Fiance acting shady..or am I just paranoid?

[Mr. Lucky]

I will never do this a second time.

 

If I had to guess, she already has. And a third time...

 

It's a leap to think he was a straight-arrow, committed BF and husband who fell off the wagon a year ago. More realistically, she's just found out who he is and always has been.

 

I'd hate to bet on future changes in light of past performances...

 

Mr. Lucky

[Tamfana]

 

I know. Why did he do that???

 

Because he's ticked off that he's been seen for who he really is. He is not remorseful. Or caring.

[georgia girl]

Because he's ticked off that he's been seen for who he really is. He is not remorseful. Or caring.

 

My take only: he did it because that’s what has worked for him in the past. He has learned that by falsely equivocating two pereceived wrongs and when clearly his wrong is significantly more egregious, he gets the opposite party to make concessions. It’s a great debating skill and I am sure he has spent a lifetime getting himself out of trouble this way. After all, we are all products of our learned behavior.

 

However, to me, it demonstrates that he hasn’t done any hard work yet. Instead of soul-searching, making himself vulnerable to fair criticism, etc., he went to a reliable tactic. If you don’t shut that down, things will never change.

If it were me, I would either ignore that message completely (to demonstrate that I don’t engage in meager efforts) or if I addressed it, I would say something along the lines of: “Don’t you dare ever equivocate a harmless, non-sexual conversation I once had again with blatant Year-long dating activities that included another relationship. If you do, the conversation is over. It neither demonstrates remorse or effort on your part to fix what you broke. Instead it attempts to manipulate me. That is dishonest and it demonstrates to me that I have nothing to gain from listening to you.”

 

Regardless of if you stay or go, OP, the only way this has a happy ending for you is for you to grow a very, very stiff spine.

[aliveagain]

His reply is all about keeping control, it reeks of blame shifting and it is an attempt to guilt you back into place. How does a onetime conversation with someone in the presence of your partner and how many other people at the party equate to a year long emotional secret affair hidden from you? You didn't pay to sign up on a dating site, you didn't tell someone they were more handsome then your fiance, you didn't tell another man you didn't intend on staying in a long term relationship with the same fiance. You didn't make actual plans to meet someone for sex, he did and his bullsh*t excuse that he never went through with the sex doesn't nullify the intent to have sex with her.

 

He is interfering with your time to yourself because he knows the longer your out of his control the easier it will be for you to make a decision about your future that may not include him. Remember, all his b/s excuses to guilt you to stay were not enough to stop him from betraying you. He had a million chances to stop his cheating and confess but didn't, you had to catch him before he put the breaks on their relationship. Your reply to his comments should be, "why wasn't it enough to stop you?"

 

You need to take time to consider what it is that you really want without his interference. You do need to talk to a lawyer and find out what your rights are, most courts will do what is best for the child and will view your 7 year relationship as a common law relationship and most likely treat it like a marriage. You can't keep him from his child so you will have to find a neutral way to drop off your child for visitations with interacting with him. My suggestion is you ask him for a written timeline of everything that took place, promises he made her, pictures sent to each other, who knew but didn't tell you, other women, meetings, how he felt, why you were not enough and enforce the fact that a polygraph is in his future. He lost his rights to you the moment he stepped over that line. It is not up to you to tell him what it's going to take to fix this, it's up to him to tell you what he is going to do and then you will decide if it is enough. Cheaters are liars so only believe his actions. I personally have a hard time believing a relationship that has cheating in it before the marriage is consummated can survive what it takes to make it last.

[Crazelnut]

I just read his "apology," and I'm flabbergasted. That is some top shelf bulls**t he's trying to pour you. How dare he shift that blame to you?! OMG, this guy is just awful to you. Please do not fall for his lies. He literally laid in bed beside you, told another woman you're not his long term thing, told her he ISN'T IN LOVE WITH YOU, and sexted with her. Regardless of who he told the lies to (you or her or both of you), the fact remains ... he is a LIAR. Do you want to be married to a liar?

Edited May 21, 2019 by Crazelnut

[Veronica73]

In addition to the above, he sent a photo of your daughter to this woman!!! That is all kinds of messed up.

[Curly_locks]

Frankly, I think no apology would have been better than that crappy one.

