Dumped for political beliefs

[Jacobv1]

Oh my... Is it really like this. I don't know what to say. That's a really cruel thing to do over political views. Wow though that's a mind opener.

[Woggle]

If somebody feels strongly about politics it makes sense for them to not be involved with somebody who sees the world differently. It's especially true in these polarized times.

[amaysngrace]

At no point did she string you along or act dishonestly with you.

 

Yes she did. If she formed an opinion of him that was so strong to end the relationship over then she should have said so before it got to the exclusivity talk.

 

Instead she was dishonest in her opinions by not expressing them. Silence is understood to be agreement to most normal people. She was deceptive and the minute she knew they were incompatible she should have said so. Instead she waited until he liked her and wanted to be exclusive.

[Ronni_W]

If you know you don’t click with someone on a very fundamental level you stop dating them, not string them along for months.

Three months is a VERY SHORT TIME to decide if and how well one 'clicks' with another.

If people think that any level of significant, trustworthy, reliable trust and intimacy can be built up over just three months, no wonder they are ending up feeling all 'blind-sided' and disappointed!

 

It sounds like what this woman did was stay silent but observant. If you want to truly figure-out people, this is the best way to do it. How we act, and what we say and do

in random, 'off-the-cuff' moments or when we don't know that we're actually being observed reveals more about our personality and who we are, than when we know that we're exposed

or 'on show', so to speak, where we just tend to act out a part that we think the other likes or wants to see.

 

In my experience, people who get fixated on or obsessive about not having had the chance to talk or 'hash out' the other person's thoughts, feelings and decision...either they think

that they could have gotten the other person to change their beliefs, likes, thoughts and decision...or they were willing to change themselves just to suit what the other person liked and wanted.

This of course may not apply to the OP...but it wouldn't hurt to make sure that neither is the case.

[preraph]

I get really exasperated with people who don't even keep up with good news resources and follow things but are so staunch in their uneducated views that they will argue about it and make judgments. I'm not wasting my time doing that.

 

Here's what I get a lot of. It actually says right on my Twitter that I'm an embarrassed Democrat, which is true. I was once a Hillary delegate. But because I see the absurdity of the new radical left and think they're the worst thing out there right now and believe the border must be secured, people will say my profile isn't true and that I am MAGA. All I'm doing it staying educated only on the issues I care about that there might be an opportunity for change, and I will cross the aisle for it, as should a lot more of our leaders.

 

Truth is most of America are moderates, not far right or far left, but it's only the noisy extremists who made the most noise and get the sensational press. It's pretty frustrating. And then people judge you by one of them, not the core of moderates in both parties.

[Ronni_W]

That's a really cruel thing to do over political views.

If somebody feels strongly about politics it makes sense for them to not be involved with somebody who sees the world differently. It's especially true in these polarized times.

It's that one's views, in general, tell the truth of who one is and how one sees and relates with the rest of humankind and one's external world.

 

I think to make this into a purely 'political' decision on this woman's part, ignores that all of our views (political, religious, whatever), comes from a single, core sense of identity

of who we are and what we stand for.

 

My understanding/interpretation of the term 'being polarized' is that it means that one has taken a definite decision, and opinion and stand, on something...

...as opposed to sitting on the fence or being timid/afraid to declare one's own values and priorities. I see the latter as a problem (esp. for the self), but not the former.

 

OP's former girlfriend could have made her final decision based on very much more than just his political bent...we don't know the rest of her story and experience of him.

[basil67]

Yes she did. If she formed an opinion of him that was so strong to end the relationship over then she should have said so before it got to the exclusivity talk.

 

Not exclusive = no relationship. It was just casual up until he decided he wanted more.

[lana-banana]

Yes she did. If she formed an opinion of him that was so strong to end the relationship over then she should have said so before it got to the exclusivity talk.

 

They weren't in a relationship; there was nothing to end. They weren't exclusive. They were "hanging out and having fun". Maybe she isn't interested in being exclusive with anyone right now. She did the responsible thing. When he tried to progress the relationship, she said no.

 

I also think it's damn near impossible to "string anyone along" over a period of three months of non-exclusive hanging out. When I was single it usually took me about three months of exclusive dating to determine whether I even really liked the guy. A year would be one thing, but three months is nothing. And, again, they weren't in a relationship in the first place.

[amaysngrace]

Not exclusive = no relationship. It was just casual up until he decided he wanted more.

 

Even still, why spend time, any time, with someone you secretly don’t like?

[alligator42]

Just to clarify, we weren't "exclusive" but we also weren't seeing anyone else. We both made it clear on the first date we were looking for a serious relationship, not a casual one.

 

That's why I feel this was dishonest of her as amaysngrace pointed out. If she knew we were incompatible I believe she should have brought it up with me sooner on her own, rather then waiting for me to try to make it official and then turning me down.

