Just need to offload

[Moth1980]

Pepperbird, I find it hard to believe that anyone could be as dense as this man sounds... which leads me to believe that he is well aware of what he has done and that’s why he will not tell his wife the truth of the situation.

 

OP, is it possible that the counsellor muddled the situation because that person didn’t offer support your decisions or enable your behavior? Did this person challenge you or ask you to consider some hard truths? You seem to me like the kind of person who refuses any opinion that differs from your own. You are very defensive, most notably with the whole “don’t judge me” warning earlier in your post - “I don’t want to hear any opinions or any comments that don’t support my position.”

 

No I’m happy to listen to opinions other than my own. Look back to the start. I’m not looking for counsel or judgement. I’m happy to be challenged on my behaviour and my thinking. Don’t think anywhere in this I’ve claimed to be a saint. Think of this place as more of a mirror where I can look at myself and my actions. But I thank you for your comments. And if I sound dense then fair enough... easy to view things from a prism of not walking in my shoes but equally such insights can be very helpful in reflecting on what I’m thinking and doing.

[Moth1980]

No, she hasn't chosen "you". She's chosen a character, the person you have allowed her to see. That isn't you. She doesn't even know you. She loves the character you have created in her own mind.

 

It makes me wonder if you even know yourself. who are you?

 

I think that last sentence sums me up at the moment. Have everything. Have nothing.

[darkbloom]

Hi OP,

 

Former OW here that was in a similar situation and maybe can provide some insight. You told her at the jump that you weren’t leaving your wife and kids- that’s what this OW has been going on. She started dating someone to get over you because she knew there was no future. She’s saying she doesn’t love you because she wants to move on, and she gets to take back control of the situation if you are confessing your love and she’s walking away from it.

 

It is INCREDIBLY selfish and you are treating both women like plan b to expect your OW to say she will be with you if you leave your wife but if she doesn’t you won’t. That’s a lot of pressure and unfair to your OW. (Not to mention your wife but that’s the whole A really) You’re not actively choosing your OW as a single man seeking a real relationship. Not sure why you or any MM can’t see why that would not appeal to an OW.

 

I know you say you love your wife and your OW but I would strongly challenge that statement. You don’t treat people you love this way. I believe you love yourself the most.

[pepperbird]

I think that last sentence sums me up at the moment. Have everything. Have nothing.

 

 

Fair enough.

 

 

Sometimes you have to destroy something bad so you can rebuild it to be stronger and better.

 

I don't know how you view marriage but to me, it's a partnership. It only functions well when both partners put in effort and are on the same page.Part of this is honesty. I'm not talking about the "no, that dress doesn't make your rear end look like a bus" situation, but the nuts and bolts of your relationship honesty.

 

If you want your marriage to have a ghost of a chance of being happy, and if you want to truly be able to say you love her and she loves you, you have some tough choices to make. You two can use this as an opportunity to grow both as individuals and as a couple. It's not going to be easy but I think you could do it. The alternative? You can continue on in a relationship that is a lie and stay just as you are. The choice is yours.

[elaine567]

You say she is a lot younger.

My guess is she has done the older MM thing and is now moving on.

Loads of ego boosts, besotted married man, "besotted" bf... ego flying high, then the abortion...

 

My guess she will dump you both. You have a wife and he let her down big time. Time for her to move on to pastures new.

[Moth1980]

You say she is a lot younger.

My guess is she has done the older MM thing and is now moving on.

Loads of ego boosts, besotted married man, "besotted" bf... ego flying high, then the abortion...

 

My guess she will dump you both. You have a wife and he let her down big time. Time for her to move on to pastures new.

 

Not sure she will. Was a few years ago now and she’s still with him. Scared of being lonely and she has a ready made group of friends there. Ironically all these friends are now getting married so they’re often away at weddings or hen / stag dos.

[Turning point]

Just need to offload...

 

I'm familiar with people who offload.

 

That "something more" you refer to between you and the other woman is self-reflection. In the midst of this extreme selfishness each of you experiences yourself as powerful and on a pedestal - the exact opposite of the family history describing yourself as undifferentiated and insignificant.

 

I don't need to tell you it's not love because you already know that. (Hence, you laid out your terms for posting in the very first sentence.)

