Contacting previous women who have rejected me and asking why they said no.

[ZA Dater]

He'd either tell me to be quiet because he doesn't want to hear about it, or he'd probably tell me to stop focusing on women so much and just focus on making a lot of money.

 

I think you need to pursue what makes you happy. Has dating made you happy? Does sound like it, so why not just take a break from it?

 

Open your eyes again, give thanks for what you do have, acknowledge your weaknesses and try work on them. The dating game is unfortunately very rigid, you are never going to convince that lady you do like to go out with you if you convince yourself you have no chance. You need to look objectively, look around, look at what other people do, look how other people act, then decide if you want try work with some of those seemingly universal facets.

 

I am not saying its right because it definitely is not but seemingly its the only way one can find some success. People tell me having lots of friends helps in terms of introductions.

 

Rejection gets to you but only if you allow it, you need to be a bit stronger here in view. Yes, you will meet the odd amazing person and rejection will hurt but most of the rejections I had, in hindsight the people were completely unsuitable to begin with.

 

What I have learnt is looks and confidence can get you a look being very social can make you a catch. Unfortunately some have these attributes, others have less of them so the playing field will never really be equal. You need to work with what you have.

 

If you don't find anything, well you can always window shop, go on enough dates and you will eventually realise its not really all that fantastic on the whole, there needs to be a certain meeting of minds and attraction both of which are difficult to find if one doesn't conform to a certain degree. The world is a cruel place, there is no much goodwill in dating, none in fact.

 

The best dating experiences were ones where I wasn't on a date at all. I cannot overstate the value of a good friend, I have a lady friend and she has offered me more, taught me more, encouraged me more and just generally intentionally or not offered me a look at what the non physical aspect of dating can be like and I wont lie notwithstanding the above if you do click with someone and communicate well then the simplest thing can be very nice, for example a walk through a picturesque town.

 

You are certainly not doomed.

[normal person]

- Getting leg lengthening surgery which would give me an extra 2-3 inches of height to increase my dating prospects

 

At 5'5" or 5'6", you'll still be much too short for the majority of women to consider dating you, and I imagine the procedure is horrifically painful, time consuming, and expensive.

 

- Getting plastic surgery on my face so women would find me facially more attractive

 

Meh, seems like a waste. Your face (presumably) isn't the problem, and plastic surgery won't mask your other issues that are actually the things preventing you from getting what you want.

 

- Moving to the Phillipines where women are usually short and allegedly they are very attracted to white men.

 

Is it worth it to leave everything and everyone you know and love to move across the planet and adapt to a new way of life for the possibility that you might have sex somewhat easier?

 

- Going to a prostitute with the hope that it would give me sexual experience and maybe take away some of the need for sex.

 

It "might," however that still won't satisfy you and you'll ultimately find yourself back to being miserable once the novelty wears off and you're left wondering why women only like you when you give them money. Also, you expose yourself to a number of health risks, legal risks, embarrassment, etc.

 

He'd either tell me to be quiet because he doesn't want to hear about it, or he'd probably tell me to stop focusing on women so much and just focus on making a lot of money.

 

Honestly, while not the easiest, this is the best option in my opinion. It's obvious women don't respect you as you are now. You'd gain a lot of respect if you knew how to make a lot of money. Before I get bombarded with hate -- yes, it's sad that the world is like this, no, I don't endorse this on a purely moralistic level, but we live in a capitalist society, and that's sometimes what it takes to get what you want, whether or not you or I like it. In general, the more money you have, the better a provider and protector you are, the more women (and men) will respect you. There is a salary you can earn or a net worth you can have that will eventually make ears perk. If you want to have some degree of selection beyond women you find undesirable, you need to offer something in return. Given your circumstances, you'll probably need a lot of money. People are reading this now and furiously typing out replies about how stupid I am because they know a 5'5" guy with uncontrollable body odor who works as an accountant that's the life of the party and happily married. They are all the exceptions to the rule and people typically will only respond to disagree and won't chime in just to reinforce what I've said. I'm sure there are marginal cases, but right now, your history and frustration have shown that you aren't one of them.

