Problem: I'm Sexually Attracted to Women, but Prefer Friendships with Men

[LivingWaterPlease]

Thinking about it now, with many of my girlfriends there was ample physical attraction and passion, but after a few months the relationship fizzled out because we didn't have much of a friendship going on and it felt like we had nothing to talk about. That's why I'm asking about friendship between men and women in a romantic relationship. Is it reasonable to expect a solid friendship within a romantic relationship, even if you have little in common other than physical attraction? Is there something about friendship that kills romantic passion? Should I not expect that a friendship would underlie a romantic relationship?

 

It seems that lovers are not friends and friends are not lovers. I can't seem to manage a relationship with a woman who is both.

 

 

There is an aspect of friendship I haven't seen addressed in your descriptions of your friendships with either men or women that I think is the basis for a satisfying marital friendship.

 

That is the desire to see the life of your partner thrive. It is a role of support, encouragement, joy in witnessing the growth of the person you have a spark with.

 

It is - selflessness as opposed to the selfishness you seem to be describing in your relationships with women you have a sexual desire for.

 

It seems to me what you describe is a desire to use women you're attracted to.

 

In a sense your friendships with men also develop while using the men you have things in common with and seek out as friends. However, they're using you, too. But in the process of using each other to enjoy the interests the two of you share, you become friends.

 

The same thing can happen for you with a woman with whom you don't share commonalities such as your work interests, sports, airplanes, whatever other boring (to her) interests you have.

 

But, first let's regress a little here.

 

A couple of people have asked your age and you haven't answered that.

 

But, reading your post it occurs to me that you may be somewhat immature in one sense.

 

For instance, a little baby is interested in nothing else except for having his/her own needs met. Everything revolves around a babies' feeding schedule, diaper changes, sleep schedule, etc. New moms and dads sometimes pull their hair out figuratively speaking trying to find what it is that will make the baby comfortable!

 

As a child grows around the age of 3-5 (not sure, this is not my field but believe that's the general age) they begin to learn they are a separate being from their mothers in particular. And they also begin to realize there are other people in the world they may enjoy interacting with.

 

So some of the next years are spent learning that the world doesn't revolve around their needs and desires and that it's advantageous to learn to meet the needs of others, even when needs of others conflict with one's own.

 

It occurs to me that somehow this aspect of your development got a little stunted. In that possibly you didn't have a parent who modeled being supportive to his/her spouse.

 

Also, some people are more gifted in this arena. Some, both men and women, seem to innately know that meeting the needs of another person is very rewarding and has a pleasure in itself.

 

I believe this is the type of altruistic friendship that benefits a couple, even if their interests and hobbies in life are different. It is this selfless love, this idea of finding joy in watching another person thrive, and even doing things to further their progress and happiness in their own interests, that feeds a marriage.

 

The opposite is what you describe with women you want to have sex with. What you describe is, no offense, but selfish. That is why the relationships fall apart, because a relationship that is self-centered is bound to do so long term. It's not healthy to use other people, whether they are of the same sex or of the opposite sex.

 

What you've got to do is to find a woman you're attracted to that you can also assist in ways that make her life better and invest your time, emotions and focus in helping her. Even if it's only emotional encouragement and support. However, most people could discover several different ways they could support most any other person they may become interested in.

 

The key for you is to find ways to invest yourself in the life of the woman you're attracted to, rather than just using her.

Edited October 23, 2019 by LivingWaterPlease

[thefooloftheyear]

 

So after thinking about it more, I guess I probably don't really want plantonic friendships with women, particularly with women I find attractive, even if they are brilliant and interesting. The prospect of a romantic or sexual relationship that remained unfulfilled would cause too much internal conflict for me.

 

.

 

This is completely normal behavior for most men....Only dopes want to follow a woman around pretending to be her friend., and pathetically hope that one day she throws him a crumb....Utter nonsense...

