Am I fool?

[Kamel3]

My wife and I have been together ever since we began college. She comes from a very traditional islamic family, and tney did not know about our relationship for some time. What prompted me meeting her parents was that after college, when we were still dating and began our careers, she got pregnant and we decided to abort it. This is something she has never properly dealt with nor got over. That situation was such a strain that we both saw other people for a few months. We reconciled and wanted to work things out and move forward. I met her parents soon after and we were married about a year and a half later.

 

Our marriage, which has lasted just over three years, has had its ups and downs. We aren't alwasy happy and I often times would be stressed due to work. Also, we failed to always communicate. This was an issue she commonly complained about, and I would often ignore.

 

Fast forward to summer of 2018, my wife and I considered moving to another state. About two years before, my brother's family had moved away from the town we lived in to a much nicer City and we were certain we wanted to move there. This was something in the works, but was going to take months to prepare. However, one day mid last year, my wife told me she was going to move in September to find work, and I would move soon after. The reason for my delay was that I needed to have five years in my field in order to recieved recipricol admission for my work-related license. I actually thought her setting this up showed initiative and was going to be good for our family. My brother's family as well as my father all live within minutes of the house we were moving into.

 

My wife and I packed up our possessions and my father flew down to drive the moving truck. This was early September, 2018. The lease on the condo in our original home was up, so I moved in with friensd for a few months. Not seeing my wife was hard but I knew we were making the right choice by moving. In Noveber she visited, and things were hard mainly because we were fighting over little issues. I was very stressed as I was now within my last few weeks of work and still had very much to do. Then, for a job interview in early December, I flew out to the city we were moving to. I was only there for three days and had to spend the entire first day working from home. Again, things were strained.

 

The time came for me to move, and things went well. I had another job interview within days of the move. However, just a few days later, and the reason for my post, I found out that the man my wife had dated after the abortion had flown out to the city we moved to see her. I confonted my wife and she admitted that he came to see her and that she had sex with him. Eventually, over the course of a few weeks, I found out they have had an on-again off-again affair ever since they originally dated and that the reason she wanted to move so bad was to get away from him. This obviously is very hard for me to deal with because it means she has never been faithful nor dedicated to this marriage for more than a few months at a time. She claims this was because she wanted our marriage to work. I really want things to work out and we have been getting along very well since all of this has come out Also, our sex life has been great. She has also been completely honest about everything, however not when I first confronted her, this took some time.

 

My biggest hang up is that this person flew out to see my wife and she hooked up with him. I understand they likely had a deeper connection than just friends with benefits, but considering that this was going on to some extent for the entire time we were married as well as the fact that he flew out here to see her and she didn't stop him really bothers me. I've spoken with my brother and close friends about it, all of whom think we should try to work it out. I want to, but sometimes

 

I feel like a fool thinking it could work. I know that one of the root issues was the abortion and her failure to properly deal with the emotional implications of it, however at some point (i.e. when we got married) her affair should have stopped. Though not at first, she has since become very open and honest about everything and appears to have ceased communication with this individual and blocked him completely. Through her admissions, I also learned that she saw this individual in November when she visited. I just don't know how to feel about all of this. I truly love this woman and I know she loves me, but at some point the marriage just cannot work. What should I do?

[oldtruck]

You are young, no kids, best to divorce her.

 

Bet you she wanted the separation so she could have a test run with her OM.

She has been a cheater before the marriage and after your wedding.

[Blind-Sided]

That's rough... I'm very sorry.

 

 

It's not an easy choice. I'm for trying to save things, but if one party in the marriage simply doesn't want to make it work... then there really isn't any choice for you. Or I should say... the choice was already made for you. Try as you may... that hurt will continue to grow. Mentally you won't rust her, and you will become more jealous. Not to mention, she hasn't really been faithful from the start.

 

 

I guess in this case... since there are no kids, and finances are still in the beginning... and for the sake of your own happiness (in life, overall)... you should be done. (sorry)

[Mr. Lucky]

I feel like a fool thinking it could work. I know that one of the root issues was the abortion and her failure to properly deal with the emotional implications of it, however at some point (i.e. when we got married) her affair should have stopped. Though not at first, she has since become very open and honest about everything and appears to have ceased communication with this individual and blocked him completely. Through her admissions, I also learned that she saw this individual in November when she visited. I just don't know how to feel about all of this. I truly love this woman and I know she loves me, but at some point the marriage just cannot work. What should I do?

