Problem: I'm Sexually Attracted to Women, but Prefer Friendships with Men

[Wave Rider]

I'm a man, and when it comes to matters of sexual attraction, I prefer women. But when it comes to friendship, I prefer the company of men. This has become a serious obstacle to my desire for a long-term relationship with a woman.

 

In my life I have enjoyed a number of rich and rewarding intimate friendships with men. I have had several male best friends that have come in and out of my life as I have grown through one stage of life to the next. These friendships have provided me with a wealth of emotional intimacy and support, companionship, camaraderie, and good times as we shared hobbies together and worked side by side.

 

I have never had a similarly rich friendship with a woman. Ever. I've never even had a close friend who was female. Pretty much all the "friendships" I've had with women have been "therapist" friendships. You know what I'm talking about.

 

I very much enjoy the company of men. We play golf, fly Cessna airplanes, build stuff in our physics lab, play sports, talk about the next NASA mission to Mars, and generally do guy stuff together. We bond emotionally over these shared hobbies and activities. But when I try to have a friendship with a woman, it always fizzles out. She doesn't play golf, she doesn't care about Cessna airplanes, she doesn't know anything about physics, she doesn't play sports, and she doesn't follow NASA space missions. It feels like we have nothing to talk about.

 

Of course, if I talk to a woman, she has her life too - she's got a job in HR, she likes to go shopping and spend time with her family, she loves traveling, and she goes to lunch at her favorite restaurant with her female friends. But since I don't care much about HR, I don't really like shopping, I don't know her family, I'm not that interested in traveling, and her favorite restaurant is not my favorite restaurant, I have a very difficult time being friends with this woman. It just feels like we have nothing in common and nothing to talk about. If I wasn't physically attracted to her, the hard truth is that I would have no motivation to talk to her. I would much rather spend time surfing or playing golf with a male friend than listen to a woman talk about her troubled relationship with her brother or listen to her travelogue about her last trip to Paris.

 

The fact is that is if it wasn't for the physical attraction and the prospect of sexual relationships, I wouldn't have much incentive to talk to women at all. I'd much rather spend time with men. It's not that I dislike women per se, but it's more that I just find men's personalities to be generally more interesting than women's, and I can nearly always find more common ground with a man than with a woman.

 

In our contemporary relationship ethos we expect our partner to be our best friend in addition to being our lover. Given the fact that I have never had a best friend who is female, I have no idea how that is supposed to happen for me. And famed relationship research John Gottman said in his book The Seven Principles of Making Marriage Work that the single most important thing that carries a marriage through difficult times is a deep, meaningful, abiding friendship between the partners.

 

Can someone please tell me how I'm thinking about friendships with women the wrong way?

[vla1120]

Hmmm. Back in the late 80's, I had a female friend who was an astrophysicist for a government contractor for an office in the Pentagon, where I worked. She was also an avid golfer. You probably just haven't hung in circles where you are going to meet the scientific-minded, golf-playing female. If you live near a major metropolis, maybe you should search the internet for talks/events/conferences near you that relate to air and space topics.

[preraph]

Well, that one isn't the woman for you because you find her that boring.

 

However, I don't think it's that unusual. Thing is you build a relationship if you care enough about a woman to stay with her. If you love her, for something other than sex, you become interested in her life. If you don't do that, you don't love her.

 

Does that mean you will be fascinated by her crafting or scrapbooking or anime or favorite band or whatever it is she does for a pasttime? Of course not! Any more than she may be fascinated by sports.

 

 

But that doesn't mean you have to be best friends with your girlfriend or partner. It doesn't mean you have to share all the same interests. You need to like each other's personalities, basically, and find each other fun to talk to.

 

As a woman, I always found "best friend" guys a slippery slope sexually. There is such a thing as too much familiarity that can take the spark out of a relationship. I had two guys I really cared about who called me their best friend. I think they assumed that they were mine, but they were not even close. My best friends were women I'd known for years and a couple of gay guys. Guys I was at all interested in were in an entirely different category. I could not have spent 24/7 with any of them and would always need my space and my other interests and other friends.