 

I didn't quote the other part of your post, as to not violate the sites policy, but here's the thing....Yes...when its right, your romantic partner should also be your "friend' ….But its a different kind of friendship than the one you have with your male hobby buddies...When you say you would have nothing to talk about, well, does your entire day revolve around activities of work or hobbies? If so, then that is likely where your problem is...Many M/F relationships are also geared to other stuff...For some its parenting of a child(ren)...for others its matters tending to family and other personal stuff that you don't sharer with your platonic friends...

 

So...yes, its a friendship.....just on a different level....its not the same, and I am feeling like you are trying to justify it as it should be the same or it doesn't work...Its not...You have to figure that aspect out...

 

TFY

[BaileyB]

I’ve heard it said that the basis of the most lasting romantic relationships, is actually a solid friendship. So yes, I think you can be attracted to a woman and also have a strong connection - a strong friendship - with that woman.

 

It doesn’t mean that I don’t value my same-sex friendships. Every relationship is different. No one relationship ticks all the boxes...

[Mr. Lucky]

He is what people call a "man's man".

 

Actually, I'd call that a "single man", and probably perpetually so.

 

You can't sustain a relationship with a "woman" unless you can relate to "women"...

 

Mr. Lucky

[basil67]

I did have one girlfriend (of 7) who felt like a friend to me in addition to being my girlfriend, but that relationship was the least physically passionate of all my relationships by a large margin.

 

I believe that friendship underpins a good relationship. While I can't speak for men, I think it's fair to say that most women want a man who loves them for who they are - not what they are interested in. They want someone who connects with emotions and not just hobbies. Come to think of it, it's the basis for female female friendships too. I have friends who have the same hobbies as me, but the connection isn't anywhere near as deep as those where we strip down to our emotional underwear with each other.

[Wave Rider]

Yes...when its right, your romantic partner should also be your "friend' ….But its a different kind of friendship than the one you have with your male hobby buddies...

I like this. I can get into the idea that the friendship in a male-female LTR is quite different from either a male-male or female-female friendship. So fine, my friendship with a girlfriend or wife isn't going to be the same as my friendships with my male buddies. As I've read, male-male friendships tend to focus on shared activities and mutual hobbies, while female-female friendships focus on shared emotions and disclosure of secrets and personal information. In short, men share activities, women share emotions.

 

So if I'm expecting a woman to be my surfing buddy/flying buddy/weightlifting buddy/golfing buddy, and if I'm hoping that she's watched the most recent episode of South Park so we can make jokes about it, I'll probably be pretty disappointed.

 

I hear that women complain about this too, by the way. The wish that their men would talk about their feelings and listen better. The wish that their men would act more like....women. I understand that it's quite common for women to get upset at their man because he isn't as intuitive about her feelings as her girlfriends are, or because he doesn't talk about his day and ask her how her day was.

 

OK fine, so she won't be my male buddy to do manly stuff with, and I won't be her girlfriend who gushes their feelings all over the place. So what do we do instead? What does this androgynous friendship look like? How do we relate, and what do we talk about other than paying bills and changing diapers? Can you give me some examples, especially from movies?

 

 

What you describe is, no offense, but selfish. That is why the relationships fall apart, because a relationship that is self-centered is bound to do so long term. It's not healthy to use other people, whether they are of the same sex or of the opposite sex.

 

What you've got to do is to find a woman you're attracted to that you can also assist in ways that make her life better and invest your time, emotions and focus in helping her. Even if it's only emotional encouragement and support. However, most people could discover several different ways they could support most any other person they may become interested in.

 

I'll entertain this. If I were a psychoanalyst, I might say that I have not yet achieved object relations in this regard, and that I retain my infant omnipotent defenses because I regard female romantic partners as extensions of the self. In other words, I don't really recognize that women are agents of their own with needs and feelings that exist independently of me, and that my psychological goal is possession rather than connection, or emotional conquest of one perceived as a part of the self rather than secure attachment to a differentiated other. You might be right.

 

But as far as helping a female friend/lover reach her emotional goals in life, I'll still stuck as to what I can really do for her. What can I give her that she can't get from her girlfriends?

Edited October 23, 2019 by Wave Rider

[basil67]

With the exception of those who have a degree of emotional dysfunction and are working towards being more solid, I would be surprised if women/people in general have 'emotional goals'. To be honest, I'm not even sure what the phrase means. Can you give an example so I can better understand your question?

