Wife Doesn't Want Sex, Doubts Marriage

[giotto]

There is a fundamental disconnect here.

 

I agree, but why is she not telling him? She doesn't want to upset him? I think it's a bit too late for that. It all seems very odd. You just don't stop having sex like that without an explanation. As you say, MC might be very useful.

[thefooloftheyear]

I agree, but why is she not telling him? She doesn't want to upset him? I think it's a bit too late for that. It all seems very odd. You just don't stop having sex like that without an explanation. As you say, MC might be very useful.

 

Some people are just "rug sweepers"...They just don't want to confront a problem and just would rather that it "go away" on its own..

 

And I get the feeling she is doing this with a proverbial gun to her head....That's not really the way it should be and less likely to be successful, but who knows? I hope it does for the sake of them..

 

TFY

[thefooloftheyear]

I don't really get the logic that some men have to wait until the kids turn 18. I think it's something they tell themselves just to buy more time because they're not ready to leave or don't want to. Once they turn 18, then the goal-post will move to once the kids graduate from college. Then it'll move to once we finish remodeling the house. Then it'll move to once my ailing mother is better. And on and on it goes.

 

 

You don't really get the logic, because its not something you have ever experienced personally...For a lot of men it's not merely an excuse, they'd love to leave, but practicality and the economics of it just take a precedence.....If you don't believe it, ask any guy in that situation what he would do if he managed to win a lottery while in the middle of this....Then see if they don't want to...

 

In this guys case, he has the added dimension of not being necessarily on strong ground economically....He may not want to admit this, but I would bet the farm that if he was personally financially strong he probably would bail out on this....

 

TFY

[BaileyB]

So, apparently your wife isn’t as difficult to talk with as you believed... she was very receptive, especially considering you picked a terrible time to have this heart to heart talk - just after she returned from a stressful and exhausting business trip.

 

It’s difficult to comprehend why it took all this time and 105 pages for you to have a conversation with your wife. Yet still, I wish you well at marriage counselling.

[elaine567]

It’s difficult to comprehend why it took all this time and 105 pages for you to have a conversation with your wife. Yet still, I wish you well at marriage counselling.

 

Conflict avoidance.

[BaileyB]

Conflict avoidance.

 

Clearly. And all this talk about how difficult it is to communicate with her - she seems quite reasonable to me. Perhaps the communication difficulties in this marriage are not hers, but his.

[bathtub-row]

She said it was a combination of menopause, burnout and exhaustion and it has nothing to do with him.

 

I think it does have to do with him. A man should be someone a woman can turn to and lean on for support and, when she’s in the position of carrying the burdens, it’s disastrous for her. I don’t believe he has been a strong man in her life and this has caused a huge disconnect between them and has worn her out. Most women do not do well when they have to “mother” the man in their life.

 

I’m glad they talked, although it appears that the real issue of having shut him out and previously put conversations on lockdown has not been addressed. I think therapy will reveal her intense resentment toward him, but I hope they can get things resolved and keep their marriage intact.

 

OP, I think it’s imperative that you show your wife - by your actions, not by talking her to death - that you’re not a piece of delicate china that she has to tiptoe around.

[snowcones]

In this guys case, he has the added dimension of not being necessarily on strong ground economically....He may not want to admit this, but I would bet the farm that if he was personally financially strong he probably would bail out on this....

I’ve been married before with kids so yes I have experienced it. And I’ve seen men in all different types of financial situations not leave. Men are scared, bottom line. They wrote the part in the vows “Until death do us part” because they meant it.

Edited May 4, 2019 by a LoveShack.org Moderator

[Rotaglia]

OP, I think it’s imperative that you show your wife - by your actions, not by talking her to death - that you’re not a piece of delicate china that she has to tiptoe around.

Yes, I agree. She has mentioned that my being "her rock" is super-important to her and I have been focusing on that of late—projecting quiet masculine strength, confidence, and leadership. I am running things by her less and just doing them and leaving space for her to unwind and de-stress.

 

I'm a realist here. There is no guarantee the marriage will survive and certainly no guarantee that sex will ever be possible. But at least the challenges are out in the open and some of the grief that comes from silence has been soothed.

Does she understand you considered divorcing her?

