Had a break up over something I did. Is she over reacting?

[MrWobblyTickle]

The difference is consent. She consented to a weekend of crazy sex. She didn't consent to being fondled when she was asleep. If a man can't possibly know if it's OK or not, he needs to have a discussion about it. "Hey, how do you feel about being woken by me caressing your bits?" It's really not that hard.

 

She did say to me that consent was the issue here but I still find it odd she waited 2 to 3 days before she said anything to me and continued to act normal with me until suddenly ending it over text. I understand she didn’t like it but it was morning and I had hoped she would find it pleasurable or at the worst just say no or move my hand away. She could of even asked me to leave afterwards if it were that big a deal.

 

Also at what point was I going to bring up that question to her? What I did was spontaenous and came from a place of wanting to initiate intimacy. I had no ill intentions or malice. I really care about this girl.

[MrWobblyTickle]

anybody giving you that bad a time over a misunderstanding is not relationship material

 

I agree she has made me feel awful about it all and I think all it required was for us to sit down and agree it wouldn’t happen again. I mean she has clearly decided it is a big issue for her and that is her decision and I respect that. I do think there is more at play here though than just this.

 

Last time I saw her I made a comment about being hers and she said who knows for how much longer and also she would not disclose when her time off work was to me when we were together. She then told me when her time off was once we had broken up. So I think she had plans to get rid of me and used this as the ultimate excuse.

[elaine567]

She did say to me that consent was the issue here but I still find it odd she waited 2 to 3 days before she said anything to me and continued to act normal with me until suddenly ending it over text.

Trouble is "triggers" may not cause instant reactions. There is a lot of stuff hidden away in an abuse victim's mind. She may have thought she was fine, or she managed to damp it all down and then suddenly got flooded with feelings and memories.

It is about loss of control here as emeraldgreen pointed out, you betrayed her trust by acting without her consent. She ended it as she could not trust you any more, although she may also have realised the wild sex was just her acting out her abuse and so was not keen to get into that regularly.

This is not just about abuse victims though, acting sexually without consent is no longer acceptable and could land you in more trouble than just being dumped by text.

[Tamfana]

She did say to me that consent was the issue here but I still find it odd she waited 2 to 3 days before she said anything to me and continued to act normal with me until suddenly ending it over text. ....

 

She may have been processing it and in a dilemma about whether it was right or not, questioning herself, embarrassed, fearful, angry, and confused- any number of thoughts and emotions. When someone has been trusted enough to sleep beside you, a violation of that trust and questioning your safety can be jarring, and it can take time to process and to make a decision about.

[Redhead14]

I still find it strange how she waited a few days before she said anything. I thought something this bad would initiate an immediate response.

 

You should educate yourself about childhood sexual abuse. Those children are often conditioned to keep their mouths shut about whatever was going on and that often carries over into adulthood especially if it had never been dealt with as a child. A person will carry that secret to the grave if they can. Only the very fortunate of victims will get help and move forward in their lives with healthy coping skills. At the time of the incident, she dissociated herself from the feelings it brought up. It's a disgusting, sickening feeling and the immediate response usually is to push it down, shut it off/out. That is dissociation. It's a survival tool/coping mechanism.

 

It is not surprising that she didn't address it immediately at all. I should also add that the intensity of the response she had is also a sign that her dissociative tendency/coping mechanism is beginning to break down. She may be getting to an age where that is no longer useful to her, in which case, she will begin experiencing flashbacks and the memories and feelings long avoided may come flooding back. It could take a few more years, but it will likely happen. Very often as an abused child grows up, the mind begins to heal. It gets to a point where it can can handle what's been buried and will begin to process it. As a child, all that is overwhelming to them mentally and emotionally. It's outside of their ability to comprehend and deal with. When they get older and depending on a few things, the mind matures and is able to deal with it but it happens in bits and pieces so that the person isn't completely overwhelmed. It is still very intense just the same.

