Still trying to understand this weird incidend of the past that haunts me..

[Pamela]

An unexplained thing happened about three weeks before I broke up with my ex-boyfriend (Stefan) and I was just wanted to ask some questions as to what you think was going on...

 

Stefan had been recently separated from his wife (Lydia)and they were both living in different flats; he was living in the main one and she had moved out to another one. She knew we were going together and it seemed like there was no problems, as she had supposedly been the one to initialte moving out.

 

Anyhow, I came over to Warsaw from the neighboring city of Wroclaw (where I was woring in the opera)to Stefan's flat and stayed over during a weekend, and everything had been fine. The week later I wanted to surprize him, so I came over in the morning, rang the buzzer and he said, "Just a minute" in a quiet voice, then opened up the door five minutes later.

 

I went up and he opened the door a crack, looked like he had been sweating and only had underwear on. He told me to come back in half an hour because Lydia had come over with their nine-year-old daughter and he had to take her to school.

 

Something seemed weird..When I came back an hour later and buzzed he told me to wait there and he would come down because (appartently Lydia was still there). When he came down he told me that Lydia was upset that I had stayed over and she was going to move back to the appartment because she couldn't afford the other one. If he didn't like it he would "have to go somewhere else" and give her the old flat.

 

We did some errands together, then went back to the flat (Lydia had gone) and spent intimate moments together, but something was really weird. I threw out some disgusting cigarette buts in the kitchen that Lydia had left purposely for me to see (that's what it looked like).

 

Stefan and I went out again and he called Lydia asking on her cell asking how she was. He told me that she was planning to come back that evening with the child to stay because she didn't want me staying there, even though that had been the plan. I got upset saying it was really unfair and manipulative of her to do this, but he had no power, as the flat was still legally hers.

 

After lunch we came back to his flat (I had left some bags there) and when I looked in the kitchen I noticed two fresh cigarette buts squished in a filthy plate. That meant Lydia had come back just ot "mark her territory" or something.

 

Stefan didn't seem to notice anything or care, but I picked everything up right away...

 

Sure enough that evening while we were out Lydia had come back and "planted herself" in the appartment to stay. (Stefan had buzzed the door to check)Stefan told me to come back in an hour again... I came back after two hours, waited outside while Stefan came down with my bags telling me that Lydia was not going to budge- that he would have to pay for a hotel for me the night, and that if I came up she would call the police.

 

I got really upset and began sobbing, but Stefan told me there was nothing he could do, and begged me to go to a hotel just that one time.

 

This is the "infamous night" when I lost control of my emotions and threatened to walk in front of a tram if he abandoned me.

 

It was one of the worst nights in my life, and I am ashamed of myself for having stooped so low as to beg for a cruel, worthless man to stay with me. (It happened last night four years ago on June 1st, 1997 I guess that's why it came up..)

 

He did end up staying with me in this horrible, seedy hotel right next to the train station, but he just did it because he felt sorry for me and I couldn't stop crying the whole evening. I knew our time was coming to a end..

 

Anyhow, I just wanted to ask if you think he had been having sex with Lydia that day I came over? I know the evidence seems pretty strong, but at the time I just couldn't imagine it because Lydia had supposedly ended things with him six months earlier (she was a hard-skinned woman, but she had always been very nice to me before over the phone and had seemed pleased about our relationship. I don't understand how she just flipped over to the other extreme...)

[Tammie]

Anyhow, I just wanted to ask if you think he had been having sex with Lydia that day I came over? I know the evidence seems pretty strong, but at the time I just couldn't imagine it because Lydia had supposedly ended things with him six months earlier (she was a hard-skinned woman, but she had always been very nice to me before over the phone and had seemed pleased about our relationship. I don't understand how she just flipped over to the other extreme...)

Yes, I think he was having sex with Lydia. Trust your instinct on this; it's usually correct.

 

I don't think their relationship is over, no matter if she ended it with him. If she seemed nice and pleased over your relationship before, it seems like she had a change of heart. Whether a 'dog in the manger' or she's still in love with him, I think you are being caught in the middle of a relationship that is not truly over.

 

Considering they have a child together and other factors in their relationship (length, etc), I really don't think 6 months is enough time for anyone to get over a complicated relationship.

 

He's acting like a man caught between 2 women. You need to save your self-esteem and your self-respect and end it with this man before you spend too many more nights crying your eyes out to no avail. I can't say what his motives are, but if he can't stand up to his ex- you will constantly be caught in the middle and coming second to her, and most likely, to everything else in his life. You don't deserve that.

 

You can't tell him what to do or control his actions, but you can control your own. You deserve better.

[Dragonflys]

Yeah, you are right, Stefan is a worthless scumbag. He has a kid with his wife and then treats her like crap. I.e cheating with you, still probably sleeping with her, not caring about her etc.