 

She had plenty of opportunity during our time together to say something or ask me questions if she was confused, and it would not have been nearly as big of a deal.

 

When you are seeing someone multiple times a week, they are texting everyday, you are holding hands, kissing, having sex, on top of feeling like they want the same thing as you because that's what they told you, feelings do start to develop lol. She didn't tell me anything was wrong, or show me anything was wrong until I brought up the exclusive talk, which is why it was such a blindside.

[lana-banana]

Even still, why spend time, any time, with someone you secretly don’t like?

 

Did she say she secretly didn't like him? She just didn't see him as Mr. Right, that's all. That doesn't mean she wasn't enjoying her time with him in the moment.

 

I don't get it. It would have been leading him on had she committed to a serious relationship together, but she didn't. Had she come to LS and said "hey, this guy I've casually been seeing has made some weird offhand comments that don't jibe with what I believe, but he seems like a cool guy overall even though I don't think our values line up, what do I do?" most people would have said "you don't really know him yet, give it some time" or something to that effect. I don't think anyone would have suggested she immediately end it over a single remark.

 

The three-month mark is generally the first make-it-or-break-it moment for new relationships. I dumped people, and was dumped by people, quite a few times right at that exact moment. It's not leading someone on to try a relationship out for a little while and then realize you weren't as compatible as you thought. It's just how things go.

[Ronni_W]

She didn't tell me anything was wrong, or show me anything was wrong until I brought up the exclusive talk, which is why it was such a blindside.

Because nothing was wrong with the situation exactly as it was, as far as she was concerned.

 

Something only became wrong when/because you tried to change the situation exactly as it was...you tried to make it something different/more.

 

The only thing she could have said to you (before you tried to change everything) was, "This is great...so don't change or try to change a single thing, okay?"

And...who in the heck thinks that, nevermind thinks to say it out loud to the next guy??? That would make no sense to say.

 

Is it that you think that you could have changed her mind, or that you would have changed or tried to change yourself to suit her mind?

[alligator42]

Did she say she secretly didn't like him? She just didn't see him as Mr. Right, that's all. That doesn't mean she wasn't enjoying her time with him in the moment.

 

I don't get it. It would have been leading him on had she committed to a serious relationship together, but she didn't. Had she come to LS and said "hey, this guy I've casually been seeing has made some weird offhand comments that don't jibe with what I believe, but he seems like a cool guy overall even though I don't think our values line up, what do I do?" most people would have said "you don't really know him yet, give it some time" or something to that effect. I don't think anyone would have suggested she immediately end it over a single remark.

 

The three-month mark is generally the first make-it-or-break-it moment for new relationships. I dumped people, and was dumped by people, quite a few times right at that exact moment. It's not leading someone on to try a relationship out for a little while and then realize you weren't as compatible as you thought. It's just how things go.

 

If it is the case that she was treating it as me only ever being a casual relationship, when she told me in the beginning she was only looking for a serious relationship, then she should have communicated that to me before allowing and encouraging me to start to develop feelings for her thinking we were both on the same page.

I was honest from the beginning. I assumed she was honest as well. She didn't really do anything to show me she was being dishonest, or that she had second thoughts. I went into the conversation thinking it was more of a formality, because I thought she wanted a long term relationship and she didn't indicate to me anything was wrong.

 

Is it that you think that you could have changed her mind, or that you would have changed or tried to change yourself to suit her mind?

 

I more just wanted to understand what exactly she interpreted that I thought based on comments I made, and to clear up misconceptions. It may have saved the relationship and it may not have, but I at least wanted her to get her facts straight about what I thought before making a final decision, that just seems logical. Off the cuff comments don't always reveal the truth. For instance some people laugh at racist jokes, that doesn't mean they are supremacists to their own race right?

[Ronni_W]

For instance some people laugh at racist jokes, that doesn't mean they are supremacists to their own race right?

People who laugh at tasteless jokes either, (a) Do openly or secretly agree with the stereotype being perpetuated;

or, (b) Don't have the self-esteem or confidence or courage to say, "I don't agree with that stereotype / That isn't funny / That makes me uncomfortable." (Or something along those lines.)

 

 

Discerning people will take note of how and what we do every single aspect and moment of our lives...as well they should!

[basil67]

That's why I feel this was dishonest of her as amaysngrace pointed out. If she knew we were incompatible I believe she should have brought it up with me sooner on her own, rather then waiting for me to try to make it official and then turning me down. .

 

For every poster who complains that someone took too long making sure that ending it was the right thing, there will be another poster who complains that the dumper jumped the gun and didn't give it enough time.

 

There is no single rule which will keep everyone happy.

[Woggle]

At the end of the day why would be with somebody who you will be butting heads with almost everyday. She did nothing wrong. I am not saying your views are right or wrong because I don't know where you stand but at the end of the day they present an incompatibility she just can't get past.