 

So, what is it you really want from this thread? Because IMHO, offloading is BS.

[Moth1980]

I'm familiar with people who offload.

 

That "something more" you refer to between you and the other woman is self-reflection. In the midst of this extreme selfishness each of you experiences yourself as powerful and on a pedestal - the exact opposite of the family history describing yourself as undifferentiated and insignificant.

 

I don't need to tell you it's not love because you already know that. (Hence, you laid out your terms for posting in the very first sentence.)

 

So, what is it you really want from this thread? Because IMHO, offloading is BS.

 

What do I want. Somewhere I can just write what I want and express how I feel. What others think didn’t bother me. And we can argue about whether it is or isn’t love. Whether it’s limerance or some other thing. All ok now is it’s a owerful feeling that manifests physically and mentally and in spite of 3 yrs of trying (and yes trying, maybe not hard enough) it hasn’t gone away.

[Mr. Lucky]

What do I want. Somewhere I can just write what I want

 

OK, what do you want?

 

Mr. Lucky

[Turning point]

What do I want. Somewhere I can just write what I want and express how I feel. What others think didn’t bother me.

 

You could have written to a private journal or the cloud but, you posted here instead. I do in fact, believe that other people's thoughts are not what you're after. Whether they bother you or not remains to be seen.

 

So, what do you want?

 

 

In case we're not all on the same page:

Offload:

To remove a burden and place elsewhere.

[Moth1980]

You could have written to a private journal or the cloud but, you posted here instead. I do in fact, believe that other people's thoughts are not what you're after. Whether they bother you or not remains to be seen.

 

So, what do you want?

 

 

In case we're not all on the same page:

 

Yup. Just to set it down...

[Moth1980]

OK, what do you want?

 

Mr. Lucky

 

Wasn’t clear. To write down what I want = just to share how I am. What I want is something I can’t have but maybe if I had it I wouldn’t want it.

[Buffer]

OK, what do you want?

 

Mr. Lucky

 

Good question, well asked.

 

How do you want to proceed?

[pepperbird]

All ok now is it’s a owerful feeling that manifests physically and mentally and in spite of 3 yrs of trying (and yes trying, maybe not hard enough) it hasn’t gone away.

 

 

That's the thing. You didn't really try. Every time you called her, texted her, sent her a message, gave her any sort of headspace, you fed the beast. Feelings don't just pop up out of nowhere like a mushroom. Sure, maybe there are "sparks", but the ones you developed did so because you not only allowed them to take root, you actively cultivated them.

 

That isn't trying to end it completely and move on. Trying would be sending her a note that wishes her well in life and then cutting off all contact. Trying is contacting her fiance so that one day down the road the poor schmuck won't find himself sitting at home wondering where she is and who she's with.Trying would be being 100 percent honest with your wife and giving her the basic human respect of allowing her to have control over her life.

 

Once you have done any of those, you can honestly say " I'm trying".

[Mr. Lucky]

Wasn’t clear. To write down what I want = just to share how I am. What I want is something I can’t have but maybe if I had it I wouldn’t want it.

 

Actually, my question was more literal.

 

You’ve clearly taken many risks and vacated a number of personal values and boundaries in pursuit of something. Having arrived at this point in your life, what is it? What would you like to happen?

 

Mr. Lucky

[Moth1980]

That's the thing. You didn't really try. Every time you called her, texted her, sent her a message, gave her any sort of headspace, you fed the beast. Feelings don't just pop up out of nowhere like a mushroom. Sure, maybe there are "sparks", but the ones you developed did so because you not only allowed them to take root, you actively cultivated them.

 

That isn't trying to end it completely and move on. Trying would be sending her a note that wishes her well in life and then cutting off all contact. Trying is contacting her fiance so that one day down the road the poor schmuck won't find himself sitting at home wondering where she is and who she's with.Trying would be being 100 percent honest with your wife and giving her the basic human respect of allowing her to have control over her life.

 

Once you have done any of those, you can honestly say " I'm trying".

 

Fair enough. I get the send her a message and move on but then equally her boyfriend isn’t sitting at home wondering what she’s doing. He’s probably out sleeping with prostitutes or someone else. Who knows. Being 100% honest with wife won’t help but being a bit more open might. Yes my ow lives in my head *a lot* but she’s limpit like. And I did try NC. Three months once... still couldn’t stop.