 

Well I'm glad he is gone...

 

Now, what's up with you??...why do you bring this rubbish out of you mental closet??, why do you care NOW?.

 

Also why did you write your post in a tone trying to make lydia sound like a villian??..if anything, I feel sorry for her taht she got involved with Stefan.

 

I think you you address your emotional state. Given that you gave this guy a moment of your time, and sound so selfish yourself, and then want to re-live this, you really should see a psychologist and work out why you behave in a manner destructive to yourself and many around you.

 

I really hope you do not stay in this state. Find some help so you can live for today and have a healthy relationship.

An unexplained thing happened about three weeks before I broke up with my ex-boyfriend (Stefan) and I was just wanted to ask some questions as to what you think was going on... Stefan had been recently separated from his wife (Lydia)and they were both living in different flats; he was living in the main one and she had moved out to another one. She knew we were going together and it seemed like there was no problems, as she had supposedly been the one to initialte moving out. Anyhow, I came over to Warsaw from the neighboring city of Wroclaw (where I was woring in the opera)to Stefan's flat and stayed over during a weekend, and everything had been fine. The week later I wanted to surprize him, so I came over in the morning, rang the buzzer and he said, "Just a minute" in a quiet voice, then opened up the door five minutes later. I went up and he opened the door a crack, looked like he had been sweating and only had underwear on. He told me to come back in half an hour because Lydia had come over with their nine-year-old daughter and he had to take her to school. Something seemed weird..When I came back an hour later and buzzed he told me to wait there and he would come down because (appartently Lydia was still there). When he came down he told me that Lydia was upset that I had stayed over and she was going to move back to the appartment because she couldn't afford the other one. If he didn't like it he would "have to go somewhere else" and give her the old flat. We did some errands together, then went back to the flat (Lydia had gone) and spent intimate moments together, but something was really weird. I threw out some disgusting cigarette buts in the kitchen that Lydia had left purposely for me to see (that's what it looked like). Stefan and I went out again and he called Lydia asking on her cell asking how she was. He told me that she was planning to come back that evening with the child to stay because she didn't want me staying there, even though that had been the plan. I got upset saying it was really unfair and manipulative of her to do this, but he had no power, as the flat was still legally hers.

 

After lunch we came back to his flat (I had left some bags there) and when I looked in the kitchen I noticed two fresh cigarette buts squished in a filthy plate. That meant Lydia had come back just ot "mark her territory" or something.

 

Stefan didn't seem to notice anything or care, but I picked everything up right away...

 

Sure enough that evening while we were out Lydia had come back and "planted herself" in the appartment to stay. (Stefan had buzzed the door to check)Stefan told me to come back in an hour again... I came back after two hours, waited outside while Stefan came down with my bags telling me that Lydia was not going to budge- that he would have to pay for a hotel for me the night, and that if I came up she would call the police. I got really upset and began sobbing, but Stefan told me there was nothing he could do, and begged me to go to a hotel just that one time.

 

This is the "infamous night" when I lost control of my emotions and threatened to walk in front of a tram if he abandoned me. It was one of the worst nights in my life, and I am ashamed of myself for having stooped so low as to beg for a cruel, worthless man to stay with me. (It happened last night four years ago on June 1st, 1997 I guess that's why it came up..) He did end up staying with me in this horrible, seedy hotel right next to the train station, but he just did it because he felt sorry for me and I couldn't stop crying the whole evening. I knew our time was coming to a end.. Anyhow, I just wanted to ask if you think he had been having sex with Lydia that day I came over? I know the evidence seems pretty strong, but at the time I just couldn't imagine it because Lydia had supposedly ended things with him six months earlier (she was a hard-skinned woman, but she had always been very nice to me before over the phone and had seemed pleased about our relationship. I don't understand how she just flipped over to the other extreme...)

[Laurynn]

The reason that Pamela brought this 4 yr old incident 'out of the woodwork' is.....from her past posts here, it seems pretty clear to me that:

 

1. she lives in the past

 

2. she has a long history of being involved with married men.

 

3. she has a very hard time getting over the demise of past relationships/can't move on.

 

Remember, Pamela is the gal who posted here a couple months back....about her teacher she'd had an affair with at the age of 17...who ended up being GAY, then he married another man, and she was furious that this gay married man had moved on with his life....was here asking for advice on how to 'get back at him'....complaining that she'd call him up to rag on him about his "gay pride" and he'd be rude to her (imagine!)

 

Oh, and then it came out that the man she was recently married to....she'd met him in Paris, I believe......and he was married at the time......she was his mistress......or something to that affect.......she ended up cheating on him, I believe.

 

Seems that Pam's life, according to what she shares here, is filled with disrespect for herself, other women (wives, etc) and even the men to some degree.

