Could there still be a chance?

[philly24]

Hi everyone. This is my first post here. I was looking for a place to share my story and would like some advice on it. Any thoughts would greatly be appreciated. It's kind of a long story but I'll try to sum it up as much as possible. Sorry if it's a long post.

 

 

So I'm 26 and got out of my first serious relationship over 3 months ago. My ex was my best friend for 2 years before we dated. We dated for 1.5 years. I've dated plenty of girls before but I never loved anyone like I did her. Our first year together was perfect - we even started talking about marriage and having a family together. We clicked so well on so many levels since we were best friends before. She told me she has never opened up to anyone as much as she did with me. Things got rocky when she started grad school.

 

 

She met a lot of new friends in school and had her own friend group. But there was this one guy (we'll call him Ed) I was always iffy about. To shorten it as much as possible, these are the things he did:

 

1. Ask to start a Snapchat streak with my gf (which she agreed to because she thought he was just being friendly).

2. Avoided me completely when she tried to introduce me to her friends during a school banquet. Like he straight up walked away.

3. Follows her around school like a "lost puppy" (this is what two of her own friends told her after noticing).

4. I noticed he didn't like any of her IG posts that included me.

5. Continues to try and text her even when she gives him one word answers, or ignores him.

 

 

After seeing all this, I asked her to stop texting or talking to Ed on social media. She also unfollows him on IG. Despite all that, he continued to follow her in school. So I asked her to tell him to back off, but she doesn't do so because she does not want confrontation, or to make it weird among her friend group. He would continue to follow her and she'd tell me she would handle it if he ever tried anything. Even months after, it would continue happening and he was still snapchatting her. I asked her several times to tell him straight up to back off. She would tell me no and that I should trust her every time. This is when a switch inside me flipped. I eventually put thoughts into my own head - like "if she loves me so much, then why can't she eliminate one guy for me?" - thoughts like that became resentment, and then I became hurtful towards her.

 

 

I would start fights about him every other week or so. Sometimes on her exam weeks. Little things that she did that were annoying became a big issue to me. These fights weren't THAT bad, but they were often during a period of about 5 months, and they eventually took a toll on her. In these fights, I wouldn't full out scream, I'd talk louder and sometimes it made her cry, and I wouldn't apologize til an hour or so later when I calmed down. We also fought a lot over texts and she misconstrued things which also caused her to cry. I never called her any names, but I also didn't make her feel like she was a great gf 100% of the time. The worst I ever said was "I don't care what you say." She'd tell me I made her feel like a ****ty gf, and I'd tell her that was never my intent (it really wasn't), but she would tell me that's how I came off. The fights eventually stopped later on, not completely, but A LOT less. I was also not supportive of her professional fraternity, it was really important to her, but I never liked it because Ed was in it. She also had a very busy semester coming up, and took up a lot of positions in her fraternity and clubs. I questioned how she would ever see me doing that, she said she'd make time for me, but I doubted it and came off as unappreciative.

 

 

It's been over 3 months since we broke up. 3 weeks after the breakup, we met up and had sex. We agreed to try FWB. She told me she missed me and would reconsider in a few months. She even gave me a kiss goodbye. But a week after that, I saw that she re-followed Ed on IG again and confronted her about it. This is when she got really upset. She told me I always twisted her friendship with him into something more and that she never really forgave me for how I made her felt during those fights. She said she realized I was bad for her and she'd never date me again. We then agreed to no contact and have been at it for a month now.

 

 

I was also iffy about another guy (we'll call him Craig) she talked to during our relationship. She told me he was a "**** boy" and I had nothing to worry about. She told me they only talked about school stuff and showed me texts. Well, she's dating him now. But I don't think she liked him like that until after I upset her that last time (remember, she still wanted to be FWB with me). From what I hear through mutual friends, Craig is the opposite of me - he's not what she's usually attracted to.

 

 

I'm not proud of how I made her feel during those fights. I put those thoughts in my head for what? To satisfy my own selfish ego. I made her feel ****ty for what? So I could "win" arguments every time. I wasn't supportive because of one insignificant guy. I was so childish and immature. I let those thoughts consume me until it ruined our happiness. I pushed her away. And I was too oblivious to see any of that. Unfortunately, I see all of it now. I needed the breakup to evolve myself as a person and bf. I set out to fix the things I didn't like about myself and did just that. I would say my inexperience played a big role, but that's not a good enough excuse. Last time we spoke, she said she resented me for not thinking of the right words to say until after the breakup.