 

Yes I agree, it just made me feel guilty.

 

Unlike others, I think you can save this relationship but it would take two very critical things.one is that he would have to work his butt off to re-earn your trust, love and respect. The other is that you will have to make him work for it. No free passes, no helping him out. You need to be true to what you need and demand it. It will be too easy for you to forgive. Make him earn it.

 

And give this all a little time. You just found out about this. I think itÂ’s fair to tell him that he had a year of fooling around, you get a year to figure out if this is what you want and that you are willing to walk away at any moment.0

 

Yes he would have to put in A LOT of work. I would want full access to everything he does on his phone etc. I would need him to understand the extent of what hes done, but I'm not sure if it's hit him yet. My heart wants to save us, but I don't know how I'll trust him again. I know from Loveshack people have been able to move on even from physical affairs. I don't know. I didn't answer the msg, cause I didn't know what to say to all that. I just answered the one about if he can pick our daughter from her toddler group with a "NO!!!"

 

 

If I had to guess, she already has. And a third time...

 

It's a leap to think he was a straight-arrow, committed BF and husband who fell off the wagon a year ago. More realistically, she's just found out who he is and always has been.

 

No I know he hasn't cheated before. I've seen how he is around women who flirt with him, he never paid them attention, he shut them down. There was nothing on his phone apart from this one woman. He wasn't even really interested in others on POF. He told her the same thing, that he's never cheated once on me. That he's had opportunities for sex, but never was worth the risk. But that SHE IS worth the risk. Yeah he said that. And yet he still didn't go through with her. I do believe this is the first time 100%.

 

However, to me, it demonstrates that he hasnÂ’t done any hard work yet. Instead of soul-searching, making himself vulnerable to fair criticism, etc.,.

 

He hasn't and he needs to.

 

His reply is all about keeping control, it reeks of blame shifting and it is an attempt to guilt you back into place. How does a onetime conversation with someone in the presence of your partner and how many other people at the party equate to a year long emotional secret affair hidden from you? You didn't pay to sign up on a dating site, you didn't tell someone they were more handsome then your fiance, you didn't tell another man you didn't intend on staying in a long term relationship with the same fiance. You didn't make actual plans to meet someone for sex, he did and his bullsh*t excuse that he never went through with the sex doesn't nullify the intent to have sex with her..

 

That's what I'd like to know. Does he seriously think that the conversation I had with that guy is the same situation?! I've always been nothing but loyal to him and he knows it. He wants it to be the same thing to lessen his guilt, but it's not at all. I wasn't hiding anything from him with chatting to that guy, he was right there and it was innocent. Ridiculous.

 

I just read his "apology," and I'm flabbergasted. That is some top shelf bulls**t he's trying to pour you. How dare he shift that blame to you?! OMG, this guy is just awful to you. Please do not fall for his lies. He literally laid in bed beside you, told another woman you're not his long term thing, told her he ISN'T IN LOVE WITH YOU, and sexted with her. Regardless of who he told the lies to (you or her or both of you), the fact remains ... he is a LIAR. Do you want to be married to a liar?

 

He's not usually awful to me. Or a liar. That's the problem. Everything started when he decided he wanted a bit of attention, then chatting to her. And I (well him really) need to get to the bottom of why he needed it. In his "apology" it sounds like it's because we got together young. And what can I do if that's the case? I have no idea. This isn't who he usually is, so I just don't know what tf went wrong.

 

In addition to the above, he sent a photo of your daughter to this woman!!! That is all kinds of messed up.

 

Yes it is!!! Very.

 

Guys, I've not contacted the OW (hate that I have to type OW but whatever.) I need to focus on getting answers from him first. I think i will tell him he can take our daughter out for a few hours. Probably Saturday. Then when they have played etc. That we have to have a Serious talk, and that it's not gonna be comfortable for him and I want the 100% truth for every single question. I'm not going to move forward either way if I don't even ask him questions.

 

Today has somehow been the worst so far. I'm feeling very depressed, crushed, and lonely. I feel like my whole life is just a fail. Like I'm a fail. Not good enough, not pretty enough, can't make a man happy. Just blah. I read the screenshots over and over, keep checking his account incase they talk. He's not text or call today. Which I want but the silence feels loud. I'm not sure how to cope with the pain, esp when my daughter is a sleep. I'm in this stupid bed he sext her in, and honestly I want to burn it down. Thanks so much for the support. This forum is a great idea, you've all been great.