 

If you're in IT, you've got the footing for this. You can settle into a standard IT career which would be fine by most peoples' standards, but even if you're making $100-200K you'll still be competing with everyone else making the same amount. Last I heard the FAANGs offer a pretty lucrative career trajectory where you make more than enough to offset the cost of living in the bay after some years, plus stock. That can easily turn into seven figures after several years. Or, if you start or get in on the ground floor of a startup that gets bought out, there's your winning lottery ticket. With several million dollars in your pocket, people will think twice about you and start to overlook the other stuff. That's the way it is. Yes, it's extreme. Yes, it's a lot of work for something that everyone else seemingly gets handed to them. But while difficult, I think the process of working to achieve something and succeeding will give you purpose and make you naturally happy. The collateral effects of which will be the confidence, circumstances, and aura that you need to be the person people chase, not the person who chases others. Do something difficult to achieve your goal, "win," get paid handsomely for it, and everything else will fall into place.

 

You're not in a position to try and do it backwards or concurrently, and trying that will just bring you more of the same. What's crucial is to not let your pursuit of women become the primary focus in your life, everything else will suffer, and as a result, your standing with women will suffer. Focus on achieving and finding purpose (hopefully something that pays you particularly well), then the women will follow. I know someone who prioritized his relationships throughout his teens and twenties and then had a bit of a crisis when his life wasn't where he wanted it to be in his 30s, and his relationship suffered as a result. If you're not in a position to capitalize now, you need to think longer term.

 

I know it's not too savory to hear, but it's basically the way I see things for you. I'm open to criticism.

Edited October 1, 2019 by normal person

[mark clemson]

Yes, it's a lot of work for something that everyone else seemingly gets handed to them.

 

Just a point of fact - there are actually many many people in the world who don't get this handed to them. Hence PUAs/incel/MGTOW, etc, not to mention all the lonely single women in the world.

 

The nice thing about focus on a career is that you should probably be doing it anyway and is an achievement that you will always have.

 

I respectfully disagree that this can't be done concurrently with other efforts.

[ZA Dater]

If you're in IT, you've got the footing for this. You can settle into a standard IT career which would be fine by most peoples' standards, but even if you're making $100-200K you'll still be competing with everyone else making the same amount. Last I heard the FAANGs offer a pretty lucrative career trajectory where you make more than enough to offset the cost of living in the bay after some years, plus stock. That can easily turn into seven figures after several years. Or, if you start or get in on the ground floor of a startup that gets bought out, there's your winning lottery ticket. With several million dollars in your pocket, people will think twice about you and start to overlook the other stuff. That's the way it is. Yes, it's extreme. Yes, it's a lot of work for something that everyone else seemingly gets handed to them. But while difficult, I think the process of working to achieve something and succeeding will give you purpose and make you naturally happy. The collateral effects of which will be the confidence, circumstances, and aura that you need to be the person people chase, not the person who chases others. Do something difficult to achieve your goal, "win," get paid handsomely for it, and everything else will fall into place.

 

No criticism from me because I think you are quite right and there is some fulfilment from challenging oneself to achieve out of the dating world and to he honest completing a great merger or suchlike gives me more a thrill than 95% of the dates I have been on.

 

OP you need to look around and stop seeing problems but start seeing solutions.

 

I have learnt something else when someone tell me I cant do something I go out to the prove them wrong so when people tell me to go for people I don't find attractive I see that as a challenge to aspire to get what I want. I might never get it but trust me the chase is worth it because it gives you focus, in life you need to be careful to not devote too much focus to one particular thing as the expense of other things, I did that when I was your age and to some extent I regret doing that

 

Don't put ladies on a pedestal, I have sat having lunch with a fairly well known international model and I have sat having lunch with a care giver. Fundamentally the same, yes the one excited me more because she lived a interesting life but I treated them exactly the same, spoke to them in the same way.

