Next Chapter - MM & Me

[heartwhole2]

We've done this "he cares about me because" dance before. The point isn't whether he has affection for you -- he does. He maintains the relationship you've established by offering emotional support. Of course, if this means a whole lot then I think of the enormity of literal strangers stopping their days to offer you support and advice. But I digress.

 

The problem isn't whether he cares enough to have a relationship with you. The problem is that the relationship created is dysfunctional and harmful.

[BaileyB]

The problem isn't whether he cares enough to have a relationship with you. The problem is that the relationship created is dysfunctional and harmful.

 

... to yourselves and others.

 

Although I don’t expect you to agree given your previous post in which you stated that everyone was “fine” including MM’s wife and that the only individuals who suffer are yourself and MM - his with guilt and you both with missing each other...

[finna]

We've done this "he cares about me because" dance before. The point isn't whether he has affection for you -- he does. He maintains the relationship you've established by offering emotional support. Of course, if this means a whole lot then I think of the enormity of literal strangers stopping their days to offer you support and advice. But I digress.

 

The problem isn't whether he cares enough to have a relationship with you. The problem is that the relationship created is dysfunctional and harmful.

 

It’s a thoughtful and fair point as always - thank you.

[Ravensglen]

Hello Asaysno; I’ve followed & read both of your threads from the very beginning. I commend you for coming back again and again, posting updates & taking the (at times) harsh critiques.

 

I am a MW who had an EA with an ex boyfriend who was married at the time. I have no contact with him now, and I don’t check on him via social media so I don’t know what his situation is now. Anyway, I am not a saint. FAR from it. I screwed up & I have to live with it for the rest of my life. When my ex and I were in contact, he also told me negative things about his wife. She’s mean/spoiled/yells at him, they sleep in separate rooms and don’t have sex, etc. I felt sorry for him when he first started telling me these kinds of stories - but then, I kind of thought - either he’s a complete wuss/coward bc he doesn’t stand up for himself, or he’s completely full of sh*t. And seeing as he’s in his early 30’s and his sex drive should be through the roof, the odds are that he IS getting it from her, or he’s not and he’s a completely spineless excuse for a “man” for staying in the relationship. Also, I don’t believe his W is the monster he made her out to be... The last straw was he texted me while they were both out at a concert and sent me a picture of the venue to “share” it with me?! I was so utterly disgusted by how he could try to talk to me when he was sitting with her, probably holding her hand, probably saying “I love you” to her. I realized in that moment how f***** up it was and i could not take it anymore. I felt HORRIBLE for what I was doing to her. And I never met her or talked to her. How do you not? I was totally romanticizing him during the A, justifying his (and my) actions... But that, I couldn’t take. Him trying to talk to me while he was actually with her made me realize what an unscrupulous disgusting character he had. I lied to myself for a long time, thinking their marriage was their business not mine. That is the logic of someone who has a lot of guilt and wants to justify the situation. I was responsible for my role in enabling him to emotionally step out of his marriage and wanted no further part in it. Is your gut calm? Are you at peace? I think not... Again, I respect you tremendously for coming back here again and again, taking the harsh critiques and posting updates. If you are not at peace inside yourself, this relationship with your MM is not good for you. I was acting Incongruously with my beliefs is right/wrong - my gut churned constantly and I felt guilty. Please, if you have those feelings don’t dismiss them. They are your mind/body trying to tell you something. Living in a state of tumultuous excitement and guilt is not sustainable. If you put your energies into finding someone who can actually be yours, and you theirs, you will feel peaceful in the relationship.

 

Best wishes.

[Tristian]

OK all, after a bit of review I'm going to put these ground rules down.

 

1. The OP is well aware of the dynamic of her situation. She knows he's married, she knows he has kids, she knows she is an OW. There is no need to browbeat the OP with these facts.

 

2. The OP started the thread for assistance with her relationship. If you have assistance to offer, great. If you are looking to come to the aide of the BS then maybe she will start a thread and you can help her there but this one belongs to the OP.