[Wave Rider]

With the exception of those who have a degree of emotional dysfunction and are working towards being more solid, I would be surprised if women/people in general have 'emotional goals'. To be honest, I'm not even sure what the phrase means. Can you give an example so I can better understand your question?

 

I guess I should have said "satisfy her emotional needs" rather than "reach her emotional goals." I can't edit it now. My question here is - what can I as a man do for her emotional needs that her girlfriends cannot do for her?

Edited October 23, 2019 by Wave Rider

[basil67]

It depends on the woman. Some women will manage their emotions like a man does. Some will go to their girlfriends for all support, others will think their man should react like their girlfriends and do all support and other women will do a combination of friends and partner for support. If you want to be supportive of her, just listen and give opinions only if she asks for them. Men have a tendency to want to fix things (and even as a woman, so do I) but a lot of women just want a sounding board.

[Foxhall]

the opening line of your thread there, that was how I felt for much of my 20s,

 

I had a strong group of male friends and we enjoyed sporting activities, drinking, chasing women from a sexual point of view I guess being honest.

 

those male buddies, the group we had have drifted apart then through my 30s, and in the last five to six years I have been trying to build new friendships,

 

funnily enough my better friendships now are with women , I enjoy the type of emotional and life stuff that women like to talk about, also have perhaps some feminine type interests such as health and alternative medicine and have enjoyed getting to know a few amazing women in the last few years,

 

until very recently more friendships than romance mind but thats ok!

 

I do miss the golfing outings and horse racing banter and gambling that I had with the guys previously,

 

It is a different type of friendship with women, but I am enjoying embracing my more soulful side!

Edited October 23, 2019 by Foxhall

[LivingWaterPlease]

What can I give her that she can't get from her girlfriends?

 

As just one example, her gf's can listen to her when she's having a rough day (rough week, whatever) and empathize with her. They can even give her a hug. That'll help her get through a trial.

 

You can do the same and more. Just as an example (and this may not be what she'll respond to but there are ways you can discover what she WILL respond to) she can walk through the door after a rough day looking discouraged or whatever negative emotion she may be experiencing about the rough thing she's going through and you can simply say,

 

"Hey, Good looking!" with a twinkle in your eye (or some other positive expression of affection, whatever comes naturally to you), put your arms around her and hold her for awhile while you stroke her face and hair and tell her whatever she needs to hear for comfort (you have to discover this, what she needs and she needs to help you learn, this comes naturally to some people but seems you're going to need to work at it). Then you can watch her body language and expression change as she responds to your kindness. A gf of hers is not going to do that for her or even have as powerful emotional effect on her.

 

That is what some women would like but other women may appreciate your support in different ways.

 

You can also give her a romantic birthday dinner for just the two of you, which her gf's can't do, for instance. Yes, they can take her to dinner but it won't be the same for her as having dinner with you (and possibly you even bringing a gift of some sort).

 

Read the book, "The Five Love Languages" (I haven't read it but am familiar with the concept) and discover hers. Then seek to provide support for her in the ways her love languages dictate.

 

She should also be seeking to provide for you the support you need from her which she will be working to figure out.

 

Yes, working! All relationships take work. It seems to me you just haven't been motivated to work at a relationship.

 

Possibly if women weren't so willing to hop in the sack with you before a relationship develops you'd be motivated to develop a relationship with them.

 

I hope, for your sake, you meet a woman you want to bed badly, who won't allow you to do it without working for it. Would be one of the best things that ever happened for you.

 

Baby steps. You've got some growing to do! But, I commend you on reaching out on LS showing a desire to grow! Way to go Wave Rider!

Edited October 23, 2019 by LivingWaterPlease

[BaileyB]

My question here is - what can I as a man do for her emotional needs that her girlfriends cannot do for her?

 

My girlfriends will listen to me talk for hours, they will offer empathy and problem solve. My partner will do the same, to a much lesser degree. He will hold me at night. He will lighten my load around home - cook me dinner, make me tea. He has a lot to offer - it’s just different.

