skinut2234 Posted September 20, 2005 Share Posted September 20, 2005 ....of my rope I work full time and my wife is stay at home... 2 kids in school all day and one 5 year old home. Every day I come home and the house is trashed- )or close to it) Now I will admit I am anal and I like everthing to be clean but I am also understanding and realistic. I just do not think it's fair for me to come home and clean off breakfast dishes! Every time I bring it up it turns into a fight and I'm ready to explode once and for all- I am tired of living in a pig sty. We have 2 different standards when it comes to neatness and I see that- but where do I draw the line on what is acceptable?? I know for a fact she has at least 3-4 hours a day home with nothing going on. AM I being unfair??? Please tell me if I am.......... Link to post Share on other sites
Mz. Pixie Posted September 20, 2005 Share Posted September 20, 2005 You are not being unfair but perhaps it could be negotiated? The problem with being a SAHM ( i did it once, not for me) is that you never see any type of accomplishment or at least they are few and far between so it can get overwhelming. For instance- laundry? Yeah, you can wash it all and put it all up- but there it keeps coming right back. Dishes?? Yeah, you can clean them up but they will just get dirty again. It's not like it's a project like at work that she finishes, moves on from and never has to touch again and she can say, "Gee, I finished so and so......" Perhaps she's feeling frustrated because she never gets caught up. Do you give her any time off when you're home? I agree that it's her job when she's at home to keep the house clean if you're providing financial means for her to stay at home. Could you lower your standards a bit and ask her to raise hers by way of compromise? You could do this by sitting down and listing out what's most important for you in terms of keeping the house clean- have her make a list of what's least important to her and you guys work from that. She's got a hard job- it's not like what some people think it's like- she's probably not sitting on her duff eating candy all day so try to see her point. In return she should see yours that you work hard all day and would like to come home and see some type of order. It can be done! Good luck! Link to post Share on other sites
Jas Posted September 20, 2005 Share Posted September 20, 2005 You make it sound as though it started off clean...and then when you come home it is once again trashed w/ dishes from breakfast and the like. If that is the case - who cleans up eventually? If it is her, maybe she just wants some time to herself to clean without any distractions. That's when I prefer to clean. However, if it is you, you two probably need to delegate some chores. A friend of mine had a similar situation living w/ someone whose standard of cleanliness was different from hers. The clean freak (i mean that in an endearing way, really) chose the one thing that bothered them the most and that was a cluttered living room. The less clean one agreed to compromise and make certain that one room was spic and span, and they achieved some harmony. It's not a perfect situation - but I'm sure anything would be an improvement for you at this point. Figure out what your big one is - breakfast dishes? toys scattered? and just ask your wife if she could manage that one thing, and you'll try not to let the other stuff get to you, or maybe even help out with it. For someone who is not so clean, they don't understand how living in messy conditions can make you miserable. She may not know you are at the end of your rope. When bringing it up turns into a big fight - she may think you're overreacting. Try to compare it to something that is a big deal to her, but not you - and maybe she'll understand the severity of the issue. Good luck! Link to post Share on other sites
JadeStar Posted September 20, 2005 Share Posted September 20, 2005 Have you talked with her about this? It amazes me how alot of people think that because they go out into the world to work and get paid money for what they do they think that stay at home mothers sit around and do nothing. Its a big job. I'm sure you're aware of that however I take it that your house is always like this when you come home? Or just on an occassion? I'm a stay at home mom and I clean, cook, take care of the kids, run errands, laundry, dishes you name it. Sometimes I feel theres not enough hours in the day to get what I need to do done. I would say if this is an all the time thing then yeah you might want to have a nice talk with her. If its not all the time and just on an occassion I would say give it rest. Could be she just didn't get around to it, or something came up with kids etc. Either way, maybe just express to her how you feel on the situation. When I was growing up there were times I was a little "anal" about certain things and when I complained to my hard working stay at home mother, her response to me was, "If you don't like it, do it yourself. I then learned to tone down being so anal. Jade Link to post Share on other sites
