In a rough place - thoughts appreciated

[finna]

Their family situation has changed, their child is now in school and they can no longer travel with your MM. Just in time for your great 'love' affair', what a coincidence... If I was his wife we would be having hard discussions about new jobs, career changes, it's time to stay closer to home.

 

Going by what you yourself have written this man is not good to his wife, he is away from home most the year, works to avoid her, sounds emotionally distant and wants to set her up a career, which will reduce alimony. BTW every time you say you're not going to be detrimental about his wife you follow up by saying something completely detrimental about her.

 

Do you travel as much as MM?

 

I travel 25-35% of the time... not quite as much.

[finna]

No doubt that I am in love with my idea or perception of him. I would say that’s probably true for most people’s relationships... we rarely know 100% of everything about a person.

 

As far as whether he wants to focus solely on his marriage without me in the picture - that may be. I’ll know for sure in the next few days. If that’s the case this is all a fairly moot discussion.

 

 

I’m sorry, but I find this post somewhat funny. Please forgive me if what I am about to say sounds harsh. Reality often is.

 

You say she is ‘in love with the idea of him”.

Edited June 5, 2019 by a LoveShack.org Moderator

[PhoenixRising8]

Does this mean if he wants to focus on his marriage (to the extent that's possible with a third party in the picture) while keeping you in the mix also, are you OK with that? It sounds like you might be as you're leaving that up to him. Maybe I haven't understood properly.

[finna]

I think they are having those discussions. He also loves his job as it is currently his primary identity - he has a very different work personality - an assertive leader who is well-liked and respected and has no problem engaging in rigorous discourse and fighting for what he wants. I think he is very afraid of losing that particular identity.

 

 

Their family situation has changed, their child is now in school and they can no longer travel with your MM. Just in time for your great 'love' affair', what a coincidence... If I was his wife we would be having hard discussions about new jobs, career changes, it's time to stay closer to home.

 

Going by what you yourself have written this man is not good to his wife, he is away from home most the year, works to avoid her, sounds emotionally distant and wants to set her up a career, which will reduce alimony. BTW every time you say you're not going to be detrimental about his wife you follow up by saying something completely detrimental about her.

 

Do you travel as much as MM?

[Jhm42]

I wouldn’t be surprised if she gets pregnant in the next few months to further this goal (again, not being derogatory- just observing potential behavior based on what I’ve witnessed so far).

 

Or because she wants another child and should be allowed to think about that with her husband?

 

But not only is he making her feel crazy by denying what she suspects, he’s taking no steps to prevent their further entanglement in the form of another pregnancy and child? Not to state the obvious, but she can’t get pregnant on her own. He has choices. If he’s not making them, that should tell you something.

[finna]

Does this mean if he wants to focus on his marriage (to the extent that's possible with a third party in the picture) while keeping you in the mix also, are you OK with that? It sounds like you might be as you're leaving that up to him. Maybe I haven't understood properly.

 

I am not entirely sure - I’m trying to process what I want. Ideally we would be legit of course. I don’t know if I’m okay with anything else or not... I don’t want to be in some weird in between where we say we are friends only but then have benefits when we travel together... whatever we are needs to be understood and embraced by both of us - which is more than likely me saying come and find me if/when you are free.

[finna]

Or because she wants another child and should be allowed to think about that with her husband?

 

But not only is he making her feel crazy by denying what she suspects, he’s taking no steps to prevent their further entanglement in the form of another pregnancy and child? Not to state the obvious, but she can’t get pregnant on her own. He has choices. If he’s not making them, that should tell you something.

 

No doubt. That would tell much.

[PhoenixRising8]

I am not entirely sure - I’m trying to process what I want. Ideally we would be legit of course. I don’t know if I’m okay with anything else or not... I don’t want to be in some weird in between where we say we are friends only but then have benefits when we travel together... whatever we are needs to be understood and embraced by both of us - which is more than likely me saying come and find me if/when you are free.

 

Well, you appear to be getting at least as much as she is getting from him. You are in effect, the sister wife, the one that gets the fun while she has the real chores.

 

As for friends, no. Once you cross the line, friends is not what you are. The nature of friendships is not secret and a large part of your relationship is just that - secret.

Edited June 3, 2019 by LilKatKat

[finna]

Well, you appear to be getting at least as much as she is getting from him. You are in effect, the sister wife, the one that gets the fun while she has the real chores.

 

At the moment I am getting nothing. I am traveling in his city and he is home with the family with no extra effort to see me. I’m not complaining - he should be with his family while he is home. We have texted a bit while he was at work today. But I think it is a pretty good indication of the current state of things.

