In a rough place - thoughts appreciated

[HadMeOverABarrel]

He HATES OW.

 

I fully plan that one day my BF and I will get married. But had he moved, we would be over.

 

Does your xWH hate his fOW bc he blames her for the breakup of your marriage? That's what I'd expect for par. Just curious.

 

Congrats on the awesome boyfriend! Nice to see an example of how better partners are out there for BS & OW who have the courage to let go of WS/MM.

[Aloha123]

You also need to realize that you've drawn a false contingency between his marriage and your future.

 

This affair has continued long enough that it will eventually end his marriage, whether he wants that or not. The end of his marriage however, is also more likely to end his association with you than to send him running into your arms.

 

.

 

This is such an important point. It's something I learned on this forum, that in those rare instances that a MM does leave his wife, he more likely than not ends up with a 3rd woman rather than the OW.

[finna]

I suppose if he is unable to continue to compartmentalize it may be the end. On the other hand, it could take years to get there- I’m not placing any bets on whether it ends or not at this point- obviously three weeks ago I would have said something entirely different but many posters here seem to think he may just go back to her and they will make a go of it.

 

I know I haven’t had any other affairs and I believe him when he says he hasn’t. There are many reasons for my belief that I don’t feel comfortable sharing here - I know you will judge that as naive- so be it. I think there are plenty of other behavioral issues that led to the affair without having to have prior cheating on his part in the mix.

 

 

You also need to realize that you've drawn a false contingency between his marriage and your future.

 

This affair has continued long enough that it will eventually end his marriage, whether he wants that or not. The end of his marriage however, is also more likely to end his association with you than to send him running into your arms.

 

Your premise is that his marriage was bad and therefore the two of you "fell in love" (struck up an affair.) The more likely truth is that he has affairs and that is why his marriage is bad.

 

It's comical to watch, but my ex learned the hard way. She found out she wasn't the only OW to her MM. Apparently, true love also comes in a six pack. MM learned she also wasn't a one trick pony herself - and each of them condemned the other for their treachery.

[Amethyst68]

Thanks for all the comments. With regard to logistics we would establish two home bases as we already spend significant time in each other’s cities. Honestly we would see our kids just as much if not more than we do now with travel, which for me is having my son 50%. The kids would spend time in both places as makes sense with school, etc. and they both love to travel. That is one part that worries me the least.

 

One of the primary reasons I have emphasized that if MM leaves he must do it for him and not for me is the resentment piece. I know that can be a very real thing.

 

So it sounds like you've discussed and planned stopping the travel if he leaves his wife. Do he'll do it for you but not his family?

 

How do you plan to speak to him this week, I thought his family was joining him to celebrate their wedding anniversary?

[finna]

This is such an important point. It's something I learned on this forum, that in those rare instances that a MM does leave his wife, he more likely than not ends up with a 3rd woman rather than the OW.

 

Yes - this is undoubtedly a possibility any time there is this kind of upheaval in relationships... I don’t have a crystal ball on that one other than to say the way he talks today leaves the door open for the two of us in the future (of course - I get it).

[finna]

So it sounds like you've discussed and planned stopping the travel if he leaves his wife. Do he'll do it for you but not his family?

 

How do you plan to speak to him this week, I thought his family was joining him to celebrate their wedding anniversary?

 

We are in his city working this week so he is at home but will take me to and from the office, etc. This weekend he and I drive to our next destination and they join in the middle of the week.

[Starswillshine]

Does your xWH hate his fOW bc he blames her for the breakup of your marriage? That's what I'd expect for par. Just curious.

 

Congrats on the awesome boyfriend! Nice to see an example of how better partners are out there for BS & OW who have the courage to let go of WS/MM.

 

He hates her because she couldnt sit in her corner and be a good little "OW". She is the reason I found out the truth. I found out about her, I wasnt aware of the details. You know the typical "it was just some sexting, we only saw each other once." She eventually told me the truth. He said she was lying. He stayed in contact with her and further played into her emotions. He says to keep her happy so she wouldnt give me more info. Who knows the real truth (I think more because he wanted his cake and to eat it too). So when i found out the real truth, he had no use to keep her happy any more and dumped her. And HATES her.

