Female friends and people watching in our partnership

[shydad]

Hi Dandelioness, you said that he deleted her phone number. This is a good thing. I'd take this one step at a time. I encourage you not to take any actions, including confrontations, while you're angry. Also, important talks should be in person, face to face, and in private. Otherwise you lose the ability to have body language, look into his eyes, touch his arm, etc. (You may want to check out urbansitter.com, for a babysitter, if the grandparents can't babysit.)

[elaine567]

He's not this obvious all the time. But now anytime yoga pants walks in, I'm sensitive to it. I just find it disrespectful he'd behave like that without any awareness about how I would feel.. and not just "me" but any partner.

 

He doesn't care how you feel, he enjoys upsetting you, he feel entitled to do it, that is the bottom line.

He may even be punishing you for something... and is sending you a message by ogling these women.

How is your sex life?

[Mrs._December]

I did tell him it's embarrassing. He was offended and said maybe we shouldn't hang out in public together then.. since I'm so insecure.

So in other words, he has zero respect for you as a woman, as his wife, and as a human being. Further, he doesn't give a rat's ass how it makes you feel or how he makes you look like a fool in public while he's pushing you out of the way because you're blocking his view.

 

I guess only you can decide whether you're willing to settle for someone who has no respect for you at all, and honestly doesn't care about your feelings.

 

Is this guy REALLY that much of a prize that he's worth accepting this type of disrespect and pig behavior? I'm willing to bet my entire paycheck he's not.

[FMW]

I agree with others, what you describe him doing is weird and creepy. I would be disgusted and not want him to EVER touch me after witnessing that.

 

Since another poster specifically mentioned it, I'll add that I agree with you that him discussing your marital issues with his family isn't right. I had plenty of issues with my xH but NEVER discussed them with my parents (or any other family member) and I was very close with them. I didn't want to skew their opinions about him, knowing that it would be only natural they would automatically take my side.

 

As to isolating you by taking your child to his parents, on the surface of it I would say maybe he thinks you appreciate having some alone time, but if it makes you feel isolated you should tell him that. If he continues to do so anyway then it will be clear what his intentions are.

 

It's really lousy of him to be treating this as if it's just your issue, your hormonal over-sensitivity.

[Mrs._December]

I did tell him it's embarrassing. He was offended and said maybe we shouldn't hang out in public together then.. since I'm so insecure.

So in other words, he has zero respect for you as a woman, as his wife, and as a human being. Further, he doesn't give a rat's ass how it makes you feel or how he makes you look like a fool in public when he's pushing you out of the way or trying to look past you because you're blocking his view of someone's ass.

 

I guess only you can decide whether you're willing to settle for someone this low, has no respect for you at all, and honestly doesn't care about your feelings.

 

Is this guy REALLY that much of a prize that he's worth accepting this type of disrespect and pig behavior? I'm willing to bet my entire paycheck that he's not.

[Mrs._December]

I repeated again and again, we're not talking about "people". We are talking about "sexual body parts" that he's tracking as if I'm not there. His comments about dogs and flowers?? Is he kidding me? Then he asked me if I see him tracking men. I said, "Are you tracking their dicks?" And he said, "I don't know, you tell me. You're the one watching my eyes.." Again, head games. Of course he's innocent. I'm the crazy one.

I'm changing my bet. I'm upping the ante to TWO paychecks that says this degenerate isn't the prize he thinks he is.

[Mrs._December]

Question: Am I overreacting about him contacting this friend? I don't trust either of them.

 

Welcome to the REST of your life, Dandelioness. All this guy DOES is disrespect you. That's all he does - over and over and over and over and over and over and over ad nauseum.

 

What kind of scumbag continually ogles women when he's with his wife out in public - sometimes having to move you out of the way because you're blocking his vision - so he can continue ogling someone until she's out of his sight? And then he has the colossal nerve to call you insecure and/or crazy or hormonal for being so sensitive and ridiculous when you call him out for it. Unreal.

 

I am certain he has never cheated on me but I do question the emotional affairs he may be having.

