Clueless

[Versacehottie]

I'm on the west coast so it might be too late but i hope you asked him to go to dinner with your parents and that he did go. Let us know. I have some theories of course.

[Iris The Butterfly]

I'm on the west coast so it might be too late but i hope you asked him to go to dinner with your parents and that he did go. Let us know. I have some theories of course.

 

I'm on the west coast too, so not too late. Got back from dinner not long ago. He was invited to dinner by my dad but as I expected he had some pressing work related stuff related to a big 'deal' he was closing tomorrow that I had already known about. He talked with my dad a lot, guy talk, he was asking about him and his background and work, typical for my conservative 'stand up guy' dad who I've told my friend about many times. He knows about my family and he's never met them before, over the years we have shared a lot, more lately, about our parents. He said he really appreciated the offer and would be seeing them another time soon but had a lot on his plate with work stuff tonight to prepare for tomorrow (as I expected). It was nice of him to take his time out after a busy day at work and between other work stuff.

I'm curious to know your theories you speak of!

 

My mom said, "he's really a nice guy, the All American boy next door" and that is true. He's polite, puts himself together well, is smart and humble and is just a stand up dude, trustworthy and kind. He was raised well with good manners and has always had my back, and anyone he cares about. Spending time with him lately I've been finding him more attractive than I used to, he was also younger and maybe I didn't see him as a man, rather thought of him as just my friend's brother. I don't know if and when this would ever cross into romantic territory, but I've always had a crush on him but have been tied up in relationships with other guys, or he wasn't living in the area, or I just didn't notice that he liked me... but now I can really say that any girl would be lucky to have him. I'm feeling pretty intrigued right now. I just see how good of a person he is. As my friend foremost, he treats me very well and that is most attractive. Lately I've been noticing that he's acted a little more protective and caring. Maybe he always has and I haven't noticed.

 

After being treated badly and dumped by a guy I fell in love with not long ago, it is very appealing and compelling for me to be drawn to and excited about spending time with a good guy like him who I truly trust and respect and love spending time with. The guy who broke my heart was right in feeling threatened by him. He's so much better.

 

Sometimes I wonder how he thinks of me... as I said earlier I always used to see him as 'my friend's brother' but now I'm seeing him on a more personal level. I guess I kind of am looking at him in a different light lately, more as a man. If that makes sense. Maybe all these years he's also just thought of me as just his sister's friend... a girl in the group of friends. I don't know if he thinks of me in a different light now too. When he mentioned last week about a friend in the past telling him that he should pursue dating me, it made me think that his perspective of me had changed, since only recently, like in the past 3-4 months he's been bringing it up, the idea of us dating. It's like for the first time in all these years, he's been thinking of it, or vocalizing it anyway.

 

I have another male friend (who I mentioned earlier in this thread) who adores me and has known me for years through bad and good and seen me for who I am and who loves me, and fell in love with me. One day out of the blue, when I was 28 he looked at me and said, "I never saw you like this before, you've grown into a woman, I always saw you as just a teenager, like when I first met you." It was then that his feelings for me apparently changed. I kind of feel that way about this male friend now. And that's a nice feeling, it really is. It's.... pure and genuine.

 

I don't know what will become of this, but I do know that regardless he will be in my life for a long time, as a friend no matter what. I'm kind of just letting things happen as they will. I've said this a million times in this thread but I would be happy if we just have a friendship, I would be even more happy to have a romantic relationship with him too. It takes two though. I'm ready to explore it, I need more green lights so I'm consciously more receptive and paying close attention now. I really hope I'm not wrong in all this and I'm the only one getting butterflies.

 

Side note: a couple in our group of friends were platonic friends for 2 years but she always had a crush on him. Soon they were spending lots of free time together and got really close and became besties. One day last year he reached over and touched her hand, privately. One day when he said goodbye instead of kissing her on the cheek or a hug he gave her a peck on the lips. Soon he professed his feelings for her and said he loved her and wanted to be a couple. And they are all in now, talking about marriage. And they will be together for the long haul, it's a given. I think...I don't know, but I think that for some time it was a hurdle for him to cross that boundary because they had been friends and he didn't know how to enter the romantic realm with her. From what I know it took a little warming up but once they did, they have really gone all in. They were worried about announcing their relationship to the group because for some reason they were worried about how people would take it. Personally, I wasn't shocked at all and I told her I could see it long before they came out with it. I could tell it was only a matter of time. I don't know why history couldn't repeat itself, but anything is possible.

 

It was really nice to see him today. I look forward to the next time and I'm sure it won't be long.

[Versacehottie]

I'm on the west coast too, so not too late. Got back from dinner not long ago. He was invited to dinner by my dad but as I expected he had some pressing work related stuff related to a big 'deal' he was closing tomorrow that I had already known about. He talked with my dad a lot, guy talk, he was asking about him and his background and work, typical for my conservative 'stand up guy' dad who I've told my friend about many times. He knows about my family and he's never met them before, over the years we have shared a lot, more lately, about our parents. He said he really appreciated the offer and would be seeing them another time soon but had a lot on his plate with work stuff tonight to prepare for tomorrow (as I expected). It was nice of him to take his time out after a busy day at work and between other work stuff.

