Do you believe the phrase "Once a cheater, always a cheater"

[JuneJulySeptember]

Well...i lied one time...i stole one time...i cheated one time

 

Does that make me a liar a thief and a cheater for life?

 

no it doesn't

 

 

Everything is circumstances.

 

Stealing a pen from the office is different from stealing $5000 from your mother.

 

And there's different levels of cheating.

 

I like to tell the story of this woman from my college who slept with her boyfriend's best friend at her boyfriend's birthday party and the days previous to that slept with another guy.

 

I think the personality type/priorities that led to the decisions to commit those acts kind of stays with you. She was/is a person who is a very spontaneous thrill seeker and very much an emotional roller coaster.

 

I mean, yes, people can change personalities, but they rarely do. You can see from this forum, people barely even budge an inch when presented with a varying viewpoint on dating/life.

 

So, it depends. But if I find out my GF did some crap like above to one of her ex-BFs, I would seriously considering ending it right there. Other types of infidelity I could forgive, maybe even if done to me. Maybe.

 

That said, I don't think cheating is that bad for most people, considering 50% or so of people have cheated.

Edited July 15, 2017 by JuneJulySeptember

[Midwestmissy]

A severe consequence in my wh case was losing the respect of our oldest son who then left for college. It's a tense, wary relationship where there was once a closeness. That's severe, and I know it's not one that was ever considered. It's a huge loss.

 

My son's experience through all this was his own. Each person in the same house experienced different feelings with the same situation. My wh was not in control of any of the outcomes - he was pretty surprised and humbled by that. My son doesn't have a lot of contact with my in laws as a result. He was flat out disgusted, this occurred at a very crucial time in his coming of age, and he formed very strong opinions.

 

My wh acknowledges that all of this was a result of the choices he made. He accepts all the blame. To act that entitled again is hard for him to grasp, I think. It wasn't worth it. He sees my relationship with the kids, our home life, our day to day, and sees what he was willing to give up. He's the one who lost big. Being a well off white man in North America is like winning the lottery in this world, and he wanted more like a bratty whiny tantrum filled toddler, without consequence. You handle that kind of toddler by walking away, which I did. He sees how selfish and stupid that was. To cheat again is to effectively lose everything. Everything is now in my name, and he can't buy respect anyway, at least from people you want in your life.

[JuneJulySeptember]

A severe consequence in my wh case was losing the respect of our oldest son who then left for college. It's a tense, wary relationship where there was once a closeness. That's severe, and I know it's not one that was ever considered. It's a huge loss.

 

My son's experience through all this was his own. Each person in the same house experienced different feelings with the same situation. My wh was not in control of any of the outcomes - he was pretty surprised and humbled by that. My son doesn't have a lot of contact with my in laws as a result. He was flat out disgusted, this occurred at a very crucial time in his coming of age, and he formed very strong opinions.

 

My wh acknowledges that all of this was a result of the choices he made. He accepts all the blame. To act that entitled again is hard for him to grasp, I think. It wasn't worth it. He sees my relationship with the kids, our home life, our day to day, and sees what he was willing to give up. He's the one who lost big. Being a well off white man in North America is like winning the lottery in this world, and he wanted more like a bratty whiny tantrum filled toddler, without consequence. You handle that kind of toddler by walking away, which I did. He sees how selfish and stupid that was. To cheat again is to effectively lose everything. Everything is now in my name, and he can't buy respect anyway, at least from people you want in your life.

 

Yes, that happened to my father's friend. The wife cheated and the almost college age daughter refused to speak to the mother. The younger son, who was about my age, was more forgiving.

[elaine567]

I would like to ask...what would be classified SEVERE consequences? and who dictates them?

 

That is up to the individual.

To some the consequence may be internal guilt, no-one will ever find out, it was a ONS, but they have ongoing guilt they may find it very difficult to live with.

To another they may have had the full blown d-day, casualties everywhere and thrown out of house and home, but they may not see that as "severe" consequences at all, and will happily do it all again.

[aileD]

Yes, that happened to my father's friend. The wife cheated and the almost college age daughter refused to speak to the mother. The younger son, who was about my age, was more forgiving.

 

 

Yeah things are horrible between my 16 year old daughter and her dad since he cheated.

[Mrs. John Adams]

That is up to the individual.

To some the consequence may be internal guilt, no-one will ever find out, it was a ONS, but they have ongoing guilt they may find it very difficult to live with.

To another they may have had the full blown d-day, casualties everywhere and thrown out of house and home, but they may not see that as "severe" consequences at all, and will happily do it all again.

 

So what i might think is a horrible consequence...you may not think is a consequence at all.

 

SO then why do we read so much on this forum about people judging other peoples consequences? When in reality...they cannot possible know if there were consequences or not?

[misspalmy]

in most cases its tru, they have to want to change, but if if people keep taking cheaters back they will unlikey not change,

[minimariah]

True. The "I would nevers" scare me. Pride goes before the fall and all that. Arrogance MAKES one vulnerable.

 

while i agree with this...

