I've always been single what's wrong?

[SaintJonesy]

I really hope this doesn't come off as a big pity party or an "I'm so great", but I don't know what to do anymore and I need some advice. Also, this might get a little wordy, but I just want to be as thorough as possible. Here goes:

 

Essentially, my problem is this: no one wants me. I'm the only one of my friends who has never had a relationship, and I'm at my wits end about it. I used to just think, "It'll happen when it happens, I'm not going to stress about it", but the past year or so I haven't been able to suppress the self-doubt. I don't know what my problem is, and I've tried everything. I've approached easily hundreds of women in my adult life, and I've been on a few dates, but never a third date. Most women pretend they don't hear me, or give really clear body language that they want me to go away. Some get nasty toward me and make little digs at me. None are ever attracted to me. Many women think I'm gay, and I don't know why. I ask the women I date if they can offer any constructive criticism ALWAYS and this is some of what I've gotten (para-phrasing):

"You're too good for me. I feel inadequate"

"I know I couldn't offer you what you could give me."

"I could see you being married with kids, but never dating anyone."

"I don't trust you, you don't seem 'normal'."

"I'm going to date someone else."

"I'm not attracted to you."

"I want to work on myself more."

"You could do much better."

"You're not a real man."

*Ghosted*

 

I've specifically asked if desperation, clinginess or creepiness was a factor, and unanimously the people I asked said no. "You carry yourself very well," one said.

 

A description of myself and what I have to offer:

 

I'm twenty-five years old, I work part time and I'm a full-time college student (used to work full-time). I have a lot of friends, and I enjoy traveling, writing, reading, cooking, working out, hiking, learning things (esp. foreign languages!), outdoor activities (esp. rock climbing!) and going to festivals and big social events. I've been to 38 states, 3 provinces, 8 countries and 4 continents, usually traveling solo. People have told me I'm extremely emotionally intelligent, considerate, intelligent, friendly and approachable. I have very strong morals and a good sense of empathy (although I'm not religious). They've also told me I'm attractive, although no woman my age has ever told me that (I'll attach a picture if that's possible, idk, this is my first post). I'm short, which I know most women don't prefer that, but I compensate for it by working out A LOT and being very toned and built. I was raised by only women, and as a result I'm extremely respectful of women. Combine that with my emotional intelligence, and I think I'm pretty good at keeping people comfortable and not being pushy or demanding. I am a little effeminate, I like to dress up, I have good hygiene and I do have a mood disorder that causes me to fall into depressions. My sex drive could probably be described as "very low" because I prefer cuddling, but (and I don't want to be crass or gross here because I don't know the rules on this site, so this next part is NSFW)...

 

***************************************************************NSFW!!!

NSFW!!!I have a significantly larger than average member and decent, if unpracticed, sexual prowess, or so I've been told, even when I lost my virginity.

NSFW!!!!

***************************************************************

 

I would offer emotional support more than most guys are capable of, a keen intellect and good conversation, good communication skills with a genuine humility that allows me to fix and make up for mistakes, interesting activities with an openness to her activities as well, emotional understanding and compassion, good cuddles... and I'm a decent cook lol! I have more to offer than that, but those are the high-lights for a relationship I think.

 

What I don't offer is a "stoic" face that seems to be prized in a lot of men. I'm very expressive, and it's clear when I'm getting overwhelmed or something is bothering me. I'm also not terribly funny, at least I don't think I am. I can make people laugh, but if I get three or four good laughs on an outing that's an average night for me. And, as mentioned before, sometimes I get depressed.

 

I'm looking for a woman who I find attractive. I'm not sure exactly what that entails, because I seem to be attracted to a wide array of women, but I can say that I often find skinny women attractive. I've been attracted to heavy women before too though. Usually I'm attracted to women around my height (5'4") or slightly taller, but that's not something I consciously notice. I've been attracted to shorter or much taller women though too. Attraction is something I just "feel", not something I notice.

 

I had five traits that I said I needed in a partner:

1) Empathy - She has to treat others with caring and respect.

2) Curiosity - Intelligence isn't necessary, but curiosity is.