Edited May 25, 2019 by Redhead14

[MrWobblyTickle]

You should educate yourself about childhood sexual abuse. Those children are often conditioned to keep their mouths shut about whatever was going on and that often carries over into adulthood especially if it had never been dealt with as a child. A person will carry that secret to the grave if they can. Only the very fortunate of victims will get help and move forward in their lives with healthy coping skills. At the time of the incident, she dissociated herself from the feelings it brought up. It's a disgusting, sickening feeling and the immediate response usually is to push it down, shut it off/out. That is dissociation. It's a survival tool/coping mechanism.

 

It is not surprising that she didn't address it immediately at all. I should also add that the intensity of the response she had is also a sign that her dissociative tendency/coping mechanism is beginning to break down. She may be getting to an age where that is no longer useful to her, in which case, she will begin experiencing flashbacks and the memories and feelings long avoided may come flooding back. It could take a few more years, but it will likely happen. Very often as an abused child grows up, the mind begins to heal. It gets to a point where it can can handle what's been buried and will begin to process it. As a child, all that is overwhelming to them mentally and emotionally. It's outside of their ability to comprehend and deal with. When they get older and depending on a few things, the mind matures and is able to deal with it but it happens in bits and pieces so that the person isn't completely overwhelmed. It is still very intense just the same.

 

When put like that it makes sense that she reacted the way she did. I honestly had no idea. I mean it is speculation but if it is the case then I think I have stumbled across a hidden trauma. I have never felt so bad about something in my life. I told her the other day how bad I feel about it and I would never do it again. She has offered me her friendship and forgiveness and we are going to take time before we reach out again. Is there anything I can do to make this right? I never had malicious intent I just wanted to give her an erotic awakening. I was naive and thought she would like it. I’m lucky she even spoke to me the other day.

[Rayce]

She may not even remember the abuse and acts out in ignorance….

 

Redhead14 post is spot on! As a survivor of childhood sexual assault this pretty much describes what happened to me. I was 7 years old when it happened by a teenager down the street. Honestly I was so young I really had no clue what happened to me. It was so traumatic that I buried deep inside and didn't remember until I was in my 40's. I had large memory gaps... in my life... I still have memory gaps... A homeless man triggered my memories and that caused my one and only panic attacked... that sent me back to therapy. The incident cause all these lost memories to come flooding back. It's been over 10 years since all that happened and I'm still learning how to cope. I am glad I had my break through.... it has allowed me to heal. Only now am I finally able to talk about it... but I think that is because both my parents are dead now.

 

Childhood Sexual Assault is a lifetime sentence of dysfunction.

Edited May 25, 2019 by Rayce

[ExpatInItaly]

OP, to be fair, I don't think making this one specific incident "right" will do anything to get the relationship back on track. It might clear the air with her and ease tension, but I don't think there was a future here anyway. You seem to be underestimating the significance of all the other problems that existed before the break-up as well.

 

It is very clear from what you write that she is attracted to women in a way that would likely spell the end of your relationship with her. That isn't something you can do anything about and I think you need to realize that you two didn't really have the foundation for anything solid to begin with.

[MrWobblyTickle]

OP, to be fair, I don't think making this one specific incident "right" will do anything to get the relationship back on track. It might clear the air with her and ease tension, but I don't think there was a future here anyway. You seem to be underestimating the significance of all the other problems that existed before the break-up as well.

 

It is very clear from what you write that she is attracted to women in a way that would likely spell the end of your relationship with her. That isn't something you can do anything about and I think you need to realize that you two didn't really have the foundation for anything solid to begin with.

 

Well I spoke to her face to face and she didn’t want to get back together. She said she can forgive but not forget and a friendship may be possible in the future. That is something I guess. Whether that happens or not will have to wait and see. The first time we broke up she did say who knows 5 or 6 months time you might be coming out with me and my friends and that happened. So it isn’t out the realms of possibility but this time I have been blocked on Facebook and deleted on snapchat. This time I have made a big mistake so if she doesn’t come back that makes sense.

 

Yeah I did think to myself while I was with her all it would take is a woman with a personality she liked and who was attracted to her would be enough to end things. I care about her so much and want the best for her. Never meant to upset her. I am just confused as she would hold my hand, kiss me, cuddle me and have sex with me. I just don’t get how she could do that if she only wants a woman.