Ladyjane14 Posted September 20, 2005 Share Posted September 20, 2005 I guess I'm going to be the voice of dissent today. If we're talking SAHM here....do you mean 'Stay At Home Mom'? Or 'Stay At Home Maid'??? Because there is a difference. Have you ever seen that Nanny 911 show? It's a great show to watch with the kids, because they get to see the frustrations parents face for one thing. They also get a bird's eye view of other children behaving REALLY badly. It gives them perspective in what they, themselves, might look like when they're indulging their temper. And hey, if you watch with your teens....what better incentive can you offer them regarding birth control??? Anyway, I was watching a couple of weeks ago, and I noticed that when the "Nanny" arrived, the home she went to was IMMACULATE. One might think that since the wife knew she'd have a filming crew in her house, she might have taken special pains to make it so. But nope....turns out she was a perfectionist. The problem with her "perfectionism" is...that it extended to the house and the cooking but NOT the kids. Hell, her seven year-old was running down the block with a steak-knife in his hand at one point! And of course, the Dad....who works ALL DAY LONG (poor thing)...punches out when he leaves work and is OFF THE CLOCK. My point is...that kids need attention. It takes TIME to give them the attention that they need. When my kids were small, and I was a stay-at-home-mom, I spent the majority of my day, playing with my kids. They learn ALOT when you're playing with them, because in ACTUALITY what you're doing is teaching them. You gotta strike while the iron is hot when you're dealing with kids. The laundry and the mopping will STILL be there when you get back to it...but if you don't take the opportunity to teach your kid 'that we don't hit our sister', or 'that blue and yellow make green' or 'that bugs taste bad'.... Well that's wasting your opportunities. These things are important. Might not sound like it to YOU, but I bet your kid would disagree. Even when they get older, a game of cards is still more important than the dishes in the sink. Over a game of cards, you might hear which of your daughter's girlfriends is "boy-crazy", and which of your son's friends is grounded for smoking pot. Anyway, you might agree with me that spending time with the kids is an important priority. But there should still be plenty of time left over for keeping the house neat, right? Well, if that's her job....then that's her job. But exactly who is her boss? Don't even tell me you're willing to go there. Would you REALLY want an Employer/Employee type relationship with her? And if you would....exactly WHEN does she get to 'hit the time clock'? But say you DON'T want to be her boss.... Then, who are you to be going to her job site and telling her how to run it? Any way you go on this, you're liable to end up with even more trouble, dissent and division. If you're playing Felix to her Oscar for the rest of your life, I guarantee....it's not going to be end up being in any ways comedic. Unless social services would condemn the place on sight, this is small potatoes. Not worth damaging the relationship over. Your best bet is to split the household chores. If you're smart...you'll negotiate for the ones that you like best. My husband prefers laundry over cooking. Link to post Share on other sites
Author skinut2234 Posted September 21, 2005 Author Share Posted September 21, 2005 All good advice- and yes I would prefer she spend time with kids over the chores but it has just gotten to a point where I am embarrassed to have people over. I don't expect it to be clean ALL the time- but it would be nice to come home after working 10 hours and not have to clean. In addition to working full time- I also maintain the entire outside (lawn, trimming, garage, picking up junk etc) all year round and am also the "fix-it" guy when things break and clena and maintain the cars- I've accepted the jobs I have and know they need to get done when they need to. She just has the house which really is not that much. I know all the ladies are going to gang up on me but be fair. I know it's a lot of work- (I've stayed home on Saturday's with kids and cleaned the house so I know what it's like)- I don't have much of a choice- I cannot slack off at work or I don't have a job!- I work hard so she CAN stay home..... anyone see my point??? Link to post Share on other sites