 

3. This is the OM/OW forum. It should be no surprise what is discussed here. If you find those topics distasteful then you should probably move on to another section more to your liking without comment.

 

Those choosing to ignore these guidelines do so at their own peril as penalties will be stiff.

 

I encourage the OP to make liberal use of the Alert function.

[finna]

@Ravensglen

 

Thanks for taking the time to read my story. It’s been about a year now since I first started having feelings for MM. It would be another couple of months before either of us acted on them but this has certainly turned into more than just a fling... certainly nothing that I saw coming.

 

Your question about whether I am at peace is a good one and I will answer that as best as I can. When I am with him I am 100% content. When we’ve had a good conversation over text it adds that much more happiness to my day. Him sending even a couple of brief messages during a very busy day make me smile to know he’s thinking of me.

 

The times when it is harder is when we have gone more than about three weeks without seeing each other, or if I unexpectedly don’t hear from him on a given day. Then I do start to feel a bit sad and anxious. And of course it is very difficult to be apart from someone that you love and want to be with.

 

For the most part, I think my feelings are little different than anyone in a mostly long distance relationship. I was talking about it with a friend yesterday who reminded me the missing and at times sadness and loneliness are totally normal for people who are involved but live halfway across the world from each other.

 

We are both busy people with our jobs and family and household obligations, and I have several hobbies and an active social life as well. I do my best to weave him into my day, rather than wait around for him to message or call.

 

But I suspect none of this is what you are really asking.

 

So... I am doing my best to take a calm, long term approach to our situation and not get caught up in small frustrations. People here will give me holy hell, but as I stated in the beginning of my first thread, I believe that MM and I have much to teach and learn from each other, and my gut tells me we will likely eventually be together if things naturally take their course (there are any number of disruptions that could prevent this).

 

I believe he still struggles with where he should be and who with on a daily basis. When we were together a couple of weeks ago he prefaced several statements with “if I was married to you I would...” which is language he had never used before and I was surprised to hear. He also talked a couple of times about wanting to make our relationship sustainable.

 

For myself, I am monogamous by nature and hate the lying/deception part of our relationship. I don’t do it- my family and friends know at least the general details of the situation and I won’t lie about it. So while my approach tends to allow me to feel peaceful, his approach most certainly does not. However, I feel like he has to work through his issues and choose his path. My only real choice is to support him as he does that (even such that it takes a while) or exit the relationship. For now, it brings me the most happiness and contentment to have him be a part of my life- although there are certainly challenging days.

[Allupinnit]

Honestly if this relationship makes you happy as-is, then I can't see how anything we might say to try and help you see things differently will change things.

 

I personally don't think he's struggling at all with where he should be - he's exactly where he wants to be with his wife and family. It's really sad how he strings you along like this - life is so short to be in limbo.

 

I really hope you get what your heart wishes for.

[S2B]

From your last post it’s glaring that you simply hand him too much of YOUR power.

 

And he’s future faking again by saying “if you were my wife...”

 

But I wish you well - you could easily be waiting around for decades - he’s made it clear he’s not divorcing his wife.

 

I wish you would seek professional help to take back your power you so easily hand over to him every day.

[finna]

Thanks for your thoughts. You may be right that he’s where he wants to be with his family- at least in the moment when he is with them. I also think he’s exactly where he wants to be when he is with me... or he wouldn’t go to the effort to make it happen.

 

I don’t have the answers or a crystal ball. I do know that cutting him out of my life would be excruciating... far worse than the ending of any other relationship I’ve ever had including my 20+ year time with exH. And that time may eventually come, as all relationships have some sort of expiration date.

 

So while I seek support here as I don’t have anywhere else to talk about and more or less journal these things in depth, I’m not necessarily looking for people to tell me to drop MM as the only path forward. I do appreciate all perspectives and thoughts on the approach and coping, as long as they are focused on me and not what I should be doing on behalf of everyone else.

[finna]

From your last post it’s glaring that you simply hand him too much of YOUR power.

 

And he’s future faking again by saying “if you were my wife...”