I'm curious to know your theories you speak of!

 

My mom said, "he's really a nice guy, the All American boy next door" and that is true. He's polite, puts himself together well, is smart and humble and is just a stand up dude, trustworthy and kind. He was raised well with good manners and has always had my back, and anyone he cares about. Spending time with him lately I've been finding him more attractive than I used to, he was also younger and maybe I didn't see him as a man, rather thought of him as just my friend's brother. I don't know if and when this would ever cross into romantic territory, but I've always had a crush on him but have been tied up in relationships with other guys, or he wasn't living in the area, or I just didn't notice that he liked me... but now I can really say that any girl would be lucky to have him. I'm feeling pretty intrigued right now. I just see how good of a person he is. As my friend foremost, he treats me very well and that is most attractive. Lately I've been noticing that he's acted a little more protective and caring. Maybe he always has and I haven't noticed.

 

After being treated badly and dumped by a guy I fell in love with not long ago, it is very appealing and compelling for me to be drawn to and excited about spending time with a good guy like him who I truly trust and respect and love spending time with. The guy who broke my heart was right in feeling threatened by him. He's so much better.

 

Sometimes I wonder how he thinks of me... as I said earlier I always used to see him as 'my friend's brother' but now I'm seeing him on a more personal level. I guess I kind of am looking at him in a different light lately, more as a man. If that makes sense. Maybe all these years he's also just thought of me as just his sister's friend... a girl in the group of friends. I don't know if he thinks of me in a different light now too. When he mentioned last week about a friend in the past telling him that he should pursue dating me, it made me think that his perspective of me had changed, since only recently, like in the past 3-4 months he's been bringing it up, the idea of us dating. It's like for the first time in all these years, he's been thinking of it, or vocalizing it anyway.

 

I have another male friend (who I mentioned earlier in this thread) who adores me and has known me for years through bad and good and seen me for who I am and who loves me, and fell in love with me. One day out of the blue, when I was 28 he looked at me and said, "I never saw you like this before, you've grown into a woman, I always saw you as just a teenager, like when I first met you." It was then that his feelings for me apparently changed. I kind of feel that way about this male friend now. And that's a nice feeling, it really is. It's.... pure and genuine.

 

I don't know what will become of this, but I do know that regardless he will be in my life for a long time, as a friend no matter what. I'm kind of just letting things happen as they will. I've said this a million times in this thread but I would be happy if we just have a friendship, I would be even more happy to have a romantic relationship with him too. It takes two though. I'm ready to explore it, I need more green lights so I'm consciously more receptive and paying close attention now. I really hope I'm not wrong in all this and I'm the only one getting butterflies.

 

Side note: a couple in our group of friends were platonic friends for 2 years but she always had a crush on him. Soon they were spending lots of free time together and got really close and became besties. One day last year he reached over and touched her hand, privately. One day when he said goodbye instead of kissing her on the cheek or a hug he gave her a peck on the lips. Soon he professed his feelings for her and said he loved her and wanted to be a couple. And they are all in now, talking about marriage. And they will be together for the long haul, it's a given. I think...I don't know, but I think that for some time it was a hurdle for him to cross that boundary because they had been friends and he didn't know how to enter the romantic realm with her. From what I know it took a little warming up but once they did, they have really gone all in. They were worried about announcing their relationship to the group because for some reason they were worried about how people would take it. Personally, I wasn't shocked at all and I told her I could see it long before they came out with it. I could tell it was only a matter of time. I don't know why history couldn't repeat itself, but anything is possible.

 

It was really nice to see him today. I look forward to the next time and I'm sure it won't be long.

 

Oh wait, I missed the part where you saw him today.... was it earlier in the day? Anyway, glad this happened even though it wasn't him coming with in the end. As for your example of your couple friends, yes that's what pretty much happened with all of my friends that are couples who were friends to begin with. Something to think about. Because i'm guessing yours would be similar way to happen.

 

Ok, love that your parents had good thoughts of him and that he spoke to your dad (like a guy who wanted to impress your dad would do, i.e. first clue).

 

So my theories were:

*if he acted suddenly weird and like he was avoiding the dinner, it would be much like a guy you were dating trying to avoid the dinner--commitment phobic and not wanting or resisting taking any steps further. Your guy didn't do this (unless he acted weird which it didn't sound like he did).

 

*if he went and was actively trying to impress your parents, i would say he was really close to making a move.

 

*lol, since he did something that lies within the two (going vs not going), i'd say he was probably a little nervous to conduct your relationship (as whatever it is that you usually do privately in front of others, especially parents). However, since he actively was a standup guy in conversation with your dad, I would say he tried to impress him, that's boyfriend-ish. lol, I guess in theory, it could be realtor-ish too but i tend to be optimistic on love things. And there has been the other evidence too. I think you just may need to make peace with a slower simmer & i think it will come around. Realize your frustration is because you want certain of the timeframes and usuals that come with normal dating vs friend-into-bf dating and having been a lot deflated by your last experience. Just keep making fun times with this guy. He also sounds like someone who will realize though it make take a while that someone, i.e. you, is his whole world but isn't over the top and emo pouncing on things (who often turn out wishy washy) but when he commits it will be for real. That's what I think. Ok good luck!