 

Though, who knows now. He has another girlfriend. Aka victim. Her husband left her for his OW. Warning her will only look horrible on me, so I just watch with a sickness that another woman will fall victim to his selfishness.

 

And thanks, though I was devastated. I loved my husband with everything I could ever had, after 20 years.... I realize now how I was never able to be myself with him. I always felt like I had to please him and be who he wanted me to be. One thing I realized... many cheaters are like this. Once the BS has the strength to leave, they are sorta bummed it didnt happen sooner. Sad reality. I gave and gave to that man. Oh well, I have an amazing one now.

[Amethyst68]

I also meant to say don't be so sure his son could spend time at your location. Your MM would need his wife's permission to take him out the country. I still don't see how the logistics would work, your children are in school, different term times, holidays etc to coordinate.

[finna]

I also meant to say don't be so sure his son could spend time at your location. Your MM would need his wife's permission to take him out the country. I still don't see how the logistics would work, your children are in school, different term times, holidays etc to coordinate.

 

My son has the option to do online schooling and my ex is fine with me taking him out of the country for periods of time. It could be that we would spend more time with the kids at that home base... logistics are one of my specialities - just takes a little creativity and resources to figure out sometimes.

[Amethyst68]

And the question about stopping travel if you do get together?

[finna]

Stop driving with him. Take charge of yourself!

 

Car time gives him the opportunities he wants to manipulate you!

 

Perhaps. But it also gives us much needed time to talk that we don’t normally get when we are long distance.

[finna]

And the question about stopping travel if you do get together?

 

As far as travel - much of what he does now in my city would be covered by that being one of our bases. If we needed to we could cut back fairly significantly to other places.

[finna]

You would benefit from a professional counselor to help you a healthy boundary that keeps you happy, healthy and safe.

 

Yes - I am looking into that.

[finna]

Ya, no kidding... he wants you to feel connected to him.

 

He IS staying married!!!!!

 

It’s not your role to stay connected to him when he should be getting connected to his WIFE!

 

 

You are all up in THEIR marriage! How would you like that if you were his wife?

 

I wouldn’t. That doesn’t mean that I don’t need to have some f2f talks with him for myself. I want to be crystal clear on intentions and expectations before we part ways again in a couple of weeks. If I was never going to see him again that would be one thing but it’s just not the case- we have to travel and work closely together for the remainder of the year... leaving things uncommunicated and in crazy limbo now does no one any favors.

[elaine567]

The "prize" is too great to leave it alone and walk away...

She feels she is so close, she can hear it, smell it and taste it... all she needs to do is hang on in there...

 

BUT...

[finna]

The "prize" is too great to leave it alone and walk away...

She feels she is so close, she can hear it, smell it and taste it... all she needs to do is hang on in there...

 

BUT...

 

Not sure how to respond to this. I’m doing the best I can balancing emotions, practicality, responsibility, etc with frequently changing information. My world has been rocked and I’m not sure where I stand. I know people are saying to “take a stand” and I want to do that- but with more information that I can likely get in the next few days when I can talk to him about where his head is at. Like I’ve been saying - he may draw some firm boundaries as well.

 

My ex actually advised me to sit tight and let things play out just a bit. It was his “guy opinion” that it wasn’t worth worrying about too much until there was a communication opportunity.

Edited June 3, 2019 by asaysno
Update

[BaileyB]

My ex can do whatever he likes. He is friends with lots of people - male and female. Hypothetically- if I was married and didn’t know someone was an AP, I wouldn’t think to have any issues with that person.

 

Come on... get real here. You would not have a problem if your husband was “friends” with a woman, a female colleague with whom he travels for extended periods of time, a woman with whom he texts frequently... I seriously doubt that. I am the least jealous person in the world, and that would raise my suspicions...

 

Especially because you ARE in an affair with this man, makes it even more inappropriate and downright LUDICROUS that you think you can maintain a friendship with this man... Have some respect for his wife, please. You are already ******* her husband, at least have the respect to put some distance between you when he walks away from the affair.