[Redhead14]

This is very common. She is confused sexually. It's very likely that a man abused her. So it's confusing to her to have feelings for a man. They will have sexual feelings for men, but it doesn't make sense to want that with a man "because men hurt me". They will try to have a relationship with men because it seems natural, but if one or more of them hurt them, they will shy away. SA victims sometimes develop a preference for women because of that. A man hurt me, maybe a woman won't.

 

It's not unusual.

[MrWobblyTickle]

This is very common. She is confused sexually. It's very likely that a man abused her. So it's confusing to her to have feelings for a man. They will have sexual feelings for men, but it doesn't make sense to want that with a man "because men hurt me". They will try to have a relationship with men because it seems natural, but if one or more of them hurt them, they will shy away. SA victims sometimes develop a preference for women because of that. A man hurt me, maybe a woman won't.

 

It's not unusual.

 

I hate to think I am now considered to be one of those men that hurt her. She trusted me and would cuddle up and sleep with me and I did something stupid without thinking. I really wish I could undo it. I wanted to be the guy who protected her and took care of her. I should just put my arm around her and kissed her on the forehead. Just in the moment I felt like initating sex and went for it. Now I am paying the price for it.

[Rayce]

I hate to think I am now considered to be one of those men that hurt her. She trusted me and would cuddle up and sleep with me and I did something stupid without thinking. I really wish I could undo it. I wanted to be the guy who protected her and took care of her. I should just put my arm around her and kissed her on the forehead. Just in the moment I felt like initating sex and went for it. Now I am paying the price for it.

 

I'm sorry your hurting from this experience. You seem very remorseful and I am sorry she can't move pass that. Honestly… I am not really sure what is going on with her. I read your post last night and had nightmares about it. Her sexual preference is just out right scary IMO! I'm not sure I agree with turning to woman because of past abuse either... I didn't turn to women and I have several friend who are also survivors. They didn't turn to women either.... I wonder what the stats are on that? Maybe she just likes to punish men... seems based on her sexual preferences... what you did really seems to go along with what she likes so don't be too hard on yourself. You are not responsible for her hang ups. You learned something that the next woman will benefit from going forward.

 

Peace

[JuneL]

I want to say that this statement pissed me off to a spectacular degree. Unwanted and unexpected touch from anyone is never OK, ever! And, it doesn't matter that the "offending" person didn't think it was a big deal. What matters is that the person who was touched thinks it's a big deal. And, that is likely what set her off -- his cavalier attitude about it instead of apologizing and understanding.

 

It is highly likely that this girl experience childhood sexual abuse. That's very sad.

 

I don’t disagree with this. But her hitting his penis when he couldn’t have an erection was no less of an assault.

[Redhead14]

I don’t disagree with this. But her hitting his penis when he couldn’t have an erection was no less of an assault.

 

It was an assault. It doesn't excuse that. However, it is not intended or understood by her to be an assault in her mind. She is likely mirroring behavior of her abuser(s). Lack of cooperation may result in rough treatment, pain, etc. An odd dichotomy is often created in those experiences.

[JuneL]

It was an assault. It doesn't excuse that. However, it is not intended or understood by her to be an assault in her mind. She is likely mirroring behavior of her abuser(s). Lack of cooperation may result in rough treatment, pain, etc. An odd dichotomy is often created in those experiences.

 

But the same can be said of the OP’s fondling her while she was asleep: It was not intended or understood by him to be an assault in his mind.

 

OP: You have apologized profusely so many times for what you did to her. I was wondering if you should also tell her what she did to you had crossed the line big time.

Edited May 25, 2019 by JuneL

[MrWobblyTickle]

But the same can be said of the OP’s fondling her while she was asleep: It was not intended or understood by him to be an assault in his mind.

 

OP: You have apologized profusely so many times for what you did to her. I was wondering if you should also tell her what she did to you had crossed the line big time.