[Iris The Butterfly]

Oh wait, I missed the part where you saw him today.... was it earlier in the day? Anyway, glad this happened even though it wasn't him coming with in the end. As for your example of your couple friends, yes that's what pretty much happened with all of my friends that are couples who were friends to begin with. Something to think about. Because i'm guessing yours would be similar way to happen.

 

Ok, love that your parents had good thoughts of him and that he spoke to your dad (like a guy who wanted to impress your dad would do, i.e. first clue).

 

So my theories were:

*if he acted suddenly weird and like he was avoiding the dinner, it would be much like a guy you were dating trying to avoid the dinner--commitment phobic and not wanting or resisting taking any steps further. Your guy didn't do this (unless he acted weird which it didn't sound like he did).

 

*if he went and was actively trying to impress your parents, i would say he was really close to making a move.

 

*lol, since he did something that lies within the two (going vs not going), i'd say he was probably a little nervous to conduct your relationship (as whatever it is that you usually do privately in front of others, especially parents). However, since he actively was a standup guy in conversation with your dad, I would say he tried to impress him, that's boyfriend-ish. lol, I guess in theory, it could be realtor-ish too but i tend to be optimistic on love things. And there has been the other evidence too. I think you just may need to make peace with a slower simmer & i think it will come around. Realize your frustration is because you want certain of the timeframes and usuals that come with normal dating vs friend-into-bf dating and having been a lot deflated by your last experience. Just keep making fun times with this guy. He also sounds like someone who will realize though it make take a while that someone, i.e. you, is his whole world but isn't over the top and emo pouncing on things (who often turn out wishy washy) but when he commits it will be for real. That's what I think. Ok good luck!

 

So that was the last time we spoke or saw each other, it was last week. I think it is all good, I will likely see him again soon, although we haven't been in contact since the day after we saw each other. He was out of town over the weekend anyway. I don't want to get all excited and invested about this, as it is we are simply friends who happen to be flirting at this point. We're not dating so I don't expect the level of contact or time together to be like it would be if we were dating. I guess I do feel impatient, I'm lonely and I want a relationship and to be with someone I trust and enjoy being with... he would be a great partner. It would be great if the whole friendship thing wasn't holding him back or whatever it is.

 

I'm not looking to meet anyone, I'm not dating, I deleted my dating app and to be honest, I try and keep under the radar and am not actively trying to meet anyone right now due to my recent heartbreak. If someone asks me out and I'm interested, then yes I would go out with him. In the meantime, I'm just on my own. I think I'm especially drawn to my friend right now because he's a man who I like and who likes me, I enjoy the attention and time, and of course being with him.... I just would like more.

 

I think as long as I'm not dating anyone else, I'm available, and right now no potential dates or relationship in sight, so I do hope he acts on this window, if he is in fact interested in dating me. I've thought about it a lot... we couldn't just hook up or date. If we crossed that boundary I believe it would become a serious thing. I don't think there would be any turning back.

 

Going forward, in the meantime....I think I'm just going to continue to flirt more and be receptive. As long as he's acting the way he has been lately, I will be open to it.

[Iris The Butterfly]

Just a little update, nothing monumental. As I mentioned, I've noticed lately that he's been reaching out to me for seemingly meaningless reasons to communicate, which never really used to happen much, noticeably within the past couple months. I've probably been clueless and he always has in some way but I started taking the blinders off. When he contacts me it's not necessarily to plan to meet or to talk about plans in the group, or whatever. It's stuff like, "where do you like to get lunch around the office?" or "any idea where the nearest Starbucks is?" "how is your weekend going?" "happy Friday" "have a great time on your trip", stuff like that. I noticed myself doing the same in the past several months because.... well, I guess he was in my thoughts. We haven't seen each other since the night last week when my parents were there and he had told me he was going out of town this past weekend but he reached out today asking about places I like to get lunch around the office. So I mentioned a couple restaurants, one he says he likes too, I said we should go, he says yes let's do that, I said Friday works for me. I think that was him asking me to lunch. DUH. Before it seems like he would have just said, "hey want to grab lunch?" like.. asking a friend to meet for lunch, seems it would be effortless and you would just come right out and ask. What a sweet guy. It's really hard not to like him.

Edited August 2, 2018 by littlebridge

[Iris The Butterfly]

A little update and I'm really happy about it. Maybe still no reason to expect or think more than a close friendship but tonight I was invited to his family vacation this coming weekend. His sister invited me while I was there today having dinner, he was there also. She said she wanted to ask me something, after they had been talking alone outside. So I will be leaving later this week! I wonder who brought it up. But maybe she's starting to see something and she suggested... I wonder.

Tonight he said something really sweet to me that was just heart melting. She and I both looked at each other and shared a smile. Wow you guys, maybe this is the start of it?

[Iris The Butterfly]

Sadly, I didn't go on the trip this weekend after all. I was invited but apparently it turned out just to be an idea and when I agreed it wasn't yet confirmed with the host. Early the next morning the sister contacted me and said she was so sorry but she should have talked to the host first but that there was apparently a full house but next time for sure. I was very disappointed as this would have been a great opportunity for me to spend more time with him, his family, and get closer and maybe finally cross the romantic boundary. However, on the other hand, I'm happy that I was even invited on the trip. I missed the opportunity to drive up in the car with the friend, his sister, and her boyfriend. The foursome. It's an annual family vacation. Maybe they just invited me as a friend. But...

