Sleep incompatibility

[snowcones]

I see this as, you two dated for a few months and had fun, but weren't meant to be together for longer. You can be upset about that but it's so much better to see it in a positive light. She helped you through a separation and lonely time. She gave you light for a while. It was only for a few months, but that's the way to see it, rather than, she duped me or I'm so mad that she doesn't want me forever and I hope that she lives unhappily ever after with her food stamps. See the good in it, appreciate it for what it was and move on. Getting angry with her is only going to spoil what you two did have. In reality, you both felt it was too soon to do anything with permanence, like living together, so you were both reticent, and now, the fun time is up. It sucks but it happens. Thank her and move on.

 

Here is the #1 song right now, that may help put things into perspective.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=POlsv3byRoo

Edited December 17, 2018 by snowcones

[Trail Blazer]

I see this as, you two dated for a few months and had fun, but weren't meant to be together for longer. You can be upset about that but it's so much better to see it in a positive light. She helped you through a separation and lonely time. She gave you light for a while. It was only for a few months, but that's the way to see it, rather than, she duped me or I'm so mad that she doesn't want me forever and I hope that she lives unhappily ever after with her food stamps. See the good in it, appreciate it for what it was and move on. Getting angry with her is only going to spoil what you two did have. In reality, you both felt it was too soon to do anything with permanence, like living together, so you were both reticent, and now, the fun time is up. It sucks but it happens. Thank her and move on.

 

Here is the #1 song right now, that may help put things into perspective.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=POlsv3byRoo

 

Thank you for the kind sentiments, snowcones. Look, I got caught up in the frenzy of this thread and my hurt spilled out a bit. I don't wish anything bad upon this girl. I'm hurting because I feel foolish, I'm hurting because the good times were so good albeit brief, and I'm hurting mostly because I love her. I wanted it to be different. I wanted to be the difference in her life that she didn't have previously. It hurts feeling like I'm rejected after everything I feel I've proven to her that I'd do, yet every jerk she dated previously lasted longer than this.

 

I reached out to her today and asked if she was ready to talk. We hadn't spoken in a few days. She said she would like to come over to my house tomorrow evening and bring some food so we can cook a meal. I don't know whether bringing over food means anything other than a kind gesture. She's a kind person so I won't look into anything deeper, especially anything potentially negative.

 

You are so right about how she helped me through a tough separation. I actually don't want to lose her in my life if we agree that we're not compatible to date. We've actually become very good friends. Obviously our commumication has become strained in recent times, but I think without the pressure of trying to forge an intimate relationship out of material that doesn't exist, I think that we'll just remain friends.

[Veronica73]

You're kidding, right? You can't have read every post in this thread. I have gone to great lengths to explain how it is not I who has the difficulty communicating, it's her! I have tried on NUMEROUS occasions to talk to her about stuff. Pleasr go back and read what's been said thoroughly. You clearly haven't done so as you keep accusing me of not trying things which I've already addressed.

 

No, I’m not kidding. Frankly, I think you should look up “martyr complex”. And I’m saying this after reading all the posts in this thread, and also the posts about your marriage.

[MaleIntuition]

If I’m reading the situation correctly, the core of the problem isn’t that OP isn’t getting “laid”, but that she doesn’t seem to be interested in any form of intimacy anymore which seem to indicate a loss of attraction..?

 

Are there Any good reason why they weren’t at least cuddling some why watching TV together?

 

The whole single-mom-is-tough narrative is all good - but, honestly; the kid is 6, not 2, he goes to school(?) and the girlfriend doesn’t have a job. (How is she supporting herself?). If that is such an impossible life puzzle, she shouldn’t have been dating in the first place. But, I don’t believe time - or sleep incompatibility, is the true issue.

[Happy Lemming]

Even if I were to dump her, I need to talk to her in person in order to do that.

 

Why?? Unless you have a bunch a crap at her house or vice-versa, why do you need to have some serious discussion about breaking up?? Do you think that she'll ask why, you'll explain your displeasure with the lack of sex and she'll throw her clothes off and do you??

 

Just call her up, tell her "I don't want to see you anymore" and if she asks why "I just don't think we are compatible" (I've used that line over and over and over, again) Then say "Good bye" and hang up.

 

Like taking a band-aid off... just rip it off and be done.

[Happy Lemming]

She can either come for the ride or collect food stamps for her and her son and go back to dating a-holes.

 

Some women want that exciting "bad boy" or "a-hole" type man, even if they are a single mom on food stamps.

 

Or they are looking for a fixer-upper guy... They'll be the one to "change" him, yea right!!

 

Either way, who cares what she dates after you dump her.