 

I had my chance to say but didn’t say anything. We have agreed to take a few months apart doing our own things so I can’t unfortunately message her bringing it up. If we speak in the future and the subject comes up just to get it out the way I will have a chance to mention it then. After my last talk with her I pretty much took on the blame for everything. I felt I had to. She said it has affected her mental health and it was the worst thing I could of done. So I felt obliged to take the blame. I am a very sensitive person so that is why I just wanted to make amends.

[MrWobblyTickle]

Hey all I am getting a little better each day and appreciate all the replies. It is still playing on my mind and I still feel bad about it. I am also starting to feel like I was used to help with the move and this has been used to get rid of me. I still miss her and want her back. I know I made a mistake but I wasn’t given a chance to learn from it.

 

One thing that I thought of was if she is a victim of sexual abuse. Surely she wouldn’t of wanted to meet with me last Monday and talk to me face to face? Yes she sat away from me but surely any face to face interaction would be too much?

[ExpatInItaly]

One thing that I thought of was if she is a victim of sexual abuse. Surely she wouldn’t of wanted to meet with me last Monday and talk to me face to face? Yes she sat away from me but surely any face to face interaction would be too much?

 

OP, it is conjecture at this point that she suffered sexual abuse in her past. Nobody here can assert with absolute certainty that this is true. Only she knows that.

 

You thus can't rely on that conclusion to be behind all of this. All you can do is assume she is being honest that this was the straw that broke the camel's back for her and the relationship is over.

 

Trying to frame her current behaviour as a sexual abuse survivor is therefore futile right now. She has never confirmed this to be the case. Maybe it's true, maybe it's not. Leave that line of thinking alone unless and until she opens the door to a conversation about it. Now your only job is to work on accepting that this wasn't going to be your relationship of a lifetime.

[MrWobblyTickle]

@ExpatInItaly

 

That is true it is all conjecture. There is no way of knowing either way if it happened or not. I just hope it isn’t the case.

 

I just keep thinking if I hadn’t of done that we would still be together and we’d be fine now. I hate that my actions killed this relationship. I’m also worrying that she is seeing a new guy or girl. I care about her so much and have apologised so much and told her it wouldn’t happen again but she won’t take me back or talk to me. I’m on anti depressents because of this and i’m struggling with day to day basics. Biggest regret of my life. I’m just sat here hoping she will get in contact.

[elaine567]

You are still trying to justify your actions, defending the indefensible, trying to shift the blame.

Whether she was a victim of sexual abuse is moot, your action in law was one of assault, that is the bottom line.

[JuneL]

Both of them have done something to each other that is technically sexual assault in the legal sense. They’re better off not with each other. I also agree with Expat that whether she’s a sexual abuse victim is pure speculation and it a moot point now.

[ExpatInItaly]

I just keep thinking if I hadn’t of done that we would still be together and we’d be fine now..

 

This is your ego talking. It helps to feel that you were in the driver's seat of the relationship, and thus could take steps to make it all better again, but I think you are still very much in denial. There were a lot of issues here that were out of your hands altogether.

 

There were big problems between you two and everything wasn't fine before this specific incident even occurred. I know you are having trouble seeing this right now, but this relationship did not have the legs to go the distance.

[Redhead14]

@ExpatInItaly

 

That is true it is all conjecture. There is no way of knowing either way if it happened or not. I just hope it isn’t the case.

 

I just keep thinking if I hadn’t of done that we would still be together and we’d be fine now. I hate that my actions killed this relationship. I’m also worrying that she is seeing a new guy or girl. I care about her so much and have apologised so much and told her it wouldn’t happen again but she won’t take me back or talk to me. I’m on anti depressents because of this and i’m struggling with day to day basics. Biggest regret of my life. I’m just sat here hoping she will get in contact.

 

 

Whatever is going on with her, it's clearly a significant issue(s). I promise you that this relationship would always be difficult for you. Her issues and how to deal with them as a partner are well outside of your skill set to be of any value toward "fixing" it. If that event didn't happen, you would still be struggling. Keep moving.