 

 

Bottom line is, we're on NC now. It's been over a month of NC. She's dating someone else. She was my best friend and remains very important to me. I want to call her up for coffee. I'm no longer emotional, nor am I the guy I used to be. Getting rid of my issues has made me so much happier and I want to apply that to her, but I understand it may be too late. I see stories of people reconciling and have their love stronger the second time around and I hope that could be us one day.

 

 

I guess my questions are:

1. Is it a good idea to contact her? Maybe not directly, but through a mutual friend first?

2. Do you guys think we can ever reconcile?

3. Could Craig just be a rebound?

 

 

EDIT: I should mention I wrote her an apology letter. In that letter I acknowledged all of my mistakes and told her how she has helped me become a better person and bf for the future. I did NOT write about my feelings or ask for a second chance in it. I gave it to a mutual friend that goes to school with her. I asked him to hang onto it until she asks about me. He will give her the letter if she ever asks.

Edited September 1, 2018 by philly24

[Marc878]

Get the letter back and burn it. You still need to grow up. You weren't stupid she liked the attention from the other guy. She isn't ready for a relationship and neither are you.

 

NC is your best course of action.

 

Move on like she has. This isn't the end of the world

Edited September 1, 2018 by Marc878

[philly24]

Get the letter back and burn it. You still need to grow up. You weren't stupid she liked the attention from the other guy. She isn't ready for a relationship and neither are you.

 

NC is your best course of action.

 

Move on like she has. This isn't the end of the world

 

What makes you think I'm not ready? I'm okay now. I'm like her 5th serious relationship so I'm sure she thinks she's ready too, as it's obvious with her dating right now.

 

 

I know it isn't the end of the world. I never said it was. It's tough losing a friendship and relationship over issues I had. She may have liked the attention, but she never did anything.

[preraph]

I guess she isn't old enough to realize that she's encouraging Ed by not totally making him go away. Honestly, she's probably not discouraged him at all in person. She enjoys the adoration. I've seen more men like this than women, who will jeopardize their relationship for the constant validation from an orbiter.

 

So she's dating other people now, and I guess she needs to do that. She may need to learn for herself that orbiters like Ed will continue to block her relationships and in the end, be someone she will have a hard time getting rid of. He's going to have to work up his nerve to kiss her first and then she will be all, I never thought of you that way! What are you doing? And then he will creep around and pretend they're just friends while making it look to others like they're together, and then finally, something else will happen -- he'll beg or whatever -- and she'll finally pull her head out of the sand and realize he's a problem that won't go away. The she'll be forced to be confrontational, which doesn't come natural to women, and then and only then will she realize you might have had a point.

 

But does she come back? Don't know. Probably she'll be on to someone else by then that she wants to keep bad enough to run Invasive Ed off. Sorry. It takes years of experience to learn to run these oribiters off early.

 

Since you two were good friends, there's more chance she might circle back around. Instead of arguing with her next time, simply find out the status and leave if you can't live with it so that instead of her feeling she's left someone who was being ugly to her and making her feel bad, she realizes she let go someone who had been super good to her but couldn't put up with her lack of boundaries.

[philly24]

I guess she isn't old enough to realize that she's encouraging Ed by not totally making him go away. Honestly, she's probably not discouraged him at all in person. She enjoys the adoration. I've seen more men like this than women, who will jeopardize their relationship for the constant validation from an orbiter.

 

So she's dating other people now, and I guess she needs to do that. She may need to learn for herself that orbiters like Ed will continue to block her relationships and in the end, be someone she will have a hard time getting rid of. He's going to have to work up his nerve to kiss her first and then she will be all, I never thought of you that way! What are you doing? And then he will creep around and pretend they're just friends while making it look to others like they're together, and then finally, something else will happen -- he'll beg or whatever -- and she'll finally pull her head out of the sand and realize he's a problem that won't go away. The she'll be forced to be confrontational, which doesn't come natural to women, and then and only then will she realize you might have had a point.

 

But does she come back? Don't know. Probably she'll be on to someone else by then that she wants to keep bad enough to run Invasive Ed off. Sorry. It takes years of experience to learn to run these oribiters off early.