3) Openness - Both to others' lives and new experiences.

4) Lack of Materialism - I'm sort of a minimalist.

5) Good cuddles - Self-explanatory.

 

However, I kind of said I'll whittle that down to just "empathy", because apparently I was asking for too much. I also want to say, I've NEVER broken it off with someone else, they always break it off with me after the first or second date.

 

That's pretty much it. Does anyone have any ideas for what my problem might be? I'm so depressed about it lately that I've been considering suicide. I don't want to do this whole thing alone, and I don't know what I'm doing wrong.

 

[]

Edited October 21, 2018 by a LoveShack.org Moderator
Picture link deleted and moved to ISO

[Garcon1986]

You look like you are classically attractive to lots of women (i.e. many women I know would consider you the hot guy they want to date). What I would do, is try to pay attention to what the women around you are doing, rather than what they are saying. Many women will say stuff to you to be nice, rather than tell you truly what they are thinking through their actions. They are trained to do this from a young age because that's socially normal for a young lady. It's socially normal for them to play politics a lot harder than guys the same age, who relatively speaking, tell you like it is. What I suspect is that you are deep down perceived as their "gay male friendgirl" rather than a manly man. You've mentioned that you are a bit effeminate, and can show emotional issues - these are not acceptable on the first few dates with a woman. If you so much as give off the vibe of being a gay male friendgirl, it takes sleeping with you off the table. You are allowed to show emotions a few more dates down the line, but not when you are initially trying to attract a girl. I don't show emotion directly to women, but I tell about how entertaining it is to take care of children (I'm a single/ dating pediatrician). That's one example.

 

In summary, you absolutely must not show too much of your emotional or effeminate side early on. This will get you friendzoned as you described very well. Best of luck old chap.

[Logo]

As a heterosexual guy, I can tell you that you seem like an amazing cool guy. I don't say that lightly.

 

 

 

You seem far more mature and intelligent than most people your age that I have spoken with or come across.

 

 

 

The women that told you that you were too good for them were being honest with you.

 

 

 

As a general statement, I think the women you have dated so far just couldn't keep up with you, as far as intellect or experience. You've traveled a lot, have had so many interesting experiences during your travels, I'm sure.

 

 

 

You're just not the typical cookie cutter type of guy that fits the mold of the average joe. You're way better than that.

 

 

 

Perhaps the women you've dated so far just feel inadequate. I have a couple of friends who come from humble beginnings and when I'm excited or thrilled about something that has happened to me and I share it with them, they don't seem as excited as other people or other friends. It's their own insecurities that make them feel and act that way.

 

 

 

Now, in your case, the women that are not nice to you. They have their own issues. The women that ignore you. They too, have their own issues. They just have no manners.

 

 

 

You seem to have been raised in a good household, with good values and morals, as well as manners.

 

 

 

Values, morals and manners are severely lacking in today's world. I think most women, especially in their 20s just don't know how to absorb that fact. They're not used to it.

 

 

 

By the way, do you live in a major city or a small town or in the suburbs. I'm asking because people, in general, behave differently depending on where they live and where they're from.

 

 

 

People in small towns, for example, could be more hospitable and more outgoing and laid back. People in major cities tend to keep to themselves and keep an emotional distance from their fellow human beings.

 

 

 

I'm sure the women on this board will chime in with their points of view, so I'll leave it at that.

[d0nnivain]

It's not unusual that you haven't had a long term relationship. Stop beating yourself up over it. Your initiate attitude of it will happen when it happens is most likely correct.

 

It has nothing to do with the size of your equipment. If you genuinely think that is a factor & you focus on it, your over emphasis on sex is probably why you can't keep a woman.

 

Unfortunately your height is probably a factor. You are overlooked by tall women. That is a stereotype but it is also a reality. Given your height because you are expressive & emotional, that combo may give the false impression that you are not as masculine as taller men.

 

Do talk to your friends, those closest to you, to ask about their insights. If they see a recurring pattern, they might be able to help you over come it.

[Gretchen12]

It's not about you.