 

I'm trying to understand, what marriage are you saving?

 

More than an affair, your wife has led a double life the entire time, coming home to you after having been with him. So whatever relationship you've thought you had, she's been involved in something completely different. There's hasn't been a period when she wasn't juggling both of you.

 

Kamel3, your decision to stay would be based on this - someone who's lied to you for so long about something so fundamentally important is now telling you the truth. That's not a concept I'd be willing to accept, you may feel differently. Keep posting...

 

Mr. Lucky

[Kamel3]

My thoughts are that if she wanted to move away for a fresh start away from this person, is that enough to at least try? Obviously she messed up even after that. My only real question is whether it's worth trying to make things work here since we already wen through the move and are here? We have such a long history even beyond the marriage, but obviously that's the most serious point in our relationship and she couldn't go more than a few months without seeing him since the wedding. Is it possible for forgiveness at this point and if so, is it foolish to do so?

[LonelyITGuy]

My wife and I have been together ever since we began college. She comes from a very traditional islamic family, and tney did not know about our relationship for some time. What prompted me meeting her parents was that after college, when we were still dating and began our careers, she got pregnant and we decided to abort it. This is something she has never properly dealt with nor got over. That situation was such a strain that we both saw other people for a few months. We reconciled and wanted to work things out and move forward. I met her parents soon after and we were married about a year and a half later.

 

Our marriage, which has lasted just over three years, has had its ups and downs. We aren't alwasy happy and I often times would be stressed due to work. Also, we failed to always communicate. This was an issue she commonly complained about, and I would often ignore.

 

Fast forward to summer of 2018, my wife and I considered moving to another state. About two years before, my brother's family had moved away from the town we lived in to a much nicer City and we were certain we wanted to move there. This was something in the works, but was going to take months to prepare. However, one day mid last year, my wife told me she was going to move in September to find work, and I would move soon after. The reason for my delay was that I needed to have five years in my field in order to recieved recipricol admission for my work-related license. I actually thought her setting this up showed initiative and was going to be good for our family. My brother's family as well as my father all live within minutes of the house we were moving into.

 

My wife and I packed up our possessions and my father flew down to drive the moving truck. This was early September, 2018. The lease on the condo in our original home was up, so I moved in with friensd for a few months. Not seeing my wife was hard but I knew we were making the right choice by moving. In Noveber she visited, and things were hard mainly because we were fighting over little issues. I was very stressed as I was now within my last few weeks of work and still had very much to do. Then, for a job interview in early December, I flew out to the city we were moving to. I was only there for three days and had to spend the entire first day working from home. Again, things were strained.

 

The time came for me to move, and things went well. I had another job interview within days of the move. However, just a few days later, and the reason for my post, I found out that the man my wife had dated after the abortion had flown out to the city we moved to see her. I confonted my wife and she admitted that he came to see her and that she had sex with him. Eventually, over the course of a few weeks, I found out they have had an on-again off-again affair ever since they originally dated and that the reason she wanted to move so bad was to get away from him. This obviously is very hard for me to deal with because it means she has never been faithful nor dedicated to this marriage for more than a few months at a time. She claims this was because she wanted our marriage to work. I really want things to work out and we have been getting along very well since all of this has come out Also, our sex life has been great. She has also been completely honest about everything, however not when I first confronted her, this took some time.

 

My biggest hang up is that this person flew out to see my wife and she hooked up with him. I understand they likely had a deeper connection than just friends with benefits, but considering that this was going on to some extent for the entire time we were married as well as the fact that he flew out here to see her and she didn't stop him really bothers me. I've spoken with my brother and close friends about it, all of whom think we should try to work it out. I want to, but sometimes

 

I feel like a fool thinking it could work. I know that one of the root issues was the abortion and her failure to properly deal with the emotional implications of it, however at some point (i.e. when we got married) her affair should have stopped. Though not at first, she has since become very open and honest about everything and appears to have ceased communication with this individual and blocked him completely. Through her admissions, I also learned that she saw this individual in November when she visited. I just don't know how to feel about all of this. I truly love this woman and I know she loves me, but at some point the marriage just cannot work. What should I do?