 

So you may be extreme a little, and you may not maybe have ever fallen in love enough to be interested in someone, but there's plenty of men and women whose best friends aren't their mates.

[thefooloftheyear]

So does the majority of men on Earth...In fact, the guys with female friends are often the least desirable of women when looking for men to date or enter a relationship with...

 

Women aren't supposed to be like your buddies....All the hobbies you mentioned would bore the average woman to tears...

 

I know ill catch a lot of flack for saying this, but most guys know that men don't befriend many women without some hope of getting in their pants....And women don't generally befriend hetero guys unless they like the attention they get from orbiters that are only there to boost her ego...The other possibility is that they like to befriend guys because guys can do stuff for them when they need...(car/house repairs, moving, etc) Ive seen that as well..

 

Bottom line is that aspect of your character has zero bearing on whether you can or cant find a woman to date, nor does it mean you cant eventually be friends with that woman...Most relationships start with physical/sexual attraction, then you decide if you want to keep them based on these other aspects....I think you are trying to believe that its the other way around...(need to be friends first...its often never the case..)

 

TFY

[Woggle]

I can't say I agree. As much crap as I have talked on here over the years I actually get along very well with women offline. I get along well with men as well but if a woman shares my interests why not hang out with her?

[thefooloftheyear]

I can't say I agree. As much crap as I have talked on here over the years I actually get along very well with women offline. I get along well with men as well but if a woman shares my interests why not hang out with her?

 

I get along great with women both on and off line, but cant say that I go out of my way to befriend them....I mean, sure, in the scenario you posted was to come about, then I can say I would certainly entertain it...

 

But here is the thing, and maybe its just me...

 

Never in my entire life was ANY woman I was with "ok" with me even having female acquaintances, let alone friends.. Whether they are willing to admit it or not, most women are highly protective and territorial over their men...And rightfully so...Other women don't think twice of trying to move in on taken men...

 

But my only point is that a guy doesn't have to have a bevy of female friends or even the type of personality that attracts female friends to be successful with women...Its not a concern of any woman out there, and is often seen as a plus for a guy to not have any female hanger on's or whatever...They want their man to be the one to give sole attention to them and no other woman, be it platonic or otherwise..

 

As always...YMMV

 

TFY

[alphamale]

1. how old are you?
   
2. have you slept with a woman before?
   

[elaine567]

The OP's issue is deeper than he just doesn't want female friends.

He can't see a relationship with a woman working as he cannot be "friends" with her.

He has no interest in women past sex.

He finds them boring and finds no common ground.

Whereas men he finds very interesting and he loves hanging out with them

[Beendaredonedat]

Have you ever been in a relationship past the honeymoon stage? I wonder just how inattentive you are to your partner (if you've ever had one) if all you want to do with them is share sexual chemistry (until that lust ends).

 

Surely there are women out there that you can relate to that play golf, watch football on a Sunday afternoon, like the outdoors, can talk politics (or whatever)???

 

You sound very unmotivated to ever be in a real relationship that includes a fun activity partner and a "comrade in arms" if you will.

Edited October 22, 2019 by Beendaredonedat

[Els]

I'm puzzled that you don't have even one female friend who shares a single one of your hobbies. Most physics, sports, space, etc groups have a higher percentage of men, sure, but most of them are not literally 100% men (I belong to a few amateur astronomy and space hobbyist groups and most of them have at least 10% women, in fact). And granted some of the women will not be available for a relationship, but that doesn't prevent them from having male friends. Are you somehow ignoring all of the women you meet in these areas? Or do you just have this one "clique" of male friends that you met in high school or whatever, and you haven't made any real effort to join larger communities and meet new people?

Edited October 22, 2019 by Elswyth

[BaileyB]

Well, I’m sexually attracted to men and I love my boyfriend dearly... but, I would be lost without the friendship of my girlfriends. I don’t think there is anything unusual about this...