 

Despite what some say, chase what is incredible to you because you will get smacked to the ground, but YOU will always know you are chasing what you really want. An ex friend married a wholly unremarkable lady because "we had chemistry in bed" to me this was the most pathetic reason to marry someone but for him it was all that mattered so NO we wont all universally match which is what makes dating hard because we don't all covet the same things. All you can do is go out and be the best version of yourself.

 

Its incredibly hard and I relate more you can imagine but I took a conscious decision to step back and let it go, enjoy life, enjoy what I do have and worry less about what I couldn't really control and that is dating. Yes you live with a degree of being lonely but I'd rather be that than look at someone and always know she doesn't wow me at all.

Edited October 1, 2019 by ZA Dater

[Pat77]

You exaggerate. Not dateless for almost 25 years because you weren't suppose to date for the first 16 years or so of your life!! Also, you're not that short. I'm 5'4" and I've always considered myself really tall. I mean, I feel tall, and always try not to block the view of people behind me.

 

Your idea is actually not bad. But I'd tweek it. Find the friendliest woman of the bunch, and instead of asking her why she rejected you (which is rather confrontational), just tell her you get that you two were not a match, but could she help you with your dating. Treat her as a friend. Ask about hair, clothing, what women like, etc. When she tells you what you should do differently, from that you can figure out why she rejected you.

 

But it doesn’t have to be a style thing or that there was something wrong with that person as to why somebody rejected them.

 

A lot of times people just don’t have chemistry with someone on that level. It doesn’t mean the person was lacking something who got rejected.

 

I have female friends who are physically attractive and have very good personalities and would make great partners but we vibe like brothers and sisters I wouldn’t date them but nothing is wrong with them.

Edited October 1, 2019 by Pat77

[an0nym0us123]

 

 

One thing you should realize is that the 20's is when things are most stacked against men. The women are at their best and getting chased by all kinds of horny guys. Esp. the top 20% attractive ones - most of those have more interest than they know what to do with.

 

This switches sometime around the early 30's for a variety of reasons. So, time is genuinely on your side.

 

I think you are right up to a point. There will be some women who missed the boat and are more keen to settle and start a family. However a huge number of early 30's single women have kids, and a lot of us that dont have kids ourselves do not want anything to do with this situation.

 

On top of this there seems to be a fair amount of baggage with many this age, exs lurking in the background, domestic abuse in previous relationships. Ive met all kinds online. One her ex beat her and caused her to have a miscarriage. These women could end up extemely damaged goods and may simply be undateable for the rest of their lives.

 

That said there are a small number who have it together and are single. But from what ive seen here in my part of the world, actual women who would be considered wife material are pretty rare by 30.

Edited October 1, 2019 by an0nym0us123

[Foxhall]

what about this guitar playing? get more out of your interest in music,

 

get to a level where you can play at local events and gigs

 

set up a meet-up group for people interested in piano,

 

relax in terms of women, your goal is to hold a conversation, chat to them about your interest in music and work at having a few lines or conversation starters to hand when the need arises,

 

the kind of rejection you are experiencing with women, I suspect, is due to not being able to hold a normal conversation with them,

 

you need to be able to put a woman at ease by chatting easily and casually to her,

this can seem daunting if you are shy and awkward, but it also a learned skill and something which you can get better at,

you will also find that some women are easier to talk too than others, so do not get disheartened by any awkward conversations.

 

 

agreeing with the others here, you are probably way too focused on sex and that will not happen for you funnily enough until you stop wanting it so much,not easy I know when your sex drive is through the roof!

 

as I say your goal has to be to put a woman at ease make her enjoy your company,

sex will follow at a later stage once you master holding conversation,

 

this interest in music should open up plenty of possibilities for you to meet women,

dont be looking for excuses to not bother,

 

confidence too can be pretty transient, I can foresee your whole confidence level spiraling upwards once you get a bit of a boost with women.

[elaine567]

That said there are a small number who have it together and are single. But from what ive seen here in my part of the world, actual women who would be considered wife material are pretty rare by 30.

 

You are talking uneducated women, plenty educated women get married in their thirties... it is par for the course.

[preraph]

Anonymous, that age thing and whether they're single varies from place to place. Here in the US, it's not really true. Lots of people wait until their 30s or don't marry at all.

