REAL LOVE Affair or Male Postnatal Depression? (Baby loss)

[Zinging]

There's a couple I know who are going down a similar road as you. There was infertility, multiple miscarriages and a lot of stress. The wife was able to make it past the previous miscarriage point for them; the husband turned 40 and started an affair.

 

He was texting the OW while his wife was in labor. As she and their newborn lay resting he and the OW were finalizing details for the next boink-fest.

 

He got caught and his wife left so he figured "my marriage is over; I might as well keep banging the OW." The BW came back and caught him again. He fully expected to be thrown out but wasn't and he didn't want to be that guy who abandoned his family so he stayed physically but not mentally.

 

The BW loves him and desperately wants him to love her too. She has no confirmation that the affair is over. She wants to save her family and is hanging on to every shred of hope whether real or imagined. She wants to assert boundaries but can't because he'll trample all over them and then whine about how she's ruining his fun. She wants to give consequences but he's totally cool with being thrown out so she's powerless.

 

She's admitted that she'll sob on the bathroom floor in view of him in the hopes that he'll see the devastation that he's caused, vow to fight for her and scoop her off the floor into his arms. What he actually does is walk away. He'll go to the living room and wait for her to come out; if she comes down upset then he'll leave the house. If she comes down calm then he expects the conversation to be over. He IS NOT INTERESTED in her pain.

 

He doesn't touch her or offer any physical reassurance. He can't even muster empty words of reassurance.

 

She keeps planning outings in order to show him how fun being a family is and recently planned a vacation. She looked so happy in the pictures because he had his arm around her and was taking pics to show the world (including the OW) how great they are together. Then they got home and the camera stopped and he's right back to ignoring her. She keeps trying, though, because she's determined to be able to tell their kids she tried everything.

 

I know the WH and he'll never show remorse, shame or repentance. He'd rather lose everything than experience guilt. He's also not going to initiate a divorce and will get upset if his wife initiates one.

 

Why won't he give her an answer about the affair? Why won't he try? Why won't he invest in their family, have a heartfelt conversation, go to counseling? Because he doesn't want to. Sometimes the answers are devastatingly simple.

 

Been reading relationship boards for nearly a decade... and every so often, when I think I've seen the worst, I'm proved wrong...

[stillafool]

 

...and yet the fact that his entire family seem to be condoning him and the 'thought' of them (& the OW past or present) talking about me, again it hurts and it feels like its on 'me'.

 

(

 

You can forget about his family abandoning him and supporting you. Blood is thicker than water and they will be with him through right and wrong. You need to lean on your family now. They are your support system. His family is no longer yours.

[Rainbows]

Prudence - you are correct. He has actually said that his family have basically said that to him.. (he said they have also said they are on 'his side'!)

But this is what riles me...selfishness.

 

Like I say, I also believe my husband has used a get out of jail free card on his family in my absence and blamed the 12 years estrangement mostly on me..he admits to me it wasnt, but he is playing the victim card for sure..and I understand that, he wants to avoid their confrontation and he has admitted they have picked him apart since they reconciled and that it hasnt been easy for him..

 

Pink Elephants, yes that is so very similar...when you were explaining the crying on the bathroom floor scenario - this is too familiar.

My husband struggled with emotions since I met him (he blamed his childhood and how his mother/father never hugged/comforted him so he doesnt know how to be when others cry etc as he only learnt to be alone)

But after being with me for 16yrs, he had made improvements toward connecting with his emotions, talking and knowing what to do to comfort someone...

But when the affair started, his comfort for me went out of the window and I noticed he started emotionally ignoring me again (along with our baby, as we know...)

Surely you cant avoid guilt unless your a sociopath etc?!

 

Stillafool, my husbands family were only in our lives for less than 3yrs, they were never a family to me as they (what I would describe as) 'bullied' me from day one.

I dont have anyone to lean on...no family support, friends have their own lives with the demands of children of similar ages etc.