 

What everyone has to offer/will take from each relationship will depend on the people in he relationship. Every relationship is different because people are different.

 

This notion that one relationship meets every need is not realistic.

[Wave Rider]

So for those who say that their opposite-gender significant other does great things for them, here's my question: what unique gift, not involving physical touch of any kind, can I receive from a woman that I cannot receive from a man? What can I get emotionally and spiritually from a woman than I cannot get from a man? And what unique spiritual or emotional gift can I give to a woman that she cannot get from another woman?

 

Given the enormous amount of gender-based anger and misunderstanding between men and women, it would seem to me that gay and lesbian couples actually have it best. Gay and lesbian couples get the benefits of being in a sexual relationship with someone who, as a same-gendered person, naturally understands their emotional needs and is well-equipped to meet them. Gay men can be each other's golfing buddies and lesbian women can be each other's emotional confidantes, all on top of the benefits of a sharing a sexual relationship. It seems that heterosexual couples, many of whom complain endlessly about gender-based irreconcilable differences, really get the bad deal in relationships. Can someone please tell me how I'm wrong here?

 

People on this thread have criticized me for not wanting women for anything more than sex. Regardless of whether or not that's true, I would still argue that sexual intimacy is the #1 motivation for why people seek out intimate relationships in the first place. If it wasn't, why would heterosexuals seek out intimate relationships with opposite-gender people and be willing to put up with all the irreconcilable differences based on gender if it would actually be easier to have a platonic friendship with a same-gender friend who naturally understands your emotional needs better?

[clia]

So if I'm expecting a woman to be my surfing buddy/flying buddy/weightlifting buddy/golfing buddy, and if I'm hoping that she's watched the most recent episode of South Park so we can make jokes about it, I'll probably be pretty disappointed.

 

I don't see why you can't find a woman who is into some of this stuff. I know a lot of women who golf, surf, are into fitness/weights, who like South Park, etc. It seems like you have a strange stereotype in your head as to what women are like. Do you really never see any women on the golf course, gym, or at the beach? And while the number of women in technical fields is certainly less than the number of men, there are absolutely women out there who are into STEM, physics, etc.

 

It really just sounds to me like your picker is off and you are going after women who you aren't very compatible with. Have you tried to meet women via any of your hobbies?

[Beendaredonedat]

Given the enormous amount of gender-based anger and misunderstanding between men and women, it would seem to me that gay and lesbian couples actually have it best. Gay and lesbian couples get the benefits of being in a sexual relationship with someone who, as a same-gendered person, naturally understands their emotional needs and is well-equipped to meet them. Gay men can be each other's golfing buddies and lesbian women can be each other's emotional confidantes, all on top of the benefits of a sharing a sexual relationship. It seems that heterosexual couples, many of whom complain endlessly about gender-based irreconcilable differences, really get the bad deal in relationships. Can someone please tell me how I'm wrong here?

Have you ever had sex with a man? I think you would enjoy the sexual bonding to the gender you clearly favor.

 

please tell me how I'm wrong here?

If you have to ask that question then you'd never understand the answer. Even if you did, you'd not want anything to do with it so do everything with the males you favor and have it. Edited October 23, 2019 by Beendaredonedat

[RecentChange]

A few of you have mentioned that there are indeed women who would share my "techie" hobbies and also athletic hobbies, if only a few. I guess that's true, but I live in a place with a particularly unfavorable gender ratio. My incoming physics graduate class was 23 men and 2 women; social activities I've been to have been the department Christmas party (35 men and 6 women), the grad caucus dinner (24 men and 3 women) and the watersports day (17 men and 4 women.) Not good odds, even for forming friendships with women. It's essentially impossible to find a woman in science/engineering around here who doesn't have a boyfriend plus multiple multiple offers from other men, so I kinda stopped trying.

 

 

Are you planning to stay in this area indefinitely? I know this comment will ruffle some feathers - but honestly college is THE TIME to find a partner. The older you get, the further away you get from those social connections, the more difficult it will get - thats some facts. The ship is sailing, and the more time that goes by before ever developing a serious long term relationship, the odds of forming one decrease.