We both stated that each of us has considered divorcing the other. We each said that if things did not work out we would each try to treat each other with love and respect as much as possible and that we would be co-parents forever.

she was very receptive, especially considering you picked a terrible time to have this heart to heart talk - just after she returned from a stressful and exhausting business trip.

I swear it was not intended on my part. We were discussing upcoming calendar stuff and we had a conflict with a marriage workshop I had mentioned and we were agreeing not to attend when she surprised me by saying she wanted to see the marriage counselor I had identified. So believe it or not she pretty much was the one to bring it up. It was a very frank, very complete, very honest discussion. We didn't fix everything, but I sure felt better afterwards and I think she did too. She's sleeping now—yay!

 

The relationship needed that conversation.

Edited May 4, 2019 by Rotaglia

[giotto]

I'm happy for you and I hope things can be resolved.

[Mr. Lucky]

Clearly. And all this talk about how difficult it is to communicate with her - she seems quite reasonable to me. Perhaps the communication difficulties in this marriage are not hers, but his.

 

Or perhaps the inability to face things head on exists in both parties. Tough combination.

 

Given the OP's tendency to emphasize quantity over quality, going to take a number of sessions just to get the main issue out on the table...

 

Mr. Lucky

[preraph]

I am very happy your wife agreed to the marriage counseling (did you say workshop? I think this needs to be done in private, not with a group because it's going to get super personal about each other's flaws). Whatever happens, a true marriage counselor who brings everything out in the open will make it easier for you to move on should that become necessary. Don't go to some hack who is just giving couples a spa day or sex therapy, for God's sake! A real psychologist marriage counselor if you want good results.

[preraph]

I know having the talk lifts a lot of stress. Getting it all aired out in therapy will be another layer of relief for you both, I'm sure.

[Rotaglia]

It could turn into what amounts to a marriage exit interview. Preparation for that possibility has to be part of getting ready. It could also turn out to be a great big NothingBurger™ but that is going to have to okay, too.

 

Outcomes cannot be the focus. I will be who I will be. Actions are not undertaken to convince my wife to stay or to have sex or what ever. Wherever she is going she has to go there willingly.

 

In the back of both of our minds has to be that we have a very vulnerable twelve-year-old transgender child who is struggling with school and has mood challenges. She really needs both parents at home 100% of the time and I'll be damned if she's going to be subjected to having two part-time parents. So if we explore dissolution of the marriage I am really not sure how that part is going to work.

 

I also plan to fly to a distant state this week to escort my mother-in-law with dementia to hear from a doctor that she has rapidly progressing Alzheimer's Disease—her care will have to be worked out should there be a split.

 

Sadly, it is very difficult to envision a future where we rebuild and rekindle our romance and we each find sexual fulfillment in each other. My wishing does not make it so. Maybe my wife just needs permission to push the nuclear button. Whatever, I will pursue this with an open mind and no expectations.

 

Rebuilding this marriage is going to be a major challenge. If her heart isn't in it (or if mine isn't), it cannot possibly succeed. It's worth a shot, of course. One doesn't discard one's spouse of 22 years lightly. But if she really truly yearns to be single I can't do much about that at this point. If she really needs us to uncouple so be it—but if, on the other hand, she is actually serious about restoration ... I may have to actually take it seriously.

[Wallysbears]

Okay, you guys—my wife came home from her very exhausting business trip and we actually had a pretty long and good talk!

 

She agreed, astoundingly, to go to marriage counseling

 

I got to air my grievances

 

.

 

Yay for you? You badgered your wife into a relationship conversation after she returned from an exhausting business trip and had a "long talk" where she told you what you wanted to hear so you would leave her alone.

 

Glad you see this as a step forward.

[Rotaglia]

You badgered your wife into a relationship conversation after she returned from an exhausting business trip and had a "long talk" where she told you what you wanted to hear so you would leave her alone.

Hey man, you know what? She brought it up. I didn't plan this.

[Wallysbears]

She has mentioned that my being "her rock" is super-important to her

 

We were discussing upcoming calendar stuff and we had a conflict with a marriage workshop I had mentioned and we were agreeing not to attend when she surprised me by saying she wanted to see the marriage counselor I had identified.

 

 

I'm going to try to translate for you, but obviously I'm just guessing. I suspect you will hear something like this at the marriage counselor.