 

folks being afraid of using the words NEVER & ALWAYS - it's a red flag. to not have at least ONE thing you can claim for sure, at one point of your life... and we all know that the future is unpredictable, for sure. but to not being able to have ONE thing as ALWAYS or NEVER statement shows something very much lacking in one's character and decisiveness. i've learned that folks with the "never say never" mantra almost always have one foot out, in almost everything they do.

[knabe]

while i agree with this...

 

folks being afraid of using the words NEVER & ALWAYS - it's a red flag. to not have at least ONE thing you can claim for sure, at one point of your life... and we all know that the future is unpredictable, for sure. but to not being able to have ONE thing as ALWAYS or NEVER statement shows something very much lacking in one's character and decisiveness. i've learned that folks with the "never say never" mantra almost always have one foot out, in almost everything they do.

 

I disagree. But I understand why you feel that way.

[dichotomy]

There are no ex-alcoholics only clean and sober ones.

 

When you understand you can and did cross a line - its up to you to accept, understand why and what, and manage it.

 

We all have weakness, most often revealing themselves under stress.

Edited July 16, 2017 by dichotomy

[OneLov]

I don't believe that to be true. But I can understand how cynicism can make one feel more comfortable navigating the uncharted waters of life. It's impossible for me personally to categorize people because we are dynamic and capable of change. Due to that reasoning, I choose to approach life with the attitude that the glass is half full.

[Echo74]

Has anyone here who has been in a relationship for over 10 years, cheated (or spouse/partner cheated), reconciled/therapy, and never cheated again?

 

I'm just really curious because I go out with a group of ladies who are either going through a divorce or are separated because their spouses have cheated at least twice. One gal is going through her second divorce because both ex's were two time cheaters. So it leads me to believe that once a cheater, always a cheater. Thoughts?

[carhill]

Once one has lied one will always be a liar and once one has cheated one will always be a cheater, until one is dead.

 

So, whom have we lied to and whom have we cheated on during the entirety of our lives? Hold the mirror up. It's forever, folks. Of course, we can tell people anything we want. Billions of them around. New ones being made every hour.

 

My mantra is I'm faithful today. Can't predict the future, the past is the past, others do what they do and I have no control over it.

 

I have a good female friend my age who pretty much hates men due to being cheated on during her marriage, for many years and iterations. Fair enough. IDK, to me life is to short for such hate. Those males, and cheaters, out there, well they could care less. What does it matter to them that she hates men? Zippo. They do what they do.

 

I ran into that kind of stuff, though not as often as MW's, in my earlier life. Most seemed to work it out. Some, like the lady in my example, get entrenched in the hate and grow old alone. I guess that's one solution. One thing is for sure. She'll always have been cheated on. Never goes away until the grim reaper comes.

[Gaeta]

On very rare occasion it's possible for people to work through it. My friend got pregnant at 14 years old and her boyfriend was 18. They moved in together and fast forward 10 years later they ran into some problems. All of their life they only had been with each other and he was wondering how it would be with someone else. He cheated with their neighbor and got caught by my friend.

 

At first she left him and later decided to work on things. They went into counselling and patched thigs up. They now have been together 35 years. I do beleive he was going through a personal crisis from being a dad at 18. He never knew dating and just enjoying being a young man, he got in the army at 18 and from there became a devoted father. It caught up with him.

 

It's one of the very few times a relationship survived cheating.

 

Statistics says 50% of cheating couples will chose to stay together but only 10% of those will make it long term. So no chances of surviving a cheating partner is extremely low.

[carhill]

It would be interesting to delineate the results, accepting that self-reporting can be fraught with lies and half-truths, between....

 

1. Cheating discovered/disclosed

2. Cheating not discovered/disclosed

3. Infidelity, meaning no cheating was involved, fully transparent

 

Everyone who's cheated has been unfaithful but not everyone who's been unfaithful has cheated. Does it matter? Successful reconciliations of the differing types of infidelity would be interesting, if anecdotal, to track. I've pretty much seen them all.

 

Imagine, as an example, one has cheated on one's spouse and that spouse dies never finding out or being told and one has, once done cheating, remained faithful. Is one always a cheater? If that person's spouse was asked, what would be their answer? Interesting.

[Steve51]

My experience is that once a cheater, always a cheater. I saw this in my own relationships and those of my friends. However, it does not have to be that way. Read this to see how to recognize who will cheat again or not:

 

Once A Cheater, Always A Cheater? Marriage Therapists Weigh In | HuffPost

[Echo74]

My experience is that once a cheater, always a cheater. I saw this in my own relationships and those of my friends. However, it does not have to be that way. Read this to see how to recognize who will cheat again or not:

 

Once A Cheater, Always A Cheater? Marriage Therapists Weigh In | HuffPost

 

Hmmm...interesting.

 

So regarding my friend who is twice divorced because of infidelity. I'm wondering if the type of guys she has chooses has anything to do with it. You know, maybe she tends to choose a certain type of guy and that type are cheaters?

[Sweetfish]

Hmmm...interesting.

