Physical abuse by fathers. Common?

[Shanex]

Hey LS,

 

It’s something I have never mentioned before on this forum, and this is what prompt me the question: how common is physical abuse from a father to his children? It’s obviously impossible to come up with any « stats » about it beside the sordid anecdotes I heard here and there from even close friends.

 

Granted, I wasn’t a lovely guy as a teen, quite the contrary and apparently this was deserving of being beaten up by my father then, until he almost broke my nose punching me. I’m not talking a mere slap.

 

It’s not easy to share this honestly. I never found him any excuses for what he did to me then. I don’t think there is any excuse anyway to beat your children until they bleed. No matter how obnoxious we can be.

 

As you might have guessed I never filled a police complaint/report. It’s not so easy either for a 14 year old to go to the police station and let it all out.

 

If you want to share something, feel free to do so otherwise thanks for reading.

[CautiouslyOptimistic]

I'm so sorry that was your experience . I'm in my forties, and in my close friend group I can't think of any of them who were beaten by their fathers .

[amaysngrace]

He sounds like he has major issues, Shanex. It’s really hard to understand how someone could be so bad at a being a person when you’re opposite of them.

 

No, regardless of you being obnoxious or unruly or whatever as a young teen, he was the adult and should’ve handled it more appropriately. Beating the crap out of his child just shows how he was lacking.

 

It’s no reflection on you at all. He most likely would’ve lashed out the same way had another pushed him to a certain limit. So it’s not you, it’s him. 100% him.

[Shanex]

Thanks to you both CO and grace,

 

The relationship with my father is still sometimes chilling, not because of what he did to me then but despite my efforts to still talk and see him every other week; we occasionally argue about my own relationship with my GF or various other things. Luckily not to the point of engaging in a fight though.

 

Anyway, no. Theres never any excuse to beat up your children and even though I realize teens can be quite unruly and rebels, there are far better and smarter ways to handle children’s behavior.

 

Unfortunately this seemed to be more common then than now (or for the better instead). While beating your children was already frowned upon then, these days this could land someone in jail, rightly so IMO.

 

The damages on one’s health are pretty much irreversible. I’m fine in my life now but I still think about it now and then.

[Veronica73]

I’m sorry that happened to you.

 

I don’t think it’s common... but... possibly not uncommon either. One of my friends was physically abused by her father. But no one else I’m close to has ever mentioned that happening to them. Not to say it didn’t.

[major_merrick]

I think it happens more often than people want to admit. I think a lot of times it takes the form of spanking that goes too far, and then kids make excuses for it later in life. I know my father-in-law used corporal punishment on my husband when he was a kid. My husband has been pretty determined not to spank kids unless absolutely necessary. By his reactions to the idea of spanking, I'd say his dad crossed over into abuse.

 

In my own family, my father was a violent drunk. Anytime he felt like it, he took his anger out on me because he couldn't/wouldn't take it out on my mother. My mother was likely to be violent right back, but I was smaller and an easier target. Between the police brutality, the fights, and my father's beatings my back and arms have a lot of scars. Sometimes my father liked to use a leather strap to hit me, and he'd beat me until I bled. Sometimes he'd use a stick, or wrap a cloth around his hand and simply punch me in the stomach. I think it was the worst from when I was 8 to when I was 12. By the time I was 11-12, I spent most of my time outside of school away from my house just running the streets. When I came home and my father was mad, he'd try to beat my little sister, so I'd have to crouch over her like a human shield. My mom didn't see fit to divorce him until I was grown up and gone.

[Rayce]

I've posted about this before but my father like to beat on his family... wife and kids. I did call the cops but it didn't do any good... my dad was a cop. I grew up believing that all kids were getting beat by their parents. It wasn't until I grew up that I learned otherwise.