 

Um, bro, she doesn't love you. If she did, she wouldn't be banging someone else behind your back. You're in a deep state of denial right now. Cut your losses and GTFO. You deserve better. Your relationship can't survive all of this.

[notbroken]

Could you trust her ever again? Trust is a cornerstone of a good marriage. You know the answer. I'm sorry. Go forward with your head held high. Treat yourself as well as possible and move on asap.

[Turning point]

Your point about her moving to get away from the other man is a contradiction because she invited him to fly out and sleep with her, and also hooked up with him during the visit in November?

 

I'm not sure what part of that you call resistance. Seems to me that's full-on collaboration.

 

The bigger issue is you and all of this doubt. As much as you think want this girl, it's very clear that this duped life of hers is eating away at you. Even if you decide to reconcile I suspect that in the long run it will be you who can no longer ignore the giant elephant in the room and move to end this relationship. That may take months or it may take years but, right now you have no children and a brand new job - so choose wisely.

[Kamel3]

Could you trust her ever again? Trust is a cornerstone of a good marriage. You know the answer. I'm sorry. Go forward with your head held high. Treat yourself as well as possible and move on asap.

 

The sad thing is that I probably could. The original issue was that we both failed to get over the abortion. To this day neither of us has really dealt with it. However, I also understand that if we decided to get married, that should have been the stopping point to all of this and the time to deal with our issues.

[Kamel3]

Your point about her moving to get away from the other man is a contradiction because she invited him to fly out and sleep with her, and also hooked up with him during the visit in November?

 

I'm not sure what part of that you call resistance. Seems to me that's full-on collaboration.

 

The bigger issue is you and all of this doubt. As much as you think want this girl, it's very clear that this duped life of hers is eating away at you. Even if you decide to reconcile I suspect that in the long run it will be you who can no longer ignore the giant elephant in the room and move to end this relationship. That may take months or it may take years but, right now you have no children and a brand new job - so choose wisely.

 

I agree, it feels almost like collaboration. At best, she stopped talking to him for only a very brief period. It actually took me catching on to what happened for her to cease contact. I guess part of me just hopes that she could change and truly be dedicated to making the marriage work. If this were some random dude out here, then obviously her behavior would not have changed. What I mean is that there was some comfort that this guy brought to her after the abortion that she continued to seek. So it probably wasn't easy to decide to leave him. On the other hand, if she has that kind of connection with this guy, she should probably just be with him, and how much did she really want it to end if she continued to talk to/saw him again.

[Mr. Lucky]

What I mean is that there was some comfort that this guy brought to her after the abortion that she continued to seek. So it probably wasn't easy to decide to leave him.

 

No need for her to justify her behavior, you're making excuses for her.

 

Look Kamel3, no need to explain, every person posting here has felt what you're feeling. I remember, when I found out my ex was cheating on me, having an overwhelming desire to just close my eyes and wish it hadn't happened, I wanted it to just go away. Except it didn't and eventually needed to be dealt with, as you're dealing with the fallout of her betrayal now.

 

I guess at this point I'll simply ask you this - having engaged in this behavior most of her adult life, what would prevent her from doing this again? And is that the wager you want to bet your future on?

 

Mr. Lucky

[Turning point]

I agree, it feels almost like collaboration. At best, she stopped talking to him for only a very brief period. It actually took me catching on to what happened for her to cease contact. I guess part of me just hopes that she could change and truly be dedicated to making the marriage work. If this were some random dude out here, then obviously her behavior would not have changed. What I mean is that there was some comfort that this guy brought to her after the abortion that she continued to seek. So it probably wasn't easy to decide to leave him. On the other hand, if she has that kind of connection with this guy, she should probably just be with him, and how much did she really want it to end if she continued to talk to/saw him again.

 

I think it's time to stop using the abortion as a crutch and realize that she is a sexual creature along with everything that goes with that. She is no less likely to have an unexpected pregnancy with that other guy than she is with you. If she has difficulty reconciling the consequences of her past choices that is on her because, she continues to make the very same poor choices.

 

I think you are doing a lot of mental gymnastics to find an emotional "causation" for your situation but, there is none. She doesn't love you enough to commit to marriage and she's been playing you the whole time. I I don't see an impetus for change here? What possible reason is there for her to suddenly elevate you to her one and only if she never had that respect for you prior?