 

Blood is obviously not thicker than water, or he would be here for his children and due to my relationship with my family, its not a saying I greatly believe in. (Which is why I am passionate about creating my own family and why this is so devastating for me)

My view of marriage is obviously influenced by my parents - whom met when they were 14...theres hardly any divorce in our family lines either compared to my husbands; where its harder to find a couple still married!

Also my idea of being a mother isnt to just condone 'wrong' behavior, but my husband parents let him do whatever he wanted as a child, he was in a bad way and still they didnt buckle down, so nothing has changed...let him do what he wants as long as he's there, like a piece on a chess board.

 

The Drs appointment didnt produce anything of help for me. I felt very lost.

[schlumpy]

Surely you cant avoid guilt unless your a sociopath etc?!

 

Sure you can Rainbows. You simply blame every problem on the other person, demonize them and rationalize to yourself that they are less then human. You get the people around you to agree so that maintaining the narrative is easier.

[PinkElephants]

Been reading relationship boards for nearly a decade... and every so often, when I think I've seen the worst, I'm proved wrong...

Tell me about it. He's the worst.

 

Surely you cant avoid guilt unless your a sociopath etc?!

Meh, it's nothing that dramatic. He's simply the kind of guy who would rather be physically uncomfortable than emotionally uncomfortable.

 

He'll lose his house, his wife, his kids, his retirement, and his dog before he gets on his knees and admits he's wrong because shame and guilt are more uncomfortable than living in a tent.

 

There's also the "out of sight, out of mind" factor so if he ignores his wife into being silent then the affair really isn't a problem. If she won't be silent then he'll leave and it's still out of sight.

 

It's possible that your husband is cut from the same cloth and living in his mom's back yard is preferable to being in a warm home with his family and a heaping load of shame.

 

Before you say it, there's nothing you can do about the shame. It's on him the second he walks through the door no matter what you do. You're sweet and loving and forgive him -> shame for not deserving the affection and forgiveness. You give him consequences -> shame for being a bad dog and peeing on the carpet.

[PinkElephants]

I KNOW that no one could ever justify his side of the story, even admitting all my faults etc, theres no excuse for any of this

This is a matter of perspective. What has your husband been telling people?

 

So I know this other couple. They'd been married for a while and then the husband up and left her. She was blindsided and furious; when asked she said they'd had a few little tiffs but it wasn't a big deal and definitely not worth ending the marriage over. That he should have talked to her about it before abandoning their family.

 

He was in tears of frustration saying he was completely miserable and that they can massive, irreconcilable issues. He'd brought up their problems but she either didn't acknowledge or didn't understand the severity of the issues.

 

They were living two completely different relationships despite being married to each other.

 

We'd known about their problems for years. He was vocal about it to everyone so I assumed that he'd been vocal with her too. The point is him abandoning her wasn't a surprise to anyone but the wife and we all understood why he wanted to leave.

 

Even here on LS the responses depend on who's telling the story. A wife is left out of the blue without a chance to save the marriage and the guy is a jerk. A husband complains his wife is cold, there's no sex or affection and everyone says to leave her. They could be married to each other but the demon of the story depends on who's talking.

 

how could anyone resist kicking his ass back to his family?

If your son/brother/cousin/friend came to you day after day in tears saying "I'm so miserable, it was a huge mistake to marry her and I hate going home because I feel so unloved" would you seriously try to force him to go home? Probably not because that's cruel.

 

We did, however, urge him to resolve things by either trying one last time or divorcing her. He went home and is the most miserable person I've ever met. He's put on about 100 lbs and gone completely gray. They've been to counseling but he still feels like he's banging his head against a brick wall and is so sick of his wife he won't even look at her. She constantly drapes herself all over him and he visibly recoils.

 

That can't really be what you want. The wife is miserable because she wants him to just get over the issues and adore her like a good husband should and the husband is miserable because he feels trapped and frustrated. He wants to leave but she won't let go.

 

How would you feel if your husband only came home for the kids and wishes he could be rid of you? What if he's visibly disgusted by your touch? What would you do if he was emotionally disengaged?