 

It seems to me that the sister has been saying things lately encouraging the 'relationship' ... and that is a recent thing. I have to move soon and he was mentioning a place coming available in his complex but it was a 2 bedroom. She chimed in and said, "oh you should just take him with you! (to move in). I was there for a bbq the other day when they suggested I come on the trip... he and I talked outside absorbed in conversation... she came into the kitchen to see us standing at the sink. I was washing dishes, he stood right next to me and helped, a song came on that I liked and I started singing, dancing a little.. we were laughing... I think she noticed something. Because I sure have been noticing something.

 

I'm not sure what it's going to take, or if it will happen at all. It's evident that when we are spending time together we are flirting, engaged, getting closer, his whole face lights up whenever he sees me. At this point I have no doubt anymore that he is interested and has a crush at least... but I don't know when or if we will ever cross that line. It could be months or years. I've been single since March and we've known each other for over 5 years and nothing has ever materialized. But to be honest, on my side it's only been very recently that I've looked at him as a real potential. I always just had a little crush and thought he was cute. It's only lately that I'm beginning to actually want to BE with him. I'm disappointed because this weekend would have been a perfect opportunity to get closer. And who's to say that if we ever were to cross the boundary, that we would date and be in a serious relationship? For all I know he could meet or be interested in someone else, or I could meet someone. I feel like the window of opportunity is open now. I don't want to miss it. Labor Day weekend is coming up and I'm assuming we will be spending time together.

 

I'm almost 35 and I really would like to settle down and get married and have a family. I'm not sure if that's in the cards for me, so I'm kind of accepting that may not be the case. I think that's why I'm feeling so impatient.

Edited August 26, 2018 by littlebridge

[Versacehottie]

Sadly, I didn't go on the trip this weekend after all. I was invited but apparently it turned out just to be an idea and when I agreed it wasn't yet confirmed with the host. Early the next morning the sister contacted me and said she was so sorry but she should have talked to the host first but that there was apparently a full house but next time for sure.<SNIP>

 

good update. Listen, I'm totally pulling for this guy (and you!) but I wonder if feeling like you do (bolded) seeps throughout your actions/communications with him. I 100% believe that if you feel/think these thoughts they will. A person thinks they can hide them but they really can't even if they don't convey them directly. This could be one part of why he is hesitating.

 

Anyway, since you do want this for yourself & are "ready', well you owe it to yourself to try to get it. There are no guarantees with this guy or anyone but you want to cover your bases and be your own best advocate for the life you want. which in this case will meaning putting yourself out there to date others as well. I think that will make you feel less impatient and help whatever vibes you might be giving off that would scare a guy away dissipate. Good luck

Edited August 28, 2018 by a LoveShack.org Moderator

[Iris The Butterfly]

Need to vent.

 

Thank you, Versace. I am still talking to and going on dates with other men. I was involved with and in a serious relationship with men all throughout my friendship with him and he met the last guy I was dating earlier this year. The only thing I noticed of interest about my friend that would indicate he didn't like other men in the picture is that he said he didn't like that the guy did xyz this one time and was protective and defended me, even saying once how that guy was an idiot. Since he left the picture is when I started noticing my friend was flirting and seemed interested, we started to spend time one on one and he started acting like he was my date instead of just a friend.

 

I wonder sometimes if I'm putting too much stock into it. I think after my breakup I was so down and heartbroken, I remembered that guy had said that my friend was "totally in love" with me. So I found this light in the darkness, and I really thought there was something there. And there IS. But...I don't think he's making any moves other than flirting and thinking about it, rationalizing it in his own mind. He's had plenty of time to know me and many opportunities. It's just recently that I noticed things seemed different.

 

My worry is that I will date and meet other men and maybe get involved with someone again soon and that this opportunity will be lost. Or he will meet someone. When I first posted this thread I hadn't come to grips that he liked me more than a friend, but now I see that he does.

 

We work in the same building and see each other coming in and out very frequently in just the past week. He always stops and gives me a hug and says hello. One of my coworkers asked, "who was THAT?!" Because he approached me and my group while on a call outside and hugged me. "Oh, that's just my friend..." That's all he is.

 

When we were standing in the kitchen last week after dinner, I was washing dishes and he stood right next to me, I was singing and dancing a little, we were laughing.. it reminded me of how I felt with the guy I was with before, doing things just like that. It had a romantic undertone to it... and I felt it, maybe because I want it so much.. and I do want it with him. This is a new feeling for me. Before it was just a little crush, I thought he was cute and nice but he was just my friend's brother. But lately I see him more in a potential relationship capacity. It's very frustrating that he acts the way he does and clearly likes me and is giving off clear body language signals that he's attracted. I realize something is holding him back, I always thought it was the friendship factor.