 

It's how you make her feel. Your photo is good enough for a Nigerian romance scammer to use. With that, he can make her fall in love and send him her life's savings because he knows what to say. He doesn't need all your good qualities.

[elaine567]

There was a similar thread from an accomplished woman who struggles to find dates, and someone said something interesting there, I paraphrase "What can a man offer you, where does he fit in?"

 

and it may be a bit of the same here "What can a woman offer you, where does she fit in?" You seem to be totally self sufficient and busy.

[elaine567]

Oh God I just saw the suicide bit.

Don't do that, get professional help.

Don't know where you are from but there are emergency Call lines everywhere.

[SaintJonesy]

You seem to have been raised in a good household, with good values and morals, as well as manners.

 

 

 

Values, morals and manners are severely lacking in today's world. I think most women, especially in their 20s just don't know how to absorb that fact. They're not used to it.

 

 

 

By the way, do you live in a major city or a small town or in the suburbs. I'm asking because people, in general, behave differently depending on where they live and where they're from.

 

 

Thanks for taking the time to write such a detailed response. I appreciate your kind words.

 

Unfortunately, my household was not so idyllic. Father was abusive toward my mother until he left, then my mother was abusive toward me. But we all have our struggles and I overcame.

 

I grew up in a small city outside of Detroit Metro, lived in a major city (Toledo, Ohio), currently live in a rural area and formerly lived in an African major city (Meknes, Morocco) which I think is another different thing outside of those other options lol.

[SaintJonesy]

It's not about you.

 

It's how you make her feel. Your photo is good enough for a Nigerian romance scammer to use. With that, he can make her fall in love and send him her life's savings because he knows what to say. He doesn't need all your good qualities.

 

So is it just a matter of, "You know what to say or you don't"? Because I apparently don't haha and I've tried practicing a lot more than other guys. I put myself out there more than anyone I know, and I put more effort in than any other guy I know, and I don't feel like I know anything I didn't before.

[Garcon1986]

I would say, it involves saying the right stuff while being at the same time genuine to yourself. I would work on the effeminate side and the emotions, they need to be toned down during your first few dates.

[Logo]

formerly lived in an African major city (Meknes, Morocco) which I think is another different thing outside of those other options lol.

 

 

 

 

 

Yeah I forgot to include that option.

[SaintJonesy]

There was a similar thread from an accomplished woman who struggles to find dates, and someone said something interesting there, I paraphrase "What can a man offer you, where does he fit in?"

 

and it may be a bit of the same here "What can a woman offer you, where does she fit in?" You seem to be totally self sufficient and busy.

 

I appreciate your response! Thank you!

 

I mean, a relationship would offer a lot of things. Most days I get back from class, and I have to fill up my day or I go crazy. I can't just sit and relax, because whenever I do I just end up wishing I had someone to talk to. My home is very quiet. I don't have anyone that I can be emotionally intimate with, other than my sister and she lives on a different continent. And I have no one I can be physically intimate with. I want to be able to travel with someone and share experiences. I want a family one day. Relationships help people grow as people. More practically, loneliness is deadlier than smoking a pack a day, and in my situation, even though I have friends and I'm not totally isolated, I think loneliness is normal. The loneliness has become unbearable. Also, it would take a little economic pressure off. I could keep going all day, but I think we all know what a romantic relationship offers.

 

As for suicide/professional help, like I said, I have a mood disorder so I have weakly therapy appointments and a treatment regiment that I take very seriously. But most of my life, I've only ever wanted to help other people. I want to work for a non-profit when I get out of college. I don't volunteer, but I should. I help my sister financially; she runs an orphanage for children orphaned by AIDS in Malawi.

 

The only thing I've ever wanted for myself is a relationship and someone to share life with. And everyone gets to be a little selfish sometimes, but if I can never get what I want for myself, and I am just giving and giving and giving to other people my whole life, then at the end their won't be any of me left. It's the only thing I wanted for myself, and if I can't obtain, then rationally I think my best option would be to quit my treatments and wind this thing down. I refuse to fade into bitterness and decrepitude. I'd rather take my life when I'm still young and bright, because as I mentioned above loneliness ages you very quickly, ends your life prematurely and makes you start to go crazy as you do. I remember seeing older people in my family get dementia and lose their minds when I was a kid, and I said, "That will never happen to me." I meant it.

