Where and how

[brigit87]

Total and complete waste of time and money, I'd have had better use buying homeless people food than wasting it on that.

 

...well if you buy a hot and homeless 20 something girl some food you can call that a date.

 

Seriously, you need to first make your age range a bit bigger. There are tons of beautiful 30 something women.

[ZA Dater]

...well if you buy a hot and homeless 20 something girl some food you can call that a date.

 

Seriously, you need to first make your age range a bit bigger. There are tons of beautiful 30 something women.

 

Really. Across 4 platforms there are none I deem beautiful. What there many of are single mom's of mid 30s looking for father figures for their kids. Run for the hills territory this.

 

25 to 30 is my realistic range. More than that they have kids or want kids.

[ZA Dater]

You have 2 options:

 

1. Keep doing what you are doing and getting the same results.

2. Change what you are doing and your way of looking at dating.

 

There is a third option. Dont give a f about the whole thing and join the ranks of the manipulators and B's brigade who seem to excel at dating.

 

I go out i try smile nobody even looks at me. Might as well be invisible. But hey maybe go out drink and look like a loud mouthed fool is the way to go. That being the case I'll stay at home.

[Wallysbears]

There is a third option. Dont give a f about the whole thing and join the ranks of the manipulators and B's brigade who seem to excel at dating.

 

I go out i try smile nobody even looks at me. Might as well be invisible. But hey maybe go out drink and look like a loud mouthed fool is the way to go. That being the case I'll stay at home.

 

Good luck with that. I sure do hope you don't have such a negative demeanor when speaking to people in person.

[Garcon1986]

Learning to be more socially fluid is not equivalent to being a liar and a social cheater.

[ZA Dater]

Learning to be more socially fluid is not equivalent to being a liar and a social cheater.

 

Who said I wasn't socially fluid?

[Garcon1986]

I'm recommending you get yourself on the path of being more socially fluid with women in a dating context. Why is that so painful? You've already done well in being socially fluid in a business and professional context and I can tip my hat to you for that part.

[ZA Dater]

I'm recommending you get yourself on the path of being more socially fluid with women in a dating context. Why is that so painful? You've already done well in being socially fluid in a business and professional context and I can tip my hat to you for that part.

 

The upside is better there. I get anf try with dating for what? Anything worth having isn't interested or not single so I am just stuck with what I don't want.

[normal person]

I'll pass on the "I don't like it but we'll everyone else dues it" mantra. If that's the only way to get dates then I won't bother.

 

"If waking up early and going to work is the only way to make money, then I won't bother."

 

In life, people often have to do a lot of things they don't want to in order to get something they do want. Your continuing inability to accept this and your entitled attitude are probably the biggest roadblocks to your success.

 

 

Why the heck someone would go to such places if you didn't enjoy it I have no idea.

 

You started a thread asking where single people go. People have told you. You don't like those places? That's your problem, not everyone else's. Go ahead and keep waiting for the world to conform to your desires and see what happens. It's been several years of this sentiment and has anything changed? Maybe if you just hold out a few more?

 

And yes I have been to places say at the bar with my water and it was always the same, fit guys big wallets they get the choice, heck of they are loud supposedly cool and arrogant all the better.

 

Your insistence that only fit, rich men meet women is patently false. By definition, most of the men getting into relationships, marriages, and parenthood are in average shape and averagely paid. So you can stop using this as a convenient excuse, it doesn't hold up.

 

There is a third option. Dont give a f about the whole thing and join the ranks of the manipulators and B's brigade who seem to excel at dating.

 

Once again, you're misrepresenting and oversimplifying the dating scene to suit your argument. I'm roughly your age. I haven't been to a loud club/bar where the median age was <25 in years. I met my girlfriend Tinder, 2 of her close friends have also met their boyfriends on Tinder in the last year, and they (and myself) are all very nice, non-manipulative, respectful people who don't fit into your very distorted profile of the dating scene, whose path you could follow relatively easily by:

 

1). taking age appropriate steps out of your comfort zone,

2). having realistic expectations given the circumstances, controlling what you can control/accepting what you can't with dignity/perseverance, and

3). dropping your judgmental attitude about people who have decided to do things differently.