[Moth1980]

Actually, my question was more literal.

 

You’ve clearly taken many risks and vacated a number of personal values and boundaries in pursuit of something. Having arrived at this point in your life, what is it? What would you like to happen?

 

Mr. Lucky

 

Yup. I’ve taken a load of risks. Destroyed my value and belief system such as I don’t know if I ever really held them. I genuinely think some of my behaviour is sociopathic. I wouldn’t say narcissistic as I don’t have that inflated an ego of myself. But I’m definitely at a point where I don’t feel that much guilt and if I’m honest remorse. You can probs tell that from earlier posts. I think I’m looking for more excitement and adventure in life. And maybe I see that manifested in the ow. Whereas home is safe and the 2.4 children narrative that’s fed to all of us.

 

What would I like to happen? My head to clear and to figure out one way or the other what I want.

[Amethyst68]

Pretty arrogant to think you should be the only one to get what he wants. Why doesn't your be get the chance to make the same choice? A fully informed choice? Instead you use her as a safe landing spot until your OW comes back.

[Turning point]

I wouldn’t say narcissistic as I don’t have that inflated an ego of myself.

 

You don't need an inflated ego to be narcissistic, Grandiosity comes in many forms.

 

What do you want - from this forum? (Start small.)

[Mr. Lucky]

I genuinely think some of my behaviour is sociopathic. I wouldn’t say narcissistic as I don’t have that inflated an ego of myself.

 

Big words, it might just be as simple as you're selfish and self-centered, no pathology involved. Assigning oneself a disorder is just another form of deflection - "I'm sick, so what can I do?".

 

There's a guy I work with who, ten years after his sick mom's passing, is still using her disabled parking placard. When I called him on it, he said "other people have no way of knowing whether I'm handicapped, and there's plenty of reserved parking spaces anyway".

 

You seem to be his marital equivalent...

 

Mr. Lucky

[SummerDreams]

She said she didn't love you anymore. What else is there to do?

 

 

Also, I don't consider his W wholy the victim. She knows the story and she chooses to stay. She can see her H is not there emotionally and she chooses to stay. Why is she a victim then?

[pepperbird]

 

Also, I don't consider his W wholy the victim. She knows the story and she chooses to stay. She can see her H is not there emotionally and she chooses to stay. Why is she a victim then?

 

 

I highly doubt she knows the extent of his cheating. I have a feeling he was quite adept at minimizing his actions, and she has no idea he was seeing lots of women behind her back.

[SummerDreams]

I highly doubt she knows the extent of his cheating. I have a feeling he was quite adept at minimizing his actions, and she has no idea he was seeing lots of women behind her back.

 

 

A woman does not need to know the full extent to realise her H is not there emotionally. Does it matter if he cheated with one woman or with ten? Cheating is cheating, and if she chooses to ignore it, then she no longer gets to be the victim.

[elaine567]

Also, I don't consider his W wholy the victim. She knows the story and she chooses to stay.

 

Nowhere does it say she knows the story.

It says he lied to cover up his cheating.

She no doubt trusted him.

That is the problem with blind faith and love...

A devious man can get away with almost anything if his wife trusts and believes in him...

 

All very well to be judgemental of BSs, but with little kids, as here, the whole situation changes. Even if she is aware, it is not easy to just blow up a marriage. Kids do not do well in divorces.

[SummerDreams]

Nowhere does it say she knows the story.

It says he lied to cover up his cheating.

She no doubt trusted him.

That is the problem with blind faith and love...

A devious man can get away with almost anything if his wife trusts and believes in him...

 

All very well to be judgemental of BSs, but with little kids, as here, the whole situation changes. Even if she is aware, it is not easy to just blow up a marriage. Kids do not do well in divorces.

 

 

So all the frustration we see in his posts his wife can't see in his behavior, his words, his actions? He was faithful for years and I bet he was a certain way, doesn't she notice the differences? I'm not saying she should abandon him, I'm saying she doesn't get to be the victim in my eyes. She is not a child, she knows that something is up and she chooses to ignore it. This is her own decision.