 

Their kid was born into this and has never known a day where Mom and Dad loved each other. She sees her parents ignoring each other, there's no affection in the marriage. One day she'll figure out that her dad constantly brings up separation until mom makes him drop it. She's never had stability because no one ever knows if they're separating, divorcing, reconciling, going to counseling or just ignoring each other. She sees mom throwing herself at dad and dad just wishes it would stop. What kind of relationship do you think she's going to grow up to have? We're all very concerned for this poor little girl because the example she's given is so toxic.

 

In both cases these people are forcing their kids to live in dysfunction so they can play out their toxic relationships. NO ONE is creating stability for the kids.

 

You say you're lost so find a direction. Your kids need a direction, too, and it's not going to be provided by your husband.

[Rainbows]

PinkElephants; Yes I agree with the out of sight out of mind concept in regards to how my husband may deal with something..

And yes like another poster mentioned earlier in the posts, my husband will see himself in his mothers failings of abandonment..he's seeking shelter where he can be accepted.

These two reasons above are why he's cut absolutely everyone he/we knew off..and moved to a different town.

 

It is hard and sad to understand how I cant help lift his shame (if this is the issue)

 

I completely agree and had already understood that my husband will be painting a totally different picture to his family, its the only way he could be the victim and not the villain...to give a reason for an affair(!), re-writing history for his own conscience also..thats a standard reaction for the cheating spouse I understand.

 

I understand what your saying re perspectives from whos telling the story...but there is still NO excuse under the sun for having an 'affair', & after your wife has just given birth.

If the poor husband was in a sexless marriage etc etc etc...sort it out or end the marriage? OR as soon as you commit the act of adultery...tell your spouse.

 

The very fact people are going around talking so openly about their relationship problems to other people shocks me? I never did that, but...I never actually had any problems so thats probably why(!)

We were both the smug married couple everyone always responded with 'Awww' after seeing us together!?

After my husband would declare how I was his best friend. He was never ashamed of loving me.

 

The situations you describe in your previous post, I say this with a smile because I know people will probably mock me here, like im deluded...but in complete honestly...we were completely in love!!!

When people would mention their relationships with their wives to my husband he would say openly and proudly; I dont really relate to that as I get on so well with my wife...we were the freaky couple whom people looked upon because we never got sick of one another...

This was NOT one sided, honestly, honestly...I feel like thats doubted 'now' because my husband has had an affair, but we had 16years before that affair, and that affair happened at the height of very very rare stressful events that could happen all at once for a couple...

Thats the tragedy.

 

I wasnt a puppet master he really did not have to go around giving this impression for 16years, I have spoken to his work colleagues - ie those werent mutual friends of ours, they were HIS friends, he could have confided in problems to them, but theyd tell me how he would talk about me all the time, he adored me, that was his reputation - happily married, family man.

He had told a colleague how he was terrified I was going to die upon the birth of our son...

We have all stood and thought could that have had a influence in him 'resenting' our son???

That was September.

In November he was in tears to me saying how terrified he was of loosing me.

And then the sudden affair...

I dont think im deluded in reflecting on my marriage

 

Even when we were with the counsellor - he said we had a very happy marriage, it was only upon our daughter turning 1 (ie the last year) that he had started to become unhappy...

and I DO understand and accept that a lot of that time I was a naggy, housewife, I was very ill, had no support etc etc, I never saw that he was unhappy, but in reflection I could have totally done more for him and thats again part of this tragedy because we just need a chance to try save the marriage now.

 

No, obviously I would not want my husband to return solely for the childrens sakes if 'I' honestly made him completely miserable - but this is what I simply cant believe because of the relationship we 'had', but certainly if he tried and we failed to make it worse, then that situation is going to be a lot easier on the heart/lot less confusing to be able to say we tried, we didnt throw a marriage away etc.

 

Even now, in the aftermath of this affair and abandonment, we get on well together. I dont think about the affair when im with him, I cant feel anything but love for him when he's in front of me.