 

That's a much better third option for you.

 

 

I go out i try smile nobody even looks at me. Might as well be invisible. But hey maybe go out drink and look like a loud mouthed fool is the way to go. That being the case I'll stay at home.

 

Your bitterness towards people who want to drink isn't doing you any favors. What does it do for you besides make you look petulant and insecure? If someone else wants to drink, you can let that be their business and they can deal with what comes of it. You're a little too old to this vocally opposed to how other adults want to live their lives, which have no bearing on yours. You always attempt to make the world sound like you're an intellectual, well-mannered, puritanical teetotaler lost in a never ending sea of or steroid raging, abusive, frat boys. Someone as smart as you should know that there is a very broad spectrum of single people who drink and you've deliberately chosen to represent just the extremes and neglect the majority of people who fall into the middle.

 

If you don't want to drink, fine. But you should accept the fact that many people do, and most of those people can do it without it being an issue. Smiling is a step in the right direction but if it's not yet getting you what you want, you'll need to go at least a step further. Do you and your friends ever go to bars that cater to a more mature (late 20s+) crowd? If not, why? What's stopping you?

[ZA Dater]

"If waking up early and going to work is the only way to make money, then I won't bother."

 

In life, people often have to do a lot of things they don't want to in order to get something they do want. Your continuing inability to accept this and your entitled attitude are probably the biggest roadblocks to your success.

 

 

 

 

You started a thread asking where single people go. People have told you. You don't like those places? That's your problem, not everyone else's. Go ahead and keep waiting for the world to conform to your desires and see what happens. It's been several years of this sentiment and has anything changed? Maybe if you just hold out a few more?

 

 

 

Your insistence that only fit, rich men meet women is patently false. By definition, most of the men getting into relationships, marriages, and parenthood are in average shape and averagely paid. So you can stop using this as a convenient excuse, it doesn't hold up.

 

 

 

Once again, you're misrepresenting and oversimplifying the dating scene to suit your argument. I'm roughly your age. I haven't been to a loud club/bar where the median age was <25 in years. I met my girlfriend Tinder, 2 of her close friends have also met their boyfriends on Tinder in the last year, and they (and myself) are all very nice, non-manipulative, respectful people who don't fit into your very distorted profile of the dating scene, whose path you could follow relatively easily by:

 

1). taking age appropriate steps out of your comfort zone,

2). having realistic expectations given the circumstances, controlling what you can control/accepting what you can't with dignity/perseverance, and

3). dropping your judgmental attitude about people who have decided to do things differently.

 

That's a much better third option for you.

 

 

 

 

Your bitterness towards people who want to drink isn't doing you any favors. What does it do for you besides make you look petulant and insecure? If someone else wants to drink, you can let that be their business and they can deal with what comes of it. You're a little too old to this vocally opposed to how other adults want to live their lives, which have no bearing on yours. You always attempt to make the world sound like you're an intellectual, well-mannered, puritanical teetotaler lost in a never ending sea of or steroid raging, abusive, frat boys. Someone as smart as you should know that there is a very broad spectrum of single people who drink and you've deliberately chosen to represent just the extremes and neglect the majority of people who fall into the middle.

 

If you don't want to drink, fine. But you should accept the fact that many people do, and most of those people can do it without it being an issue. Smiling is a step in the right direction but if it's not yet getting you what you want, you'll need to go at least a step further. Do you and your friends ever go to bars that cater to a more mature (late 20s+) crowd? If not, why? What's stopping you?

 

I get judged and kicked aside by people who dont respect my choice not to drink. It's a complete deal killer. So tell me who is respecting who's choices?