 

Since you two were good friends, there's more chance she might circle back around. Instead of arguing with her next time, simply find out the status and leave if you can't live with it so that instead of her feeling she's left someone who was being ugly to her and making her feel bad, she realizes she let go someone who had been super good to her but couldn't put up with her lack of boundaries.

 

 

I should have mentioned that Ed apparently confessed his love to her when we broke up and she rejected him. She told one of our mutual friends who told me. Not sure if it's true or not.

 

 

Yes, she's dating a guy who apparently likes to sleep around a lot. At least that's what she told me during the relationship. And now she's with him, so maybe she was lying. I don't know anymore.

 

 

I won't argue with her if we ever talk again. I'm just confused that she didn't want to work on our issues together and try again in a few months instead of her jumping into dating. She once told me, "you just know when you've found the one," and she can't wait at least 6 months? That is the part that hurts me the most. If she were still single now, I would be okay, but right now I'm just bothered by it. I'm not hurting anymore, just confused.

[Marc878]

The only one keeping you in this is you. You should realize that you can't keep someone around that's unhealthy for you. Life is constantly changing. This is just one of those things you leave behind.

 

She has no boundaries. This was the problem.

 

If you are in a relationship it doesn't work well with other guys (orbiters) allowed.

 

This is her issue not yours. You are willing to accept the unacceptable to tag along? Why?

[Marc878]

I should have mentioned that Ed apparently confessed his love to her when we broke up and she rejected him. She told one of our mutual friends who told me. Not sure if it's true or not.

 

She allowed him to orbit at your expense though didn't she?

 

Yes, she's dating a guy who apparently likes to sleep around a lot. At least that's what she told me during the relationship. And now she's with him, so maybe she was lying. I don't know anymore.

 

It's what she wants to do at this time. You don't matter.

 

I won't argue with her if we ever talk again. I'm just confused that she didn't want to work on our issues together and try again in a few months instead of her jumping into dating. She once told me, "you just know when you've found the one," and she can't wait at least 6 months? That is the part that hurts me the most. If she were still single now, I would be okay, but right now I'm just bothered by it. I'm not hurting anymore, just confused.

 

She's done with you. She's told you and her actions show you. Yet you don't believe it. Why?

[philly24]

The only one keeping you in this is you. You should realize that you can't keep someone around that's unhealthy for you. Life is constantly changing. This is just one of those things you leave behind.

 

She has no boundaries. This was the problem.

 

If you are in a relationship it doesn't work well with other guys (orbiters) allowed.

 

This is her issue not yours. You are willing to accept the unacceptable to tag along? Why?

 

 

She stopped talking to him over the phone - texting, Snapchat, Facebook, etc. She didn't in person because I guess it was hard to since they were both in the same friend group. He was persistent as hell. I pushed her away by making it seem like I didn't trust her. It really wasn't the case, but I didn't know how else to say things to make my point. My inexperience showed there.

 

 

As for why I'm still hoping? I see stories about exes reconciling all the time over things worse than this. It may take months, or years, but it does happen. I wanted to hear thoughts on my particular case. And the guy she's dating now? Not her usual type, and not what she's usually attracted to. But I guess I'm just in denial. It's just THAT much worse because I have lost my best friend in the process, the person I turned to when I needed someone to talk to. My friends now are great, but they're not the best support group. They will listen, but never really check up on me. The loneliness is pretty unbearable sometimes. Though, it does come a lot less now.

[Marc878]

She stopped talking to him over the phone - texting, Snapchat, Facebook, etc. She didn't in person because I guess it was hard to since they were both in the same friend group. He was persistent as hell. I pushed her away by making it seem like I didn't trust her. It really wasn't the case, but I didn't know how else to say things to make my point. My inexperience showed there.

 

 

As for why I'm still hoping? I see stories about exes reconciling all the time over things worse than this. It may take months, or years, but it does happen. I wanted to hear thoughts on my particular case. And the guy she's dating now? Not her usual type, and not what she's usually attracted to. But I guess I'm just in denial. It's just THAT much worse because I have lost my best friend in the process, the person I turned to when I needed someone to talk to. My friends now are great, but they're not the best support group. They will listen, but never really check up on me. The loneliness is pretty unbearable sometimes. Though, it does come a lot less now.