[MrWobblyTickle]

Hey all. Not sure if anyone will read this but an update.

 

I saw her on Plenty Of Fish about a week after she told me she wasn’t looking for anyone. We had a back and forth about it over text and ended up talking on the phone. She said she missed me and loved me. We talked about what happened and she explained an ex had done that to her and that she has had issues with the men in her life. We agreed it would not happen again.

 

So I went and saw her June 2nd. We spoke and set boundaries. Agreed to get back together and she said she wanted something long term. She was all over me like nothing had happened between us. She also said she would let people know we’re back together.

Her flatmate came home early and we explained we are back together.

 

Back to the phonecalls and I love you from her throughout the week. All back to normal. See her the following weekend. 8th and 9th June. All normal and we go back to having sex. She is very sexual with me that weekend.

 

Following Friday 14th I go to see her before she goes away on holiday. Seems fine with me and normal. We have sex that night but she says she hurts halfway through so I put a stop to it. We speak afterwards and she tells me how her dad use to beat her and her siblings.

 

Wake up the next day. She doesn’t want to really talk to me or want me near her. Exactly how she was last year when I broke up with her. All day she is off with me. I get her to talk to me and she tells me she is gay again. She says she will always prefer women. She says she wants me in her life as her male best friend and that she loves me and misses me but in the sense of just friends. I agreed to be friends.

 

I stayed the night on a separate mattress and she went off on holiday and sent me pictures and videos of the holiday.

 

We stayed in touch and agreed to meet up the weekend 29th and 30th June. We just hung out and played video games and watched TV. We get on very well when hanging out. It got late so I ended up staying. We talked for over an hour about everything. I said how this had made me feel and that I still love her and care about her. She said she cares about me too but she just wants to be with women. She doesn’t want a man.

 

She told me how outspoken her dad was about her sexuality and now she has moved out she can do what she wants. I think I was used to keep her entertained while she was living at home. Her dad ignored her when she was with a girl previously. She got fairly teary eyed during this conversation.

 

She said the next girl will be lucky to have me and that she doesn’t deserve my friendship. She admitted she used me to work out who she was and she knows she has hurt me.

She said she will be gutted if I wasn’t in her life.

She said I can be the best man at her wedding. I have noticed this pattern of saying weird things like that.

 

We then agreed to be friends but I have said if I need space I will let her know. Afterwards I was an idiot and asked if we could have sex one more time. She sat there and didn’t say no but was unsure. I said if she didn’t want to we won’t. We sat quietly for a bit and then she agreed. Saying be passionate and no talking. We had sex for a bit and then she stopped it saying it felt wrong as she only likes women.

 

She was totally cool about the sex and I said I was worried it would change things but she said it doesn’t and she knows how it feels to be horny and wanting it. So we’re all good there.

 

Woke up the next day she was normal with me and we watched TV and had a laugh. I left at 1pm Sunday on good terms. We have messaged a little back and forth since.

 

I know she is already talking to someone new. A girl called Kayleigh I think. She kept making sure I couldn’t see her phone screen when I was hanging out with her and i’ve noticed she is on Whatsapp till late.

 

I am now depressed and seeking psychiatric help. I plan to go back to the gym, learn to drive, take up a martial art and join the police.

 

I don’t think she will ever change. She’ll jump from partner to partner just sleeping about and not being able to maintain a relationship. She doesn’t look after herself and never will. I have encouraged her to get back on her anti depressants and seek professional help but she seems reluctant.

 

Will just have to see how this friendship goes as we get on well just hanging out and talking but a relationship is a big no no for us.

 

That has shown me that the touching thing wasn’t a big deal after all and she blew it way out of proportion. We got past it and she still finds a reason to dump me.

 

Thank you for your time.

[d0nnivain]

While the groping may have been an excuse, this woman dumped you because try as she might, she's just not into men. she keeps coming back & denying her true attraction to other women. I feel bad for her because she's acting like somebody who is not comfy in her own skin.

 

A relationship between you will never work. even if you two are OK with it, her new GF is not going to be happy about the straight EX hanging around.