 

I dont like any bar or club, none of them. The only thing missing on your argument is the "use resources wisely" how many of those Tinder successes were due to that at least in part?

 

I dont care if they drink I do care of get written off because I don't.

 

What might those realistic expectations be?? Judgemental...heck I get judged and I'll do the same back.

[Garcon1986]

You go to a quieter event, you say I'll drink my drink, you can drink yours. If they judge you based upon your beverages it's not a good partnership anyway.

[ZA Dater]

You go to a quieter event, you say I'll drink my drink, you can drink yours. If they judge you based upon your beverages it's not a good partnership anyway.

 

They all judge every single one of them. Might as well throw up the red flag.

 

Which quieter event, I suppose a meet up. Look I'll honour the forum and go to a bar heck I'll even go to a pool hall and see. I dont expect to be surprised because that corner beckons the only looser with no friends.

 

Only thing all this has taught me, it's made me emotionally hard insults wash off like water.

[Garcon1986]

Being emotionally hard is helpful in the dating world, so I tip my hat to you for that. However, judgment will be everywhere in the dating world. That's unavoidable.

[RecentChange]

Who said I wasn't socially fluid?

 

Its painfully obvious that you lack some sort of basic social adaptability.

 

How else can you explain your extreme level of dysfunction when it comes to the opposite sex?

 

Are you really ugly physically? Dim witted? Financially destitute? Totally unsuccessful in all areas of life?

 

No? Is it that everyone else that manages to have a relationship is some sort of morally corrupt, manipulative, self centered drunk? From what you have described it makes it seem that is what you believe.

 

Then on top of it you have a narrow definition of who you would consider dating. Certain looks, certain age, lack of baggage etc.

 

I find your rigidness, your judgmental attitude, the victim-hood, the jaded bitterness to be extremely unattractive. I have a feeling the women you encounter in your life pick up on this as well, even if you think you are hiding it behind a phony smile.

 

Honestly, I see no solutions for you. You are not interested in the paths that may lead to some sort of success. You want it your way or no way... and well, the universe does not often cater to our whims, so here you are, over and over and over again with the same dilemmas.

[normal person]

I get judged and kicked aside by people who dont respect my choice not to drink. It's a complete deal killer. So tell me who is respecting who's choices?

 

Does every single person you meet "not respect" your choice? Is every single person turning their nose up at you? Is everyone in your country so heartless that if you explain that you don't drink for health reasons, or your family has a history of addiction, or you're allergic, or you're driving, that they wouldn't be able to look past it? Is everyone you meet constantly handing your drinks and watching to make sure you finish every drop? What percentage of the people you meet are shooting you down because of your lack of alcohol consumption?

 

So tell me who is respecting who's choices?

 

What concern of yours is it what those particular people think? Especially if their own choices and attitudes preclude them from your dating pool anyways. You have such a childish rhetoric with regards to the natural variance of circumstances that you don't want to accept:

 

"(Some) people don't respect my choices, so I can use that to justify making blanket excuses for other misgivings against my own self interest."

 

You can if you like, but it'll land you back in this same spot. You're just making the relationship between yourself and these people more tenuous. If someone has an issue with your refusal to drink, why not educate them on why you don't and why it's important to you? If they still take issue, why not just take the high road and move on? The only thing you do by reciprocating the antagonism or misunderstanding is make yourself look insecure. You can take the high road and be confident, dignified, and unbothered, or you can lower yourself to someone else's level and look like a child.

 

"Women don't have to work to impress me, so why should I have to expend effort to impress them?"

 

Because as it stands, you want them more than they want you. Who do you even direct this question to? Who do you think is going to change this for you? The market speaks and is always right, whether you like it or not. You don't like it? Take it up with science, or God, or whatever your thing is. You're not doing anything but looking foolish by complaining about how unfair things are. Yes, things are unfair. Everyone else has learned to accept it and adapt while you've spent your time writing 100 threads complaining about it.