[finna]

Well, you appear to be getting at least as much as she is getting from him. You are in effect, the sister wife, the one that gets the fun while she has the real chores.

 

As for friends, no. Once you cross the line, friends is not what you are. The nature of friendships is not secret and a large part of your relationship is just that - secret.

 

I would actually be glad to legitimize our relationship as friends in many ways if it were possible. Like - being able to call or text just like any other friend or colleague about regular stuff. That would certainly require some specific boundaries and I know we are not there yet.

[pepperbird]

which is more than likely me saying come and find me if/when you are free.

 

 

I hope you don't wait around for him.

Why do you need him in your life anyway?

[BaileyB]

She also is very in love with the idea of him I think (obviously she doesn’t know or is in denial of his full character).

 

His is somewhat amusing to me, that you would say this and not have the insight to know that this also reflects your current state of being... Pot - kettle. Except, she is legally bound to the man and thus, has a different investment in the man than you do.

 

She suspects something is going on though and her response has been to work even harder to keep him around.

 

I have to wonder if this is the reason for the recent turn of events. She would have to be a fool not to be suspicious.

 

I also wouldn’t be surprised though if once she starts working, gains some confidence, and meets new people, as well as matures a little if she would move on from him.

 

Projecting, are we? Wouldn’t that be ideal for you if this was to happen... Let’s just say, she hasn’t gone anywhere yet. Only time will tell.

[BaileyB]

I would actually be glad to legitimize our relationship as friends in many ways if it were possible. Like - being able to call or text just like any other friend or colleague about regular stuff. That would certainly require some specific boundaries and I know we are not there yet.

 

No, you are definitely not there yet.

 

Let me ask you this - if your husband wanted to be “friends” with his former affair partner, what would you think of that plan?

[finna]

I hope you don't wait around for him.

Why do you need him in your life anyway?

 

We have a lot of fun together. We take care of each other when we are together and support each other when we are apart. The time I spend with him is very joyful and I feel like I can be completely myself. He teaches me a lot about things I’ve not yet learned and makes me smile and laugh myself silly.

[Aloha123]

OMG nothing makes my eyes glaze over faster than when a thread starts to focus on the details of the MM, his life, his wife, etc.

Who the f cares??

I get that talking about him to a certain degree is aimed at snapping the OP out of her denial, but since every OW's FAVORITE topic is the MM and his life and their relationship, it always feels slightly enabling to me.

I mean, I would love for nothing more than to dissect my MM's marriage, his motivations, what he does everyday, the ways in which I am convinced that he actually cares about me, but does any of that really matter. The bottom line is that every day over the past two years he chose her over me. Period. Case closed. The end.

[finna]

No, you are definitely not there yet.

 

Let me ask you this - if your husband wanted to be “friends” with his former affair partner, what would you think of that plan?

 

My ex can do whatever he likes. He is friends with lots of people - male and female. Hypothetically- if I was married and didn’t know someone was an AP, I wouldn’t think to have any issues with that person.

[finna]

OMG nothing makes my eyes glaze over faster than when a thread starts to focus on the details of the MM, his life, his wife, etc.

Who the f cares??

I get that talking about him to a certain degree is aimed at snapping the OP out of her denial, but since every OW's FAVORITE topic is the MM and his life and their relationship, it always feels slightly enabling to me.

I mean, I would love for nothing more than to dissect my MM's marriage, his motivations, what he does everyday, the ways in which I am convinced that he actually cares about me, but does any of that really matter. The bottom line is that every day over the past two years he chose her over me. Period. Case closed. The end.

 

I was a little surprised people cared so much about the details. I do appreciate all the perspectives though - it is helpful in processing in this early phase.

[finna]

So he intends to stay married and wants to NOT feel guilty in his marriage.

 

So really - the ONLY way to do that is to no longer have an affair with himright?

 

Can you respect his wishes?

 

He has flip flopped and been inconsistent in his wishes many times in the last few weeks. When we have a chance to talk in person later this week and I find out where his head is at - yes I will support him with where he wants to be, and also talk with him about my boundaries.

[Aloha123]

I was a little surprised people cared so much about the details. I do appreciate all the perspectives though - it is helpful in processing in this early phase.

 

 

Yeah it's helpful at first, to shake yourself out of denial. But I notice that if anything this feedback just makes the OP/OW start to stick up for him and the situation. Which is the last thing you should be doing.

[finna]

I wonder how you would have felt about someone - an OW henching in on your marriage/husband this way while you thought you were connected to him while married?

 

You two are pulling a fast one on his wife. That’s very unkind.