Jayhawks Posted September 21, 2005 Share Posted September 21, 2005 Compliment her when she does clean up or helps the kids. Make her know you appreciate it. You appreciate being recognized at work for a job well done. Do the same for her. Link to post Share on other sites
lilmoma1973 Posted September 21, 2005 Share Posted September 21, 2005 Hey Skinnut, I am also a STAHM and i know how things can be.. You men trip me out you think because you have a 40 hr a wk job that when you clock out from work your job is done.. A STAHM job never ends !! We are on the clock 24/7!! Maybe she has cleaned up before the two kids comes home from school and when they come in they tear the place up.. You say you keep the kids on sat sometimes and it is hard .. Try doing it 24/7 !!!!!!! You couldn't do it!!! My h thinks that when he comes home from work all he has to do is get on the computer!!! I cook,clean, bathe my daughter and get her ready for bed and prepare her for the next day.. She also has allergy meds she has to take too and i do that too... i am very involved with my child school too!! After school i play with my daughter and spend time with her and we ride bikes .. i DO THIS EVERYDAY!! I am sure she has to do homework and teach the other what he/she needs to know to prepare for next yr for kindergarten.. Quite your bitching and complaining and help her out !!! Awomens job is never done!!! OH yeah did i mention i have raised up my h son since he was 2 and he is now 15 !!!Maybe she thinks you don't appreciate her and she feels why bother !! Link to post Share on other sites
Author skinut2234 Posted September 21, 2005 Author Share Posted September 21, 2005 lilmoma- hang on here- let me set the stage.... During the day- she has one kid who is 5 - the others are in school ALL DAY. She has at least 4-5 hours to herself every day and frequently goes out to lunch. I come home and have to clean breakfast dishes? with milk still in them from 7:00 in morning??? Come 'on- that is in insult to me and the hard work and income I provide- The sad part is- it's not so much that I will clean it up- but she will not even say anything to me about the fact- (so many times I've come home from work at 5:00 and find myself clenaing table, washing dishes etc.... - even cooking dinner in work clothes)- I know it's hard work and I've had to step it up in my career to earn more money so she can stay home- Why does the same not apply fo stay at home moms?? With 2 kids in school no less- there is not much to do until they come home at 3:00. I am sick and tired of hearing about how hard it is - I KNOW- and honestly- it's not that difficult to get ahead when you have 4-5 hours to yourself to clean off breakfast dishes- (She had time to go out to lunch!) Give me a break- I am a very level-headed- hard working -realistic person and I do spend time with kids when I get home ....... always... I agree it's more important but I'm sorry- I cannot put up with things being this much out of control- flame away if you want- but if you mean to tell me she cannot spend and HOUR a day cleaning up breakfast.... I must be crazy...... Link to post Share on other sites
JadeStar Posted September 21, 2005 Share Posted September 21, 2005 I have asked you this in my first reply and I'll ask you again. Is this an ALL the time thing? Meaning has your house ALWAYS been in the shape when you come home, or is this something that happens on an occasssion, and she has recently been doing as far as not cleaning? Have you expressed to her how you feel about it? If so, what has she said to you as far as why she doesn't? Jade Link to post Share on other sites
Author skinut2234 Posted September 21, 2005 Author Share Posted September 21, 2005 It's like that 95 % of the time..... and I have asked nicely to just straighten up the kitchen (the whole house does not need to be cleaned)- Link to post Share on other sites
MAINMAN1 Posted September 21, 2005 Share Posted September 21, 2005 ...you have every right to be upset. She is taking advantage of you. flat out. alll these women in here can complain about your standards/expectations because they have some degree of unhappiness in their lives / relationships, or they resent gender roles, or whatewver but c'mon. Yes being a stay at home mom is hard as hell, thankless and neverending. But for this woman to be content with you comming home from work and immediatley jumping into fixing dinner and taking on the dishes and cleaning is flat out disrespectful. For any self respecting wife to allow her husband to come in and take on the housework as well as hold down a career and support the family is just asking for trouble (or