 

I dont like any bar or club, none of them.

 

And I don't like waking up early or working, yet I do it because my desire to make money and provide a healthy, comfortable, safe, life for my family outweighs the discomfort of it. Also, as I mentioned (which you conveniently ignored), there are plenty of people whose relationship to alcohol isn't extreme, and there are plenty of places to meet people other than bars and clubs.

 

The only thing missing on your argument is the "use resources wisely" how many of those Tinder successes were due to that at least in part?

 

Oh, right, I forgot: every person who isn't you is a judgmental alcoholic. Every man who isn't you is an insensitive misogynist. Every Tinder match ever made is a result of money. For what it's worth, I've dated this woman for over a year before she got a big snapshot of my finances. One of the other guys is an immigrant who moved to this country at age 10 with one parent, not speaking the language, and dragged and clawed his way to a prestigious law school, graduating just recently with 6 figures of debt.

 

I dont care if they drink I do care of get written off because I don't.

 

Fair enough, but what good does lowering yourself to their level do? Why not just accept it and move on unbothered, with your head up, instead of bitter and resentful? There will always be people like that in your life. You can't control that, but you can control how you react and carry yourself in spite of it.

 

 

What might those realistic expectations be??

 

You're 35, bitter, and judgmental with an inability/unwillingness to understand and adapt to the natural inequalities of life that many, many, many people face in one way or another. You spend countless hours on a message board complaining about things in cyclical fashion; first asking why you can't get the things you want, (then when presented with advice from people who want to help), making excuses as to why you won't break your habits to get those things by misrepresenting circumstances to extremes to bolster your argument, then finding temporary solace in your ill-earned righteousness and respectability, then repeating the whole process shortly after when you realize you're just as, if not more, unhappy than before. You think that in spite of all that, you should be dating thin 25-30 year olds because you're similarly thin.

 

Given what I know about you and making some inferences from that, I don't think you have realistic expectations. For one, you seem to lack some fundamental understanding of how the world works and how to adapt to it.

 

Judgemental...heck I get judged and I'll do the same back.

 

Why?

Edited November 26, 2018 by normal person

[ZA Dater]

Does every single person you meet "not respect" your choice? Is every single person turning their nose up at you? Is everyone in your country so heartless that if you explain that you don't drink for health reasons, or your family has a history of addiction, or you're allergic, or you're driving, that they wouldn't be able to look past it? Is everyone you meet constantly handing your drinks and watching to make sure you finish every drop? What percentage of the people you meet are shooting you down because of your lack of alcohol consumption?

 

 

 

What concern of yours is it what those particular people think? Especially if their own choices and attitudes preclude them from your dating pool anyways. You have such a childish rhetoric with regards to the natural variance of circumstances that you don't want to accept:

 

"(Some) people don't respect my choices, so I can use that to justify making blanket excuses for other misgivings against my own self interest."

 

You can if you like, but it'll land you back in this same spot. You're just making the relationship between yourself and these people more tenuous. If someone has an issue with your refusal to drink, why not educate them on why you don't and why it's important to you? If they still take issue, why not just take the high road and move on? The only thing you do by reciprocating the antagonism or misunderstanding is make yourself look insecure. You can take the high road and be confident, dignified, and unbothered, or you can lower yourself to someone else's level and look like a child.

 

"Women don't have to work to impress me, so why should I have to expend effort to impress them?"

 

Because as it stands, you want them more than they want you. Who do you even direct this question to? Who do you think is going to change this for you? The market speaks and is always right, whether you like it or not. You don't like it? Take it up with science, or God, or whatever your thing is. You're not doing anything but looking foolish by complaining about how unfair things are. Yes, things are unfair. Everyone else has learned to accept it and adapt while you've spent your time writing 100 threads complaining about it.