[lana-banana]

...then she should have communicated that to me before allowing and encouraging me to start to develop feelings for her thinking we were both on the same page.

 

It was THREE MONTHS. I know it can seem like a lot of time but in terms of dating it's not even a drop in the bucket. She may have really thought it was surmountable, or that it wasn't that big of a deal, or wavered back and forth in her own considerations, or just woke up one day and decided she couldn't do it anymore. This stuff happens all the time at the three-month mark for millions of reasons, not just politics.

 

Nobody decides to stop seeing someone in the blink of an eye. She probably spent a while thinking about it, talking about it with friends, weighing pros and cons, etc. You are apparently mad at her for not making a snap decision about not hanging out anymore or getting serious, which is silly. These things take time and reflection.

 

Off the cuff comments don't always reveal the truth. For instance some people laugh at racist jokes, that doesn't mean they are supremacists to their own race right?

 

Laughing at racist jokes may not make you a supremacist but it doesn't make you a great human being or life partner, either. It's frankly really gross. I wouldn't date anyone who laughed at a racist joke.

 

If she really and truly thought you guys were compatible, or if she really liked you that much, she WOULD have talked to you about it. Instead she cut her losses. At the end of the day she didn't like you that much. I know that hurts, but think of it as an important life lesson: when someone wants to walk out of your life, for whatever reason, let them.

Edited August 6, 2019 by lana-banana

[alligator42]

People who laugh at tasteless jokes either, (a) Do openly or secretly agree with the stereotype being perpetuated;

or, (b) Don't have the self-esteem or confidence or courage to say, "I don't agree with that stereotype / That isn't funny / That makes me uncomfortable." (Or something along those lines.)

 

 

Discerning people will take note of how and what we do every single aspect and moment of our lives...as well they should!

 

So have you ever laughed at a tasteless joke then? What if a person made all sorts of judgments and conclusions about what type of person you are because of that? I guess it depends on the joke. Sure some are straight offensive and way too far, however most aren't designed to be offensive but humorous. There is a degree of truth to stereotypes, otherwise they wouldn't exist.

 

I agree with you that actions speak louder than words, but that doesn't mean that words have no weight and can't fill in the gaps.

 

For every poster who complains that someone took too long making sure that ending it was the right thing, there will be another poster who complains that the dumper jumped the gun and didn't give it enough time.

 

There is no single rule which will keep everyone happy.

 

This isn't about finding a general conclusion to every relationship breakup, but a consensus of right and wrong in my situation.

 

Overall, I believe everything happens for a reason. If it wasn't meant to be, so be it. In my mind, proper direct communication beats out staying silent/judging comments/pros-cons with friends/whatever she was doing lol. Leading people on to think everything is fine with you, when it's not, is dishonest. I want to be with someone where if they have a problem they tell me. Give me an update on where you're at, check in with me. If you have an issue with someone, and you bottle it up and keep it to yourself and judge them for it, things like this happen.

 

In a perfect world where our political views were nicely aligned (I don't even know her views because she never told me), her inability to communicate would have caused a lot of relationship problems anyways. I'm just surprised that people think her leading me to believe one thing, and actually thinking something else, is perfectly acceptable.

[basil67]

So have you ever laughed at a tasteless joke then? What if a person made all sorts of judgments and conclusions about what type of person you are because of that? I guess it depends on the joke. Sure some are straight offensive and way too far, however most aren't designed to be offensive but humorous. There is a degree of truth to stereotypes, otherwise they wouldn't exist.

 

Actually I draw pretty quick conclusions about those who make jokes at the expense of others. I much prefer the type of humour where someone tells about a funny thing which happened to them.

 

This isn't about finding a general conclusion to every relationship breakup, but a consensus of right and wrong in my situation.

 

There is no right and wrong because the argument has two sides.

 

In my mind, proper direct communication beats out staying silent/judging comments/pros-cons with friends/whatever she was doing lol. Leading people on to think everything is fine with you, when it's not, is dishonest. I want to be with someone where if they have a problem they tell me. Give me an update on where you're at, check in with me. If you have an issue with someone, and you bottle it up and keep it to yourself and judge them for it, things like this happen.

 

In an established elationship, I agree with you. But at only three months in, I'm an advocate of quietly watching to see what kind of person they are and making a judgement call.

 

her inability to communicate would have caused a lot of relationship problems anyways. I'm just surprised that people think her leading me to believe one thing, and actually thinking something else, is perfectly acceptable.

 

These "odd comments" she judged you on.....if you'd known how she felt, would you have changed your position without question in order to keep the relationship?

 

Also, don't forget you were only "starting" to have feelings for her recently. So it's not like you wasted three months desperately in love.

