Do women who are very successful have difficulty dating

[JuneL]

I understand why you do that as a tactic but I earned my position and if someone asks me, whilst I won’t brag about it I sure wouldn’t minimise or downplay my role or career accomplishments.

 

I fully believe this is a very genuine statement of yours. But according to my observations, sometimes things may be much more subtle than that. Say you have worked your butt off your whole life to become a high-level executive in the biggest telecommunications company, and you meet a good man who works as a technician in a rival telecommunications company. While he has a perfectly respectable job/career, you may at the subconscious level lose a little respect for him for not being nearly as ambitious and for his lack of caliber compared to you. In other words, it’s not about the status or money per se, but his overall career outcome may subtly signal certain traits of his.

[Trail Blazer]

I fully believe this is a very genuine statement of yours. But according to my observations, sometimes things may be much more subtle than that.

Exactly. See, men don't care nearly as much as women about what their SO does for a living. In many cases, a man actively avoids a woman who earns more than he.

 

As long as she has some kind of a job, or did have a job before extenuating circumstances temporarily disallow work, then it indiactes a level of work ethic and self-reliance. Many guys would be happy with that, especially if the plan is to start a family and her income can't be relied upon after child birth.

 

Generally a woman sees a man who is less successful than her in a different light than a man does a woman. I do not think men can offer as much in a relationship if it isn't related to work, so there is a practical sense to it. Men need purpose and a man's purpose has not been to stay home with kids throughout history.

 

Whilst I'll leave the old, patriarchal attage of it being a woman's purpose to stay home and look after the kids, from the genstation period to birth, it just comes more naturally to women.

 

Modern femisism has a lot to answer for. Third-wave feminism is a departure from feminism's original intention of a civil rights campaign seeking genuine equality, to the toxic feminism we see today. The espousal of this adversarial and combative attitude towards men undermines the core of equality.

 

Until women can accept a man as readily for not being as career driven as a man would a woman, there will never be true equality. Having said that, until men can feel as though it's not some kind of emasculation that he's being provided for, rather than being the provider, then we won't see true equality.

 

The crux of the situation is that there is no such thing as true equality between two very different sexes. Humanity needs to embrace the diffences and celebrate them, rather than socially engineered gender fluidity.

 

I accept and understand women's perspective regarding the partner they seek. Biology extends beyond culturally-ingrained gender norms. It's natural for a woman to be hypergamous. It's a natural response for a man to work hard in order to present himself as a good provider.

 

Successful career women are not driven by a desire to be seen as a good catch by the opposite sex for their career success. Men, on the other hand, are just as purposeful when it comes to wanting to succeed for themselves. However, the status and money a successful man has gained is a lot more attractive to women than vice versa.

 

Men and woman both know this, so it's little wonder why men are more successful than women. Equality of outcome is a false equivalence to equality of opportunity (refer Jordan Peterson). Men literally feel that if they can get their house in order, they'll have the pick of the women. Women feel they have the pick anyway, so for every incremental level of success she achieves in life, she's effectively narrowing her own dating pool.

 

I'm happy with where I'm at now. I've had time away from a toxic marriage to define who I am and not be held back. I'll not date a woman who is more successful than me, even though I'm doing quite well for myself these days. If I meet someone who wants more kids, I'll be in a position to assume financial responsibilty. I want her to assume the responsibilty of the kids. Stay at home parent isn't my craft. I

 

Im sure I won't find it hard to find a suitable candidate without delving into the pool of the "six-figure chicks." To most women, what I bring the table is unquestionably evident. What I want from a woman is someone with whom we can compliment, rather than compete against.

 

A tip for women dating a man who earns less; if you want the relationship to last, throw the axe away ans forget he has a penis. He's a human and if he's norlt as smart, successful or whatever as you are, accept it and embrace his other good qualities, or find someone else. Don't demean, deride or even bully him into "being the best version of yourself" if he's actually comfortable with where he's at and what he's currently achieved.

Edited May 17, 2019 by a LoveShack.org Moderator

[Woggle]

If a woman I love is successful as my wife I am very happy for her success but if she has a terrible personality then she has a terrible personality. My wife certainly doesn't but as great as success it doesn't matter if I can't stand dealing with her for more than an hour and she turns everything into some battle. I want peace at home and if a woman or anybody for that matter is going to disrupt that then I am better off without her. It really is that simple. There are some self proclaimed strong women who want an adversarial rather than an equal relationship with men and I just do not need that in my life. Let them find some other man to push around. A healthy relationship should always have a foundation of mutual respect.