 

But that's an external problem, and I think there's an even bigger internal problem. For me, the prospect of a romantic or sexual relationship changes everything, especially if I think the woman is attractive. I would have a very hard time being "just friends" with a woman I thought was attractive. Pursuing a "just friends" relationship with an attractive woman would only cause me to feel more and more rejected as time goes on, and more jealous of the guy that she's dating. That's why it would be hard.

 

So after thinking about it more, I guess I probably don't really want plantonic friendships with women, particularly with women I find attractive, even if they are brilliant and interesting. The prospect of a romantic or sexual relationship that remained unfulfilled would cause too much internal conflict for me.

 

Honestly, beyond trying to reverse your inexperience, there is no reason to peruse a friendship only relationship with a woman you are attracted to. Have you never met an interesting woman you weren't attracted to?

 

 

My question was somewhat about platonic male-female friendships outside of romantic relationships, but it was more about friendship within romantic relationships. My question was more about whether or not a woman can be both a friend and a lover to me. Generally, a woman has either been a friend or a lover to me, but not both. I did have one girlfriend (of 7) who felt like a friend to me in addition to being my girlfriend, but that relationship was the least physically passionate of all my relationships by a large margin.

 

We are all individuals, but for many I would say the answer is yes. My parents are best friends. And my husband and I are best friends.

 

Our relationship didn't start out as "friends" - Actually it was what I thought would be a one night stand - but DAMN did we connect on a sexual level - the kind of thing you certainly want more than once. So we started dating, and with in a few months were head over heels for each other. We discovered we had similar upbringing (which helps us connect on so many levels), enjoyed the same kind of activities, saw eye to eye on politics, religion, priorities in life and goals for the future. We make each other feel good about ourselves and each other - its absolutely possible to be friends and lovers.

 

Thinking about it now, with many of my girlfriends there was ample physical attraction and passion, but after a few months the relationship fizzled out because we didn't have much of a friendship going on and it felt like we had nothing to talk about. That's why I'm asking about friendship between men and women in a romantic relationship. Is it reasonable to expect a solid friendship within a romantic relationship, even if you have little in common other than physical attraction? Is there something about friendship that kills romantic passion? Should I not expect that a friendship would underlie a romantic relationship?

 

Here's the deal, and something I think many overly analytical men struggle with. Romantic relationships do not follow set equations. They can't be predicted with such certainty. I think for most, yes, friendship is at the core of a long lasting relationship. Will it be for you, not certain. Will you meet someone you mesh with in that way? Don't know. Does entering a relationship with pre-conceived notions about how its supposed to play out help? Doubtful.

 

So if I'm expecting a woman to be my surfing buddy/flying buddy/weightlifting buddy/golfing buddy, and if I'm hoping that she's watched the most recent episode of South Park so we can make jokes about it, I'll probably be pretty disappointed.

 

I can't tell you how many times I have led into a story with "do you watch south park?"

 

I know many women who surf, but finding someone not the SAME as you, but compliments you would probably be a better fit. For example a couple I know - he is an avid surfer, she likes the water, they both dive etc - but she is an amazing photographer and artist. Instead of surfing with him, she comes out and shoots him and his friends. They together took on a project re-painting his boards in amazing designs that makes it easier for her to spot him in the water.

 

OK fine, so she won't be my male buddy to do manly stuff with, and I won't be her girlfriend who gushes their feelings all over the place. So what do we do instead? What does this androgynous friendship look like? How do we relate, and what do we talk about other than paying bills and changing diapers? Can you give me some examples, especially from movies?

 

Movies aren't real life - don't look to them for any advice. And honestly, at this stage I think the heavy psycho analytics do not help either. Romance is an ART not a science. Its feel, its flow, its instincts, its passion - its something that one must simply DO without being so stuck in their head analyzing all of it.

 

On a regular ol' work day, my husband and I will text each other a bit. Sometimes just an "I love you".

 

If something good or bad happens - we tell each other first "Hey! I just got a bonus of XX!" - Awesome hun, your hard work is paying off, lets celebrate at Y this Friday.