[mark clemson]

Today has somehow been the worst so far. I'm feeling very depressed, crushed, and lonely. I feel like my whole life is just a fail. Like I'm a fail. Not good enough, not pretty enough, can't make a man happy. Just blah. I read the screenshots over and over, keep checking his account incase they talk. He's not text or call today. Which I want but the silence feels loud. I'm not sure how to cope with the pain, esp when my daughter is a sleep. I'm in this stupid bed he sext her in, and honestly I want to burn it down. Thanks so much for the support. This forum is a great idea, you've all been great.

 

 

You seem like a great woman and your life is certainly NOT a fail. You were betrayed and it's completely unfair. Relationships start and end, and this may be the end of yours, but that in no way makes you (or the relationship, frankly) a failure. If it ends, it was a mostly successful relationship that resulted in a daughter, but that ended in a bad way due to your partner's failings.

 

You have every right to be upset and angry as you process this. Don't hesitate to contact a counselor or even a crisis hotline if you need to.

[elaine567]

I am not in anyway trying to condone his actions but getting together young can be a big issue, as there are never any proper wild oats sown.

The person starts to crave variety, they are not happy with the thought that this is it "for life", one woman, one man forever and never the chance of anyone different.

They start looking for others to satisfy their craving. Your child probably compounded the feeling, he was trapped and there was not a lot he could do about it...

He went on POF found this suitable woman and suddenly there was a way out... if he had the nerve to take it. He was getting close...

 

Sorry to say that cheaters tend to find some way to contact the OW, second Ddays are too common. He knows you are monitoring him, so he will lay low on that platform, so do not expect much to be happening there.

[Mr. Lucky]

No I know he hasn't cheated before. I've seen how he is around women who flirt with him, he never paid them attention, he shut them down. There was nothing on his phone apart from this one woman. He wasn't even really interested in others on POF. He told her the same thing, that he's never cheated once on me. That he's had opportunities for sex, but never was worth the risk. But that SHE IS worth the risk. Yeah he said that. And yet he still didn't go through with her. I do believe this is the first time 100%.

 

Do you believe it as strongly as you once believed he'd never cheat on you in the first place?

 

Look Curly_locks, just don't allow emotion to cloud judgment. I can tell you, based on experience, every sentence coming out of his mouth right now is filled with half-truths and manipulations. Like every busted cheater, he'll say anything and everything based on what he thinks you want to hear. He's good at lying, been practicing for a year or more.

 

Just be careful. Find someone solidly on your side, a friend or family member, and bounce things off them. If it doesn't pass their smell test, it shouldn't pass yours...

 

Mr. Lucky

[ExpatInItaly]

Do you believe it as strongly as you once believed he'd never cheat on you in the first place?

 

That was my thought, too.

 

You don't know he's never cheated, OP. You trusted that he hasn't, but well, we can see your trust in him was misplaced at least on this occasion. And for a long time. Personally, I think he likely has. He's comfortable with lying to you and kept it up for quite some time. That doesn't usually come out of nowhere. As I said before, perhaps he's never used POF to cheat, but I would be surprised if he's never had a one-nighter or some such thing. He's apparently quite good and showing you only what he wants you to see, and getting you to believe it, considering you had no idea he was emotionally cheating for a very long time. And of course he would tell his crush he has never cheated- she wouldn't be interested in him otherwise.

 

Talk to him, yes. But don't assume he's now going to start telling the truth. He's the type of cheater who will only admit to what he can't possibly deny (in the face of evidence) so you need to be wise enough to realize he is likely going to feed you more half-truths.

 

The other issue is that even if you do forgive him, and he started being transparent, it doesn't solve the underlying problem that he's very emotionally checked out and doesn't respect you or your daughter. My prediction is that even if you wind up trying to stay together, the damage he's done to the landscape of your relationship will ultimately lead to the undoing of the relationship altogether. Moving forward, know that your relationship will be very different and you won't be able to go back to the way things were. In your mind, you will likely always think of your relationship in terms of pre-affair, and post-affair. It's a vastly different future ahead now.