 

Don't put your life on hold waiting for a maybe. Time and no contact will help. There is no magic to fix this.

 

You will be fine. Yep, it's hard but life happens. You learn to deal and cope with it.

 

Yes, you are in some denial. Most usually are. It's good you recognize that.

[philly24]

Don't put your life on hold waiting for a maybe. Time and no contact will help. There is no magic to fix this.

 

You will be fine. Yep, it's hard but life happens. You learn to deal and cope with it.

 

Yes, you are in some denial. Most usually are. It's good you recognize that.

 

 

I understand. I'm not really putting my life on hold. I am trying to get out there to date. It's hard to find girls like her in my area. I'm Asian and she speaks my family's native language. The girl I date being able to communicate with my family is really important to me.

 

 

Yeah, I'm in denial. But I've already set out to work on myself. Sometimes, it's really hard. Especially on weekends when you're at home with nothing to do.

 

 

Side note: what's up with the spacing on here? Am I doing something wrong? I hit enter twice and it creates a huge space between my sentences when I post.

[preraph]

So he finally confessed to her that's good. So I'm sure she doesn't want to hear I told you so. But maybe in time she will lose her defensive miss about it and realize you did have a reason to worry. the bigger problem now is she seems to be enjoying dating and playing the field. If she is still young and in her twenties she probably needs to get that out of her system. You should by no means wait around for her, but if it's true you had a really good friendship before anything else, there's always the chance. But remember she'll have more respect for you if you go ahead and move on and date other women. Who knows maybe she'd get a little jealous and realize you were really moving on.

 

So move on assuming she's gone because it shows you have respected that she said she was moving on and are doing the same. Anything else would be putting yourself at a disadvantage. If she happens to come back around, who knows if things would even be the same. Good luck.

[philly24]

So he finally confessed to her that's good. So I'm sure she doesn't want to hear I told you so. But maybe in time she will lose her defensive miss about it and realize you did have a reason to worry. the bigger problem now is she seems to be enjoying dating and playing the field. If she is still young and in her twenties she probably needs to get that out of her system. You should by no means wait around for her, but if it's true you had a really good friendship before anything else, there's always the chance. But remember she'll have more respect for you if you go ahead and move on and date other women. Who knows maybe she'd get a little jealous and realize you were really moving on.

 

So move on assuming she's gone because it shows you have respected that she said she was moving on and are doing the same. Anything else would be putting yourself at a disadvantage. If she happens to come back around, who knows if things would even be the same. Good luck.

 

 

Yeah, she's trying new things in terms of dating. She's the same age as me (26), but is more experienced with long-term relationships. Regardless, I am definitely NOT waiting around for a second chance. I'm already looking to date as well. I just wanted to see if anyone went through something similar and had their ex come back. Appreciate the advice.

[ExpatInItaly]

I guess my questions are:

1. Is it a good idea to contact her? Maybe not directly, but through a mutual friend first?

2. Do you guys think we can ever reconcile?

3. Could Craig just be a rebound?

 

EDIT: I should mention I wrote her an apology letter. In that letter I acknowledged all of my mistakes and told her how she has helped me become a better person and bf for the future. I did NOT write about my feelings or ask for a second chance in it. I gave it to a mutual friend that goes to school with her. I asked him to hang onto it until she asks about me. He will give her the letter if she ever asks.

 

To answer your questions in order:

1. Do not go through a mutual friend. That is for highschool kids. If you contact her, it needs to come from you with no third-party involvement. I wouldn't recommend you do it now, though. She is going to be in a happy haze with her new guy and probably won't respond well.

 

2. It's anyone's guess as to whether you'll reconcile. It's true that couples sometimes do, and I know couples who have. But I have to be honest that very few stayed together on the second attempt.

 

3. This Craig may not become a serious boyfriend, but she also isn't rebounding for the same reasons a broken-hearted dumpee does. Given that she wanted the relationship to end (I gather it was her who pulled the plug) she is eager to explore and see what else is out there. Rebounds generally happen when someone is desperate to numb the pain of a break-up, but I don't think that's why she's with him.

 

As someone else advised, get the letter back. Keep it to yourself. She is likely not going to enjoy receiving it simply because she asks about you. It's too much.