 

She has to "ask" whether Stefan was still having sex with his WIFE Lydia, that day he answered the door in his undies, all sweaty..um, HELL YEAH! of course he'd been having sex prior to answering the door. I doubt the guy was running around half naked, working up that much of a sweat in order to get his kid off to school. Doesn't take a rocket scientist to see that he was still carrying on with his wife...and personally, Pamela had no business getting involved with a man who a) wasn't officially DIVORCED...b) his estranged wife lived in the flat below. How weird! Surely there are hundreds of SINGLE, available men in the world. Why Pamela migrates to those who are already taken, is beyond me. I agree that she should seek professional help...I suggested that once, but she tore me a new on, in response, then came back using all kinds of bogus names to anonymously flame me. You better put on your flame retardant suit, Oliver :-))

 

L

[Pamela]

...and personally, Pamela

had no business getting involved with a man who a) wasn't officially DIVORCED...

 

In Poland it takes longer to get a divorce than here,so it is quite common for people who are still officially married to have completely separate lives from each other. I know cases of married couples in the ex-Soviet Union who still lived in the SAME FLAT, but had different parteners. You have to realize that is not easy in ex-communist countries to just move out of a flat and find another one the way we do in the West, as the housing is still limited and people sometimes wait years just to have a flat with a telephone.

 

b) his estranged

wife lived in the flat below. How weird!

 

No, she didn't live in the flat below. That day she just happened to be hanging around the area (I guess she was watching us from a distance. Who knew?)

 

Surely

there are hundreds of SINGLE, available men in the world. Why Pamela migrates to those who are already taken, is beyond me. I agree that she should seek professional help...I suggested that once, but she tore me a new on, in response, then came back using all kinds of bogus names to anonymously flame me.

 

I only used one bogus name once and Tony caught it right away. Don't exaggerate, okay? Another time I posted a passionate post entitled "I hate you Laurynn" under my real name. Now I set the facts straight.

 

P

[Dragonflys]

Oh, I didn't know it was THAT Pamela, thanks Laurynn. I'm a dummy

 

Well, since it is, I'll just say to you Pamela, please get yourself some help. Life can be so beautiful if you can live in the present and enjoy it's beauty. And, as Tony keeps harping YOU ONLY GET ONE CRACK AT IT!.

 

You are living a self inflicted hell that not you yourself, nor any of us can make any inroads into correcting. You are clearly ashamed of it too, because you post with a degree of anonymity. Try reading the book 'working on yourself doesn't work'and you will see that in your case, you need the help from outside you.

 

Put your trust in a good counselor and rid yourself of your torturous mindnoise.

 

Oliver

[Laurynn]

You always have creative little ways of justifying things, Pamela. I don't think it matters one iota how "long" it can take to get a divorce in the Soviet Union...married is married. Divorced is divorced. In the eyes of the law (and in the eyes of God, if you believe in God) a person is still married up until the divorce is granted. End of story. If you feel good about yourself by trying to justify your pattern (self admitted, here) of being a 'mistress'...being involved with married men, etc....that's entirely your prerogative.....but after having been here for a good many months, I can assure you that you're not going to be receiving "sympathy" for your self inflicted situations.

 

As for when Tony busted you for using "other" names to flame me with, my memory's pretty sharp..and I believe you were busted using at least 3 different names.....I'm sure Tony or Miss Mojo can confirm this...though, it really doesn't matter now :-)

 

L

[Pamela]

You always have creative little ways of justifying things, Pamela. I don't think it matters one iota how "long" it can take to get a divorce in the Soviet Union...married is married. Divorced is divorced. In the eyes of the law (and in the eyes of God, if you believe in God) a person is still married up until the divorce is granted. End of story. If you feel good about yourself by trying to justify your pattern (self admitted, here) of being a 'mistress'...being involved with married men, etc....that's entirely your prerogative.....but after having been here for a good many months, I can assure you that you're not going to be receiving "sympathy" for your self inflicted situations.

 

As for when Tony busted you for using "other" names to flame me with, my memory's pretty sharp..and I believe you were busted using at least 3 different names.....I'm sure Tony or Miss Mojo can confirm this...though, it really doesn't matter now :-)

 

L

[Laurynn]

Nope...but I am a woman with class, pride, scruples, respect for myself/others..and I live my life in reality. No religious denomination associated with that.

 

Thanks for playing!

 

Laurynn

[Pamela]

Nope...but I am a woman with class, pride, scruples, respect for myself/others..and I live my life in reality. No religious denomination associated with that. Thanks for playing!

Wow! I'm so taken by you. Wouldn't we all like to be as perfect as you!

[tramp43]

Not sure I care for your use of the word mennonite,in this posting? What does being mennonite have to do with what your saying here anyway? Explain please? Nope...but I am a woman with class, pride, scruples, respect for myself/others..and I live my life in reality. No religious denomination associated with that. Thanks for playing! Laurynn