a divorce). Having a difference in standards of cleanliness is one thing - but if it is like you say it is at your house then this is something totaly different. By doing this she is telling you she doesnt respect you, and is ungratefull for your contributions to supporting your family. Dont listen to her words if she is telling you "oh I am thankfull or what you do around here" if her actions are saying something different. Alot of these ladies are right in looking at the actions - not the words, of their men when their guys are merely paying lip service to their marital concerns - you should do the same thing. Talk to her, dont yell. Tell her in no uncertain terms why you are unhappy and then ask her for her help in making things right. Give her a chance to fix things and then see what happens - but if the lunches while the house is trashed continue I would seek a therapist as a last resort before divorce. Link to post Share on other sites
JadeStar Posted September 21, 2005 Share Posted September 21, 2005 So if you have asked her nicely to do this, have you asked her WHY she doesn't? What is her answer to you for why she doesn't? I would be curious to see what she would have to say. Possible she would hand you a BS line about it,then again maybe in her mind she feels she has a ligiet reason. Not justifying her not doing some housework etc, but just saying maybe in HER mind thats the way she sees it. You said its like this about 95% of the time, so I'm assumming you went into the marriage knowing she wasn't much on cleaning? Or she became lazy in your eyes after having kids etc? I'm not knocking either one of you, just trying to see why maybe she feels the need not to do some things. If it continues to be a problem then I would suggest some marriage counseling over the matter. Maybe try to get to the root of whats causing this. Jade Link to post Share on other sites
sanso Posted September 21, 2005 Share Posted September 21, 2005 I will admit to falling into this type of unclean rut myself, and we don't have kids!! I don't have a job right now, and we let things get a little out of control. The thing is, when we both worked we agreed to split the chores. Now I feel resentment that I should do it all, because I should have time since I am home. My thought was, when I do get back to work, what will happen? Will there still be the expectation that I will take care of all the chores because that's the way it's been done? I firmly believe that you have to talk about who will be responsible for what. I can't cope with vagueness like... if something needs to be done and you have time, do it. (which was my husband's first opinion) My H and I had a discussion about what bothers him most... dirty dishes in the sink... and I have made the effort to keep that one thing in check. On the other hand... I can't stand it when he clutters the kitchen table, so we created a spot for keys and mail and newspaper and he has to keep them there. We have our designated nights to cook, and one night a week we can order take out, or go out or whatever. Compliments for work done, even for something as trivial as doing the ironing, can go a long way. Positive attitude and positive reinforcement plus communication are my $0.02 Link to post Share on other sites
sanso Posted September 21, 2005 Share Posted September 21, 2005 PLUS, another thing that I didn't think of at first, because we don't have kids... is INVOLVE THEM!! School age children can easily be expected to contribute!! Even the 5 year old can help mommy push a broom or hold the dustpan!! Create a household responsibilites chart with stickers and stuff and expect everyone to keep up their job all week. At the end of the week, have a family time reward. Anyone who didn't keep up with their jobs cannot participate... and that includes Mom and Dad! Rotate jobs weekly or monthy. As with everthing, the only way to succeed with this plan is consistancy and follow through. Take the family out for ice cream as your week's end reward, and if little Johhny didn't take the trash out all week have the guts to make him sit and watch you eat ice cream. (And before anyone attacks me for being cruel, I am a teacher and this is a discipline plan implemented at the school I worked at!) Link to post Share on other sites
Author skinut2234 Posted September 21, 2005 Author Share Posted September 21, 2005 Jade- I've asked her why and the answer is: "it just doesn't bother her"- She knows it gets to me and sooner or later I will do it ( so I admit I am partially to blame)... To her- it's good enough (Doesn't seem to matter what I think) As for the lunches- I approached her on it in a nice way stating that we need to save money and not to go out so much- her answer was that it's her "payment" for staying home and doing the chores (which never get done) I know she feels it's a thankless job- so she treats herself to lunch to compensate (yes maybe that is because I do not compliment the work) but she needs to do the work to get complimented!!!!! ARGH! Link to post Share on other sites