[philly24]

To answer your questions in order:

1. Do not go through a mutual friend. That is for highschool kids. If you contact her, it needs to come from you with no third-party involvement. I wouldn't recommend you do it now, though. She is going to be in a happy haze with her new guy and probably won't respond well.

 

2. It's anyone's guess as to whether you'll reconcile. It's true that couples sometimes do, and I know couples who have. But I have to be honest that very few stayed together on the second attempt.

 

3. This Craig may not become a serious boyfriend, but she also isn't rebounding for the same reasons a broken-hearted dumpee does. Given that she wanted the relationship to end (I gather it was her who pulled the plug) she is eager to explore and see what else is out there. Rebounds generally happen when someone is desperate to numb the pain of a break-up, but I don't think that's why she's with him.

 

As someone else advised, get the letter back. Keep it to yourself. She is likely not going to enjoy receiving it simply because she asks about you. It's too much.

 

 

1. I don't know if I should be the one to do it. She doesn't want to hear from me.

 

 

2. If we do reconcile, I wouldn't worry about staying together. I've dealt with my issues and feel much happier. Wish I did during the relationship, but I needed the breakup to improve myself.

 

 

3. Maybe you're right. At the same time she did talk to him during our relationship. Would this be considered emotionally cheating? I never once thought she'd end up with him since he's so different from what she likes.

 

 

Why do you think the letter is too much? I feel like she will be okay reading it. She will finally know that I acknowledge my mistakes and know that she isn't to blame. I pushed my issues onto her and she had to deal with them. It was unfair and she needs to know. I let a couple of friends read it and they both said it was "heartwarming."

[BaileyB]

If we do reconcile, I wouldn't worry about staying together.

 

She will finally know that I acknowledge my mistakes and know that she isn't to blame.

 

You should worry about staying together - she allowed this guy to orbit at your expense. She showed a lack of consideration for your feelings and poor boundaries with this other guy. That kind of behavior is quite immature.

 

Date another woman, she will show you that people who love and respect you wouldn't do this kind of thing...

 

I don't know what "mistakes" you are referring to... If your mistake was voicing your opinion about the fact that she failed to have better boundaries with a man who was inserting himself where he didn't belong... Well, I would argue that this is not a mistake.

 

My friend, this relationship is over. There are so many other good woman out there - go find one of them! Chalk this relationship up as a learning experience...

[philly24]

You should worry about staying together - she allowed this guy to orbit at your expense. She showed a lack of consideration for your feelings and poor boundaries with this other guy. That kind of behavior is quite immature.

 

Date another woman, she will show you that people who love and respect you wouldn't do this kind of thing...

 

I don't know what "mistakes" you are referring to... If your mistake was voicing your opinion about the fact that she failed to have better boundaries with a man who was inserting himself where he didn't belong... Well, I would argue that this is not a mistake.

 

My friend, this relationship is over. There are so many other good woman out there - go find one of them! Chalk this relationship up as a learning experience...

 

 

I meant not worry about staying together as in I know what to do next time if we ever date again. I highlighted my mistakes in the first post. I made lots of them and I could've avoided all of them. I just didn't think like I do now.

 

 

I am sort of looking for other women right now. The relationship has been a learning experience for sure. It's just crazy how much harder it is when you lose a best friend in the process. I have no one to turn to and understands me like she did now.

[ExpatInItaly]

1. I don't know if I should be the one to do it. She doesn't want to hear from me.

Then you definitely should not be involving another person. That is just not appropriate and suggests you don't really care that she doesn't want to hear from you.

 

2. If we do reconcile, I wouldn't worry about staying together. I've dealt with my issues and feel much happier. Wish I did during the relationship, but I needed the breakup to improve myself.

I don't get what you mean here. You don't care if you break up again? That should be a concern for any reconciling couple. Why bother getting back together if you don't worry about staying together? Assuming that just because you have changed means it will all be fine is simplifying things.

 

Why do you think the letter is too much? I feel like she will be okay reading it. She will finally know that I acknowledge my mistakes and know that she isn't to blame. I pushed my issues onto her and she had to deal with them. It was unfair and she needs to know. I let a couple of friends read it and they both said it was "heartwarming."

Because you said she doesn't want to hear from you. Look, she gave you chances during the relationship to cut the unpleasant behaviour, and you didn't. A letter now is going to look disingenuous and probably only make her feel guilty for still not wanting to be with you.