 

But now I wonder if maybe it's true... he knows that I want something serious and want to settle down. I've been vocal about that in my friendships and he knows. I don't have to hide it, it's known. And I think for most PEOPLE in their early-mid thirties, they want to settle down. Most of his friends and mine are married with kids or in serious relationships. I've wondered since he's a couple years younger he just may be not at that point. Maybe he doesn't want a girlfriend, maybe he just wants to play the field and not have anything serious which would explain the stalling. However, he admitted to me recently that he's never been in love. His sister said he's never brought a girl around or to his family. He told me he's had short term flings and nothing ever serious which is strange for a guy his age (almost 32). Maybe he doesn't know how to act and is shy. Honestly I think his sister has picked up on some signals lately that he's giving off, which is why she has been encouraging things along. He said not long ago that a former friend always spoke so highly of me to him, saying how I'm so great and pretty and nice, etc. "as if I should date you" (as if he was thinking about it, he said it out loud, in front of his sister too). He's not the only one who has suggested it, my friends have recently too. If we were to date it would be supported and encouraged, at least that's good to know.

 

I can't say that I'm scaring him or anyone off, but I think if a guy doesn't want anything serious he would be hesitant to date me knowing that I want something more. Which is why the other guy left and maybe why my friend isn't pursuing it. He wouldn't want to lead me on. Flirting and being friendly and engaging, etc. isn't the same as pursuing a relationship. He obviously feels perfectly content keeping things as they are. Although just lately like I've said things have seemed different between us. I'm just not really sure it's going anywhere. It seems to be stuck in limbo. And when I was invited on that trip last weekend, I was excited to spend time with him and get to know his family more. Then I wonder and feel self conscious if he hesitated and the offer was reneged because he felt uncomfortable. It was his sister's suggestion, they talked about it, but she was the one who extended the invite.

 

I've come to the reluctant acceptance that I may not have kids anytime soon or ever, but I still want to find my partner and someone to share my life with. He's turned out to be someone I can see a future with. So it's hard dating other people knowing that someone I really like and can see a future with and who likes me too is right in front of me. As far as his intentions, he has shared with me that he wants to get married and have kids in the next couple years. He may be just a little behind me though.

 

When he found out a couple months ago that I had another prospect, (another male friend admitted after many years that he was in love with me, wanted to be together and wanted to marry me)... I didn't bring it up, we were having dinner, his invitation, his dime... he stopped and looked at my left hand and said, "So I hear you had a proposal?" He's aware that other men are or would be interested... he's not doing anything about it. We're not dating. So yes, I will continue to date other men. Who knows, I might meet someone and start something, he might, and all this will ever turn out to be is a flirtatious friendship.

 

Feeling stuck. I think that the failed trip got me down.

Edited August 28, 2018 by littlebridge

[Iris The Butterfly]

Ok, so it's still moving slow as molasses but in my opinion something is definitely changing. I'm getting very frustrated but I know (hope) that it's only a matter of time.

 

Last time I posted I was invited on the family trip, and it didn't work out. We saw each other the following weekend (the weekend before last) for dinner, the 'double date' as usual. When I was with him at the restaurant he acted like we were a couple. It really felt like it. It was all very cozy, he picked out the wine, we sat next to each other and talked quietly, he picked up the tab. Usually when we are out as friends we have split the bill but I've noticed over the past several months if we go out to eat now he's starting to pay for me. That's a date.

 

It feels really comfortable being with him in that way. I guess it's good to start ACTING like we are dating instead of just friends, that seems that it would encourage the transition. After dinner we went to a local bar and played pool, doubles. The way he was treating me that night, or lately... I don't know, I noticed a tenderness in the way he was talking to me that wasn't there before or that I never noticed. We found ourselves talking alone at a table for a little bit, we were sitting close and smiling, he was talking about the lake house where they went for the family vacation, and next year I will come. Next year, huh? I mean, I know that he and his sister will always be my friends... but for me to be included in that trip is really a big deal I think. Another thing that happened kind of recently is that he started acting more protective. I know, all the signs are there.

 

We usually communicate every couple days and usually see each other over each weekend unless we are out of town.

 

Over this past weekend he got in touch and we met in a big group at the beach. Later we resumed our typical double date night. Had bbq and played cards and drank wine. At one point in the evening, we were sitting across the living room from each other. I looked up, and I don't know who was looking first, but there were no words, no smile, we just held the gaze for a good two or three seconds. We have never looked at each other like that before. It was very different. There was no context that we would be looking at each other, usually we would make eye contact in conversation or a smile upon first sight. But that look was pretty intense and more like, "I want you." Whatever it was it was different.

 

I'm getting frustrated but it's actually very exciting. Clearly something has shifted. I want to nudge it along but I don't want to make any bold moves. I would rather he be the one to 'pursue' it. If we crossed over from friendship to romantic territory, it would be a big deal I think! So I don't want to force or pursue it if he's not fully comfortable, you know? I have been flirting openly, touching him, being very receptive and feminine and trying to encourage him to take the reigns on it if this is to move forward. I feel that he is shy but he's also old fashioned and I could see would want to take the 'pursuer' role. In my experience driving any kind of pursuit with a guy doesn't work out. So I'm just laying down all the signs that I am receptive to his 'advances'.