[mark clemson]

In our contemporary relationship ethos we expect our partner to be our best friend in addition to being our lover. Given the fact that I have never had a best friend who is female, I have no idea how that is supposed to happen for me. And famed relationship research John Gottman said in his book The Seven Principles of Making Marriage Work that the single most important thing that carries a marriage through difficult times is a deep, meaningful, abiding friendship between the partners.

 

 

Perhaps you'll just have to hope you are an exception to this "rule". I would point out that relationships continue because both persons choose to continue them. Friends or no. Plenty of LTRs continue to exist even though the partners are not good friends (e.g. due to co-dependence). These might not be the best LTRs to be in, but nonetheless.

 

Perhaps you'll be able to find a woman with similar enough interests to be a "buddy" as well as an SO. Perhaps you won't stay married forever but will have a series of shorter relationships and that will be your romantic life?

 

Perhaps you and a woman will choose to stay together in a LTR and pursue your own interests individually. This last state is necessarily common, but the degree to which it's true varies. Maybe you will be more independent of each other than most, but still happy and content together?

 

There are all kinds of permutations of "pretty good" in marriages and LTRs.

[basil67]

Yes, you are thinking about friendships the wrong way.

 

The problem is that you are unable to connect on subjects outside of hobbies and interests. The people who are most successful in friendships are ones who can talk about all kinds of things and find interesting things in everyone. Most of all, they have interest in who they person is, not what they do for a hobby. If your conversation is limited to your interests, then you're always going to struggle.

[chillii]

How old are ya op ?

Sounds like you've never had a gf or relationship.

Anyway on that note, your just into each other, you click , that's the difference with the female you'll want to have a relationship with.For me that side of things is very much about her personality and just who she is, how she is , everything about her, and vise verse .

The rest don't matter, you don't need to have friendships with women or get along with other women in a friends ship sense and nah you'll usually have nothing much in common with them anyway.

 

l only have one female friend and we're only friends because she's one of the coolest most in there people l ever knew and we just happen to get along in a friendship way, very like minded. But we don't hang out or anything like that just email a bit these days , bout it. l have zero interest in hanging out with women in general , only my own really.

There was one piece of common ground brought us together in the first place , but then we just found we were also very much alike so a friendship grew from that. But there's never ever been anything romantically, she's with someone l'm with someone , matter of fact we're more a brother sister thing we call it.

There's always a few women l enjoy a bit of a chat with , brothers gf , she's pretty cool, one or two l know apart from that as well , but we'd never hang out as such or anything.

Only chick l hang out with is my woman but her l do love hanging out with.

From a relationship point of view, you'll probably just meet someone one day where your just really into each other on that level , that's the big difference.

Edited October 22, 2019 by chillii

[Ruby Slippers]

Whatever works for you.

 

I agree you don't "need" female friends.

 

I'm more traditional about romance, as are the men I date. I generally don't have male friends, and the men I date don't have female friends. I've had conversations with a few boyfriends about it, and we agreed that having opposite-sex friends while in a relationship, and especially hanging out with them alone, is asking for trouble, so best not to even go there.

[lana-banana]

So with all the data you have available, you could conclude that you simply haven't met women who are intellectually stimulating and interesting. Instead you have apparently concluded that women are not capable of such things. That is a red flag so dramatic and glaring that you frankly have no business being in any relationship with a woman, romantic or otherwise. Honestly, I'm sure the women you've interacted with can sense your condescension and are turned off. Until you can wrap your head around the idea that women are your mental equals you're not going to be successful.

[Beendaredonedat]

No one "needs" friendships of the opposite sex. The problem I see here is that the Op doesn't want anything to do with his romantic female partner(s) past the sex they have had or could possibly provide to him. . He's bored with her/them(?) and doesn't know how he can maintain a friendship with a woman if he were to form a relationship with her.

 

The fact is that is if it wasn't for the physical attraction and the prospect of sexual relationships, I wouldn't have much incentive to talk to women at all.