[philly24]

Then you definitely should not be involving another person. That is just not appropriate and suggests you don't really care that she doesn't want to hear from you.

 

I don't get what you mean here. You don't care if you break up again? That should be a concern for any reconciling couple. Why bother getting back together if you don't worry about staying together? Assuming that just because you have changed means it will all be fine is simplifying things.

 

Because you said she doesn't want to hear from you. Look, she gave you chances during the relationship to cut the unpleasant behaviour, and you didn't. A letter now is going to look disingenuous and probably only make her feel guilty for still not wanting to be with you.

 

1. I posted something similar on Reddit. The top reply to my topic there was a girl who got burned by her love. She mentions that apologizing to my ex will give her the “honor” I failed to give her in the past. She mentions she is still wrecked and cries almost every day for how he treated her. And without an apology, “it’s like a wet wound that won’t scab over.” That made sense to me and I don’t want my ex ever feeling that way.

 

2. What I mean is if we ever get back together, I know what not to do. I have learned from my mistakes and will never treat her that way again. That is why I wouldn’t worry. I will do everything I can to make our love stronger than ever but that’s if she ever comes back.

 

3. I didn’t because I was naive. I know it’s not a good enough excuse but my lack of experience played a role. Refer to my first point. I don’t want her feeling that she was wrong. I don’t want her to take any blame at all for everything that happened.

[ExpatInItaly]

1. I posted something similar on Reddit. The top reply to my topic there was a girl who got burned by her love. She mentions that apologizing to my ex will give her the “honor” I failed to give her in the past. She mentions she is still wrecked and cries almost every day for how he treated her. And without an apology, “it’s like a wet wound that won’t scab over.” That made sense to me and I don’t want my ex ever feeling that way

I don't mean to be rude, but if she is dating someone else, I don't think she is sitting at home crying every day about how you treated her. Based on what you described, your ex is not like the girl in your Reddit post.

 

She was starting to check out of your relationship before she ended it. No, she didn't appreciate your snappy and irritable behaviour and had you knocked it off, things might different now. However, I don't think she's as broken up about this as you are. She was allowing other guys to get close to her, and while you were worried about Ed, this other dude Craig was the one who actually had her interest. If she were invested in you, she would have shut that down.

 

Give her the letter if you insist. I just don't think it's going to yield the results you want or have a dramatic effect on her feelings.

[philly24]

I don't mean to be rude, but if she is dating someone else, I don't think she is sitting at home crying every day about how you treated her. Based on what you described, your ex is not like the girl in your Reddit post.

 

She was starting to check out of your relationship before she ended it. No, she didn't appreciate your snappy and irritable behaviour and had you knocked it off, things might different now. However, I don't think she's as broken up about this as you are. She was allowing other guys to get close to her, and while you were worried about Ed, this other dude Craig was the one who actually had her interest. If she were invested in you, she would have shut that down.

 

Give her the letter if you insist. I just don't think it's going to yield the results you want or have a dramatic effect on her feelings.

 

Yeah that would make sense. She was really upset when we last talked though and I never gave her the appropriate apology.

 

The thing is, I did knock it off. She admitted I fixed 80% of the problem but it wasn’t enough. What does that even mean? She didn’t have interest in Craig until later on. Remember, she still wanted to try FWB with me until I upset her again after the breakup.

 

If it has no effect for her, then at least I know I tried and said sorry. Maybe she’ll appreciate it one day, but if not then I know I tried. I wanted to let her know she was still important to me and if she ever changes her mind down the line about being friends again, my door would always be open to her. I don’t want to lose her completely like this and if this letter helps at all, I’ll have to take the chance.

[ExpatInItaly]

The thing is, I did knock it off. She admitted I fixed 80% of the problem but it wasn’t enough. What does that even mean? She didn’t have interest in Craig until later on. Remember, she still wanted to try FWB with me until I upset her again after the breakup.

 

It means she was losing interest for other reasons, too, and the break-up wasn't all down to your mistakes. She was on her way anyway.

 

Wanting to be FWB after a break-up isn't necessarily a good sign though, friend. All that means is she wanted to have you around to sleep together while she eased her way back into singledom. It's not usually the way back to a relationship, but the way out.