[Woggle]

I don't think that tasteless or unpc jokes make you a bigot or a sexist or whatever. Some of the most hateful and nasty people are the same ones who get offended by everything. That being said for whatever reason she thought the two of you were incompatible and you need to just accept that.

[Ronni_W]

So have you ever laughed at a tasteless joke then?.

I actually have been thinking about that. I mostly have been told that I "don't have a sense of humour" because I call people out when I don't find their 'jokes' funny.

 

Of course one can tell when someone is being 'innocently ignorant' and trying to be humourous, or is just ignorant.

When you look deeper into the origin of any stereotype, you will see that ignorance, bigotry, false science, etc., is behind it; not any degree of truth.

 

On the other side, people have been harshly critical, and made all sorts of negative judgments and conclusions about me...whether or not it was accurate or deserved,

they still had the right to their opinions.

 

, but a consensus of right and wrong in my situation.

There is no 'right' or 'wrong' because each person has his or her own fears, insecurities and psychological limitations to overcome, to fulfill their own wants, needs

and goals for any given relationship (or job, friendship, or whatever situation).

 

Ideally, in a perfect world, everybody would have that level of awareness and skill in verbal communications that you have and desire from your relationships.

But please do consider that in another ideal and perfect world, everybody would stop being ignorant and perpetuating or supporting negative stereotypes.

 

For you, one is less acceptable while the other is okay; for her, the other is less acceptable while the one is okay.

[alligator42]

Actually I draw pretty quick conclusions about those who make jokes at the expense of others. I much prefer the type of humour where someone tells about a funny thing which happened to them.

 

I agree with you, I prefer that sense of humor as well. It can depend on taste and severity as I said.

 

 

In an established elationship, I agree with you. But at only three months in, I'm an advocate of quietly watching to see what kind of person they are and making a judgement call.

 

Ok, but when is a relationship considered established to you? It's kind of arbitrary because it depends on the connection between the individuals. There is no set amount of time each couple is supposed to hit particular milestones.

I considered the relationship somewhat established when she wanted to see me all the time, making plans together, and sleeping together. I considered the talk as I said as more of a formality because from what she was showing me, she was already indicating we were established.

The other side of this is why would you communicate differently in a serious relationship vs a relationship with the intention of being serious. Wouldn't you want to show the person your ideal way of communicating upfront?

 

 

These "odd comments" she judged you on.....if you'd known how she felt, would you have changed your position without question in order to keep the relationship?

I'm not confident with everything she even judged me on, which is part of the problem. Nobody fits together perfectly even if good communication, even harder without. I would've liked her to communicate with me if she disagreed or found what I said offensive, because obviously my goal wasn't to intentionally upset her. For example, I think healthy communication is something like this:

 

Me: says comment about abc. Her: Alligator, I don't agree with that, did you know abc actually did/is xyz? Me: I didn't know that actually, I'll have to look into that.

 

Me: says comment about abc. Her: Alligator, it upsets me when you talk about abc like that. Me: Ok, I didn't know you felt that way. I will avoid talking about it with you in the future.

 

Wouldn't this also allow a more accurate judge of character rather then sitting back and not telling someone what bothers you? Say I continued to talk about abc despite her telling me no, doesn't that make me more a jerk compared to talking about abc and not knowing it offended her? We all do some "adapting" to some degree when we meet someone new.

 

 

When you look deeper into the origin of any stereotype, you will see that ignorance, bigotry, false science, etc., is behind it; not any degree of truth.

If it was all a lie, and there was no degree of truth to any of it, stereotypes would not exist. The reason why they do exist is that in some situations in some degree they are true. That's why as a society we can identify what a stereotype is.

 

On the other side, people have been harshly critical, and made all sorts of negative judgments and conclusions about me...whether or not it was accurate or deserved,

they still had the right to their opinions.

 

They have a right to their opinion, but does that make their opinions justified?

 

There is no 'right' or 'wrong' because each person has his or her own fears, insecurities and psychological limitations to overcome, to fulfill their own wants, needs

and goals for any given relationship (or job, friendship, or whatever situation).

There is no right and wrong because the argument has two sides.

 

Ronni, that explanation kind of contradicts your quote.

 

Yes, there is a right and a wrong. If i started straight up murdering people, but I gave the excuse that I have a small peepee and my dad didn't hug me enough, would you say "well, that's his truth. What he did wasn't wrong"? You would hopefully say "murdering is wrong, lock this guy up".

 

Everybody has their issues, but it doesn't mean they can't do the right thing. The right thing isn't always easy to do. Sure, it might have been hard for her to communicate with me directly for whatever reason. But given the situation, she should have.

In this case, she should have told me how she was feeling and talked to me about it rather then keeping it all a secret and leading me to believe everything was great. The former would have not only been more respectful but more productive to both of our apparent goals.