Edited October 22, 2019 by Beendaredonedat

[somanymistakes]

It is okay to prefer friendships with men.

 

It is okay to prefer friendships with men and sex with women.

 

You are not the only person who feels like this. (NO, it is absolutely NOT all men, but it does happen.)

 

You are absolutely allowed to have your own preferences. What matters is that you are honest, don't mislead people, and aren't insulting about it.

 

If you only want to have sex with women and don't want to hang out with them? DON'T GET INTO A RELATIONSHIP. Look for people who are looking for hookups. Be clear that sex is all you want. If they disregard your wishes and ask for more, dump them, move on. You are allowed to do this! As long as you're not making false promises, it is totally okay to form your own boundaries.

 

Of course, you may not always find it easy to find partners who are up for this arrangement, but eh, that's life. There's always porn.

 

Now, when it becomes a problem is if you try to extrapolate your personal feelings into a general stereotype. If you start declaring that because YOU don't want to be friends with women, that NO ONE should be friends with women, or that all women are stupid and boring... then you'd be a jerk and I would have a problem with you.

 

If you just jive better with guys? That's fine!

 

There are women who jive better with guys too, honestly, and it doesn't always mean they're lesbians or anything. People come in all shapes, sizes, and flavors.

 

You are allowed to be you.

[basil67]

No one "needs" friendships of the opposite sex. The problem I see here is that the Op doesn't want anything to do with his romantic female partner(s) past the sex they have had or could possibly provide to him. . He's bored with her/them(?) and doesn't know how he can maintain a friendship with a woman if he were to form a relationship with her.

 

Reminds me of a discussion I had with a mum who's supporting her autistic son to with his desire to have a relationship. She said that before you can have a relationship with a girl, you need to know how to be friends with a girl.

 

If the OP doesn't like what women have to offer as people in general, then a relationship can't happen.

[basil67]

Until you can wrap your head around the idea that women are your mental equals you're not going to be successful.

 

It's more than intellect though. She may be his mental equal but in things which aren't to his interest, so he will still be bored with her. And of course, being interested in the person - as opposed to their interests - is also crucial to the kind of relationships which found by most to be meaningful.

[snowboy91]

If I wasn't physically attracted to her, the hard truth is that I would have no motivation to talk to her. I would much rather spend time surfing or playing golf with a male friend than listen to a woman talk about her troubled relationship with her brother or listen to her travelogue about her last trip to Paris.

 

The fact is that is if it wasn't for the physical attraction and the prospect of sexual relationships, I wouldn't have much incentive to talk to women at all. I'd much rather spend time with men. It's not that I dislike women per se, but it's more that I just find men's personalities to be generally more interesting than women's, and I can nearly always find more common ground with a man than with a woman.

 

Ultimately... I just don't think you've found the right women yet! To be fair, a lot of your hobbies and interests are traditionally very male dominated, which makes it unlikely (though not impossible) for you to meet someone who will share your interests.

 

With the bold bit above - I feel it's a little narrow minded to think this way about women. Sure, travel isn't your thing, nor is gossip. But there are plenty of women out there who have all different kinds of hobbies which you might need to be a little more open to. And if that someone is keen to join you when you play golf, or fly planes (I'm sure many would find that exciting!), or in some new thing you can both enjoy, then that's even better.

[Mr. Lucky]

The fact is that is if it wasn't for the physical attraction and the prospect of sexual relationships, I wouldn't have much incentive to talk to women at all.

 

I can only guess you mean "I wouldn't have much incentive to talk to bimbos at all".

 

Because there's no such thing as "women", expressed as a group with commonality. I could look at your username and conclude you're a vapid beach dude, except having grown up in a coastal community I know surfers come from all walks, all backgrounds, all educational and financial levels, no way to fit them into one box.

 

So I'm not sure how you've done the same thing with women?

 

Mr. Lucky

[elaine567]

I may be wrong but I have a feeling like a lot of guys like this he doesn't really want women "invading" his hobbies and interests.