 

 

 

And I don't like waking up early or working, yet I do it because my desire to make money and provide a healthy, comfortable, safe, life for my family outweighs the discomfort of it. Also, as I mentioned (which you conveniently ignored), there are plenty of people whose relationship to alcohol isn't extreme, and there are plenty of places to meet people other than bars and clubs.

 

 

 

Oh, right, I forgot: every person who isn't you is a judgmental alcoholic. Every man who isn't you is an insensitive misogynist. Every Tinder match ever made is a result of money. For what it's worth, I've dated this woman for over a year before she got a big snapshot of my finances. One of the other guys is an immigrant who moved to this country at age 10 with one parent, not speaking the language, and dragged and clawed his way to a prestigious law school, graduating just recently with 6 figures of debt.

 

 

 

Fair enough, but what good does lowering yourself to their level do? Why not just accept it and move on unbothered, with your head up, instead of bitter and resentful? There will always be people like that in your life. You can't control that, but you can control how you react and carry yourself in spite of it.

 

 

 

 

You're 35, bitter, and judgmental with an inability/unwillingness to understand and adapt to the natural inequalities of life that many, many, many people face in one way or another. You spend countless hours on a message board complaining about things in cyclical fashion; first asking why you can't get the things you want, (then when presented with advice from people who want to help), making excuses as to why you won't break your habits to get those things by misrepresenting circumstances to extremes to bolster your argument, then finding temporary solace in your ill-earned righteousness and respectability, then repeating the whole process shortly after when you realize you're just as, if not more, unhappy than before. You think that in spite of all that, you should be dating thin 25-30 year olds because you're similarly thin.

 

Given what I know about you and making some inferences from that, I don't think you have realistic expectations. For one, you seem to lack some fundamental understanding of how the world works and how to adapt to it.

 

 

 

Why?

 

Because it's either judge or be judged anyway. Thanks for telling I should be dating some frog. I can lower myself there but I am not going to. You have all the answers and a self proclaimed perfect life. Off you go and enjoy it, your chest pumping superiority complex is nauseating in the extreme.

 

You have all the answers but none of the roads to them. Don't lecture me about the inequality of life because I'd wager I am more attuned to that than you are.

 

You fail to see if can bend over backwards do everything you say and still get judged and passed over. How do you know I haven't tried? You don't. You paint a lovely idyllic picture but it's not so for everyone no matter what they do. Why should any of us accept what we don't want? I suspect you would not.

 

Every time I go out the focus becomes on why I don't drink, o move the narrative onto something eise but the damage is done.

[Garcon1986]

Whether you feel attacked or not, the dating scene is still with the same expectations as before - woman seeks good looking exciting man who has evidence he can take care of himself, have a sense of humor, doesn't take himself too seriously, can protect her, can provide for a family, and has some sense of a life story to share. The man in turn can qualify the woman and look for many of the same things, which by the way, builds attraction, and says you are not just looking for any woman in the neighborhood to have sex with. That's the core basics.

 

The easiest of the things to change here is to be funny and take classes on charisma, which in the beginning is fake, but later on becomes natural. Why is it so painful for your to work on your charisma? It's a talent like anything else. The so called jerks and frat boys have more of it, but you can get a fair percentage of charisma too. It's just that you are refusing to do so because it's fake. A woman won't love you for who you are until you demonstrate you are exciting to be around. That's how it's always been, since the asteroids were falling and the earth was cooling.

[ZA Dater]

Whether you feel attacked or not, the dating scene is still with the same expectations as before - woman seeks good looking exciting man who has evidence he can take care of himself, have a sense of humor, doesn't take himself too seriously, can protect her, can provide for a family, and has some sense of a life story to share. The man in turn can qualify the woman and look for many of the same things, which by the way, builds attraction, and says you are not just looking for any woman in the neighborhood to have sex with. That's the core basics.