How he feels I cant answer obviously.

But he's never said 'Im in love with the OW/I want a divorce/Im not happy'...instead he says 'You wont ever forgive me for this'

This is part of the confusion, if he wants to end it, even though that will never make sense to me - end it!

 

We cant ignore the fact that there are many many marriages that survive affairs etc. I know ive handled the situation all wrong, because I have followed my heart rather than my head.

But to not try will be the second biggest tragedy in our story

 

 

And still...I love him.

Edited November 20, 2019 by Rainbows

[Mr. Lucky]

In November he was in tears to me saying how terrified he was of loosing me.

 

Rainbows, that was November of last year. Are you willing to still be stuck in this same place November of next year?

 

At some point, it just doesn't pencil out anymore. Life is finite, your kids are only this age once. The months you're spending still thinking "what if" are precious commodities and in limited supply.

 

And I know it's easy for an outsider to say, but he's neither earned nor deserves to be given any more of your time and attention. Hope you take some small steps to put yourself first...

 

Mr. Lucky

[BaileyB]

It is hard and sad to understand how I cant help lift his shame (if this is the issue)

 

Because you are not a therapist. Only he is responsible for his own mental health.

 

There are things you control, and other things that you do not control. You must accept that you can not control his past and how it affects him, his family, his mental health, his decision to get with this other woman, and his abandonment of his own children and wife.

 

But he's never said 'Im in love with the OW/I want a divorce/Im not happy'...

 

Not in as many words, but most definitely by his actions.

 

We cant ignore the fact that there are many many marriages that survive affairs etc.

 

Sure, but these marriages have two partners who want to reconcile and save the marriage. You do not have that.

 

You can try as one person to ride a teeter totter, but it won’t happen. And yet, you seem to think that if you just try harder, and don’t give up, it will somehow happen...

 

As has been said above, it’s not hard to understand your desire to do everything you can to save a 16 year marriage. But, at some point you are going to have to accept and deal with the reality of the situation...

[pepperbird]

op,

it's so true that, especially when it comes to mental health, you can't fix them. No amount of time, gentle treatment, love or anything else you do can make him any different than he is right now.

 

He has to fix himself, and for that to happen, he will have to admit he has a problem and how deep it runs. For many, that can only come when they hit rock bottom, and they don't have a problem dragging their family along with them.

 

 

 

It may seem like he doesn't see the pain he's putting you and your children through, and that's likely because he can't. I used to be so angry at my husband when he couldn't see what he was doing to our family. I could see it, others could see it, why couldn't he?

 

His therapist explained that, for many people with mental illness, so much mental energy and focus is spent on keeping themselves afloat they simply have none left over for anyone else. He couldn't be there to help us cope as he was all tied up in helping himself.

 

Since we are all "adults" ( my youngest kid is 16) we were able to talk all this over, and decided, as a family unit, what to do. Would they stick around while he went through all of this again, or would our two oldest be better off being on their own while he heals? ( they're in their early 20's and in university)

 

They decided that, so long as he's getting help for his rages, etc., they would stay. Your kids aren't old enough to make that choice, and have no say in the impact your husband's actions will have on them so you need to be their voice right now. Love him or not, do you think he's capable of being a good farther and husband? If not, how long will you wait for him to pull up his socks before you finally say "enough" and really mean it?

[Rainbows]

Its now been 6 weeks with no contact and no visit from my husband.

He'd only seen the children for '2hours' 6 weeks ago, before that the last visit was over 2 months ago.

 

I do have some clues that the OW is back with her ex partner!...

This would align with the timing of my husband's depression followed by 'drastic' cut off (ie normally he would make an excuse etc - this is stone cold silence, I only know he's alive due to some money being spent from our account still etc)

 

So I figured he must be going through some guilt/depression, and so I backed off the contact to allow him that time.

I sent him a few articles on guilt after affairs etc to help...he's recently replied to literally just say 'he' was ok, dont worry....so I asked him to clarify was he struggling or not? No response. He just said He misses the kids and hope they are ok.