JadeStar Posted September 21, 2005 Share Posted September 21, 2005 I 2nd what sanso said about getting the kids involved with helping as well. We do that in my home. My kids are 8 and 5. My 8 year old makes up his bed, there are times when he will change the small trash can bags in both bathrooms. He has even help load up the dishwasher before. He has swept off the front porch. Our 5 year old, helps dust, sweep, she likes to even help mop the kitchen a little. She will spray our mirrors and glass door with window cleaner. When I do the laundry, they are expected to put away their own clothes after we have folded them. Are my kids jobs they do around the house always perfect? Nope, but they try, and it teaches them responsibilty as far as helping. Not only that, it can sometimes lighten the load of things we do. Jade Link to post Share on other sites
li'l bunny Posted September 21, 2005 Share Posted September 21, 2005 I am a stay at home mom too and I have to agree with you. Your wife should be cleaning, at least the kitchen and living room. That's what bothers me most - though my H wouldn't notice if the dishes were piled high in the sink!! The problem I have is that it is so boring and you get so fed up doing the same thing all day every day. I realise that you have to do it when you come home, but is there any way you could come to an arrangement, tell your wife if she keeps the downstairs clean that you will hire someone to come in and clean the house for an hour or two a week? I don't believe it would cost a huge amount and it has helped my 'mum' friends a lot. If you can't afford this maybe she could suggest going back to work next year when the third child is in school. Do you have a dishwasher by the way?? Link to post Share on other sites
Author skinut2234 Posted September 21, 2005 Author Share Posted September 21, 2005 Lil bunny- yes we do have a Dishwasher and I agree with you that it's boring but I keep hearing that from all the SAHM's- Well so is my day! I do the same thing basically day in and day out and I do not expect anyone to have sympathy for me- Yes I do get paid for it- but I also deal with upset clients and people yelling and telling me what to do. How come we are always expected to "understand" and be sympathetic to our wives for the "rough day" they may have had when I deal with non stop BS all day?? I understand it can be hard with the kids and all and I've been there- but I do not expect sympathy since it's my job and I just accept the fact that is HAS to get done just like all the other chores, (lawn, weeding, garbage, outside work, etc)- All MY jobs in addition to full -time job - I accept it and will never complain about it. But I'm supposed to feel bad and have sympathy for her- I'm not being insensitive- I just don't get it...... (if I ever said to her- it's your JOB to keep the house clean- she would make me sleep outside)- but it's OK to tell me it's MY job to provide income for the family in addition to all the other jobs I have to do......... Link to post Share on other sites
goody2shoes44 Posted September 21, 2005 Share Posted September 21, 2005 I think you should win an award for all you do then. The bottom line is if this bothers you, both of you get into counseling to see what the problem is. Sounds like you are starting to resent her for her not doing her part or maybe you have been resenting her for awhile. Could be too that maybe she feels some resentment for you as well and thats why shes not doing nothing. Its great that you're the bread winner, and work hard and put up with BS all day long on your job. Its also great that you cook, clean, do yard work etc too, however sounds like YOU are so busy, that maybe you have neglected other areas of your relationship that she feels is important. Doesn't look like alot of cummincation going on either. Get into some counseling is all I know to tell ya. I think you might be putting so much emphasis on the "house work" that maybe you're not putting enough emphasis on her needs?? Possible?? You say she goes out to eat alot, with who does she go with? Link to post Share on other sites