Oh man. You sound like every betrayed wife/girlfriend before you. The only way you could ever be 100% certain of this is if you were surgically connected to this guy's hip from the day you met him. And you haven't been. Therefore, you DON'T know with certainty and considering how shady and scummy his behavior is, I wouldn't bet even 5 cents on his loyalty to ANYONE.

 

I think you're being very naive and I also don't believe for one minute that this latest woman is the only one he's ever fooled around with. Surely you don't think he's been a saint all this time and you just miraculously caught him the one and ONLY time he's ever done this? I mean, it would be extremely naive to believe someone like this has been true blue up to now. This guy is so cliche and predictable it isn't even funny. In HIS case, for every rat you see, there are 50 you DON'T. I also don't believe for one single second that his renewed 'friendship' with this woman has only been through text. I think you're going to find out it went A LOT farther than that.

 

He's threatened to end our relationship multiple times as a scare tactic since he really has no intentions and knows I have nowhere to go. It goes on..

Yeah, I kind of figured that's why you keep trying to find ways to overlook the horrific disrespect, lies and cheating he's continually served up to you because you're financially dependent on him and have nowhere to go. And he knows that so that's why he continually disrespects you - he knows you won't leave no matter what he does. I think the first thing you should do is stop having kids with this guy. All you're doing is making it harder and harder for yourself to ever have any good options. Edited April 19, 2019 by Mrs._December

[mark clemson]

Agree. As a male, it's pretty normal to window shop a bit. However, I think it's very much another thing to do this blatantly right in front of your partner.

 

Possibly he got used to doing something along these lines with guy buddies, e.g. in college or possibly even at work. If he hasn't figured out that the woman who has his children is not a "pal" to do this with, well that would be truly moronic. I think much more likely it's a significant lack of respect.

[Dandelioness]

I disagree, we are only viewing one side of the story. He visits his parents with their grandchild and it has somehow become a form of isolation?? So if he's given crap about doing so, isn't that isolation? So I guess my wife and i should be categorized as isolationist abusers for bringing the kids to Grammys house. Wow just wow. And if he's talking to family about marital issues I guess that's a big abusive action as well....

 

He takes our children over to his parents almost daily. This isn't the problem as they like having a visit with their grandchildren and vise versa. They live three doors away. Their visits are usually up to an hour but more likely 20minutes. They babysit for us all the time. They get plenty of time together.

 

When it becomes an isolation issue is when he's mad at me for addressing a concern. He then takes our daughter (prior to the birth of our second child)to his parents place and stays there for half a day or so. There's a marked difference here and it's a form of punishment. It's one thing to step out because he's mad, upset, etc. It's another to take our child with him as he does so. It's also parental alienation.

 

He's also admitted to me about venting to his parents about our issues. They know there's "something" going on anytime he stays there for lengthy periods of time. I had to create a rule that anytime he's at his parents house, to stop texting me. And, if we're ever at odds with each other, don't go to their home. It's very disrespectful and keeps me out of the family circle. They have asked us if we argue via text. They can see he's pissed off about something when he behaves in this way.

 

 

When he gaslights me, that's what he forwards onto other people. They don't have a true picture of what's really going on.

[Dandelioness]

Hi Dandelioness, you said that he deleted her phone number. This is a good thing. I'd take this one step at a time. I encourage you not to take any actions, including confrontations, while you're angry. Also, important talks should be in person, face to face, and in private. Otherwise you lose the ability to have body language, look into his eyes, touch his arm, etc. (You may want to check out urbansitter.com, for a babysitter, if the grandparents can't babysit.)

 

I find I am better at articulating my feelings and thoughts in written form. Some of his excuses, the gaslighting, make me angry! He doesn't see his role in a lot of our issues.. or pretends not to? If he does make changes, it's only to please me (for now) rather than self-reflecting and owning up to his mistakes.

[Dandelioness]

Yesterday, his friends invited us both to a play since they had 4 tickets. They like double-dating (they're in their 50's) and they are a very nice couple. He was over at their house when he texted me and I said, due to our current situation, I didn't have the energy to be social with anyone. He tried to convince me otherwise and I said I couldn't. I'm quite affected by his actions and how he handled my concerns.

