Yet another success for the awkward chap

[Garcon1986]

Sometimes they just get a vibe that you are interested and are standoffish because they don't want to do anything to keep you going in that direction, so yeah, when that happens, just stop trying because they've already eliminated you. I wouldn't say that's a "me too" thing. I would say it's just a "not interested" thing and it may be amplified if it's in the workplace where women are often gossiped about if they even talk to a guy. Now, that's a "me too" thing in a way.

 

 

That's ridiculously unfair but is the way of the Wise and True Man =p Sometimes none of my characteristics are redeeming enough for someone to give me a chance.

[preraph]

I know, and it's true for many of us. I remember trying so hard to get a guy to notice me on several occasions. Finally, I saw him with a huge-chested woman and understood he didn't want a flat chested little college freshman and didn't want to do anything to "get me started."

 

It is brutal out there and you are in a unique situation where everything is more of a challenge because of people's ethnic preferences and you having grown up in a different culture and being attracted to that just like most people stay mostly within their own familiar culture or ethnicity. But you are in a profession where you can continue to meet quality people at least. And maybe getting to know someone slowly at work will one day make someone cross that bridge. I think you're an awfully good guy.

 

I just know you'd do better in a larger city known for having lots of cultures and blendy people who are all used to each other. Deep South has many spendors but isn't know for diversity!

[JuneL]

And so I did move far far away from her, it's just frustrating that I did everything a gentleman should but still got this "creep" reaction. Can't wait to leave the state.

 

I meant you should have picked up on her cue that she found the convo unpleasant and backed down accordingly right then and there. If you had done that, she wouldn’t have thought of you as the weird guy who insisted on dragging on the convo despite my most obvious signals.

[JuneL]

I know, and it's true for many of us. I remember trying so hard to get a guy to notice me on several occasions. Finally, I saw him with a huge-chested woman and understood he didn't want a flat chested little college freshman and didn't want to do anything to "get me started."

 

It is brutal out there and you are in a unique situation where everything is more of a challenge because of people's ethnic preferences and you having grown up in a different culture and being attracted to that just like most people stay mostly within their own familiar culture or ethnicity. But you are in a profession where you can continue to meet quality people at least. And maybe getting to know someone slowly at work will one day make someone cross that bridge. I think you're an awfully good guy.

 

I just know you'd do better in a larger city known for having lots of cultures and blendy people who are all used to each other. Deep South has many spendors but isn't know for diversity!

 

Again, I really think this culture thing is just an excuse. I am a very urban girl who grew up in one of the most urban metropolitan areas in the world and only like to live in a big city. I had lived a few years in a not-so-urban city in the States. While I was quite unique compared to the majority of the population there, I got along great with people: they liked me and would never in a million years think of me as some creep or weirdo. Garcon’s experience has much more to do with his social awkwardness, and some of his issues are universal.

[Garcon1986]

Indeed I'm quite well liked by the women at work, but when it comes to finding a date around here, it is in the top ten hardest challenges I ever worked through. I've been recommended to get to know one of the other cardiologists here because she is Thai and single, but one false accusation of impropriety will cost me my job.

 

 

 

 

I am eternally frustrated by people's desire for an edgy guy who is just the right combination of flirty and confident, and the simultaneous rules that have harsh consequences for me making any mistakes. Hence I have to live with slowly getting better at being "that hot guy", and be gentle to other while simultaneously being criticized for not being confident enough.

[chillii]

And so I did move far far away from her, it's just frustrating that I did everything a gentleman should but still got this "creep" reaction. Can't wait to leave the state.

 

 

 

 

Also, some women flatter themselves by acting something like this for no reason too, as if you were about to make a move when you both know it was nothing of a sort.

l did mess up one day though in that sort of a way. Went out to quote a job and we were talking and joking round on the veranda, sorta hit it off. She cracked a joke we laughed and l just messin playin round poked her in the ribs and she like sorta sprung back with a real look..

It was nothing, l've got 6 sisters we do shyt like that all the time, zero interest in her she wasn't even on the planet of someone l'd go for but she made like l was trying to touch her type look.

Felt like sayin don't flatter yourself girl stop acting like a princess your not even close to someone l'd have any interest in.

But things went weird after that of course and l didn't take the job l was quoting either, not my thing.

But l ouldn't believe the performance she put on, admittedly though of course l shouldn't have poke her like that , would've been a fun thing with anyone l know though but of course we didn't really know each other.

But still , talk about a drama queen.