[BaileyB]

I get that talking about him to a certain degree is aimed at snapping the OP out of her denial, but since every OW's FAVORITE topic is the MM and his life and their relationship, it always feels slightly enabling to me.

 

Lol. This was my humour for the day... thanks Aloha. How true.

[Timshel]

Asaysno, really?

 

 

Anyway, I come from a different place than some who post in the OW/OM forum. When I first came to LS it was from a place of despair that my 'friends' who are all married had abandoned me after my husband passed away.

My late husbands' best friend told me in the week of his death that he and his wife couldn't spend time with me anymore because quote 'I'll get in trouble with my wife.'

 

It was beyond disturbing in the months that followed that I was suddenly no longer invited to dinner parties and get together's; I was shunned. I get that some of that was from awkwardness and I was sad, no doubt.

 

I was informed by one kind (enough) girlfriend that I was no longer a 'safe' person to have around married men as their wives worried that I would be so desperate/lonely as to husband poach.

 

 

This is brash but the truth, you and other women like you are the reason for this stereotype. Reading the OW threads opened my eyes and though my friends were insecure and the insult was not taken lightly, I see now why they were afraid.

I am not like you but they weren't sure how grief may have changed me. I had never known this was a thing until my husband died and until I came to LS and started reading....and to be honest, witnessing this behavior myself.

 

 

You will need to take stock of yourself and the values that you have and that values/integrity are nothing without action. Your married man is a lying cheater, he doesn't have to be. He could tell the truth. These things are on him and your things are on you.

 

 

You have tunnel vision now because you are obsessed. Your son, friends, family; attractive, intelligent and available men....the whole wide beautiful world are all around you but you see nothing except what you do not have.

[BaileyB]

My ex actually advised me to sit tight and let things play out just a bit. It was his “guy opinion” that it wasn’t worth worrying about too much until there was a communication opportunity.

 

Ok, so we know that your ex-husband also has poor judgment and a weak moral code. It certainly doesn’t help that he enables you...

[HadMeOverABarrel]

He hates her because she couldnt sit in her corner and be a good little "OW". She is the reason I found out the truth. I found out about her, I wasnt aware of the details. You know the typical "it was just some sexting, we only saw each other once." She eventually told me the truth.

 

I would expect that she probably told you closer to the truth than he did. Either she hoped it would push you over the edge so she could "have" him...so she wanted you to know the gory details (possibly with slight exaggerations but you know him better than she does so you could probably discern).

 

He said she was lying. He stayed in contact with her and further played into her emotions. He says to keep her happy so she wouldnt give me more info.

 

When I read this, I immediately thought, "Yep he was STILL trying to keep up the status quo, cake-eating charade!"

 

Who knows the real truth (I think more because he wanted his cake and to eat it too). So when i found out the real truth, he had no use to keep her happy any more and dumped her. And HATES her.

 

Ironically, maybe he felt betrayed by her lose lips. She exposed and he lost his cake-eater set up. I don't buy that he was on a damage control mission. She already spilled the beans, not so? Or was he trying to keep her from spilling the beans? I feel a bit guilty for wanting to laugh at the irony of this...he lost his teddy and his blanky all in one go. (i.e. Wife and Side chic) Not so fun when the tables turn, right? Play with matches, get burned.

 

Though, who knows now. He has another girlfriend. Aka victim. Her husband left her for his OW. Warning her will only look horrible on me, so I just watch with a sickness that another woman will fall victim to his selfishness.

 

Well let's hope he is better to her, lest she repeat the story from first husband. I agree--stay away from that hornet's nest. Truly, I hope each of them becomes a better person.

 

And thanks, though I was devastated. I loved my husband with everything I could ever had, after 20 years.... I realize now how I was never able to be myself with him. I always felt like I had to please him and be who he wanted me to be.

 

Surely, it is tough to give and not get back in equal measure, especially after so many years. You probably grew from the experience though, and you have kids with him, right? So they are a blessing that came out of it.

 

One thing I realized... many cheaters are like this. Once the BS has the strength to leave, they are sorta bummed it didnt happen sooner.