 

He went without me.

[Mr. Lucky]

He went without me.

 

Are you surprised ?

 

Mr. Lucky

[Dandelioness]

Are you surprised ?

 

Mr. Lucky

 

No, of course not. I didn't even say anything to him about it.

[Turning point]

Others have given some good comments, I'd just like to note something worth paying closer attention to - and that's the distinct difference between what he puts in writing (his emails) and what he speaks privately to you in person.

 

He appears quick to verbally gaslight you privately but, in writing he portrays himself in very flowery terms. His written communication cites a consensus about your shortcomings while referring to his own as an issue with how you think.

 

Step back a bit and watch to see if this dichotomy between what he says privately and how he communicates publicly or in a written record is as dramatic as it seems here in your thread.

 

I get that you don't trust him - and his own duplicity may be the root cause of that.

[Dandelioness]

Others have given some good comments, I'd just like to note something worth paying closer attention to - and that's the distinct difference between what he puts in writing (his emails) and what he speaks privately to you in person.

 

He appears quick to verbally gaslight you privately but, in writing he portrays himself in very flowery terms. His written communication cites a consensus about your shortcomings while referring to his own as an issue with how you think.

 

Step back a bit and watch to see if this dichotomy between what he says privately and how he communicates publicly or in a written record is as dramatic as it seems here in your thread.

 

I get that you don't trust him - and his own duplicity may be the root cause of that.

 

I tell him this every time there's an abruption. What he says and how he acts is quite a bit different. He does physically show me affection and he tries often. It's me who tenses up. I'm just not certain if his affection is for me, or for his own needs. I often feel like he says "I love you" just to see if I say it in return, and hugs me because he needs the hug. I've asked him to stop writing poetry because the BS in the emails makes my stomach turn.

 

I wish I could have face to face conversations with him about these issues but it doesn't work out. Either he gaslights me, drowns me out, or he creates distance because he's guilty of something. We both end up yelling and we avoid this by texting/emailing.

 

I know in my heart he hasn't physically cheated. I'm sure some disagree here. But, contacting ex-flings via texts, staring at women's privates in public, and flirting with particular neighbours has a function. He can't tell me it's all in my head. It's disrespectful and he thinks I'm just insecure.

[Cullenbohannon]

You give him no love, no romance, no affection and no intimacy and you whine because he is "looking"?. Everything he does is fake, Everything he does is suspect. He deserves nothing from you except resentment.

 

Well keep on keeping on, but lets get real. What do YOU bring to this relationship? Why should he stop looking at other women when YOU ARE NOT LOOKING AT HIM. YOU decided on a celibate relationship and he is supposed to tow your line?

Edited April 20, 2019 by a LoveShack.org Moderator
rude

[Mr. Lucky]

But, contacting ex-flings via texts, staring at women's privates in public, and flirting with particular neighbours has a function.

 

In his mind, what purpose do you think these activities serve?

 

Mr. Lucky

[Dandelioness]

You give him no love, no romance, no affection and no intimacy and you whine because he is "looking"?. Everything he does is fake, Everything he does is suspect. He deserves nothing from you except resentment.

 

Well keep on keeping on, but lets get real. What do YOU bring to this relationship? Why should he stop looking at other women when YOU ARE NOT LOOKING AT HIM. YOU decided on a celibate relationship and he is supposed to tow your line?

 

When trust is broken, everything else falls apart.

 

I do give him love. I am very supportive with his medical condition. I accept some of his affection as my way of trying. I am present - I listen to his stories, jokes, and whatever trouble that comes his way. We co-parent. We laugh. We spend a lot of time together.

 

Intimacy is a problem. Not just for him but for me, as well. I didn't create celibacy. Other factors did.

 

I am trying to get past the trust issues and I deserve to be respected. Even though he hasn't cheated on me, a lie is a lie. Betrayal is betrayal. And an apology means it doesn't happen again. So when he suddenly tells me he's been texting an ex-fling whom he's said nothing nice about, I question his motives. When there's hesitation in his answers (or gaslighting) I worry.

 

I do criticize him a lot. I am angry and I'm being honest about it.