[Logo]

One thing that works really well with women is the swagger that comes from confidence.

 

 

 

Here's an exercise you can try, even if just for fun. Go someplace busy where people your age usually hang out.

 

 

 

Walk with a healthy erect posture, look straight ahead and pretend as though you're parting an ocean with your gaze. Put on a stoic expression and walk calmly, as though you're walking to the beat of your heart. Hands to your sides. Have a friend with you and ask him to look around and see how the women in the room respond to your presence.

 

 

 

I think you'll be pleasantly surprised.

 

 

 

Studies show that first impressions are made based on non-verbal cues such as body language and facial expressions. Later the tone and pitch of one's voice come into play, too.

[Hopeful30]

Few questions for you.

 

What your parents relationship like?

 

What your relationship with your mother?

 

Do you notice a pattern or constant variable among the women you choose?

[SaintJonesy]

I would say, it involves saying the right stuff while being at the same time genuine to yourself. I would work on the effeminate side and the emotions, they need to be toned down during your first few dates.

 

I appreciate your response; however, I will have to respectfully say that I hope this isn't the problem, because these are ingrained parts of my being. Although I might have given you the wrong impression on exactly what I meant by this. It's not like I'm effeminate like I talk about feminine things or dress effeminately or use feminine body soaps. And I didn't mean emotional like I break down crying on a first date or start spilling a bunch of details about my personal life. Changing this would be the same as trying to get rid of a muscle reflex. This is how I learned to do things unfortunately and it's just as ingrained as the frequency of my voice and the chemical imbalance in my brain.

 

I didn't mean to give the impression that I'm wearing my heart on my sleeve on the first date. When I say "effeminate", I mean I was raised by all women so my mannerisms and speech patterns tend to be effeminate. I don't mean I have the stereotypical "Gay man's lisp", but there are interesting videos you can look up on the subtle differences in the way men and women tend to pronounce letters. Since my dad walked out, I learned to form sounds the way my mother does, which is in no way a conscious or controllable effort. As for mannerisms, I tend to move with grace, and flow through a crowd and be light on my feet. Also I have really good hygiene. Also my voice is higher-pitched than most men (not like Gilbert Gottfried or Steve Buscemi or anything, but on that tract) which isn't something I can change.

 

I've tried to nix the expressiveness of my face and vocal tone on dates, but this usually means I am acting like someone totally different. I come across as aloof and disinterested, because I just have to be totally not interactive. According to a therapist, I just have a very expressive face and there isn't much I can do about it.

[Chilli]

Just a few thoughts op.

l don't think there's anything wrong with you you don't even look that short really.

 

Having done so much though so far , could be a bit daunting to chicks around the age you'd be looking for , might be a thing.

Being different , in ways you talked about , from the norm that might be out there, being different always has it's price and takes time , sometimes it's an advantage , sometimes not so.

But you must've had a pretty busy life so far to achieve everything you have , and that might've taken you out of the loop a lot so that you haven't spent those years partying and socializing the way most do , so not meeting many girls anyway.

 

The few guys and gurls too actually l've known that've done so much so young have actually all suffered similarly in that department .

[SaintJonesy]

Few questions for you.

 

What your parents relationship like?

 

What your relationship with your mother?

 

Do you notice a pattern or constant variable among the women you choose?

 

Abusive. My father walked out, and he came around to pick us kids up every once in a while and we'd go see a movie. My mother tried to murder him once and he used to rape her. Sorry to get so heavy there, but them's the facts. I dealt with it in time.

 

Also abusive. We're better now and she's apologized to me for the way she treated me when I was growing up. When my father left, she tried to make me into a co-parent and saw me as an adult male partner when I was 8 years old and she admits that. There wasn't much physical abuse, but I remember wishing she would just hit me because the things she said and did were worse. Now we're okay after I spent a few years away and traveling. We even have fun together sometimes, although she is still very codependent and not at all emotionally supportive, so I have to distance myself. She's a good drinking buddy.