[Kamel3]

I think you are doing a lot of mental gymnastics to find an emotional "causation" for your situation but, there is none. She doesn't love you enough to commit to marriage and she's been playing you the whole time. I I don't see an impetus for change here? What possible reason is there for her to suddenly elevate you to her one and only if she never had that respect for you prior?

 

You raise a good point. One question I have for all of you though is: if someone cheats, does that mean they no longer love you? What has been your experience with that issue? Does this mean she doesn't love me?

[WorstFeelingEver]

It actually took me catching on to what happened for her to cease contact.

 

OP, listen man, she was not AND has not been faithful to you OR, told you about the AP, until YOU found out...

 

And, your wife kept in contact with her AP, gave him the new city, state, address where to meet her.....AND she opened the front door to your house to let him in...hmmmm.

 

How can you trust her again?...I agree with others here...no kids, no big finances yet, (except house), new job......pack & run!

 

The longer you stay married, the more she gets....

 

Sorry, you are going through this.

[Turning point]

People don't coincidentally get on planes, show up at our door and end up in bed with us. That takes a lot of communication, planning, and coordination even when it's not done covertly. Imagine how much foresight is required when it's all a big secret.

 

If she can truly cut off the other man at the drop of a hat then what does that personality trait hold for your future? If she didn't have enough integrity or love for you while living this double life then from where is this new found commitment going to spring?

[Turning point]

You raise a good point. One question I have for all of you though is: if someone cheats, does that mean they no longer love you? What has been your experience with that issue? Does this mean she doesn't love me?

 

It means she's selfish. What does "love you" actually mean? Obviously her definition is not aligned with yours, and as a result you have no emotional safety in this relationship. People don't have to kick and beat you to abuse you - often, we're content to let them destroy us from the inside out.

[WorstFeelingEver]

People don't coincidentally get on planes, show up at our door and end up in bed with us. That takes a lot of communication, planning, and coordination even when it's not done covertly. Imagine how much foresight is required when it's all a big secret.

 

 

^ If you are in archery, you hit the tiny dot in the middle of the target!!!!

[Kamel3]

Does it even make sense to try counseling and invest just a few more months into this relationship? I don’t see how a couple more months isn’t worth trying to make it work.

[notbroken]

What would you expect to get out of counseling that would make this better? She could say "I'll only love you forever" yet it won't erase the past - nor make her automatically faithful. No amount of counselling can make this go away. She married you under false pretenses. She moved under false pretenses.

 

Is there a 'line in the sand' that your wife can not cross and you would divorce her? What is that line? Hasn't she already gone miles across it?

 

I'm very sorry, but there is nothing to save here other than a version of her you have in your head that likely never really existed.

[Turning point]

If you love this woman, then explore every avenue that might reveal a path to what you (think) you want, or reveal to you that it is an unreasonable pursuit.

 

You must always remain realistic about where on the map you presently reside, and reassess repeatedly as you proceed. At each point of the journey you should determine if the destination remains as desirable as you originally believed it to be.

 

Do this without making future plans. No kids, no major financial ties, until you know for sure.

Edited February 21, 2019 by Turning point

[Orokotikki]

You should see an individual counselor for yourself.

 

You say she is honest has she shown you all records of communication and messages as far back as possible with this POSOM?

 

Do you know all of her previous partners and whether she had contact with any of them as well? (unfortunately you can never know this last one for certain)

 

You need to be willing to lose your marriage to truly save it.

A truly fresh start may be divorcing before deciding whether or not to reconcile with her. This shows you cannot stand what she has done, and that the consequence of cheating is divorce.

 

Depending on how you feel, and how you both handle it, what is to stop her courting you afterward?

[Turning point]

I think you're stuck at a point where you realize she cheated on you and yet, you're afraid of cheating your self out of the future you wanted.

 

Try to remember, that a distortion exists in the vision of your future because you have not allowed yourself to see it with a different supporting character playing that role.

[vla1120]

I'm the first one to usually recommend counseling and to work it out, but she continues to betray you by bringing that man into your new home and visiting him on the sly when she came back to visit you. Clearly, her behavior is not going to change. Are you ever going to be able to trust her again? Right now, you seem to be willing to try anything to save your marriage. She removed herself from the temptation, but still could not stay away from him. I suspect there will be more heartache in your future if you stay with her. Your family members live in this new city, not hers, right? Move out there, be with your family, tell her she can go back and live closer to this other man. You deserve better than the treatment you are willing to accept from her.