 

Or " ______, bad thing happened" Okay I will figure out what we can do - I'll do some research and lets talk tonight.

 

First thing first we are PARTNERS. I have his back, he has mine no matter what life throws us.

 

As for "what do we talk about" We talk about work, our industries, we talk about politics, we talk about life philosophies, we talk about plans, next week, next month, next year.

 

We just "chat" my husband is hilarious (and hell, I can be funny too) we love to make each other cry with laughter.

 

This week we are planning a Halloween party, so last night was online shopping for costumes and figuring out all the logistics for the party.

 

Typical weekend? Wake up have sex, I'll cook us breakfast and we will chat about the day ahead. I'll head out for a few hours to ride. He'll go ride his bike and or watch football. We will reconvene in the afternoon, maybe make some plans with friends or to go out for dinner and cocktails etc. Or some projects around the house - last weekend I helped him re-wire a light fixture, paint a ceiling etc.

 

What was your parents relationship like? We they not friends?

[RecentChange]

So for those who say that their opposite-gender significant other does great things for them, here's my question: what unique gift, not involving physical touch of any kind, can I receive from a woman that I cannot receive from a man? What can I get emotionally and spiritually from a woman than I cannot get from a man? And what unique spiritual or emotional gift can I give to a woman that she cannot get from another woman?

 

Given the enormous amount of gender-based anger and misunderstanding between men and women, it would seem to me that gay and lesbian couples actually have it best. Gay and lesbian couples get the benefits of being in a sexual relationship with someone who, as a same-gendered person, naturally understands their emotional needs and is well-equipped to meet them. Gay men can be each other's golfing buddies and lesbian women can be each other's emotional confidantes, all on top of the benefits of a sharing a sexual relationship. It seems that heterosexual couples, many of whom complain endlessly about gender-based irreconcilable differences, really get the bad deal in relationships. Can someone please tell me how I'm wrong here?

 

People on this thread have criticized me for not wanting women for anything more than sex. Regardless of whether or not that's true, I would still argue that sexual intimacy is the #1 motivation for why people seek out intimate relationships in the first place. If it wasn't, why would heterosexuals seek out intimate relationships with opposite-gender people and be willing to put up with all the irreconcilable differences based on gender if it would actually be easier to have a platonic friendship with a same-gender friend who naturally understands your emotional needs better?

 

Ying and Yang I guess. I have absolutely no desire to have another woman as my life partner. Its about a balance of strengths and weaknesses.

 

To me, a marriage is about far more than sex - its about me and him against the world. Its about the unique support we can offer each other. I can comfort him in ways a woman can, he can comfort me in ways a man can.

 

Will a man hold you to his breast, comfort you during your darkest hour in a way a woman could? Would a man simply listen to your hardship and pledge their support without feeling compelled to solve the problem for you? Can you be totally open and extremely vulnerable to your male friend? Tell him the deepest darkest parts of yourself that you have hidden for fears of appearing weak or broken? In my experience with men, these are some of the things I can offer that their friends can't.

 

Can you be a pillar of support for a woman? Strong and protective? Make her feel safe when she feels vulnerable? Those aren't things girl friends usually provide their friends.

 

Understanding the world from different perspectives.

 

I have never experienced "enormous amount of gender-based anger and misunderstanding between men and women" nor have I ever experienced "irreconcilable differences based on gender" with any man I have ever been in a relationship with. But to me, same sex always seemed like it would be a bit more difficult because you do not have that balancing dynamic like in a hetero relationship.

 

I guess in the end, interpersonal romantic relationships come naturally to some people. I have never found them difficult.... and to others, I guess its an insurmountable task.

 

Yours is a perspective so foreign to mine that I have a hard time understanding why its so very difficult for you.

[elaine567]

Wave Rider is not a young inexperienced guy.