 

I am moving at the end of the month. He took it upon himself to offer to help me move and assisted in my rental search. (Long story, I'm not buying yet but still renting for now). I plan to hire movers but I appreciate his offer, I mean I could take it but instead he said he would come help me unpack and set up, order some pizza. He did that when he moved in, I happened to come over and helped him unpack. So maybe he just wants to return the favor. But... I hope that we would have an opportunity to be alone at that time... that would be perfect. I would love his help setting up my new place.

 

In the meantime, I am still talking to other guys, I went out on a date last night and have another this week. It kind of feels strange going out with other men when I have feelings for my friend. But it takes two people to want to be in a relationship. Earlier this year I went through terrible heartbreak with a guy that really liked me but didn't want/wasn't ready for a relationship. I don't know if D feels the same. Maybe he doesn't want anything serious, but he likes me and it's easy to flirt. But that doesn't mean he's willing to take it to the next level. I wish he would because I would love to date him! I can absolutely picture myself being with him long term.

 

And something new... for me... is that I'm starting have very strong romantic and sexual desire for him. That is totally new, we've known each other for over 5 years and I've never thought of him in that way. I thought he was cute and nice but now I'm thinking of him sexually. The other night when he looked at me like that, all I wanted to do was get over there next to him and hug and kiss and cuddle. I hope someday very soon we will!

 

I've decided to talk to his sister about it. I know it's kind of silly but I'm surprised that I never have brought it up to her. It's reached a point that it seems like it would be obvious to other people. I wanted to get her input, tell her my feelings had grown, and well... I don't know what good it will do but she might help to encourage it along. Do you think that is a bad idea? She is one of my closest friends. I met her first and later on through mutual friends I met her brother.

[preraph]

You know what? Maybe leave his sister out of it. You know how siblings will tease and make you feel like a jerk sometimes. Maybe what he needs is to not keep having his sister in the middle!

 

It's encouraging he acted like you were his date, so I agree he's moving slow as molasses, but hey, if this is how he wants to do it, maybe he'll speed up at some point. I really think you need to break away from always being the double date at some point. I mean, would you want your sister to see you try to kiss her friend? He's be self-conscious. Why don't you invite him and only him to do something and not even tell her about it and see what happens.

[Iris The Butterfly]

You know what? Maybe leave his sister out of it. You know how siblings will tease and make you feel like a jerk sometimes. Maybe what he needs is to not keep having his sister in the middle!

 

It's encouraging he acted like you were his date, so I agree he's moving slow as molasses, but hey, if this is how he wants to do it, maybe he'll speed up at some point. I really think you need to break away from always being the double date at some point. I mean, would you want your sister to see you try to kiss her friend? He's be self-conscious. Why don't you invite him and only him to do something and not even tell her about it and see what happens.

 

Ok, but we have had more than a couple one on one opportunities to 'see what happens' and nothing has happened besides flirting, getting to know each other more, etc. When alone he has been more forward physically and with flirting I guess but doesn't make any bold clear moves like a kiss or profession of feelings. When he offered to help me unpack/move, that would have been a one on one. We certainly have the opportunity to be one on one. Not sure why it doesn't happen more frequently. It's kind of like, "we should get lunch this week", or "next time you go to such and such let me know I would like to come with you". Sometimes the timing or schedules don't align, sometimes they do.

 

I see what you mean about not being a double date all the time. In my free weekends, either I go on a date with someone else, not spend time with anyone at all, or spend time with my friends. Spending time with my friends jus happens to include the double date group. It's not ALL the time, maybe a couple times a month or so. You have a point about not wanting to see your sister see you kiss her friend, but on the other hand we aren't in high school. We're in our 30s. I am so close to her so it has seemed odd that I've never told her my feelings about it. I suppose I don't have to but I thought maybe sharing my feelings might prompt her shedding some light on the situation.

But I see why you would encourage leaving her out of it.

 

I think he is self conscious about making a move in general, whether or not she is there. Maybe just a matter of time at this point?! It seems like plenty of time has passed, I mean it's been over 5 years that we've known each other. He's had plenty of opportunities to make a move. But he's only recently started to act differently, just within the past 6 months. Coincidentally I'm recently single/available as of 6 months ago. So maybe it's happening, just painfully slowly. I feel like it's just building, it's happening but not much has changed on a monthly basis. Minor changes but definitely noticeable. I kind of noticed something shifted earlier in the summer. And that look the other day, that was definitely something brand new. So maybe that slow burn will continue. It would be nice to start now.

Edited September 11, 2018 by littlebridge

[preraph]

It is painfully slow, but maybe it will be worth the wait. If he's this slow moving, then at least he won't be flitting around and cheating and all that. You won't have to worry about that unless you really manage somehow to inflate his ego with regular sex!

 

His behavior has changed. He took you on a real date and paid for your dinner. It's a step in the right direction. I hate to bring it up, but you may have to resort to some old cliche "come on" techniques like next time he's over, asking him to get a kink out of your neck. Geez, I just hope he's not gay and can't face it or something. But you said his face lights up when he sees you, so maybe not. Do you think he's a 30-year-old virgin or do you know if he's had a girlfriend before? I just hope he doesn't have a performance problem or something that prevents him from getting something started. That does happen, but now with Viagra and all, it's not as common. You should start just touching his arm and leg or back every now and then while talking to him. I hate it when a man won't just go for it. How is he on other things in life? Does he have a good job? Is he assertive enough in daily living or passive about everything? Like does he let AT&T run his bill up or would he take a stand on something and contest it? Because I had this gay bf once and it drove me nuts how passive he was! I wouldn't want that in a husband. I'd want him to take the bull by the horns on daily issues that come up in life.