 

Personally, I think you dodged a bullet. In time, I think you would get bored with her, you are driven, she is not. For me, I need an intelligent woman, one that is well read, otherwise I get bored rather quickly.

[BettyDraper]

Why?? Unless you have a bunch a crap at her house or vice-versa, why do you need to have some serious discussion about breaking up?? Do you think that she'll ask why, you'll explain your displeasure with the lack of sex and she'll throw her clothes off and do you??

 

Just call her up, tell her "I don't want to see you anymore" and if she asks why "I just don't think we are compatible" (I've used that line over and over and over, again) Then say "Good bye" and hang up.

 

Like taking a band-aid off... just rip it off and be done.

 

I'm guessing that TB feels that a discussion is necessary because of how serious the relationship became. Children and parents were involved and "I love you" was said. It would be callous and inappropriate to simply call and tersely end the relationship. Just because the relationship didn't work out, it doesn't mean that TB needs to be unnecessarily harsh.

 

The "I just don't think we're compatible" line is perfect when there was only a few dates or there was a serious problem.

[Happy Lemming]

The "I just don't think we're compatible" line is perfect when there was only a few dates or there was a serious problem.

 

 

But its the truth... They are not sexually compatible.

[Trail Blazer]

Why?? Unless you have a bunch a crap at her house or vice-versa, why do you need to have some serious discussion about breaking up?? Do you think that she'll ask why, you'll explain your displeasure with the lack of sex and she'll throw her clothes off and do you??

 

Just call her up, tell her "I don't want to see you anymore" and if she asks why "I just don't think we are compatible" (I've used that line over and over and over, again) Then say "Good bye" and hang up.

 

Like taking a band-aid off... just rip it off and be done.

 

That's way too brutal! I don't operate like that. She's a real person with feelings and I care a lot about her wellbeing. Yes I'm frustrated, but I am undecided whether I'll even break up with her. I need her to talk to me more. I need to hear what she has to say with regards to my feelings of the situation. She's coming over shortly so hopefully we'll be able to straighten a few things out.

[BettyDraper]

But its the truth... They are not sexually compatible.

 

It is the truth but break up phone call with a terse goodbye is not suitable for this situation.

 

I realize that sex is very important in a relationship. However, I wonder if sex is the only reason you date.

[BettyDraper]

That's way too brutal! I don't operate like that. She's a real person with feelings and I care a lot about her wellbeing. Yes I'm frustrated, but I am undecided whether I'll even break up with her. I need her to talk to me more. I need to hear what she has to say with regards to my feelings of the situation. She's coming over shortly so hopefully we'll be able to straighten a few things out.

 

Yes, you're an honorable man so you don't get anything out of being harsh for no good reason.

 

It makes sense to treat others with respect. Some men don't respect women because they hate us.

[greymatter]

TB, I can understand where you are coming from. Sex is a really important aspect of my relationship with my boyfriend but if it stopped for some reason, I would definitely have a conversation about it with him prior to making any decisions. I care about my BF too much to just walk away unless there were a really good reason to end things. We plan to be together in the long term and I imagine that at some point sexual dysfunction could happen, even though my BF is younger and probably has some years before ED happens, if it does.

 

I’d be as upset as you are if we stopped sleeping together because the sexual connection is really special to both of us. I hope that she is willing to have an open and honest discussion with you about things.

[Happy Lemming]

However, I wonder if sex is the only reason you date.

 

If your question is for me, then "yes"...

 

Sex is the only reason I date or stay in a relationship. If I've been "cut off" from a woman, I'm moving on. My long term girlfriend and I enjoy other activities, but without sex, she is just a friend. And I have enough friends.

[Happy Lemming]

That's way too brutal! I don't operate like that.

 

Trail Blazer, I know you are coming out of a divorce and you think the dating world is rainbows and unicorns, but its not. I'd liken it to a grist mill.

 

With your moderate income and nice heart, you're going to be chewed up and spit out. My advice is to toughen up a bit and don't worry so much about being Mr. Nice Guy on the way out. Why do you care about her well being, once you are gone, she doesn't care about you or yours.

 

Its a dog eat dog world out there in the dating community.

[Trail Blazer]

Trail Blazer, I know you are coming out of a divorce and you think the dating world is rainbows and unicorns, but its not. I'd liken it to a grist mill.

 

With your moderate income and nice heart, you're going to be chewed up and spit out. My advice is to toughen up a bit and don't worry so much about being Mr. Nice Guy on the way out. Why do you care about her well being, once you are gone, she doesn't care about you or yours.

 

Its a dog eat dog world out there in the dating community.

I didn't intend to fall for someone so quickly, but I did. I can't turn my feelings off, even if I made a concerted effort to be more cut throat in my dealings. That's as hard for me as actually being brutal in my dealings with her. I simply can't be like that, not least to her.