[preraph]

It isn't as common as it used to be. Anytime you have someone punching someone, that it their rage, not discipline. I believe in rare spankings, but that is not the same thing. Spankings should be measured out and not done in a rage either. And parents should try everything else first. Spankings shouldn't be brutal, should be done immediately so it's associated with the behavior, and should be reserved for situations in which your child isn't listening and is putting themself in actual danger, like running away from you into a street, or being violent towards you or others. I know some will say a kid who isn't spanked won't be violent, but that isn't true. I know two with parents who don't believe in spanking and both of them have hit their parents before or shoved them, charged them like a bull ramming into them.

 

Discipline has to be started young, under say age 7, and be consistent and not let them wear you down. I think some kids are out of control today because some parents think kids can't learn that young, but of course they can. So that's the time to discipline them in the nonviolent ways so it gets hardwired into their growing brains that you are the boss of them, because you're still able to physically overpower them if necessary and take privileges and electronics away and make them earn things with good behavior.

 

What happened to you was definitely bad abuse. I'm sorry you had to grow up with that. Remember that man was your role model, so whatever you were doing to get in trouble, was probably something you saw him do or some way he acted. Your father was no doubt similarly abused as a child. He is continuing the cycle. When someone is physically abused, they often grow up with rage, often outbursts of uncontrolled rage, with certain triggers.

 

Of course, you too often see ragers who only rage at their wife or their kids and never rage at work. Those people could control their rage if they wanted to. Those people need anger management training. Rage is grounded in fear. Anyone with quick rage needs to either get in therapy or take an anger management course. In there my understanding one thing you learn is what prompts rage, which is fear, and then coping techniques. Most people, once they learn it reflects their own fear, and that some other people are aware of that, don't want to show that anymore.

 

You either continue the cycle and accept that model as your role model or you rebel against it. The latter is more healthy. Without good role models, I'd advise a lot of people to take a parenting course before having kids and to take it with their spouse so they're on the same page. Because you don't have healthy parenting skills if you grew up in an abusive household.

 

One of the hardest thing for child abuse victims to accept and face is that their mother didn't stop it. Some are never willing to face that, and when they do, it's devastating because they may have thought of her as the nice one. But weak and tolerant is just as inexcusable. In today's world and with the awareness we have today, there's very few instances a woman couldn't leave a bad man and get away.

 

Learn to parent, learn to control your rage, learn to break the cycle.

 

By the way, seems to me you turned out pretty good, so you're a survivor.

[major_merrick]

One of the hardest thing for child abuse victims to accept and face is that their mother didn't stop it.

 

 

This statement is definitely true. For me, my mother didn't stop it and was an active participant. She'd act like she loved me, and then would turn around and trade my off for favors from her friends. Sometimes she'd watch as my father beat me and did nothing at all, but would almost enjoy it. I think she resented getting pregnant at a young age. I know she didn't want me, and she definitely didn't want my sister. I think that kids whose mothers are less attached to them are more vulnerable to abuse.

[Shanex]

Some great points preraph and you’re most definitely right that my father was just probably equally abused as a child by my grandfather (who I despised too, a violent and bad-tempered alcoholic who never admitted he did wrong to his family).

 

Anyway I agree with everything you say but wanted to highlight the terrible « cycle » you mention. You’ve been physically abused then repeat this shyte over your own children? Goodness me if I should have some kids later I’d rather punch myself before them.

 

For very few parents that’s « authority » and a way to gain respect from your children. Truth be told, very few people in the remaining family on my father side still talk to him; beside me. He’ll most likely die alone and miserable and while I’m not looking forward to it, the terrible memories from my teen years with him will make it hard for me to be compassionate.

[preraph]

This statement is definitely true. For me, my mother didn't stop it and was an active participant. She'd act like she loved me, and then would turn around and trade my off for favors from her friends. Sometimes she'd watch as my father beat me and did nothing at all, but would almost enjoy it. I think she resented getting pregnant at a young age. I know she didn't want me, and she definitely didn't want my sister. I think that kids whose mothers are less attached to them are more vulnerable to abuse.

 

You had a brutal childhood. It's affecting a lot of what you do now.

 

Her getting pregnant was her own fault. Birth control has been widely available and widely used for decades now. She has no excuse. She was probably a mental mess and too disorganized and irresponsible to even see to birth control. Sorry you grew up like that.