[Kamel3]

What would you expect to get out of counseling that would make this better? She could say "I'll only love you forever" yet it won't erase the past - nor make her automatically faithful. No amount of counselling can make this go away. She married you under false pretenses. She moved under false pretenses.

 

Is there a 'line in the sand' that your wife can not cross and you would divorce her? What is that line? Hasn't she already gone miles across it?

 

I'm very sorry, but there is nothing to save here other than a version of her you have in your head that likely never really existed.

 

I fear this is the case, but because we don't have kids nor a mass amount of wealth, I want to at least give some counseling a try. Your opinion is 100% valid and based on the evidence though, and that is why I consider it, but do not want to jump to it at this moment.

 

 

If you love this woman, then explore every avenue that might reveal a path to what you (think) you want, or reveal to you that it is an unreasonable pursuit.

 

You must always remain realistic about where on the map you presently reside, and reassess repeatedly as you proceed. At each point of the journey you should determine if the destination remains as desirable as you originally believed it to be.

 

Do this without making future plans. No kids, no major financial ties, until you know for sure.

 

This is my plan. We have talked about this and this is my sentiment, with which she agrees. Honestly, a physical separation and divorce would make my life more traumatic at the moment during this transition phase.

 

 

You should see an individual counselor for yourself.

 

You say she is honest has she shown you all records of communication and messages as far back as possible with this POSOM?

 

Do you know all of her previous partners and whether she had contact with any of them as well? (unfortunately you can never know this last one for certain)

 

You need to be willing to lose your marriage to truly save it.

A truly fresh start may be divorcing before deciding whether or not to reconcile with her. This shows you cannot stand what she has done, and that the consequence of cheating is divorce.

 

Depending on how you feel, and how you both handle it, what is to stop her courting you afterward?

 

I hope that with some individual counseling (really someone to talk to who is completely separated from her and I) will help me straighten out my priorities, wants, and needs. I understand that it is more likely than not that things are over. But I have the luxury of at least wasting a few more months of my life on this. Honestly, your comment about courting really hits home because that's what I want. I know it's unrealistic, but this girl and I have so much history, she risked being disowned by her family to introduce me to her family. Also, and during college I was unfaithful (often). if that set the pre-text for marriage then that's an issue we need to deal with. Regardless, because this went on for so long, she has no excuse to justify the entire thing. The moment she said "I do" this should have never been a thought. Things in our marriage were not perfect, we fought often, I didn't spend much time with her, and at times I really failed to appreciate some of the things she did for me. These were my short comings. It's not an excuse for her continuing her affair as that began prior to all of this, but it may have added fuel to the fire. I want to believe that she was not acting like some user who just used our marriage to further her own interests, and that instead she was at least somewhat torn between what to do and simply viewed being with this guy as an escape from reality. I want to at least try to get to the issue.

 

To sum up, if things seem great in a year, and there is complete transparency in her life and she makes constant attempts to rebuild and reconstruct knowing it will be different, and we both seem happier than ever, am I fool at that point for staying. Based on statistics it will happen again This is my entire problem.

[Kamel3]

I'm the first one to usually recommend counseling and to work it out, but she continues to betray you by bringing that man into your new home and visiting him on the sly when she came back to visit you. Clearly, her behavior is not going to change. Are you ever going to be able to trust her again? Right now, you seem to be willing to try anything to save your marriage. She removed herself from the temptation, but still could not stay away from him. I suspect there will be more heartache in your future if you stay with her. Your family members live in this new city, not hers, right? Move out there, be with your family, tell her she can go back and live closer to this other man. You deserve better than the treatment you are willing to accept from her.

 

Yes, my family lives here and hers lives in the city we moved from. I appreciate the recommendation. And I am not trying to be argumentative, I am just trying to find out the cause of each facet of this dilemma. Her seeing him, I can appreciate that it is hard for someone because in the past I've had side friendships with benefits, and these people provided a base level of comfort that at times was hard to leave. Is what she is doing, waning, or a continuation? And is anything other than cold turkey acceptable? And lastly, I promise, should I place any stock in her want to move out here to start things fresh for us? Does him coming out here destroy that attempt?

Edited February 21, 2019 by Kamel3
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