 

If this all goes belly up, I know that I will HAVE to approach things differently when I decide to put myself back in the market. I know that things take longer to settle and figuring out each other's quirks and idiosyncrasies takes time.

 

I naively thought I'd found "the one" when we started chatting. Yeah, I've been married for 9 years, with the same person for 13... I was surprised how many bites I got on Tinder and Bumble - certainly enough for abundant sex, including one offer after only very little time talking. Granted, she was from the "I almost swiped the other way" list... but still! Whereas, my gf is a knockout in the looks dept but clearly not everything I'd hoped for or thought in the beginning.

Edited December 19, 2018 by Trail Blazer

[Trail Blazer]

As for dinner and chat, she came around Monday night and we did make some progress, albeit hampered by her son being present - which I knew would be the case but is unavoidable.

 

I'd opened up by first asking her to be honest with me about how she felt about me. She told me her feelings absolutely had not changed. I told her that I needed more assurance because I'd been left to wonder. I'd explained to her how I was extremely disappointed and a bit off put by why she just cut off inviting me over without talking to me about it. I'd managed to get a few points across, just before the tears started rolling in...

 

So, in summary, and before her son came back from the bedroom which I've set up as a toy room for my kids initially, with a toy in his hand wanting to show us but instead asking, "why are you crying, mommy?" - these were some of her key responses:

 

- She had been REALLY struggling in many ways

 

- She hadn't told me specifically why she didn't invite me over because she hadn't made a conscious decision. She hummed and harred before deciding not to because she was too tired

 

- She thought I'd understand given all the stress she did tell me she was going through, that I'd put 2 and 2 together and have my answer

 

- She says she in exausted from putting on a "brave face" every day so her son sees a happy, smiling mommy, not a sad mommy, that she can't switch off and be vulnerable all of a sudden to explain things to me. She said by which point she's got him to bed, she goes straight to focusing on winding down.

 

We were just about to touch on arresting intimacy levels before her son came in, which ended the discussion for the evening. I do hope to resume the discussions with her at a later date. There's still much we need to work through.

[Morello]

I don't think you're gonna get a good outcome out of this approach. She's under pressure and your putting her against the wall.

 

I know you're frustrated but if you don't back off a little and give her some breathing room she's gonna bail very soon.

[lovenoobi]

I've been following this thread a bit and the vibe that I get from your posts is that you seem to be an intelligent and reasonable guy. However you also seem to be very analytical and, I mean no offence to you, but you also have a bit of superiority complex.

 

I think your recent post demonstrates this nicely when you label yourself as this nice guy won't finish last, she will lose out and so will her son if the relationship ends. Sure that might be something you only said in the heat of the moment but those are often the true feelings you've been harboring and may also been projecting on to your GF for a while.

 

A possible problem that you may be experiencing is that very often people don't want to be told or have things done in a certain way, even if it is a more efficient or better method. She's been raising her son and managing her own life to the best of her abilities for a while and perhaps she isn't ready to let someone in and make a lot of changes. Changes of things that you deal with easily on a daily basis but which you said she stresses over about.

 

But all in all I also don't think this relationship is looking well for you. Just trying to have a discussion with your GF has to be done in parts is not a good sign. And when you start listing the number of problems you have and how you feel there is an imbalance of effort for making the relationship work then pretty much the romance is gone and you might as well just write up a contract lol. Perhaps just ending things now amicably and give each party some time off for reflection and start again in a new slate is the best course of action if that's what both parties want in the future.

[BaileyB]

It seems quite clear that this is a woman who, for whatever reason, is struggling right now and not able to invest the time and energy in a relationship. While you you certain expectations and you demand more time and attention than she can give at this time...

 

I'm sorry it didn't work out for you. Be kind, if/when you end the relationship.

[Happy Lemming]

Whereas, my gf is a knockout in the looks dept...

 

Its like having a Ferrari in your garage that you can't drive. What's the use of possessing it, if you can't play with it and enjoy it.

[losangelena]

Its like having a Ferrari in your garage that you can't drive. What's the use of possessing it, if you can't play with it and enjoy it.

 

Comparing women to cars now, that’s great.

 

 

OP, maybe you’ve tried this already—forgive me, I can’t remember—but it seems like often, when you sit down and talk to her, it’s you trying to get information or “honesty” out of her. Why all the effort to make her explain herself? Have you tried having a conversation where you tell her how YOU feel? I find that when someone has a problem with what I’m doing, it’s much easier to hear from them how it effects them, rather than being asked why I’m doing such and such. Talk about pressure!

 

Maybe you’ve tried this already, I dunno. Because if she knows how her actions are effecting you, then she can decide if she’s willing to do anything about it.