 

We've booked an appointment with a counselor. We're also looking into a more specialized counselor (ka-CHING) that may shed some light about the possibility of his medical condition playing a role in this. I'm almost hoping it is.

Edited April 20, 2019 by a LoveShack.org Moderator

[Dandelioness]

In his mind, what purpose do you think these activities serve?

 

Mr. Lucky

In his mind? You'd have to ask him.

[Dandelioness]

Thoughts to the email he sent me? It didn't melt my heart. I don't want to share my thoughts on this just yet..

 

"I'm sorry I haven't been more sensitive and understanding about how you are feeling.. I too am hurting over they way you see me and our relationship and I haven't handled it well as I have been emotional and reactive..

 

I'm sorry that I haven't been more sensitive by making sure I keep my eyes to myself and you made it clear to me that it bothers you. ( I should have listened to how it may makes you feel no matter how I feel about it, even if I dont think what I do is wrong) your feelings should be more important than anything. And I think they are and cant explain why it is taking me so long to clue in.. how you feel is very important to me and you deserve better.. I hope I am not too late to fix this..I need to stop reacting to what you tell me and try to see things from your perspective.

 

I'm do sorry .. all I ever wanted to do is make you happy and live a great life with you and the girls.. I hope we can work through this.

 

My threats of leaving were not fair to you and were hurtful. I would never be capable of leaving, saying so is me being reactive and not handling my emotions well.. I'm sorry..

 

I keep hurting you , which is the opposite of what I want..

 

I'm afraid.. I love you and the girls but I fear that I have hurt all of you and I am afraid I have been to dense to see what you have been telling me and now I may be too late to change that and make you feel the respect that you deserve..

 

I do love you and I do want you to feel loved and respected..

 

I'm sorry I haven't given you all that you deserve..

 

Please give me another chance. I need to listen and hear you better and be more aware of how my actions effect you.

 

I would never intentionally hurt you .. I'm so sorry. I will do anything you want.. I understand now and I need to work at changing .

 

We have a beautiful family and I will do everything and anything to save it and improve our relationship and happiness.

 

I do love you.. I can be a better partner i am asking for a little more help and patience. i know that you are not responsible for fixing me but I beg you to please not give up on me.. I will do anything.

 

I am hopeful that the counseling will help us this time..

 

I understand if you hate me.

 

I've been blind and deaf to you and ignored your feelings.

 

If I cant be a better partner I understand if you leave but it's not what I want . I dont deserve your love. You and the girls deserve better ."

[amaysngrace]

Well that’s very nice. How sincere is he?

 

Is this the first time he’s promised to “change”?

[elaine567]

I may be a little cynical, but I think those emails are "proof" in writing that he is a really nice guy trying to save his marriage.

I would not be surprised if he shows these to his family, so that they are always on his "side".

[Turning point]

The email is quite vague and doesn't speak to anything one could not garner from a basic assumption about anyone in a relationship.

 

It's the conversation you're not able to have that is the root problem. If he's shutting down conversations about what really matters between the two of you then these emailed intentions end up being quite hollow.

 

I get that celibacy doesn't help the situation however, if his behavior is borderline creepy that's a huge turn off. The crudeness of public leering really undermines intimacy.

[stillafool]

I honestly don't know how to respond. He's avoided me all day. He does this sometimes as a form of punishment. He'll take our child with him to his parents house (doors away) and stay there for hours - isolating me while he's surrounded by the people who love him. He's admitted to me about venting to his parents about me, which is another form of isolation.

 

Anytime I address a concerning behaviour, we spend more time talking about his feelings and how he just tries so hard to make me happy. I get a lot of finger pointing and he dodges a lot of my points until I'm too exhausted to continue, essentially not solving any problems.

 

You should take the time to get sleep, rest and relax when your bf takes your child to see his parents instead of worrying about what they are talking about. They are more than likely wrapped up in enjoying your baby rather than talking about you.

[preraph]

I just have one more thing to add about your man's staring at women problem. You have children with him. How is this going to play out when he can't take his eyes off your 14 year old daughter's friends body parts? Seriously. He needs to stop.