Wave Rider is 40+

[basil67]

Given the enormous amount of gender-based anger and misunderstanding between men and women, it would seem to me that gay and lesbian couples actually have it best. Gay and lesbian couples get the benefits of being in a sexual relationship with someone who, as a same-gendered person, naturally understands their emotional needs and is well-equipped to meet them. Gay men can be each other's golfing buddies and lesbian women can be each other's emotional confidantes, all on top of the benefits of a sharing a sexual relationship. It seems that heterosexual couples, many of whom complain endlessly about gender-based irreconcilable differences, really get the bad deal in relationships. Can someone please tell me how I'm wrong here?

 

Wow, that's some of the biggest gender stereotyping I've read in a very long time. If you stay on this train of thought, you will not succeed at relationships.

 

Not all men do hobbies and ignore emotions. And not all women are into being emotional confidants. There are some really thoughtful guys out there who love to emotionally connect (and no, they aren't gay) and there are women who much prefer the way men joke around and don't get bogged down in emotions (and no, they aren't gay either). In fact, most men and women do a combination of both to their individual satisfaction.

 

The guys you hang around with? They may also have a male friend who they talk about with what's going on in their lives - now you have no interest in this, so they won't go to you - but they may well go to other men. My hubby gets on well with most men in a golfing, beering type of way, but he connected with one of his best mates over drinks and discussions of family and life.

 

Also, what are these gender based irreconcilable differences of which you speak? I can only imagine you referring to people who are unable to operate in the space of the other gender. Like how you don't particularly women. Thing is, most of us don't have this issue and can appreciate what the other gender has to offer.

[Tamfana]

There are women who don’t find men emotionally or intellectually fulfilling so date one of them, maybe just say you want a no-strings arrangement since friendship wouldn’t be part of it. Be honest about who you are and what kind of relationship you want to boost your chances of finding women with the same outlook.

[Mr. Lucky]

How do we relate, and what do we talk about other than paying bills and changing diapers?

 

Not sure if you'll believe this, but there comes a time when those two topics (and their related subjects) pretty much take up the entire day.

 

Wave Rider, nothing wrong with your SoCal self-oriented pursuit of hobbies and life. Moving through my career there in hotels and restaurants, had a ton of 30-40 yr old employees of both sexes who just wanted to work their shifts and head to the beach or ski slopes, that was their focus. And from the outside, looked like a pretty nice existence.

 

But some people inherently want something more and different, especially as their 20's fall behind them. They begin to think more "we" than "I", and start to understand the adjustments, accommodations and compromises needed to start a family, starting with finding the middle ground needed to form a partnership with a spouse.

 

When that happens for you, your priority won't be finding a girl into "golf, fly Cessna airplanes, build stuff in our physics lab, play sports, talk about the next NASA mission to Mars". There'll be more important things to talk about...

 

Mr. Lucky

[basil67]

Speaking further to the stereotype of men only being interested in hobbies, this forum is probably 50% male. Of the male posters who have their lives together, they are excellent at discussing thoughts, feelings and relationships. And they have hobbies too.

 

Spend some time watching how other men (the ones who have got it together) write here and take a cue from them.

[chillii]

Op, you've obviously just never clicked with a woman.

There is no what do we talk about when you click with someone , it just happens and you end up talking all kinds of stuff , anything.

lt's like, two people can say the same thing , but with one you don't care.

But when the one you do care about and are just into though, says that same thing, it's just totally different, suddenly that same thing is interesting, fun, or whatever.

Hence you end up talking about anything, it's all good, your just into each other.

[basil67]

Indeed Chillii. When we are having a family gathering, my autistic son will want to know who I'll talk to and what we will talk about. It's so hard to explain to him that we just talk about 'stuff' and go where the conversation takes us.

[RecentChange]

Indeed Chillii. When we are having a family gathering, my autistic son will want to know who I'll talk to and what we will talk about. It's so hard to explain to him that we just talk about 'stuff' and go where the conversation takes us.

 

Good observation - and I think that is often a disconnect between those for which social interaction come naturally, and those who have a need to pre-analyze them, and then future try to predict their outcomes.

 

It just flows.... How to describe that, how to explain how your romantic partner can be the love of your life, and your best friend - feels somewhat unexplainable. To me it just feels natural, and all these statements about the incompatibility of the sexes doesn't ring true to my life experience.