[Trail Blazer]

I've been following this thread a bit and the vibe that I get from your posts is that you seem to be an intelligent and reasonable guy. However you also seem to be very analytical and, I mean no offence to you, but you also have a bit of superiority complex.

 

I think your recent post demonstrates this nicely when you label yourself as this nice guy won't finish last, she will lose out and so will her son if the relationship ends. Sure that might be something you only said in the heat of the moment but those are often the true feelings you've been harboring and may also been projecting on to your GF for a while.

 

A possible problem that you may be experiencing is that very often people don't want to be told or have things done in a certain way, even if it is a more efficient or better method. She's been raising her son and managing her own life to the best of her abilities for a while and perhaps she isn't ready to let someone in and make a lot of changes. Changes of things that you deal with easily on a daily basis but which you said she stresses over about.

 

But all in all I also don't think this relationship is looking well for you. Just trying to have a discussion with your GF has to be done in parts is not a good sign. And when you start listing the number of problems you have and how you feel there is an imbalance of effort for making the relationship work then pretty much the romance is gone and you might as well just write up a contract lol. Perhaps just ending things now amicably and give each party some time off for reflection and start again in a new slate is the best course of action if that's what both parties want in the future.

If I remove myself from the situation, which I often try to to help me empathize with others and also make more sense of my own feelings, casting emotions aside, I really don't come to any different conclusion. Sure, that might translate to a "reverse-projection' of sorts, but I think I'm pretty reasonable at separating facts and emotions, especially after the fact when I reflect.

 

It might be a "superiority complex" if you will, but I defy anyone to convince me of how I'm not the one taking the bigger risk, yet she's the one who stands to be more greatly rewarded for the risk I've taken on her. The issue here is not what I've said in the heat of the moment, but whether that's an attitude that rubs off. I don't think so because I've not ever said anything directly and I don't feel like I've behaved in an overt manner that suggests I think that way.

 

The rest of your post raises some very valid points. I've lived an extremely fast-paced life. I was married to lawyer and she was a very intense person. I was forced out of my comfort zone and when I reflect back to how I even survived that relationship for so long, there was very little love and more tough love. I've taken a lot of positives out of being married to someone like that, I just couldn't remain with someone so intensely overbearing. I'm a much stronger person, but now I can control the speed with which I operate. Unfortunately it seems like that speed and intensity is far too much for my girlfriend.

[Trail Blazer]

It seems quite clear that this is a woman who, for whatever reason, is struggling right now and not able to invest the time and energy in a relationship. While you you certain expectations and you demand more time and attention than she can give at this time...

 

I'm sorry it didn't work out for you. Be kind, if/when you end the relationship.

Of course I would be kind and let her down as gently as possible. She's such a sweet natured girl. If we don't work out, the last thing I want to do is cause her any more pain that necessary.

[Trail Blazer]

Its like having a Ferrari in your garage that you can't drive. What's the use of possessing it, if you can't play with it and enjoy it.

 

You can pose next to the Ferrari in selfies and look good! Alas, I didn't get into this relationship to impress others. So, while some might love the Ferrari in the garage, you don't get to feel the raw emotions until you get behind the wheel. I want a relationship to make me feel good, not just make me look good. That's the dilemma I face.

[greymatter]

I thought about your situation today (believe it or not) and what I would do if in your shoes, after your latest post about the talk you two had. You must be so incredibly frustrated (not only sexually but) by the ongoing inability to address it with her. It's not her child's fault for bounding into the room of course. You have tried but once again, it was bad timing and once again, you are left frustrated and with no resolution. And going back to the beginning of your original posts, her decision to stop inviting you over, whatever the reason, is a major change to what was formerly an exciting time when the two of you were new. Heck, your relationship is still new (!), and yet, the fun, romance, and passion seems to be gone.It seems like it would be really hard to recover that, given that she is going through a bad time. It is a lot for you to have to deal with in a new relationship, especially after going through a separation and dealing with a divorce. It just may be, however much you care about each other, that the timing of this is all wrong, and it won't or can't go back to what it was in the very beginning.

 

My situation is very different than yours because we typically have 24 hours together every weekend alone, with no kids present (and we actually haven't involved our kids meaning I haven't met his and he hasn't met mine, and we are in no hurry to introduce that element because we have no reason to...we are not looking to remarry or blend families). The 24 hours together is precious and allows for a lot of intimacy, bonding, and communication that happens organically. From what you describe, it sounds as though you have very little emotional intimacy, and of course the physical intimacy seems to be gone. I'm saying this in a supportive way, but what's in it for you at this point? Can you see things improving anytime soon, given your latest conversation with her?