I guess if he had to play golf with a woman or a man, he would choose the man...

 

He is what people call a "man's man".

 

"a man who is more popular and at ease with other men than with women."

[RecentChange]

Lots of good points...

 

But I am a woman, and I would be bored to tears by HR, shopping and lunching with family - I don't enjoy those things either.

 

I don't know, lots of people fit into stereotypes, but many do not.

 

Perhaps it's my region, but when I think of my female friends, most are in the STEM fields. There is the PhD immunologist / biotech CEO, the microbiologist lab manager, the senior software engineer, another uses her psychology and engineering degrees in her tech career, another who runs cancer treatment trials world wide, another is an engineer working in the energy sector.

 

None of these ladies really enjoy "shopping" but have other hobbies, distance running, competitive horse back riding, climbing, art etc.

 

We share common love of the outdoors, good conversation, good wine, big ideas.

 

As for best friend stuff, my husband and I are best friends - we have some common interests and our own hobbies.

 

We both like tinkering on cars, and in our early years spent many hours in the garage together working on classic cars.

 

I complete jumping horses - he does downhill mountain bike racing, different yet so similar. We both understand the commitment, practice etc the sports take, and support each other in them, even if we have no desire to actually participate.

 

My husband and I like similar music, food, entertainment etc. I rather go to a concert, travel, have dinner or just spend time with him over any of my friends.

 

I know I am not a total anomaly because lots of my female friends are like I am - and tend to share interest with their male counterparts. The PhD? Shes really into driving and super cars - how many men hate spending the day at a car show or the track?

 

Did you meet any women in your college classes?

[Wave Rider]

A few of you have mentioned that there are indeed women who would share my "techie" hobbies and also athletic hobbies, if only a few. I guess that's true, but I live in a place with a particularly unfavorable gender ratio. My incoming physics graduate class was 23 men and 2 women; social activities I've been to have been the department Christmas party (35 men and 6 women), the grad caucus dinner (24 men and 3 women) and the watersports day (17 men and 4 women.) Not good odds, even for forming friendships with women. It's essentially impossible to find a woman in science/engineering around here who doesn't have a boyfriend plus multiple multiple offers from other men, so I kinda stopped trying.

 

But that's an external problem, and I think there's an even bigger internal problem. For me, the prospect of a romantic or sexual relationship changes everything, especially if I think the woman is attractive. I would have a very hard time being "just friends" with a woman I thought was attractive. Pursuing a "just friends" relationship with an attractive woman would only cause me to feel more and more rejected as time goes on, and more jealous of the guy that she's dating. That's why it would be hard.

 

I agree that it's generally a bad idea for people in committed relationships to maintain active opposite-gender friendships outside the relationship. That's just asking for trouble.

 

So after thinking about it more, I guess I probably don't really want plantonic friendships with women, particularly with women I find attractive, even if they are brilliant and interesting. The prospect of a romantic or sexual relationship that remained unfulfilled would cause too much internal conflict for me.

 

My question was somewhat about platonic male-female friendships outside of romantic relationships, but it was more about friendship within romantic relationships. My question was more about whether or not a woman can be both a friend and a lover to me. Generally, a woman has either been a friend or a lover to me, but not both. I did have one girlfriend (of 7) who felt like a friend to me in addition to being my girlfriend, but that relationship was the least physically passionate of all my relationships by a large margin.

 

Thinking about it now, with many of my girlfriends there was ample physical attraction and passion, but after a few months the relationship fizzled out because we didn't have much of a friendship going on and it felt like we had nothing to talk about. That's why I'm asking about friendship between men and women in a romantic relationship. Is it reasonable to expect a solid friendship within a romantic relationship, even if you have little in common other than physical attraction? Is there something about friendship that kills romantic passion? Should I not expect that a friendship would underlie a romantic relationship?

 

It seems that lovers are not friends and friends are not lovers. I can't seem to manage a relationship with a woman who is both.

Edited October 23, 2019 by Wave Rider