[Versacehottie]

Oh great, more good news. I think this is all going really well. I think you should definitely let him help you set things up in your new place. That will be some good alone time.

 

As far as the sister goes, I'm really on the fence--leaning toward no. My general opinion about involved friends or relatives to help a romance along (unless the guy/girl is a stranger to you or just met once or twice--none of which are your situation) is not to have them get involved. I think it puts the other person on the spot and they may feel really strongly about not having others involved in their business like they are a baby (a scenario I can somewhat imagine with your guy, since it's his older sister that would have the message or information in advance of him). More importantly, a friend or relative can get the "message" wrong. In a way you will have a third party influencing the outcome of this crucial period. People often have agendas and opinions which even for good reasons go wrong when trying to do the business for YOUR heart.

 

I know you say you just want to ask her what his story is. But on one hand she probably will want to get involved and take the message back to him or try to help you get together or not or update you on people he is dating (info you don't need to know as I think he clearly likes you and it will just cause you to censor what you are acting like which is working). In her case, she can really really care about you but he is and always will be her brother and her loyalty is probably with him, in whichever way it manifests itself.

 

So yeah I lean toward no. It might make him feel emasculated or like he still is the little brother. for the record (which i never thought about this during your situation until now) but a serious bf of mine was my best friend's brother. I didn't have her help me when he and i got together -- or when we broke up either. Even the minor discussions we had that involved his & my status or whatever were not as gratifying as I might have hoped--since she has to be loyal to her brother and not break his confidence or throw him under the bus or anything. She helped a tiny bit and probably hurt things a little bit. Plus things you would want to tell your best friend about your bf, you can't always. He was her older brother so that is a little different and I had known him as part of our friend group for a while (so that's the same) but when we decided we liked each other it was pretty immediate so that was different than your situation. idk, if i was in your situation I would want "our" story to be ours.

 

ok, don't think i'm doom and gloom about the sister thing. I just think things are going in the right direction completely so you don't need "help" or his sister to give him a little push (which is probably what you'd really want from this conversation if we were being honest). Ok good luck! I love this!

[Iris The Butterfly]

His behavior has changed. He took you on a real date and paid for your dinner. It's a step in the right direction. I hate to bring it up, but you may have to resort to some old cliche "come on" techniques like next time he's over, asking him to get a kink out of your neck. Geez, I just hope he's not gay and can't face it or something. But you said his face lights up when he sees you, so maybe not. Do you think he's a 30-year-old virgin or do you know if he's had a girlfriend before? I just hope he doesn't have a performance problem or something that prevents him from getting something started. That does happen, but now with Viagra and all, it's not as common. You should start just touching his arm and leg or back every now and then while talking to him. I hate it when a man won't just go for it. How is he on other things in life? Does he have a good job? Is he assertive enough in daily living or passive about everything?

 

Yes, you're right, things have changed. This is not the first 'date' either. Things like this have been happening over the past several months. This last time we were in our foursome at dinner, a common event. There have been times that he and I are alone but not too much so recently. Still, you are right that things have changed. I can just tell by the way he acting towards me lately that something has changed. Like more tender and asking me a lot of pressing personal questions, being more protective and compassionate, even teasing when he didn't really used to.

He is not gay but he is very inexperienced in relationships. He told me not too long ago that he's never been in love. I also know from his sister that he's never brought a girl around the family. (I've met his family before just being friends for so long with his sister). He told me he's never had a serious relationship but only short term flings and nothing substantial. Awhile ago we both talked about how we were both on Bumble, I heard that he was talking with someone but he said nothing materialized (this was through the grapevine and this was months ago).

 

We rarely have had alone alone time, like alone in each others' houses together. It's happened a couple times not long ago, and well, we were sitting on the couch very close. I think he got nervous. He's definitely not gay because I've seen him flirt with girls before and his face definitely lights up when he sees me. The guy I was dating who first pointed this out earlier this year said, "he's totally in love with you. I can tell by the sparkle in his eyes and the way he talks about you." So no, not gay. Doubtful he's a virgin either.

 

He's a very confident, secure person in his professional life and has a great job. He's a take charge kind of guy in all social settings and very polite and a gentleman at all times. He's definitely not passive. Not at all. But one thing he is inexperienced with women and dating. Which is surprising because he's such a catch and very handsome. I've seen other women who have been interested in him over the years, for example one of my friends years ago, one of his sister's friends currently, but he seems to balk, stays friendly but doesn't lead them on or date them. At least the women I've seen surrounding him in the time that I've known him.

 

I've usually been the one attached. I'm a relationship person and have plenty of long term experience with men. He's met my ex boyfriend and the guy I was dating earlier this year on multiple occasions. I've been 'single' and available since March, which is when he started to show more interest. I've mentioned this before but recently I had an old friend profess his love after a very long long time of being just friends and said he wanted to marry me. That person came up in conversation the other night. His sister said, "oh, that's the guy that asked her to marry him." And my friend (who had asked me about it before) said, "you said no, right?" As if I was secretly engaged!!