lilmoma1973 Posted September 22, 2005 Share Posted September 22, 2005 Hey Skinnut, I can understand where she is coming from ...Why you complaining about the kitchen if that is the only thing that isn't cleaned up?You must be really anal about cleaning!!! I know when i take my daughter and ss to school by the time i get home clean and exercise and eat lunch it is time to go get her by then.. I don't think there is enough time in the day to do all the things that are need to do while they are at school!!!! Are you sure she isn't seeing someone maybe thats why your house isn't cleaned ?I find that odd she is gone for 4-5 hrs ..Do you know what your wife is doing while you are at work? Link to post Share on other sites
Ladyjane14 Posted September 22, 2005 Share Posted September 22, 2005 She needs to want to meet your needs. Apparently, one of your needs is for a clean home. Did you ever read The Five Love Languages by Gary Chapman. Possibly, one of your love languages is "Acts of Service". If so, that would explain why this is so important to you. Maybe the two of you could read it together. (????) Chances are....if her "love tank" is full, she'll be more willing to meet your needs. Maybe you aren't speaking in her language enough to keep the tank full? Link to post Share on other sites
RecordProducer Posted September 22, 2005 Share Posted September 22, 2005 Can you afford a cleaning lady once or twice a weak so that your wife doesn't have to do that and has more time for every-day chores like dishes and cooking? Perhaps you could ask her to sacrifice some of her pleasures (if any) in order to have more money for that. Nobody likes to be a maid. Baby-sitting your own kids is different from cleaning your own house. It's an awful chore. If I had a full-time maid when my twins were babies, it would have saved my marriage. Free time and good rest, and most of all, time for the children are more important than money. Link to post Share on other sites
lilmoma1973 Posted September 22, 2005 Share Posted September 22, 2005 Hey skinnut , I have to say if you aren't appreciating what she does then 9 times out of 10 she won't do nothing!! If women aren't appreciated for what they are doing they will say f*** it and it will not get done.. I feel that way towards my h .. He has made comments about "I could clean the house better" I say if you will get all this clutter out of the house maybe i could .. I do the best i can .. I don't ask him to do to much anymore .. I have a saying "Expect nohing from noone and you will never be disappointed!!" I live by this and it makes it easier to deal with things in life in general.. I would like my H to do more around the house than he does but i might as well except it isn't going to happen and i have accepted it!! I don't like it either but thats the way things are .. I try to clean before i leave if i have errands to run and know that i will not have a lot of time to clean .... Maybe you could suggest that .. I can tell you that being at home isn't all fun and games and you want to get out and see people and interact .. Maybe this is why she doesn't stay home much and i can't blame her at all.. Link to post Share on other sites
Author skinut2234 Posted September 22, 2005 Author Share Posted September 22, 2005 Thanks everyone- I can see where this is going and I'm throwing in the white flag.... Not looking to start a war- I just don't understand how when it comes to "jobs" and things that need to get done- I am EXPECTED to do my share which involves full time work plus 1000 other things. - I do not expect anyone to feel bad for me- or even thank me or appreciate me- These are things that NEED to get done- When it comes to SAHM- we all have to walk on eggshells and watch what we "say"- I have to accept that she has had a rough day and compliment her- Does not seem fair to me. My day starts at 6:30 and I get home at 6:00. I eat lunch at my desk most days- When I come home I ususally have to clean up outside- cut grass- take care of yard etc.etc..... She gets kids on bus and goes back to sleep until 10:00-! Now she has one kid to watch until 3:00..... She will get herself ready and go to lunch-probably do some laundry etc etc... To me- it's outright disrespectful to me that I should have to come home and clean kitchen, toys off floor- etc etc..... I'm sorry ladies- I have trouble seeing it any other way when I bust my hump 11-12 hrs a day so she can stay home.... it would be nice for her to think of me and my feelings....(By the way- when things are clean I do compliment)- At this point I see that all the ladies are going to gang up on me and that's OK- it would be nice to hear someone stick up for the guys (i've stuck up for the ladies and stated how hard a job staying home is) but the more I see what goes on daily- the more I'm skeptical. This will be my last post on this since I just see myself getting beat up. I'm too deflated at this point......... Link to post Share on other sites
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