 

Not really. I guess the most consistent thing would be that she takes care of herself. I don't hit on women who don't shower, or wear pajama pants out, or are missing teeth. I don't know if that's what you wanted. Also being articulate I suppose is really important. Although not necessarily articulate in my dialect, but like an African American girl speaking in an African American dialect can still be consistent and articulate with her speech patterns, even if it doesn't sound "grammatically correct" to me.

[elaine567]

One thing that works really well with women is the swagger that comes from confidence.

You are very right there.

I watched a movie a few weeks ago and this guy who was not that special in my first assessment, did a swagger as he got out of his car, instant swoon.

 

Effeminate is nice, it is cute, it is non threatening, and it is usually friendly and comfortable, but it is not heart stopping stuff.

We need a bit of heart stopping stuff on dates, else into the friendzone...

 

Can you learn to be a bit more manly in your mannerisms?

[Hopeful30]

Abusive. My father walked out, and he came around to pick us kids up every once in a while and we'd go see a movie. My mother tried to murder him once and he used to rape her. Sorry to get so heavy there, but them's the facts. I dealt with it in time.

 

Also abusive. We're better now and she's apologized to me for the way she treated me when I was growing up. When my father left, she tried to make me into a co-parent and saw me as an adult male partner when I was 8 years old and she admits that. There wasn't much physical abuse, but I remember wishing she would just hit me because the things she said and did were worse. Now we're okay after I spent a few years away and traveling. We even have fun together sometimes, although she is still very codependent and not at all emotionally supportive, so I have to distance myself. She's a good drinking buddy.

 

Not really. I guess the most consistent thing would be that she takes care of herself. I don't hit on women who don't shower, or wear pajama pants out, or are missing teeth. I don't know if that's what you wanted. Also being articulate I suppose is really important. Although not necessarily articulate in my dialect, but like an African American girl speaking in an African American dialect can still be consistent and articulate with her speech patterns, even if it doesn't sound "grammatically correct" to me.

 

Thank you for sharing. Do you feel youve moved past all this childhood pain?

 

Is it possible the blueprints of dysfunctional relationship (as primed by your parents) could be generating your mate choices?

 

Could a part of you still feel unworthy and undeserving of love?

[SaintJonesy]

You are very right there.

I watched a movie a few weeks ago and this guy who was not that special in my first assessment, did a swagger as he got out of his car, instant swoon.

 

Effeminate is nice, it is cute, it is non threatening, and it is usually friendly and comfortable, but it is not heart stopping stuff.

We need a bit of heart stopping stuff on dates, else into the friendzone...

 

Can you learn to be a bit more manly in your mannerisms?

 

I've been told I have swagger by female friends. There are some things I consciously do to appear more assertive. Good posture, walk slow, eyes on, contrived aloof expression. I'm graceful when I walk, not stomping, wide-legged stance of most men. But that stomping, wide-legged stance isn't really swagger. At least as far as I know, I could be wrong about that.

 

The mannerisms I'm referring to are things I learned subconsciously when I was being socialized and learning to speak. Since I was mostly raised by women, my speech patterns and voice intonations are subconsciously feminine. I'm not sure the exact differences, I'd have to go to like a speech pathologist or linguist to figure it all out.

 

I do know, for example, men pronounce the "S" sound with their tongue further back in their mouth than women, making it sound more bass. I tried practicing this, but it sounds like I have a lisp because that's just not how those muscles were developed. If I learned all those subtleties and differences, maybe I could retrain my mouth to make those sounds (I learned Arabic after all lol) but it would take years for it to not sound like I have a speech impediment, and I don't know... I know men far more effeminate and eccentric than me who manage to get dates.

 

Other things I have cut out. Things like nodding and using non-verbal sounds to show active listening, and now I do the more "masculine" thing, and put in slight interjections: e.g "Yeah!","Oh ****!", "**** that!". But those are the level of things I'm talking about making me effeminate. Not like locking my elbows when I gesture or cocking my hip and putting a hand on it. I tend to take up a lot of space and spread my legs (even though I think it's really uncomfortable).