 

The easiest of the things to change here is to be funny and take classes on charisma, which in the beginning is fake, but later on becomes natural. Why is it so painful for your to work on your charisma? It's a talent like anything else. The so called jerks and frat boys have more of it, but you can get a fair percentage of charisma too. It's just that you are refusing to do so because it's fake. A woman won't love you for who you are until you demonstrate you are exciting to be around. That's how it's always been, since the asteroids were falling and the earth was cooling.

 

Then I just accept being alone forever. I can bring out charisma but it takes time and I need to be comfortable with the person.

 

I am never going to be that life of the party guy. I'll just need to find some sort of compromise which gives me something even if it's just a friend zone

[normal person]

Because it's either judge or be judged anyway.

 

It's almost like you didn't read my post. What does that accomplish? Why not educate on them on why you don't drink? If they continue to judge you, why not just move on with confidence instead of making yourself look insecure?

 

Thanks for telling I should be dating some frog.

 

I didn't say that, I said it's unrealistic for you to expect to date a girl who's at the peak of her sexual market value when you still haven't learned to accept the fact that life isn't fair, amongst other things. And that's not to imply that simply doing so is a magic bullet, or that things will then be easy -- but what I'm saying is that until your feet land in the real world, you're likely not going to find much success.

 

I can lower myself there but I am not going to.

 

I never said "lower yourself," I implied that you should raise yourself to the standard of the people you want to be with first by not being bitter and petulant that the world doesn't work exactly the way you want it to, because that's not attractive to anyone.

 

You have all the answers and a self proclaimed perfect life. Off you go and enjoy it, your chest pumping superiority complex is nauseating in the extreme.

You have all the answers but none of the roads to them.

 

I did my best to try and clarify the situation to then help you out. I asked you what percentage of people you've met write you off for not drinking. You declined to answer. I asked you if you and your friends ever go to age appropriate bars, and if not, why? You declined to answer. You said Tinder was useless tool for misogynists, I provided three examples of people in your age group using it to great success without being manipulative, you assumed it was all because of money, which it wasn't. I provided you a rough road map to get you on the right path using methods I've spent my life observing and using to success (stuff most people our age should understand and implement), and you accuse me of "having all the answers but none of the roads to them."

 

No one here has all the answers for you. But you unequivocally do not have any answers for yourself. The least you could do is not waste the time of people who are trying to help you by misrepresenting your situation to extremes, shooting down/ignoring worthwhile inquiries/suggestions because they make you uncomfortable, and derailing. You might be able to make some progress if you can be an adult about things, but you won't if you can't.

 

Don't lecture me about the inequality of life because I'd wager I am more attuned to that than you are.

 

No one's lecturing you. It's not a competition so stop trying to derail.

 

But if you're so attuned to it, why do you have such a hard time accepting or understanding it with regards to your dating life? You understand that someone, or even you, have advantages and circumstances that others don't have and someone in a lesser situation could very well opine "Why wasn't I born with x, y, and z?" to absolutely no avail, but you totally fail to extrapolate the situation to yourself and you still wonder why you should have to expend more effort to meet a partner than an attractive young woman. Whatever explanation about the inequalities of life that you want to give to the first individual in the first situation, you can also give to yourself in the second. I don't see why you can't understand that.

 

You fail to see if can bend over backwards do everything you say and still get judged and passed over. How do you know I haven't tried? You don't.

 

You're right, I don't. Probably because when I asked you some questions to gain a better perspective and thus give you a better response, you ignored them.

Edited November 26, 2018 by normal person

[Mysterio]

In my social environment. It feels like Friendship is more in abundance than Romantic connections.

 

The women around me the vibe I get is this. If they are into you. They are in your face. If they are not. If you ask them out. Its a chore for them. Even though its just an outing. Its not like Sex and major physical affection is expected.

[Noemiforever43]

ZA I am sorry this is happening to you, and not all woman are like that

Edited November 28, 2018 by a LoveShack.org Moderator