 

Im so confused. What is he planning? To never see us again? Whats stopping him from seeing them!?

Whats this time, this silence about - why cant he say he is struggling and just needs some time...but as usual all I get is SILENCE.

 

I reached out to his family again, I was ignored

 

So again it bounces back to me feeling utterly repulsive....

This man has lost everything, and if Im right, now even his affair...and yet after loosing everything - he still would rather turn himself away than make steps toward just 'trying' to work on our marriage and family...

I feel like the worst person on the planet.

 

Im struggling again and I feel like theres no where to turn, Ive been to the GP, im waiting on counseling, but wheres the immediate help when I have children that depend on me and only me and I cant be my best

[BaileyB]

Well Rainbows, it goes without saying that what you are doing is not “no contact.” You continue to reach out to this man and his family. Their response is pretty clear.

 

I hope you get in to see the counsellor soon. Do you have friends who can help if you need it?

[BaileyB]

I feel like the worst person on the planet.

 

As difficult as it is to accept, it’s not about you or your children. This is all about him - his mental health, his unwillingness to seek treatment, and his resulting very poor decisions.

[elaine567]

Yes he may be indeed be struggling

BUT not necessarily.

Just because you are struggling you are assuming he is struggling too. He may not be.

He is maybe glad he has been relieved of you, his kids and the OW.

All of which no doubt caused him loads of stress.

You are not him, he is not you.

 

He was the dumper here.

If you look on the break-up section of the forum, the dumpees hearts are breaking, but the dumpers, though maybe a bit sad, a bit nostalgic at times are often just glad to be "free"...

 

Time to set yourself "free".

You can't help people who do not want to be helped.

[Mr. Lucky]

Well Rainbows, it goes without saying that what you are doing is not “no contact.”

 

In her usual direct way, Bailey is indeed right. It begs the question why, if you're feeling down and your mood and emotional energy are in limited supply, you continue to invest those resources in him? And with little or no return...

 

I think it calls for a little righteous anger. He's abandoned his family, ignored his children and betrayed his wife. Might be time to consider him to be the selfish fool he's proved himself to be...

 

Mr. Lucky

[Prudence V]

 

What is he planning?

 

Probably nothing. I doubt planning is even on his horizon. Right now he’s probably stumbling from moment to moment, waiting for someone with a magic wand to provide him with answers and a wonderful life.

 

You’re acting toward him as if he was a rational person. Perhaps he used to be, but that ship has sailed. Right now he’s not capable of rational response, and you’re only going to be disappointed if you keep hoping for one. My advice, from my own past experience with this, is to accept that you’re in this alone from here on out. Get on with parenting your kids as best you can as a single parent, and if they ask about him, tell them he’s unwell, and that hopefully one day he may recover. But for now - it’s just you and them.

 

You can hope he gets the help he needs, but unless he seeks it and is open to it, that’s not going to happen and you can’t wish him well. Maybe at some point in the future he may recover to some extent. Maybe he won’t. But you can’t hold your breath - and those of your children - waiting for that. Decades on, my xH has never returned to “how he used to be”. He has some kind of relationship with his kids, though they’re the adults in that relationship, and when he takes his meds and listens to his doctors he generally manages to stay relatively healthy... but that’s not always the case. He was recently admitted against his will and once again, others are cleaning up the trail of damage he left behind him. That isn’t something you want to drag your kids into. Let him contact them when he’s healthy, or let them seek him out when they’re old enough to deal with his condition. For now, though, they need a parent. Your attention needs to be on them, and on you - not on him.

[BaileyB]

Prudence is absolutely correct.

 

This has also been my experience with mental health. He is likely not planning, and as crazy as this sounds - he probably has little if any awareness of how his behavior is affecting others. You will be sadly disappointed every time if you are expecting a reasonable or rational response from this man.

 

This is a new day, and you must deal with the situation as it occurs now. Your children do need a healthy parent, and they won’t have that if you continue to exhaust your emotional resources on a man who has turned away...