I remember when that other guy was trying to move the relationship forward a couple months my friend was also initiating and we were spending more time together. I found myself more interested in my friend than the guy who wanted to date me officially and intended to propose... so this is where I've ended up. I let the other guy go and stayed friendly but incidentally have been growing closer to this guy. During that same time frame he started becoming interested in whether I was going on dates. Once I think he asked me if I was free the next day and I said no, he asked if I had a date and I did. That was in March or April. The sister's bf asked me the other night if I had a date the night before because I was out with other people doing a different activity. It wasn't a date but I have to wonder if I sometimes make myself more scarce he might start to wonder and be more inclined to act. Hmm.

 

Oh great, more good news. I think this is all going really well. I think you should definitely let him help you set things up in your new place. That will be some good alone time.

 

As far as the sister goes, I'm really on the fence--leaning toward no. My general opinion about involved friends or relatives to help a romance along (unless the guy/girl is a stranger to you or just met once or twice--none of which are your situation) is not to have them get involved. I think it puts the other person on the spot and they may feel really strongly about not having others involved in their business like they are a baby (a scenario I can somewhat imagine with your guy, since it's his older sister that would have the message or information in advance of him). More importantly, a friend or relative can get the "message" wrong. In a way you will have a third party influencing the outcome of this crucial period. People often have agendas and opinions which even for good reasons go wrong when trying to do the business for YOUR heart.

 

I know you say you just want to ask her what his story is. But on one hand she probably will want to get involved and take the message back to him or try to help you get together or not or update you on people he is dating (info you don't need to know as I think he clearly likes you and it will just cause you to censor what you are acting like which is working). In her case, she can really really care about you but he is and always will be her brother and her loyalty is probably with him, in whichever way it manifests itself.

 

So yeah I lean toward no. It might make him feel emasculated or like he still is the little brother. for the record (which i never thought about this during your situation until now) but a serious bf of mine was my best friend's brother. I didn't have her help me when he and i got together -- or when we broke up either. Even the minor discussions we had that involved his & my status or whatever were not as gratifying as I might have hoped--since she has to be loyal to her brother and not break his confidence or throw him under the bus or anything. She helped a tiny bit and probably hurt things a little bit. Plus things you would want to tell your best friend about your bf, you can't always. He was her older brother so that is a little different and I had known him as part of our friend group for a while (so that's the same) but when we decided we liked each other it was pretty immediate so that was different than your situation. idk, if i was in your situation I would want "our" story to be ours.

 

ok, don't think i'm doom and gloom about the sister thing. I just think things are going in the right direction completely so you don't need "help" or his sister to give him a little push (which is probably what you'd really want from this conversation if we were being honest). Ok good luck! I love this!

 

I think you are right about the sister. She and I are very close so I'm tempted to talk to her about my feelings. She asked me not too long ago if I was dating anyone recently and I said eh, I've gone out with a few people online but nothing has made it past a date or a couple dates. I'm not really divulging much and that is different. If I was actually involved with someone she would definitely know about it. I'm tempted to get her input but I agree with you that she should not be the link between us or 'help'. Like I've said before I used to only think of him as my friend's little brother but lately I'm seeing him as a man and someone I'm romantically interested in. So her involvement should be less because of that change in my view. I get that. I won't say anything.

 

In the meantime, although it seems dishonest to my true feelings, I will continue to date and be open to other men. And I'll see him soon I'm sure. I won't move anything forward or try to pursue him, but continue as I have been with the flirtation, touching his arm, hugging, getting close, being a little more physical and feminine. I'll be happy to let him continue to pick up the tab and treat me like his date if that's what he wants. That part is easy for me to do because it feels natural. I think if all this continues for much longer it's going to come to a breaking point and he will be the one to act. I also think that if I'm not always available then maybe he will start to wonder and take initiative. Like this coming weekend for example. I have plans Friday with a friend and busy Saturday, talking to someone online who I may meet that afternoon. He reaches out anyway but I'm sure if I stay quiet he might be more compelled to make an invitation or to see me alone. I don't mean to play games but I can see that the involvement with the friend group/double date setting may be making things complacent. I'll change that up.

[Iris The Butterfly]

Just wanted to post a long overdue update. Nothing changed. He just wanted to be friends. I met someone in October and have been together ever since, things are becoming serious and he recently made it 'official'. My friend has met him several times and his only comment was how much older my new boyfriend is than me. (He's 14 years older).

 

I'm disappointed nothing became of it, but we've maintained our friendship and I'm sure will always be friends. I think he's just at a point that he's still playing around and he's not looking for anything serious. He knows I am, and maybe that has prevented him from acting if he did in fact have feelings for me. I've decided he does sincerely like me as a person and friend, but he's not interested in dating me. There's been plenty of opportunities over many years. I was getting so frustrated over the summer, I decided to pull back and give up and focus on men who were actually pursuing me. I did, and now I have a boyfriend that is leading into serious territory... 4 months in.