Edited May 22, 2019 by ExpatInItaly

[elaine567]

No I know he hasn't cheated before. I've seen how he is around women who flirt with him, he never paid them attention, he shut them down.

That was for your benefit.

You don't know if he has cheated before or not. You are just assuming he hasn't.

Cheaters are not just naive little boys caught with their hand in the cookie jar, they are clever and cunning, do not underestimate him.

[Crazelnut]

I see how this is going to play out. You so desparately want to believe him and stay together that you will ignore every shred of evidence that deep down he is a master liar and manipulator. You are trying to find excuses or deflections, and you will stay with this liar.

 

Until you catch him doing it again. There is something fundamentally wrong with him that makes him a bad partner. Look at the levels of effort he put into deceiving you. Look at the horrible things he said about you when he thought you didn't know. Maybe he's insecure, maybe he's a narcissist, maybe he's just a garden variety asshat. Regardless, he will never be a trustworthy partner.

 

If you've read a few threads on LS, you know that he is operating straight from the cheater's handbook. Deny, then deflect, then blame shift, then promise to be good. I know because I was a cheater.

 

But you don't seem able (strong enough) to kick him to the curb. I feel bad for your daughter, because unless you can swallow a lifetime of disrespect, pain, and distrust, Mommy & Daddy will eventually split up anyway.

[Curly_locks]

You seem like a great woman and your life is certainly NOT a fail. You were betrayed and it's completely unfair. Relationships start and end, and this may be the end of yours, but that in no way makes you (or the relationship, frankly) a failure. If it ends, it was a mostly successful relationship that resulted in a daughter, but that ended in a bad way due to your partner's failings.

 

You have every right to be upset and angry as you process this. Don't hesitate to contact a counselor or even a crisis hotline if you need to.

 

Thanks mark, that is sweet. I will seek help if needed.

 

Do you believe it as strongly as you once believed he'd never cheat on you in the first place?

 

Ok no, I guess I can't. So not 100% but maybe 98%. I don't see why he would leave evidence of her, but not anyone else if he has done this with others. I really don't think he'd have one night stands. He could've got that on POF, but he ignored the forward women. I also believe he didn't meet her because being physical would've been crossing his line. Absolutely doesn't excuse what he has done. And my line is obviously way different to his.

 

Talk to him, yes. But don't assume he's now going to start telling the truth. He's the type of cheater who will only admit to what he can't possibly deny (in the face of evidence) so you need to be wise enough to realize he is likely going to feed you more half-truths.

 

I'm not going to blindly believe him. I'm just hoping I'll be able to tell when he's telling the truth. But I don't know. Maybe I am weak and nieve. I'm going to tell him that eventually he will be answering these same questions to a lie detector.

 

He called me 20 times in an hour this morning. And he text "you are throwing me away like I'm garbage, curly" I didn't answer anything. Since then I've installed an app to redirect his calls and text. For him it will go to voicemail I think, for me it doesn't ring but I can see he's called and read texts in a separate folder. Am I being unfair to ignore him? The sun is shining here. My mum is visiting me, she is trying to cheer me up with small talk. But I just still feel depressed.

[heartwhole2]

He called me 20 times in an hour this morning. And he text "you are throwing me away like I'm garbage, curly" I didn't answer anything.

 

He's trying to manipulate you into allowing him to disregard your boundaries. You are not throwing him away like garbage. You are reacting in a very natural way to the trauma of his lying and cheating. You have asked for space and he is not respecting your boundaries, just as he did not respect you when he signed up for POF "for fun" and sexted another woman with plans to meet up.

 

Don't let him turn this around on you so that you are chasing him, you are worried about him winding up sleeping with the OW, etc. If he does, then good riddance. If he thinks that you needing space means that he should have a full blown PA, then that says everything about him and nothing about you.

 

Hang in there.

Edited May 23, 2019 by a LoveShack.org Moderator

[elaine567]

And he text "you are throwing me away like I'm garbage, curly".

Some would say he is "garbage".

What kind of a man cheats on his gf and his 2yo daughter?

[Curly_locks]

He's trying to manipulate you into allowing him to disregard your boundaries. You are not throwing him away like garbage. You are reacting in a very natural way to the trauma of his lying and cheating. You have asked for space and he is not respecting your boundaries, just as he did not respect you when he signed up for POF "for fun" and sexted another woman with plans to meet up.