[pepperbird]

I second that Prudence is 100 percent correct. Right now, your husband can;t be who you want/need him to be.

 

Mental illness can be devastating. Hopefully, he will recover. If he keeps running, he may never will.

[S2B]

He’s not struggling. 

 

People change when ghey are uncomfortable enough to change things. He’s perfectly comfortable and you are helping him stay comfortable by not rocking the boat.

 

tell him to sign over the house and kids to you and pay for it all. If he wants a girlfriend and to abandon his family then make him pay you.

 

the more you keep being so understanding  - the more things remain the same - and you and your kids suffer because he decided to be a walk away husband.

 

start demanding things from him! Demand that he support all of you legally (with a court order) and make sure he gets a life insurance policy where you are the beneficiary. You need assurance that if something happens to him you and the kids have some money!

 

he wants a girlfriend? He can pay through the nose to have that girlfriend!

 

nothing changes if nothing changes! You want change? Then change this... he isn’t gonna change a thing! He will continue to avoid reality by avoiding you and running away with his fantasy life.

 

hes a coward and a thief by stealing your future. Why would you want someone you don’t even recognize? He is who you thought he WAS! This is who he is now! 

 

I hope you dont want him - he isn’t being kind or loving to you and your kids. 

 

 

[pepperbird]

how are you doing OP?

With the holidays coming up, I hope you're okay.

 

Do you have any holiday traditions with your fmaily? Have you thought about starting some new ones, just you and your kids?

[Rainbows]

Hello,

 I havent been able to post for a while.

We have now reached the year marker since I discovered my husbands affair.

The theory that 'time heals' is disproven by the fact Ive felt recently like im suffering the same amount as when it first happenned. Im still in mourning.

I STILL do NOT know if the affair is ongoing or not.

 

Christmas was awful, although I loved watching the children open their presents, it only emphasised how worthless I feel within myself. The reality is I have no one but my children...

It was pretty awful, I had no company, no presents (despite our children being just 3 and 1, my husband didnt even get me a card from them) we didnt have a Christmas dinner as id been so ill prior I couldnt get any food in and the TV broke!

He came round Christmas day and all I could do was cry in the other room at the contrast of what our family unit had now become, he could only stay an hour as he had to leave to have his big Christmas meal with his reunited 'family'.

He had a tear in his eye presumably feeling sorry for us and over the next few days spent some more time with us, which actually equated more time than the whole year!

And guess what happens next....he's cut me off dead again.

And it HURTS. Everytime.

 

Im seeing a counsellor now, who can identify how low my esteem is but there really seems to be no sign of me giving up on this man, on this family, I see the fault in myself yet I just cant stop TRYING.

I also cannot get over the shock still, I cant get over how a marriage with such young children could be just 'thrown' away - without ANY effort, conversation, nothing. Just one day he's here and the next he's gone...trading us in for what? Nothing should be able to pull your attention away from your babies...

I just suffer this shock every single morning and every night I still dream about him.

Everyone tells me to move on, that doesnt help me?! Im going through some mental health crisis from this and it is not as simple as the pain that I feel.

Ive found AffairRecovery vlogs online helpful, learning how chasing the 'unfaithful' only pushes them away, and I completely understand it! But to not do anything to try save my family feels so wrong to me, and for me to say to my husbnad 'im done' doesnt feel right either as it would feel like I was lying...I stay true to myself and my feelings by constantly messaging him and yet I KNOW its probably having the opposite effect.

Still....we are using our joint account, he's helped to renew this years bills, he isnt mentioning divorce, there is no sign of an official relationship coming out of this affair, still this 'secret' limbo.

Please, I know what I 'should' be doing, but the problem is how do I do it when the pain is so great - I am emotionally NOT detaching from this man, no matter what and THAT is my problem.

 

[schlumpy]

I haven't forgotten about you Rainbows. I'm very sorry things have not improved for you. All I can offer now is a prayer that someone will come into your life and get you moving in the right direction. I'm not inferring a new love interest. Just someone with some compassion for your plight. Someone who might be able to heal from a past wrong in their life by helping you. Meanwhile, please post when the mood takes you. 