 

"I've told him I needed him to be 'my rock'. Instead, I come home from this exhausting trip and I'm met with this conversation about sex. Does he NOT get it? I'm tired. I'm exhausted. I'm carrying the burden on my back for this family. And yet, all he sees is we aren't having sex". So, I agreed to come here and do this therapy. Because I'm tired. And he's not listening"

 

 

 

 

*I hope I'm wrong*

[preraph]

You never know. As she has said you have been at an impasse. She said she has not abandoned you emotionally. You have a lot of issues in your household with your troubled transgender preteen, and it's wonderful that she has understanding parents, and you're very sick mother-in-law and really all of that is very stressful. So I think being able to talk it out together in front of a neutral party can only give you both a better understanding and also a good measure of stress relief.

 

just be sure and be honest and take that opportunity to really be completely honest there with that third party to get it all out. Wether there is resolution or not, there will hopefully be better mutual understanding and quite a bit of relief.

[Rotaglia]

"I've told him I needed him to be 'my rock'. Instead, I come home from this exhausting trip and I'm met with this conversation about sex. Does he NOT get it? I'm tired. I'm exhausted. I'm carrying the burden on my back for this family. And yet, all he sees is we aren't having sex". So, I agreed to come here and do this therapy. Because I'm tired. And he's not listening"

100% fine with me. If that's the message, so be it. My sanity and my happiness depend on no person and on no particular outcome. My happiness is already here in my heart. If she wants to share in it, she's invited. That's it.

 

Sex is a sign of a functioning relationship and lack of it is a sign of a lesser-functioning relationship. It is not the central issue. I have said on multiple occasions that my wife is more important to me than sex, but sex is still very important to me.

 

I also understand that right now she is simply not into sex at all. That is okay with me. But I can't proceed with it just being my problem; it has to be our problem.

If she can practice compassion in the sexual arena, that might work for me if she is really committed to the concept.

If she honest-to-G-d wants a permanently sexless marriage, she should offer it. I would have to make a decision on that basis.

If she wants an open marriage, she should offer it. I'll say no, but she should offer it if that's what she's thinking.

Or don't. I don't depend on her decision or any particular outcome, but there are outcomes available.

WIFE: I need you to be my rock.

ME: ...

WIFE: *sigh* Not that kind of rock, honey.

 

Why pay a marriage counselor to tell me to shut up (or to deliver any kind of message) when she can and should just say it herself?

 

****

Give me your heart \ Make it real \ Or else forget about it. —Santana

Edited May 4, 2019 by Rotaglia

[BettyDraper]

So, apparently your wife isn’t as difficult to talk with as you believed... she was very receptive, especially considering you picked a terrible time to have this heart to heart talk - just after she returned from a stressful and exhausting business trip.

 

It’s difficult to comprehend why it took all this time and 105 pages for you to have a conversation with your wife. Yet still, I wish you well at marriage counselling.

 

Are we certain that R was the one who initiated this recent discussion?

[BettyDraper]

Yes, I agree. She has mentioned that my being "her rock" is super-important to her and I have been focusing on that of late—projecting quiet masculine strength, confidence, and leadership. I am running things by her less and just doing them and leaving space for her to unwind and de-stress.

 

I'm a realist here. There is no guarantee the marriage will survive and certainly no guarantee that sex will ever be possible. But at least the challenges are out in the open and some of the grief that comes from silence has been soothed.

We both stated that each of us has considered divorcing the other. We each said that if things did not work out we would each try to treat each other with love and respect as much as possible and that we would be co-parents forever.

I swear it was not intended on my part. We were discussing upcoming calendar stuff and we had a conflict with a marriage workshop I had mentioned and we were agreeing not to attend when she surprised me by saying she wanted to see the marriage counselor I had identified. So believe it or not she pretty much was the one to bring it up. It was a very frank, very complete, very honest discussion. We didn't fix everything, but I sure felt better afterwards and I think she did too. She's sleeping now—yay!

 

The relationship needed that conversation.

 

R, you have approached your wife groveling about the lack of sex more than once. You also aired your grievances more than once and asked about marriage counseling. That is not quiet masculine strength.

 

Based on what you have posted in this thread, I doubt very much that you understand what it is to be a rock. This is not meant as an insult; just an observation based your personality type. Men who are strong leaders are not excessively emotive and neurotic. A strong leader who is a rock would have been focusing on himself, if his wife refused to discuss the lack of sex in their bedroom. He would not have been chasing her for affection and discussions.