Edited May 21, 2019 by chillii

[JuneL]

Garcon: You’re trying way too hard. Your trying to imitate the charming confident guy has backfired big time. While you should work hard in learning to read people’s cues much better, perhaps you want to feel embrace being the nerdy guy who is a little socially awkward. The right woman will come to you in the right setting.

[Garcon1986]

Garcon: You’re trying way too hard. Your trying to imitate the charming confident guy has backfired big time. While you should work hard in learning to read people’s cues much better, perhaps you want to feel embrace being the nerdy guy who is a little socially awkward. The right woman will come to you in the right setting.

 

I would tend to disagree if I have gotten two dates in a year? Being socially awkward has been a failure for me ever since 2012. I had to shape up or ship out.

[Eugeleh]

I would tend to disagree if I have gotten two dates in a year? Being socially awkward has been a failure for me ever since 2012. I had to shape up or ship out.

 

I'm struck by a few things when considering the sum-total of your posts.

 

It goes without saying that you're intelligent and have a decent career in front of you. You have considerable insight into your own strengths and weaknesses. Your response in the "creepy behavior" thread shows awareness of some key social norms in regards to dating. Women who've seen your pics have commented that you're decent looking.

 

So what gives? My best guess is that what gives is to be found in your synopsis of what dating coaches recommend. While reasonable, I suspect that following that advice may come across as contrived. If people around you sense that they aren't seeing the genuine article then they may turn away. I grant you that the cultural issues you bring up are also legit, but I have a feeling that may be secondary.

[JuneL]

I would tend to disagree if I have gotten two dates in a year? Being socially awkward has been a failure for me ever since 2012. I had to shape up or ship out.

 

I have no doubt being very socially awkward has hurt your dating life. But you are what you are. You may come across as a creep or a weirdo when you overdo things, which I suspect is what’s happening here. For example, you’re trying too hard to show off your sense of humor, but your jokes are usually flat (from the few examples you gave us previously). If you just embrace being the nerdy guy who is a little socially awkward, you might have a good chance of attracting women who are attracted to quiet introverts (usually those with a more outgoing personality), especially in settings where they can get to know you genetically. With your trying way too hard to act like a naturally charming man, these women don’t know what the deal is about you.

 

p.s. Have you asked different people to give you feedback on your online dating profile? I just can’t imagine any guy with decent looks (according to another poster who has seen your pic) and a supposedly good career prospect only got two dates in a year. There must be something very wrong with your profile or your online interactions with women.

Edited May 22, 2019 by JuneL

[guest569]

I don't really get this constant defensive position. Learn to take a rejection. Sometimes people just aren't interested for whatever reason. It is unfair to expect that any woman in the world will date you simply because you're a kind gentleman, whatever your interpretation of that is.

[Shining One]

While I was quite unique compared to the majority of the population there, I got along great with people: they liked me and would never in a million years think of me as some creep or weirdo. Garcon’s experience has much more to do with his social awkwardness, and some of his issues are universal.

The creep / weirdo threshold for a woman is significantly higher than it is for a man. You can't really compare your experiences to the OP's.

[thefooloftheyear]

The creep / weirdo threshold for a woman is significantly higher than it is for a man. You can't really compare your experiences to the OP's.

 

Agreed,...Heck most guys would entertain true sociopaths if they had a nice pair of tits...

 

TFY

[elaine567]

The creepiness factor has a lot to do with fear of coming to harm or a sexual threat, most men do not fear women or are concerned regarding sexual threat.

[Garcon1986]

I don't really get this constant defensive position. Learn to take a rejection. Sometimes people just aren't interested for whatever reason. It is unfair to expect that any woman in the world will date you simply because you're a kind gentleman, whatever your interpretation of that is.

 

 

I don't think most women have experienced hundreds of cumulative rejections in real life and on online dating?

 

 

I'll just keep on trying and hope for a pipe dream. I can improve on my gentleman's charm. I definitely disagree with the approach that one day "the right woman will find me". If I lived by that motto I wouldn't have had a shred more dating competence today than I did in 2012. I can count 2 total women who have approached me for dating and I couldn't keep things going because our backgrounds were way too different (classical Chinese upbringing versus overseas Chinese).

 

 

I've stopped going to night-time salsa and tried to start my own salsa club specifically because I have no flirting skills at 10:30PM when I am super tired. People expect a lovely conversation and I am totally exhausted by that point. It takes a lot of brains for me to do good flirting and instantaneously pick up on nonverbal cues in that scenario; it's a totally different skill than speaking with patients. I've had better luck being charming with women during the daytime.