[gaius]

It's my opinion, but I just do not think that any woman can truly respect a man who earns a lot less than she does. In my case, when we had kids, I stayed home as she was earning the big dollars. Since she had 2 kids as well, she had strong opinions on everything and constantly scrutinized everything I did (or didn't) do.

 

It was a combination of her personality (being controlling), but also I think the kind of woman who had achieved what she did in a male-dominated environment is one who is jmmune to stomping on people and talking very abrasively. I was treated like one of the plebs working under her. She clearly didn't trust me and let me do my thing. She would always 'check in" on things and made me feel like she was my superior who I had to report back to.

Her lack of respect for you was probably more due to the fact you let her treat you like that rather than how much money you did or didn't earn.

 

I grew up around well educated women and never saw how much money a guy made being a determining factor in who they dated. Strength however, that was quite important. They never would have touched a guy who put up with the kind of nonsense you did trail. Never.

 

Anyway, I would wager it just comes down to there being a severe shortage of men who are intelligent, strong and not messed up when it comes to relationships. I'm all three and never had a problem. My wife is about as highly educated as you can get and she has all the respect in the world for me.

[snowcones]

Her lack of respect for you was probably more due to the fact you let her treat you like that rather than how much money you did or didn't earn.

I agree. And not only that, you need to have confidence as a man if you are with these women. They can smell weakness and maybe she thought you weren't doing the best you could in your profession.

 

Trail Blazer, imagine for a second being someone like Oprah Winfrey being single. Do you really think she would ever find a man who makes as much money as her? The answer is no. So she will have to be with a man who makes less money than her, there is no way around it. Let that sink in for a minute. I believe she has been with a man who makes less than her but he is confident and does the best he can in his profession. Some women are so wealthy and so accomplished that they have no choice but to be with a man who has less than her, but he'd better not act like a simp. That's just as unattractive as an egotistical man.

 

 

I also agree with Woogle about some wealthy women may just have a bad personality. And that also applies to wealthy men. It's possible that she was one of those too.

Edited May 17, 2019 by a LoveShack.org Moderator

[Trail Blazer]

Her lack of respect for you was probably more due to the fact you let her treat you like that rather than how much money you did or didn't earn.

 

Yeah, I was young and very green when I got with her. She was older and more established. I've come a long way from those days. Learnt a lot about life with some brutal lessons. I won't be allowing a situation like that to happen again.

[JuneL]

I also agree with Woogle about some wealthy women may just have a bad personality. And that also applies to wealthy men. It's possible that she was one of those too.

 

Again, it’s not about money or status per se. A super successful woman can have an equal partnership with a man who is successful in his own field, even though he may be making a lot less money or have a much lower overall status. For example, let’s say you’re a hugely successful scientist holding an extremely prestigious academic job and is short-listed for the Nobel prize and your husband just hops from one postdoc position to another (let’s say you met in the same program while both were doing your PhD). Then it may be inevitable to compare your achievements, as those are directly comparable; but if your husband is instead working in the private sector doing reasonably well, then you may just have different strengths in your careers.

 

That said, there’re plenty of people (women included) with a huge ego who get a kick for having a significant other significantly “below” her. After all, Blazer was with his ex-wife for many years, despite their dysfunctional partnership. From an outsider’s perspective, their relationship must be pretty good It’s hard for us outsiders to tell what the relationship dynamics are like between O and her significant other.

Edited May 17, 2019 by a LoveShack.org Moderator

[Foxhall]

"I married beneath me-all women do"- Nancy Astor"

lol I won a quiz one time on that question, that was the tie breaker question, who said it.

 

I imagine very successful women will be only interested in very successful men. As a guy I know I am somewhat intimidated by very smart successful women, I am much more attracted to the vulnerable quieter ladies, not necessarily quieter but " not as much airs and graces" about them

 

 

I would not consider myself successful but have found my niche at the moment in adult education and am happy with that. I am sure there are plenty of women would be happy with that but I doubt "very successful women" would be.

Edited May 17, 2019 by a LoveShack.org Moderator

[thefooloftheyear]

 

I imagine very successful women will be only interested in very successful men.

 

 

.

 

Not necessarily....

 

As long as the guy is secure in himself and isn't a weenie., I have seen and known of many women that are fine with it....

 

And then there are always the types that if a guy has some positive physical traits(good looking/good body), that they will select that guy for those reasons in particular and really aren't that concerned that they aren't all that accomplished...

 

Or the guy may just be the type that's fun to be around or is edgy...The thing is that now that a woman has some success and money, she can decide to do like guys do and select for frivolous reasons....This is even more prevalent at middle age and up as that woman doesn't have to depend on the guy to be the heavy earner if there are kids involved....They are already past that stage...