 

While it's great to believe that both of you would be fair and loving during a divorce, it often doesn't work out that way because divorce is mainly about money. It's easy to say that you will be kind to each other during a divorce before it actually occurs.

 

I think that you are rather naive about your wife because you put her on a pedestal.

[BettyDraper]

I think it does have to do with him. A man should be someone a woman can turn to and lean on for support and, when she’s in the position of carrying the burdens, it’s disastrous for her. I don’t believe he has been a strong man in her life and this has caused a huge disconnect between them and has worn her out. Most women do not do well when they have to “mother” the man in their life.

 

I’m glad they talked, although it appears that the real issue of having shut him out and previously put conversations on lockdown has not been addressed. I think therapy will reveal her intense resentment toward him, but I hope they can get things resolved and keep their marriage intact.

 

OP, I think it’s imperative that you show your wife - by your actions, not by talking her to death - that you’re not a piece of delicate china that she has to tiptoe around.

 

All of this! Spot on.

[Wallysbears]

 

Sex is a sign of a functioning relationship and lack of it is a sign of a lesser-functioning relationship.

 

I also understand that right now she is simply not into sex at all. That is okay with me. But I can't proceed with it just being my problem; it has to be our problem.

If she can practice compassion in the sexual arena, that might work for me if she is really committed to the concept.

 

WIFE: I need you to be my rock.

ME: ...

WIFE: *sigh* Not that kind of rock, honey.

 

 

You are NOT a masculine man by what you have exhibited here in like 108 pages now of posting. You are NOT a "rock" by what you have shown here in 108 pages of posting.

 

You are going to come back and say "well, I'm posting as Rotaglia and that's not me and I'm not him"

 

But still, I'm TELLING you as an alpha woman...you are NOT exhibiting the type of attributes she NEEDS and wants to see.

 

A "rock" of a man isn't groveling about sex. He's not nagging about sex. Or emotional connection. Or whatever.

 

He's handling business and being someone she can rely upon.

 

He's just THERE. Day in and day out being STRONG. And I don't know as though you grasp what that word means to a woman. It means not needy.

 

She has a job that NEEDS her to pay attention and be on point and on her game ALL the time. She has kids. She has an ill parent. All these things require HER to be STRONG.

 

So she is. She's "ON" all.the.time.

 

She needs YOU to step up and be the man. Meaning, the MASCULINE energy. The one place in the world she can stop being HBIC and just relax.

 

You aren't. For 100+ pages of this, you aren't.

 

And so, her sexual desire towards you is turned off. The switch is flipped.

 

She's TOLD you this flatly. She's TOLD you she needs and wants you to be her "rock" in not so many (or maybe even plain) words.

 

 

And yet, you keep taking a feminine posture.

 

I'm not someone that completely believes in gender stereotypes, but in YOUR situation, she's as much as told you and shown you through repetitive lack of sex and her words that your demeanor is a turn off.

 

She needs you to be more manly in the stereotypical way. Period.

 

Your choice whether or not to do that.

[Rotaglia]

She needs you to be more manly

I hear you. I'm working on it and I truly am improving in that area. It hasn't been an easy adjustment, but it is happening and it's an upgrade to my life. I appreciate the reminder of how important that is.

[bathtub-row]

I’ve been married before with kids so yes I have experienced it. And I’ve seen men in all different types of financial situations not leave. Men are scared, bottom line. They wrote the part in the vows “Until death do us part” because they meant it.

 

Fear is not typically the reason. I’ve seen this play out many times. Women make the mistake of thinking that men value the same things that they do. Men, on the other hand, rarely make that error in judgment where women are concerned. While women typically tend to put a huge value on love, that sentiment is much further down the list of priorities for men. For most men, the list reads more like this, in order of importance: protecting his family and territory, providing for his family, protecting his accumulated material things, his reputation as a man, then love...maybe. If they don’t accomplish these things, they often view themselves as failures.

 

Not to imply that men don’t value or want love, but it’s not a driving force that will tear them away from what they not only view as theirs, but also what their masculinity identifies with. This doesn’t mean they won’t stray sexually, it means they typically won’t leave their family over someone they have an intimate relationship with, or even love deeply. Men typically aren’t fearful about leaving a marriage; it’s more that it goes against their core beliefs about who they are.

Edited May 5, 2019 by bathtub-row