 

But I wish you well - you could easily be waiting around for decades - he’s made it clear he’s not divorcing his wife.

 

I wish you would seek professional help to take back your power you so easily hand over to him every day.

 

How do I hand him too much power? It’s true that he needs to take his own path regarding ending (or not) his current relationship - I certainly can’t make him take that step nor would I want him to only “for me”. For now, I *choose* to live as full a life as I can that includes him in it- but I don’t wait around for him. He chooses to spend several hours of his day most days with me and when I back off from that communication he tends to come running to direct even more attention my way. So I would say it goes both ways at least to an extent.

 

My IC says that I will know when the relationship is no longer benefitting me enough to be in it. She encourages me to take care of myself such that I am physically fit, have activities I enjoy, and a strong group of friends. So that’s my focus as far as my own well-being for now.

[Allupinnit]

It could be that subconsciously you don't want a full-time relationship at all. This "arrangement" might suit you best. That might be worth exploring with your therapist. You seem to be fine with the texting and intermittent meet ups. Most people want the whole enchilada.

 

People who get so deeply involved with someone unavailable tend to be unavailable themselves as well.

[heartwhole2]

I'm glad you're focusing on your social life and health.

[finna]

It could be that subconsciously you don't want a full-time relationship at all. This "arrangement" might suit you best. That might be worth exploring with your therapist. You seem to be fine with the texting and intermittent meet ups. Most people want the whole enchilada.

 

People who get so deeply involved with someone unavailable tend to be unavailable themselves as well.

 

You may be on to something there. I definitely don’t tend to open up or make myself available to very many people. MM pretty much knows everything about me... I am a complete open book with him which is something I have not been able to do in any previous relationship. When we were just friends we used to joke about how he was on my “very short list” of people I liked and really wanted to spend time with.

 

I know I want the whole enchilada with him... but it is completely unappetizing (so to speak) with anyone else at this point.

[Allupinnit]

Well, as women, we tend to only want that with one man at a time, emotionally at least.

 

For men, they tend to be very good at being in the moment.

Edited October 10, 2019 by Allupinnit

[S2B]

How do you hand him too much of YOUR power?

 

By what you stated. That you are mainly only 100% happy when you’re with him. By becoming happy during the day by him simply sending a text.

 

You should be capable of being that happy without him - without that slight communication from him.

 

 

I think that’s what you could focus on in order to help yourself regain some balance of your power. That it would feel indifferent and you could feel happy whether he sent a text or not - whether you’re with him or not.

 

You have to assume he’s staying married... that’s the facts he’s given you. To think anything may change is simply delusional - you could also work with a professional on that to help yourself.

 

Seeing the reality of what IS - is the first step in dealing with what to do about things.

 

IF/SINCE he may stay married for the next 40 years... are you prepared to be his quiet and obedient mistress for all that time?

[finna]

What you are talking about means having no emotional connection and that’s just not how it works. There are many people in my life with whom I feel joy - some more than others. Meeting up with a friend brings joy. Spending time with my son brings joy. Getting together with family brings joy. That joy would not happen without the connection with those people. Contentment and a happy existence sure- but not that added joy.

 

Why should my feelings and relationship with MM be any different? He brings me a great deal of joy. There are times when there is also challenges and pain, but that is true of every relationship if it is a close and long term thing. My son, whom I love dearly, certainly brings challenges and pain from time to time.

 

I don’t see what that has to do with power. Vulnerability yes- if we are not vulnerable we don’t get to experience any of the connections and emotions that are part of relationships.

[S2B]

You seem to be contradicting yourself. See post 306

 

That’s why it’s confusing.

 

Maybe you really don’t know how you feel deep down...?

 

The bottom line is that the person who cares less has more power - and you seem to care more. So you are willing to risk more to keep the affair going but he looks like he doesn’t care as much as you do (example is he was willing to down grade your position while you currently wish to upgrade your position).

 

He holds the power. But you also keep handing him more by caring about him way more than he prioritizes you.

Edited October 11, 2019 by S2B