 

I know you don't like anyone establishment, including psychologists, but you have a lot you really need to get a wider perspective on than the specialized environment you've put yourself in and therapy might be one way to really understand better how what happened to you affected you and just get it all out and feel some emotional relief.

[preraph]

You’ve been physically abused then repeat this shyte over your own children? Goodness me if I should have some kids later I’d rather punch myself before them.

 

I know, but some people got no empathy as children from anywhere and therefore didn't develop any empathy. You know, kids are not born good. They have to be taught empathy and things like that. Neglected and abused kids are a lot of our criminals and violent offenders, but if they grow up with no empathy, no amount of rehab has been able to fix them. There's just no raw material to work with. They have to be intercepted when really young and given some alternate role models.

 

I realize this seems like a side comment, but that is one reason I generally don't approve of home schooling, because a kid in a bad household may learn from someone else like at school if they have a chance and parents who do abuse their kids will isolate them and keep them at home like that. While most kids have good parents and homeschool is fine, the percentage that don't have no way out.

[Rayce]

My saving grace was going to summer bible school as child and learning about God's love. I was 8 years old when I got my bible which I still use today. At that summer camp I learn about the concept of love. I accepted Jesus into my life. Next year I will be celebrating 50 years with him! So while the battle raged around me I clung to my bible and developed my faith. It has not let me down.

[major_merrick]

I realize this seems like a side comment, but that is one reason I generally don't approve of home schooling, because a kid in a bad household may learn from someone else like at school if they have a chance and parents who do abuse their kids will isolate them and keep them at home like that. While most kids have good parents and homeschool is fine, the percentage that don't have no way out.

 

I get what you're saying, but it doesn't always work that way. I was sent to public school, and it was awful. You can be just as abused and isolated at school with tons of others around. I was ostracized in elementary school for my lack of English, and picked on by girls and boys alike. You get mean fast, because you get abused at home and then abused at school...there's basically no relief.

 

My husband went to a private religious school for a while, and also attended secular private and public schools as well as being homeschooled for a year or so. Among his other qualifications, he has a teaching degree. He's sending his school-age kids to another household to be homeschooled with them. I think a private, multi-family environment provides a nice balance and good socialization without the chaotic zoo of the public system. And having a network of families provides accountability among the parents without the state getting involved too quickly. If I'd had other families around to look out for me, my parents wouldn't have gotten away with the things they did.

[preraph]

^ I get what you're saying too, that you were picked on and couldn't win between home and school. I don't like the cloister effect of homeschooling. I think for kids with trouble at home, the school itself is another eye to watch them and send a flag up if they notice abuse and even more importantly, to provide a structure of reasonable rules and treatment they are not getting at home to balance out some of the abuse at home. And I think it's important to learn to cope with things young, rather than try to avoid people when you get older or only be able to function in a narrow set of people who agree with all your beliefs. I mean, one has to learn to cope with people of all kinds to coexist as an adult and hold most jobs. It's not fun, though, being picked on. In middle school, seems like nearly everyone gets picked on for something. Little savages!

[spiderowl]

I'm sorry to hear it. I don't know how common it is for parents to do that but it is definitely abuse and beyond the pale. Most parents get angry a some point, shout a lot, act in ways they regret later, but injuring your child is going too far.

 

You didn't deserve that.

[Tamfana]

It’s common enough that we have child protective service agencies. There are similar situations heard in juvenile courts and family courts all the time. I think it's much more common than we realize. I’m so sorry you went through that.

[Shanex]

Thanks to you both for these posts too, much appreciated. And good points as well.

[skywriter]

Shanex, I'm so sorry to hear what you had to go through and from someone so close as your father.

 

As has been mentioned it is somewhat a generational learned behavior I believe. In my case, my mother was beaten regularly by her drunken father so she was bent on stopping this cycle of abuse with her kids, thankfully.

 

However, my exH who was also diciplined by his father who suffered with alcohol problems went on to do these things with my kids. I had to step in and put my foot down.