[vla1120]

3 hours ago, Rainbows said:

Im seeing a counsellor now, who can identify how low my esteem is but there really seems to be no sign of me giving up on this man, on this family, I see the fault in myself yet I just cant stop TRYING.

I also cannot get over the shock still, I cant get over how a marriage with such young children could be just 'thrown' away - without ANY effort, conversation, nothing. Just one day he's here and the next he's gone...trading us in for what? Nothing should be able to pull your attention away from your babies...

I just suffer this shock every single morning and every night I still dream about him.

Everyone tells me to move on, that doesnt help me?! Im going through some mental health crisis from this and it is not as simple as the pain that I feel.

Still....we are using our joint account, he's helped to renew this years bills, he isnt mentioning divorce, there is no sign of an official relationship coming out of this affair, still this 'secret' limbo.

Please, I know what I 'should' be doing, but the problem is how do I do it when the pain is so great - I am emotionally NOT detaching from this man, no matter what and THAT is my problem.

 

I am glad you are seeing a therapist. What does your therapist suggest to you for helping to move forward?

I feel like, at this point, you should get MAD. He's having his cake and eating it too by keeping you hanging out on the back burner while he decides what he wants. It's been over a year, now. 

Have you seen a lawyer for advice to help you protect your interests? I know this must be so hard for you to even think about because you would consider it a step toward giving up, but it would also be a step toward shaking him out of this fantasy world he's living in, that he thinks he can just keep you dangling for the unforeseeable future. It's not fair to you. 

Keep working with your therapist toward coming to terms with a situation over which you have no control. If this therapist is not helping you figure out a way to move forward, ask for a recommendation for another therapist who give you the support you need. (I've been to many therapists, not all of whom have been helpful. I usually give it a month or two (at least 3-4 visits) and if I am not getting what I need, I ask for a referral to another therapist. For me personally, I need someone who will call me on my bullsh#$ and challenge me to make the changes I need to make in my life. Someone sitting across the room from me just nodding their head in agreement to everything I say has never been useful for me.

[HappiDays]

Hi Rainbows.  As I read your thread I noticed that as time has passed your self esteem has seemed to get less and less. If you don't grab yourself by your bootstraps soon and find a way to turn things around you may suffer permanent irreparable damage. You speak often about how much your kids mean to you so if you can't find a reason to change the way you feel about yourself let your kids be the reason.  You have to respect yourself before you can expect others to respect you.

 

Do for them what you won't do for yourself, that is to start the process of liking yourself and respecting yourself again. Start by researching how to learn to like yourself again (Google!!), and similar key words. Then using advice and techniques found start with the first step you feel comfortable with and follow through faithfully. Every time you try to talk yourself out of doing whatever you decided to do remind yourself that you are doing it for your kids, so they will have the best possible parent you can be for them.   

 

Don't let yourself stay in a negative frame of mind. Always strive for the positives, once again for your kids. Make a plan and stick to it until you can see the sun shining again. And if you work at it you will.

 

I just thought I would throw out some food for thought. Best wishes for you going forward.

[Rainbows]

Vla; I almost wish I was part of his 'cake', but Im all but to 'presume' that his periodically cutting me off is a message that he hopes by cutting me off I will just turn around and divorce him so he doesnt have to do anything...

The most frustrating part is however, I dont know, its all still GUESSING games, which could be very wrong

Happidays; Perhaps my self esteem has gotten lower, Im in a place that I believe I will be alone forever now, its not whats driving my thoughts however, as my husband is on my mind literally 24/7...no matter how busy I am, even when im enjoying time with my children, I smile and then instantly think how he's missing out, how much better that moment would have been if he'd have been here to experience it also, even though it is his 'choice' to sacrifice his children for his affair(!?) - I think the difficult journey we went through to create our family has a lot to do with it.

We went through so much, and then THIS.🤯