 

So regarding my friend who is twice divorced because of infidelity. I'm wondering if the type of guys she has chooses has anything to do with it. You know, maybe she tends to choose a certain type of guy and that type are cheaters?

 

Depends. What kind of guys is she dating?

[Echo74]

Depends. What kind of guys is she dating?

 

Although we met 20 years ago, we only became friends in the recent months when I bumped into her at an event so I have no idea. She said she would never have suspected her STBEX as the a-hole he's turned out to be. She's the one who thought perhaps she needs to change the type of guys she dates...when she does start dating again. The men she seems to be interested in now are high level executive types who are more her equal than her ex. (She was the bread-winner).

 

It seems so weird that all three ladies who are in the same boat as me (separated or going through divorce) have dealt with infidelity in their marriage.

[mikeylo]

This topic comes up often.

 

I feel that the label will always be there even if they don't cheat again. Most likely they do again.

[somanymistakes]

My gut feeling is that there's two categories:

 

people who did it once, saw how much of a disaster it was, and never want to go through that again

 

and people for whom it's a perpetual weakness

 

 

So if someone confesses to you that they once cheated in their youth, that doesn't mean they'll be unfaithful again. On the other hand, if you look at someone who's left every past relationship they've been in through cheating, even if they swear they've turned over a new leaf, you know they're probably going to cheat again.

[understand50]

My gut feeling is that there's two categories:

 

people who did it once, saw how much of a disaster it was, and never want to go through that again

 

and people for whom it's a perpetual weakness

 

 

So if someone confesses to you that they once cheated in their youth, that doesn't mean they'll be unfaithful again. On the other hand, if you look at someone who's left every past relationship they've been in through cheating, even if they swear they've turned over a new leaf, you know they're probably going to cheat again.

 

I think this hits it on the head. The general statement, "Once a cheater, always a cheater?" does apply to some, but not to others. We have several WS here on LS, that it would not apply to. We also have posting of other situation, where it does to a large degree.

 

As in everything, affairs come in many sizes and types, from the one time aberration, to the long standing many AP type, and everything in between. Figuring out what you are dealing with, whether, you are a BS, or WS, is critical, because you may want to try and reconcile with a spouse who had a aberration type affair, and run like hell from the serial cheater. For a WS, trying to figure out why you did this, you need to understand yourself.

 

My two cents.....

[dichotomy]

My WW has not cheated since Dday 12 years ago. She had a history even before we met of non monogamy and multiple intimate relationships at the same time.

 

but without going into all the complicated details - she retains certain mindsets, morals, weakness, characteristics, lack of full developed boundaries, or even just shades of polyamory or something like that .....that leaves her open to it more than others.

 

She is for sure less likely to cheat now, but she has it in her. I would say I have also noticed occasionally minor drifting into behaviors normal non cheaters do not engage in.

 

She also knows I am "aware" (woke? diligent?) and would give her the boot in a second and she places high value our family and home life as do I.

 

My two cents is it that it in our/her case it feels like alcoholism. They say there are NO cured alcoholics - only sober ones.

 

So yes its been over 10 years - of no cheating but I would not say its because she is cured of it. If that makes any sense.

 

but I understand more now then ever - that cheating happens and its possible or a risk with anyone - especially under certain circumstances.

Edited September 15, 2017 by dichotomy

[Echo74]

My WW has not cheated since Dday 12 years ago. She had a history even before we met of non monogamy and multiple intimate relationships at the same time.

 

but without going into all the complicated details - she retains certain mindsets, morals, weakness, characteristics, lack of full developed boundaries, or even just shades of polyamory or something like that .....that leaves her open to it more than others.

 

She is for sure less likely to cheat now, but she has it in her. I would say I have also noticed occasionally minor drifting into behaviors normal non cheaters do not engage in.

 

She also knows I am "aware" (woke? diligent?) and would give her the boot in a second and she places high value our family and home life as do I.

 

My two cents is it that it in our/her case it feels like alcoholism. They say there are NO cured alcoholics - only sober ones.

 

So yes its been over 10 years - of no cheating but I would not say its because she is cured of it. If that makes any sense.

 

but I understand more now then ever - that cheating happens and its possible or a risk with anyone - especially under certain circumstances.

 

Makes sense when you explain it that way. Like alcoholics.

 

So perhaps we (me and friends) should ask any guy we may be interested in if they ever strayed in past relationships. Guess it's worth a try.

[BC1980]

In general, I think monogamy is very difficult for long periods of time and almost unrealistic. I hate to say that, but the truth is the truth. Especially now that people live longer and marry for different reasons than they did 100 years ago. Only recently has the idea of love as the foundation for marriage been the norm. Historically, marriages were financial transactions for money, security, and having a legitimate line of children.

 

The majority of my friends and family have been cheated on or done the cheating. Some stayed, and some left. Emotions are in a constant flux and change over a lifetime. That being said, I would have been devastated if my ex cheated on me, and I would never have dreamed of doing it to him. I find those emotions difficult to reconcile with what I know to be the reality of relationships.