 

It didn't go over well and I was told I wasn't backing him up. I found through my own form of communication that spanking my kids just wasn't necessary. I could dicipline them quite well by not striking them and we communicated so well.

 

Consequently, both my kids will talk to me about anything because they trust me and in some ways I feel it was because of the way thy were raised.

[vla1120]

My real father was abusive to my mother. He didn't stick around long enough to be abusive to my brother and me. My step-father was also abusive, especially with my older brother. They used to get into knock-down drag-out fist fights, breaking furniture, etc. (because my brother used to fight back.)

 

I was a bit more fortunate. The worst I got was beatings with a belt, and one time he punched me in the face and knocked me out when I was about 16 (and had a mouth on me - but no excuse for him.)

 

I do think it was more common when I was young because what happened at home stayed at home. People were less likely to report signs of abuse. I went to school many times with clear signs of abuse (welts all over my arms and legs and sometimes my face), but no one ever said anything about it.

 

I'm sorry you experienced this. I made damn sure my daughters would NEVER experience the types of abuse that I experienced at the hands of my step-father, brother, and step-brother. I was probably over-protective, but I'd rather err on the side of caution than have them live through what I lived through.

[healing light]

I've been beaten by both of my parents. I don't think it's uncommon at all. I was also a very kind star student that seemed like a goody two shoes growing up, so I got kids writing things in my yearbook like, "You're so naive, even I'm jealous."

 

Haha. Little did they know. My parents were under a lot of constant stress, my father was chronically ill, it was just a crap situation all around.

 

There is a book called

The Body Keeps Score

and in it, the author talks about healing the complex effects of trauma. There was a survey done about adverse childhood events and it's actually not ucommon not only to have been physically assaulted but to have been sexually assaulted. Much more than people had previously believed.

 

So... you're not alone. It's just important to take the time to process these things and figure out what beliefs you have stored about yourself as a result or where it might still be holding you back. I've found somatic therapy to be a good tool for this.

[JoeyArnold]

On 11/13/2019 at 9:52 AM, vla1120 said:

I made damn sure my daughters would NEVER experience the types of abuse

 

Good. Yeah, my dad was verbally abusive. It can be tough. It is crucial to know this, first of all.

[robaday]

I have very mixed feelings about my father, especially when abuse comes up. On the one hand he never hit me directly. There was only once I remember he did turn physical and as he was drunk he wasn't able to get me - during a verbal argument he picked up a baseball bat and swung for me, but I was sober, an adult now and bigger than him and dodged it and left.

That's not to say I wasn't terrified of him. He used to throw things in a rage on the ground, or belittle me constantly. The personal attacks eased over the years as I got bigger physically and began training in mixed martial arts, but really that doesn't make me feel any better about the whole thing, just shows he liked to bully people weaker than him. 

He was a complex man and there were moments where he was a fantastic Dad when I was a child. Unfortunately they are mixed in with very bad memories too. He wasn't as bad as some Dad's and I often wonder if he was truly abusive. I know he wasn't easy to get along with and never really praised anyone. I was loyal to him and loved him, but it's mixed in with very complex feelings.   

[simpycurious]

That is NOT typical Father behavior but rather INSANE behavior.  How could anyone do that to their son?

I am so thankful for the amazing parents that I was blessed to have.  I am so sorry that you endured that OP

[pepperbird]

On 10/5/2019 at 2:21 PM, Shanex said:

Some great points preraph and you’re most definitely right that my father was just probably equally abused as a child by my grandfather (who I despised too, a violent and bad-tempered alcoholic who never admitted he did wrong to his family).

 

Anyway I agree with everything you say but wanted to highlight the terrible « cycle » you mention. You’ve been physically abused then repeat this shyte over your own children? Goodness me if I should have some kids later I’d rather punch myself before them.

 

For very few parents that’s « authority » and a way to gain respect from your children. Truth be told, very few people in the remaining family on my father side still talk to him; beside me. He’ll most likely die alone and miserable and while I’m not looking forward to it, the terrible memories from my teen years with him will make it hard for me to be compassionate.

talking about it can break the cycle.