 

TFY

[JuneL]

Yes, there’re plenty of such examples. But I doubt those relationships are equal partnerships, very much like a rich man and his trophy girlfriend/wife.

Edited May 17, 2019 by a LoveShack.org Moderator

[Foxhall]

yes fair enough, I understand what you are saying, I went on a date with a Doctor actually last week,(was through online we met) I did not have any expectations based on the notion that she would probably not be my type, however it did go quite well so we will wait and see, "do not always judge a book by the cover"

Edited May 17, 2019 by a LoveShack.org Moderator

[PhillyLibertyBelle]

While he has a perfectly respectable job/career, you may at the subconscious level lose a little respect for him for not being nearly as ambitious and for his lack of caliber compared to you. In other words, it’s not about the status or money per se, but his overall career outcome may subtly signal certain traits of his.

 

Maybe he just didn’t have the same opportunities I had? That is probably how I would think.

Edited May 17, 2019 by a LoveShack.org Moderator

[guest569]

What a fascinating and complex topic PLB.

 

In my experience, there are 3 main factors here.

 

1. Balance - do both people contribute as best they can financially, domestically and emotionally? I don't expect 50/50 financially if he is a student or earning a lot less. But if we live together and he doesn't chuck in any $ then I won't be impressed. If he never pays for dates, forget it. I expect 50/50 with home duties and emotional support/presence - within reason, knowing that work hours might get in the way of this at times. This is the point where we weed out gold diggers and leeches.

 

2. Values - how much value does your partner put on job title, wealth and 'stuff'? Is it for show, ambition, security? I admire a person who works hard and tries their best. I weed out the snobs. Modesty is a wonderful trait.

 

3. Security - is one person going to become insecure or jealous about their perceived status? Or is one person going to make the other feel insecure, or be disappointed that they are not more 'successful'? Sometimes this is immediately obvious, but others, it comes out later! I don't think I could build a relationship where one or the other feels inferior or superior.

 

It is true that some men discount women because they are too successful - not because 'oh it's like a cop out coz like those women is probably just fat and mean n arrogant and cold and stuff and like yea, heh.' but because the man feels insecure and inferior, as society has always dictated that men have to be bread winners to fit the masculinity mould.

[elaine567]

A women who is successful and has her act together is not just seeking a man , she is seeking a "special" man and that is where the difficulty comes in.

It is the same for anyone who has a list of "special" requirements.

Anyone can find a man/woman tomorrow if they are none too fussy, but to find a "suitable" woman/man it is always going to be difficult.

Each filter added excludes a large proportion of the available population.

To get that perceived "top quality" individual, 99.9% of available people may not be suitable, most not even close...

[PhillyLibertyBelle]

A women who is successful and has her act together is not just seeking a man , she is seeking a "special" man and that is where the difficulty comes in.

Each filter added excludes a large proportion of the available population.

To get that perceived "top quality" individual, 99.9% of available people may not be suitable, most not even close...

 

But we all want someone special don’t we? Special in the heart and soul. Lucky for me I don’t have all those filters so I don’t need to completely give up yet!

[PRW]

Unbeknownst to me at the time, DH was the furthest thing from a player & he'd had about 3 dates in the last 10 years. I was at a loss as to why he wasn't picking up the signals I was throwing out. In desperation to make him feel more masculine & to get some alone time with him, when the event was winding down I asked him to walk me to my car in a nearby parking garage because I didn't like the blind corners in garages after dark. We were in a very safe location so he thought I was a bit daft but his sense of chivalry compelled him to walk me. He didn't even shake my hand good bye / good night. I went home convinced I needed to up my game.

 

.......<snip>.......

 

He called me in response to the card & offered to come to my office the following Monday evening. I was disheartened because that read like business / sales meeting not date. I let him come because I wanted every shot I could take to wrangle a date without doing the asking. Remember I was trying to be demure & more beta. He came to my office & we discussed business for about 20 minutes then he asked if I'd like to get a bite to eat at a local low end restaurant. I was again disappointed because I didn't care for the restaurant choice. Unbeknownst to me, he selected that place because it was a "nice" restaurant & he thought he was stepping up his game to impress me. For a few seconds I contemplated suggesting an alternative restaurant but reminded myself that suggestion was me wresting control so we went with his choice. Years later when we talked about that date DH admits that if I had suggested some place else, it probably would have caused him to never ask me on a 2nd date because I would have been too high maintenance in his eyes.

 

Haven't posted here in a long time. This is a great story in this post and the one just previous to it, it got my attention enough to actually break my silence and post again. It emphasizes many of the things I have always told people. These things work the same way on less successful people too, there are just some contextual differences.

 

I probably still won't start posting here again, but I wanted to give you a thumbs up on this one.