 

But at the end of the day, if I have to change everything about myself right down to the subconscious reactions, like... am I really being genuine then? Is that really me? Or do I have to get a whole new personality which still might not work?

[Hopeful30]

But at the end of the day, if I have to change everything about myself right down to the subconscious reactions, like... am I really being genuine then? Is that really me? Or do I have to get a whole new personality which still might not work?

 

Exactly, and people can sense when someone is being fake, so its a lose-lose on that front.

 

Be authentic, but be *comfortable* being you. We like people who like themselves. The right woman will see your soul, not your mannerisms.

[SaintJonesy]

Thank you for sharing. Do you feel youve moved past all this childhood pain?

 

Is it possible the blueprints of dysfunctional relationship (as primed by your parents) could be generating your mate choices?

 

Could a part of you still feel unworthy and undeserving of love?

 

No problem, thank you for responding. I definitely do. I still don't like to be around my father, but that's because HE has problems, not because I do.

 

Anything is possible, but I know some of the women I tried to date were absolutely terrific people. And I am generally a pretty decent judge of character. Also, the VAST majority of women won't even give me the time of day when I go to talk to them. Like 95% of them. Which is fine by the way, I'm not entitled to their time. Sometimes I'll be out with friends and try to meet some random at a bar or something (not a good idea, I know), and those ones could be anyone I guess. But for the most part, the women I pursue are individuals of high calibre.

 

I thought I was over that, but I did feel like that pretty much until I moved out when I was not quite 18, but the past few months I'm back to doubting myself. I can recognize the bad thought patterns and tell myself, "It's just my mind playing tricks on me again," but it's getting harder and harder to argue with that little voice when it has all this evidence.

[SaintJonesy]

Thanks to the mod on this site for putting my post in an obscure, oddly named, unvisited corner of the site. Really appreciated. But hey, I get that that was the "Dating" section. Apparently my post just wasn't as relevant as such hard-hitting posts like "why are men so scared?" Grade-A work. I can see that the staff on this website are really not very welcoming. Go ahead and ban me. You already made it so no one will see this post.

[OpenBook]

It's not about you.

 

It's how you make her feel.

 

^^This. What it's all about. People won't remember what you said, or even what you did - but they will NEVER forget how you made them feel.

 

If I were in your shoes, I would observe myself closely in my interactions with others, and how they respond. As you're interacting, kinda step outside yourself and be an impartial Mr. Spock observer of yourself, for the sole purpose of acquiring data. For example, with the women that you did go out with (and those you will go out with in the future) - when you do or say X, how does she respond? What is her facial expression? body language?

 

Just a wild guess, but from the feedback they've given you, it sounds like a common reaction to someone (you) who is laser-focused on making sure they know EVERYTHING about YOU. First of all, it's overwhelming. Also, it gives them the idea (true or not) that you're not interested in THEM personally. You're just looking for an audience. Any warm body would do; they're not special.

 

People are naturally drawn to others who treat them well, and who clearly and authentically demonstrate that they enjoy their company and are interested in everything they say and do.

 

For the record, I don't think there's anything wrong with you. It could be as simple as just RELAX, and be more "in the moment" than on a Mission To Accomplish. Or just make a few minor tweaks in how you interact with romantic prospects - increase your social intelligence quotient. It's a trial-and-error kinda thing. Practice makes perfect. Don't stop trying!

[Rotn'roses]

I am 36 and still in your boat. I never wanted kids or marriage when I was younger though, or more honestly, I had only met 1 guy whom I felt would have made me reconsider had it been an option to me at the time. I only wanted a degree and a career.

Back to you though. You seem pretty much perfect so I do not know why height would be a factor. Except that people can be fickle and shallow. Try a dating site that controls height and physical appearances. Be honest in your profile and say you are such and such tall and looking for a woman who has that preference, that way you know it wont be a hang up of yours from the start. If you are self conscious of it, a woman may respond in the same manner. Good luck.