 

Really?! Ouch! You mean MM are bummed the BS did not leave sooner? I guess it makes sense. They are not fully committed to the marriage while in A, but don't have the gonads to be the one to leave either.

 

Sad reality. I gave and gave to that man. Oh well, I have an amazing one now.

 

You deserve it! Well done! Hope you live the rest of your years in bliss!

[Starswillshine]

I would expect that she probably told you closer to the truth than he did. Either she hoped it would push you over the edge so she could "have" him...so she wanted you to know the gory details (possibly with slight exaggerations but you know him better than she does so you could probably discern).

 

He was trying to keep her from giving me the full truth. She would give me bits. He would lie about it and covered it up that she was lying..but she had proof. Like physical proof that she was with him. She never gave me that. Until the very end. Which was when I left.

 

Yes, we have 4 children together and I am very thankful for them. That is the one thing good that came from him. Also, lots of lessons.... and my strength.

 

And no I meant, us, BS learn that maybe it wasnt a great fit after all.

Edited June 5, 2019 by a LoveShack.org Moderator

[Mrin]

Out of curiosity though, what do you expect would happen if I communicated that I was dating?

 

Wow this thread took off. I haven't read all of the posts between mine and current. But to answer your question - he would flip out. Get insanely possessive. And would probably - for the first time - genuinely think about leaving his wife. Up until now it was all talk and just what he had to say to you to keep the thing going.

 

That's my guess.

[HadMeOverABarrel]

This is so interesting... because I asked YOU how you would feel and you made it all about your MM and his wife.

 

Do you see you’re handing him all your power?

 

Why can’t YOU decide what’s best for YOURSELF?

 

Why does it look likeEVERYTHING is going to be determined by your MM?

 

It looks weak on your part. Never ever put yourself at the mercy of ANY man! Especially one that’s married and committed to his wife!

 

Stop driving with him. Take charge of yourself!

 

Car time gives him the opportunities he wants to manipulate you!

 

I have actually wondered about this. He has told me before that I have the evidence to have him thrown out and divorced in a matter of weeks. I’m not sure in her current state she actually would file because she is too dependent on him (that’s not a slight - she doesn’t yet have a job, etc while finishing school). She also is very in love with the idea of him I think (obviously she doesn’t know or is in denial of his full character). She suspects something is going on though and her response has been to work even harder to keep him around. I wouldn’t be surprised if she gets pregnant in the next few months to further this goal (again, not being derogatory- just observing potential behavior based on what I’ve witnessed so far).

 

I also wouldn’t be surprised though if once she starts working, gains some confidence, and meets new people, as well as matures a little if she would move on from him. At that point I wonder if he would fight to keep her as much as he has in the past when she has threatened to leave. He has said at those times he has done everything he could to fix whatever she wanted as he was afraid of being alone. Now he knows that he has the potential for options (not even necessarily me, but just that other women might be interested) so not sure how all that would play out.

 

 

asaysno, you are in deep denial right now. Your hormones have officially taken over and you are addicted. Leaving your MM behind is akin to quitting a powerful opioid drug (literally!), and you are not ready to give it up. Your perspective is that MM is confused but his love for you will ultimately win him over to you...just give him time to see you are the right choice.

 

His perspective is to manage down your expectations...down, down, down, down, down as time goes on. You mentioned recently learning about codependency and think his wife is codependent. Sometimes OW project onto the BS................. The uncertainty in dealing with a MM or MW is a killer, and it's mainly because you feel powerless (i.e. out of control) in the situation. You are looking to the other person (i.e. MM) to guide you instead of guiding yourself. [Actually, in some ways, you have allowed him to take a paternal role over you. If you're brave, this can be an opportunity to resolve some deep stuff within you, and you will emerge a better person for it. Start with the YouTube videos and then consider individual counseling.]

 

Does anyone else see the patterns? OP, I am not picking on you, but hope you will awaken. I have quoted S2B here bc I feel her comments echo what I was saying.

Edited June 5, 2019 by a LoveShack.org Moderator

[BaileyB]

If you think your story is somehow unique and special asaysno, sadly it’s not...

 

https://www.loveshack.org/forums/romantic/other-man-woman/684789-trying-move