 

Don't let him turn this around on you so that you are chasing him, you are worried about him winding up sleeping with the OW, etc. If he does, then good riddance. If he thinks that you needing space means that he should have a full blown PA, then that says everything about him and nothing about you.

 

Hang in there.

 

So I am not wrong to ignore him? I know I hate being ignored. But I just want to have space until I speak to him in person. I feel like I should be able to do things my way right now after everything. But now I'm second guessing it. There's been times when he's been pissed with me for something and just ignore me for a while. He knows I HATE it. But he says afterwards that he needed "head space" well me too. I'll admit I am worried he might go to her if I leave it too long. I think he'd only physically meet her if he think we are over. I will text text him either later or tomorrow, just a simple text about taking our daughter out on Saturday, and afterwards us having a serious talk.

 

Some would say he is "garbage".

What kind of a man cheats on his gf and his 2yo daughter?

 

Yeah I text my best friend what he said. She said "well he is and you should" At first she thought maybe we could work things out. But I think now she's starting to think differently of him. Because she said he's being selfish af keep contacting me.

[mark clemson]

So I am not wrong to ignore him? I know I hate being ignored. But I just want to have space until I speak to him in person.

 

 

It's the first week after a Dday. Not only are you perfectly justified in ignoring him, he's frankly extremely lucky you're even thinking about ever speaking to him again. Some women wouldn't be. Ever.

[stillafool]

. I'll admit I am worried he might go to her if I leave it too long. I think he'd only physically meet her if he think we are over. I will text text him either later or tomorrow, just a simple text about taking our daughter out on Saturday, and afterwards us having a serious talk.

 

The fact that you are this worried that if you take too long to think about this he will go to her says you aren't secure with him and he's not to be taken back. Of course you will take him back but you shouldn't.

[elaine567]

Because she said he's being selfish af keep contacting me.

He is trying to bull doze and bully you into accepting him back.

[FMW]

Of course it's perfectly fine to ignore him.

 

He didn't worry too much about your feelings during this ongoing connection to this other woman. You are under no obligation to worry about his feelings about you ignoring him.

 

Don't keep your daughter from him, but there is no reason for you to have any contact with him you don't want. Honestly, it would be better for you to have no contact at all with him for a while so you have time to clear your head. But you have to do what you feel you have to do.

 

It's amazing how cheaters react with such outrage and hurt at the response they get when their partner finds out, as if they are owed a pass.

[Crazelnut]

Why can't you see ... HE IS NOT A PRIZE?! He is liar and a cheater. Why do you want him?? Why are you still considering HIS feelings? He sure didn't consider yours.

[d0nnivain]

Should I contact HER too? Send a msg? Or maybe a little visit to her work place.

 

It depends. Would you like to be arrested? Assuming the answer is no, have NC with her.

 

Maintain your dignity no matter what.

[Mr. Lucky]

I need to focus on getting answers from him first.

 

Again CL, this is your emotions deflecting the truth.

 

What answers do you need that you don't already have? And what could he tell you that you'd trust to be true?

 

He called me 20 times in an hour this morning.

 

Think about this tactic. It seems more manipulative than conciliatory...

 

Mr. Lucky

[aliveagain]

Your only contact with him should be limited to questions about your daughter and or finances, anything else will be his attempt to do damage control. Tell him he needs to write out a complete timeline of all his dating activities by the end of the weekend, how it started, who with, were there any meetings, were video's or photographs exchanged, was there any physical contact, etc. and that this is his one chance to tell you the truth. Don't tell him what you know and emphasize the importance of being honest no mater how much it hurts.

 

Let him know that any contact with the O/W will be doing you a favor because he will be making your decisions about your future easier and permanent. You need to have someone you trust to confide in, you need support. Remember, this man that is calling you 20 times a day had no hesitation to lie in bed next to you while arranging sex with another woman. This man brought a predator into the lives of you and your innocent daughter. He and the O/W have secrets hidden from you and you need to know every one of them so you can take any power the O/W has over him away from her. Please google the 180, it will help you to distance yourself from him so you make the right decisions about your future with him. Do not forgive him before you know all the truths.