. While looks do play a role for nearly everybody, the level of importance is going to change from person to person. From what I've seen, women all differ in the importance that looks play in their attraction. The better looking a woman is, the more of a role looks will play in her attraction towards a mate (like attracts like). Also looks will play a more prominent role the less invested a relationship is. So for a one night stand, a woman probably almost exclusively cares about the way the guy looks, whereas for a longer term marriage style relationship, looks will only be one factor of many and therefore less important.

 

 

Also I'm not understanding how guys not getting approached inherently makes men powerless. Power is the ability to do something, so the very act of approaching gives people power whether it's men or women. Or looked at another way, men get to choose who they approach whereas women only get to choose from those approaching. Sounds to me like men have the power in that situation.

 

 

I've seen the same thing. And yes, if someone is just looking to get laid and you're looking for a relationship, clearly not a good match.

 

 

That would work for women that are mostly interested in their looks, status, and charm for sure. But women that are interested in a guy with integrity, intelligence, and a sense of humor, might not like those flirty guys as much and might see them as fake. They'd want to get to know a guy before feeling attracted based on superficial things. One is not better than the other, it's just everybody is different. Most women likely fall somewhere in the middles of those two sides, and will even change their attractors based on the situation they're in! People aren't static.

 

 

You sounds like an introvert. Small talk is not your thing; you're more interested in deeper conversations. I'm the same way. There are plenty of women who can relate to that too I'm sure.

 

 

I will caution about quiet and reserved though as that can be a defense mechanism to avoid having to show people your personality and risking people not liking you. As an introvert you'll likely do much better with one on one conversations. Not everybody likes "the life of the party", in fact some people are repelled by that personality type.

 

 

How do you know they don't want anything to do with you? Do you ask them to hang out some time and they say no?

 

 

No doubt, finding the right therapist can be challenging. I would say if your viewpoints and interests don't align with the people in your group, you're hanging out with the wrong people. You don't have to change who you are. You would do well to find others though that share your values.

 

These are your thoughts; can you see why they're unhealthy?

 

 

Most people are attracted primarily on looks, granted some aren't but I am not going to go down this road. I think how a lady looks can determine what she wants looks wise. I don't bother with anyone I find good looking because they have tons of options.

 

 

Yes, we might be able to choose but ladies summarily get to reject. I can honestly say I have never approached anyone. As for getting to know a guy, sure might be true but I certainly have never experienced it, even the best of a the bad dates I had, one in particular stands out "there is no chemistry but lets be friends", great accept I was blocked and never heard from her again. Or the countless time I have been stood up or the time she disappeared into the bathroom, left and texted me 2 hours later.

 

 

I sit and ask all the questions and none ever come my way.

 

 

I don't bother showing my personality anymore because I know it wont appeal to the audience in question. When I meet, which is frankly hardly ever someone I do like then I do try but even then its irrelevant because they aren't single.

 

 

 

Yes I have asked them to hang out and it never happens. Every so often I get so spend time with some of them but when I reach out its rejected out of hand.

 

 

I'll say this though, the "help" that got passed my way was usually of very little use and let me explain way. I get taken out to clubs and used as a project, a friend decides it best to tell my entire dating history to some lady who then takes pit "lets take him out and I will set him up with my friends". Which is a total disaster because from the off I am not comfortable in that environment and if you aren't the guy who can flirt and doesn't drink a club doesn't offer very much at all.

 

 

Eventually I declined anymore of this "help" and I have to say I don't regret not getting anymore of it either.