 

Yes - I would rather her know and make her own decisions on the situation. There is no going back to pre-affair land at this point. But MM is unlikely to tell her and I don’t feel it’s my place to do so.

[Starswillshine]

Phew, this was a long read.

 

Many posters have already discussed some of the gentle things I would have brought up, so I apologize if this posts comes off strictly harsh.

 

If you guys were to end up in a legitimate relationship, which one of you amazing parents will rip your kid away from a parent? Just curious. Because you live 5000 miles apart.

 

My xWH conducted his affairs this way. He traveled a lot. So he had LD OWs. He couldnt handle being alone. How weak and pathetic is that?

 

His main OW knew about me. Though, he never gave her false hope that they would be together, he did give her false hope of always being the OW (she wanted that). And I guess possible had I not found out. I fount out, I divorced him. He HATES OW.

 

But back to the parenting thing. My xWH makes everyone believe he is the greatest dad in the world. And like he is so awesome helping me (and he has done a lot of house projects for me). But... he moved an hour away when I kicked him out. A good parent would have stayed closer to be there for his young children who are dealing with a new reality. I have NEVER stopped him from seeing the kids. In fact, I encourage it. He never asked for more than every other weekend. I put in the papers that he could have them for dinner one night a week. You know what? When he has them, he is so awesome and hands on. And when he doesnt, they do not exist to him. He never takes them out for that dinner. He never calls them. He goes 12 days straight without any word from them. But everyone would believe he is the father of the year.

 

If your MM would be willing to move away from his child, I would definitely say he is NOT a good father. Even though my XWH has not been a great father, I would never move them away from him. I was upset for my kids when he moved an hour away. I dont have to have permission from him to move out of state, but in would not. So much so... that my BF got a promotion that would move him 16 hours away. Without calling me about it, he turned it down. I remember him calling me and telling me about the offer. It was 6 figures more money. And I remember being so happy for him but sick knowing what it meant for our relationship. He just said, "Babe, I appreciate your happiness for me, but I turned it down. Because I cant lose you and I know you would not move the kids way from <xH>, and I would never be involved with a woman who would." And yes, I would never. I fully plan that one day my BF and I will get married. But had he moved, we would be over.

[PhoenixRising8]

He has flip flopped and been inconsistent in his wishes many times in the last few weeks. When we have a chance to talk in person later this week and I find out where his head is at - yes I will support him with where he wants to be, and also talk with him about my boundaries.

 

Trust me, he will change his tune many times, until you make a final decision. Once they establish a pattern of flip flopping, they rarely stop.

[Turning point]

Yes - I would rather her know and make her own decisions on the situation. There is no going back to pre-affair land at this point. But MM is unlikely to tell her and I don’t feel it’s my place to do so.

 

You also need to realize that you've drawn a false contingency between his marriage and your future.

 

This affair has continued long enough that it will eventually end his marriage, whether he wants that or not. The end of his marriage however, is also more likely to end his association with you than to send him running into your arms.

 

Your premise is that his marriage was bad and therefore the two of you "fell in love" (struck up an affair.) The more likely truth is that he has affairs and that is why his marriage is bad.

 

It's comical to watch, but my ex learned the hard way. She found out she wasn't the only OW to her MM. Apparently, true love also comes in a six pack. MM learned she also wasn't a one trick pony herself - and each of them condemned the other for their treachery.

Edited June 3, 2019 by Turning point

[Turning point]

Once they establish a pattern of flip flopping, they rarely stop.

 

It's not a flip-flop. It's day and night. Like the old stockade forts on the frontier:

 

You open the stockade gates during the day, allowing the traders in to share their goods. Then you close them at night to keep out the riff-raff and undesirables.

 

By day he trades on his mistress, and at night he shutters the fort against all invaders. There's no flip or flop - just a very well timed security plan.

[finna]

Thanks for all the comments. With regard to logistics we would establish two home bases as we already spend significant time in each other’s cities. Honestly we would see our kids just as much if not more than we do now with travel, which for me is having my son 50%. The kids would spend time in both places as makes sense with school, etc. and they both love to travel. That is one part that worries me the least.

 

One of the primary reasons I have emphasized that if MM leaves he must do it for him and not for me is the resentment piece. I know that can be a very real thing.

 

 

If you guys were to end up in a legitimate relationship, which one of you amazing parents will rip your kid away from a parent? Just curious. Because you live 5000 miles apart.

 

My xWH conducted his affairs this way. He traveled a lot. So he had LD OWs. He couldnt handle being alone. How weak and pathetic is that?

Edited June 5, 2019 by a LoveShack.org Moderator