[JuneL]

I’m definitely not saying you shouldn’t try anything to improve. But if you are far from being a naturally charismatic guy, trying to imitate him may make you look pathetic, and your sense of humor may come across as comical.

 

When I was in graduate school, there was this PhD student doing some hardcore science who was trying to pursue me. He’s the typical nerdy scientist who’s a little socially awkward. He’s a good guy, albeit not my type. But the worst of him happened when he was trying to say something funny which was not funny at all

 

Honestly I’m not sure to what extent one can improve his ability of reading cues.

[guest569]

I don't think most women have experienced hundreds of cumulative rejections in real life and on online dating?

 

Neither have most men.

 

I've experienced a tonne of rejections, which is what my post was about. I don't blame men as a whole for not desiring me, or the fact that harassment is illegal. I have found that with more experience, in spite of that cumulative rejection feel, I actually don't care as much anymore because my confidence and coping skills have developed over time.

 

So the point I was trying to make was.. Rejection is inevitable. So learn to deal with it better. You can't make everyone love you.

[JuneL]

Neither have most men

 

If he had this mindset, he would already be that confident guy

 

No confident guy would have to worry about when a woman would be offended, because he can read her well!

Edited May 26, 2019 by a LoveShack.org Moderator

[guest569]

If he had this mindset, he would already be that confident guy

 

But that's my mindset and I'm as awkward as they come.

 

Im not sure what comes first, or how you can develop the thick skin. But damn, blaming everyone else is not going to do it.

Edited May 26, 2019 by a LoveShack.org Moderator

[Garcon1986]

Everybody gets exhausted with this much rejection at some point

 

 

It's a difficult balance to follow, with the man's duty being to push as much as the woman is comfortable with, while simultaneously projecting an attitude of "I don't care what she thinks". You have to care somewhat if you want to be reasonably well received?

 

 

I'm done soapboxing. Thank you all for kicking me in the arse and reminding me to go forward and keep on trying. Onwards to my next rejection and hopefully piece of good news.

[preraph]

Women DO experience tons of rejection, most of them. It's just not the same scenario, rejection right up front. Instead they get guys playing them long enough to get sex who then ghost them. So women actually give up something in the process and are humiliated by that sometimes because they were fooled. It's a different type of rejection than just being told no or being ignored by someone you barely know. It's worse, really.

[elaine567]

It's a difficult balance to follow,

1) with the man's duty being to push as much as the woman is comfortable with, while 2) simultaneously projecting an attitude of "I don't care what she thinks". You have to care somewhat if you want to be reasonably well received?

 

Seems to me those two extremes are well, extremes, maybe you need to ramp them both back a bit.

I certainly do not want to be pushed to my limit of comfort by some guy I don't know nor do I want to see a don't care attitude either.

[Garcon1986]

Yet quite a few here have been praising the confident man who walks up and has a little bit of the "I don't mind too much what you think, I'll impress you and have a great conversation" attitude?

[gaius]

I honestly don't know what to make of you sometimes Garcon. You seem to be intellectually curious about all these subjects that the majority of people have no interest in but when it comes to human and romantic communication, it's almost like your curiosity ceases.

 

For example, if I were in your position I'd be racking my brain to figure out what I did to make that nurse so standoffish with me. Thinking about every second of my communication with her, what I could have done wrong and how to not cause that reaction again ever. I'd be brainstorming topics of conversation based on situation to approach women with. Trying them out, seeing what works and what doesn't, then learning and growing with the results. With you though it's just like shrug, on to the next rejection. Where's the next girl I can chat with about rice production in the Nile Delta?

 

Maybe with you it just comes down to a real desire thing. The idea of having someone to talk to about what you're thinking appeals to you, but the more primal and sexual aspect of being with a woman isn't your thing. With me no matter how tired I am my body summons energy to talk and do other things with my wife, because my body has a primal urge to reproduce with her. And if you don't have those primal urges for a woman she can usually sense that, which might be another thing that's harming you in your interactions.

 

Anyway, food for thought. Our actions and reactions to things can usually tell us a lot about ourselves and what we really want. If we spend enough time paying real attention to them.

[Shining One]

It's a different type of rejection than just being told no or being ignored by someone you barely know. It's worse, really.

Having experienced both types of rejection, I'd have to disagree. I prefer it when a woman rejects me after a few dates and sex rather than before. Of course, I have far, far more experience with rejection from the start, so that probably affects my point of view.