[snowboy91]

The initial stages of "the game" are visual and social. You may be having issue there for the reasons you mention. For that reason I still think:

- You should do everything reasonably possible to make yourself as attractive as possible. Do you have clear skin, a nice haircut, and nice clothes (in college wearing a dress shirt around

might

set you apart)? You could ask a

platonic

female friend or two (not prior dates) for honest feedback on these points.

 

- Socially, consider trying to appear as relaxed/casual/confident as possible when speaking with women. Being smart is fine, but try not to come across as too left-brained or always steer the conversation to intellectual interests. Try to let your artistic side "flourish" a bit, including in how you converse. Remember that each woman is a unique individual and try to experience and appreciate her as such, whether or not you end up together. Playing some guitar or even writing a song for her might go over quite well, just don't be overbearing about it and make sure you do that in an appropriate social context.

 

 

I have to agree with these points the most. Sure, you may be a bit on the shorter side, but from my experience it's not a deal breaker. In my hometown I'

m

considered quite short, and I've had no problem with getting a reasonable amount of attention.

 

At 24, you're still on the young side - for context, I'

m

28 and I honestly think I didn't really come into my own until around your age. What changed was I started to see myself more positively and focused on a lot of the positive things in my life - which made me want to express myself differently. I developed a much better sense of style, and became a lot more social. You might still be yet to come into your own - and for some people it doesn't happen until their 30s.

 

In terms of "making yourself attractive" - you can't change your face or your height, but you can change your hair and what you're wearing. Get creative, don't be afraid to pick out something you wouldn't normally wear. Some of my favourite shirts are ones I was really unsure about at first.

 

As for the social side - I get you have an active social life, which is a great start. In a previous post was it mentioned you have Asperger's? If

so

I'd say you certainly cope with most social situations really well, but I wonder if there is something different about a dating situation that might be throwing you off a little. If you're on a date, do you talk mostly about yourself or do you show a lot of interest in the other person? If you're talking mostly about yourself it can come across a bit showy/stuck up.

 

My point is I think you're 80% of the way there - your approach may need more minor adjustments than you think.

[ZA Dater]

I think you are right up to a point. There will be some women who missed the boat and are more keen to settle and start a family. However a huge number of early 30's single women have kids, and a lot of us that dont have kids ourselves do not want anything to do with this situation.

 

That said there are a small number who have it together and are single. But from what ive seen here in my part of the world, actual women who would be considered wife material are pretty rare by 30.

 

Much the same is true where I live. By 30 all the "top tier" attractive ladies are either married or in long term relationships. What is available by and large is as you say a single parent with lots of baggage and really not an overall attractive prospect unless one is inclined to try and "fix".

 

OP, why don't you take up something like yoga, I am told that's a great way to meet ladies?

[Envy123]

Much the same is true where I live. By 30 all the "top tier" attractive ladies are either married or in long term relationships. What is available by and large is as you say a single parent with lots of baggage and really not an overall attractive prospect unless one is inclined to try and "fix".

 

OP, why don't you take up something like yoga, I am told that's a great way to meet ladies?

 

This is the case with me as well.

 

One of my ex-co-workers is an older woman, is pretty cute and single.

 

The problem is that she is rather flighty - she tends to fly to random places on a whim, being away from her home a few days at a time. It's often done on impulse, which isn't what I like. And she tends to boast about her adventures on social media and she makes it a game of just how much money she has. (despite working a low-paid job)

 

Other ex-co-workers around her age are already married, engaged or in a long term relationship.

[mr_ybor]

this interest in music should open up plenty of possibilities for you to meet women,

 

Meh... as a musician and guitar player (granted, only studio active at this point, but in a band that played out in the past) who plays modern styles to boot... I wouldn't agree with that. Especially in his age group. Twenty-something women DGAF about guitar-based music in general.

 

The occasional one who does (like my last girlfriend, 23), you probably can impress her in spades, but it's the equivalent of trying to pick up women as a Boomer as a trap DJ.

Edited October 2, 2019 by mr_ybor