Question for OW here!

[BaileyB]

1 hour ago, JimmyNorth said:

 

I have to admit, my mind gets crappy with bad thought...for example: I sometimes think what if I had her as a REAL girlfriend and she met this guy...would she have still hooked up!??? 

I’m not going to lie, this worry would be on my mind too. After all, she had no difficulty cheating WITH you. She has told you that she likes to live in the moment and sees sex as “recreation.” Yet, you are betting on her as a committed partner. I think any sane person would wonder, knowing what you know about this woman, whether this is a good bet.

 

as Elaine said above, the distrust created by an affair appears to doom many relationships. It’s hard to get over these kinds of things... But if you are going to stay with this woman, “get over it” is exactly what you need to do.

[FMW]

If you're going to hold this against her then break up with her now.  Neither of you are pristine.  Given the facts, neither of you is more or less likely to be faithful than the other.  Do you not think she wonders about whether or not you'll be faithful to her now, knowing how you were with your wife?

 

 

 

 

[JimmyNorth]

2 minutes ago, Finding my way said:

If you're going to hold this against her then break up with her now.  Neither of you are pristine.  Given the facts, neither of you is more or less likely to be faithful than the other.  Do you not think she wonders about whether or not you'll be faithful to her now, knowing how you were with your wife?

 

 

 

 

 

Ever since I took my AP out of mistress mode, there’s been a huge shift in the direction we are going. She is doing things and showing actions that she wants a lifetime committed relationship. She’s been waiting for this day.

 

The events that occurred 6 months ago were basically a result of 3+ years of waiting for me and losing hope. My disconnect with her would allow an affair to happen with any halfway decent guy that would’ve showed interest to her.

 

She just wants to be able to go public with me and no longer be a secret side piece. 

[2BGoodAgain]

13 hours ago, JimmyNorth said:

 

Ever since I took my AP out of mistress mode, there’s been a huge shift in the direction we are going. She is doing things and showing actions that she wants a lifetime committed relationship. She’s been waiting for this day.

 

The events that occurred 6 months ago were basically a result of 3+ years of waiting for me and losing hope. My disconnect with her would allow an affair to happen with any halfway decent guy that would’ve showed interest to her.

 

She just wants to be able to go public with me and no longer be a secret side piece. 

careful.. my AP also was waiting for me and she wanted a life time commitment, or so she thought.. when she finally got it, she found it wasn't what she wanted. luckily, she figured it out before we commited, but imagine if I had chosen to be with her earlier.. it'd be a much bigger heartache.

 

Take care... she may genuinely think she wants this, but you have to ask why she would involve herself in an affair to begin with... many times, affair persons are addicted to the intense feelings than the actual person... like a drug addiction... always seeking the next high... b/c it isn't about the specific drug, it's about the high... 

 

actually, you both should seek counseling, if you truly want this relationship to last... it'll help you, before you get into another relationship.. then it'll get more complicated and more heartache for the both of you.

[FMW]

14 hours ago, JimmyNorth said:

The events that occurred 6 months ago were basically a result of 3+ years of waiting for me and losing hope. My disconnect with her would allow an affair to happen with any halfway decent guy that would’ve showed interest to her.

 

Then put this behind you and focus on moving forward together.      

[JimmyNorth]

5 hours ago, 2BGoodAgain said:

careful.. my AP also was waiting for me and she wanted a life time commitment, or so she thought.. when she finally got it, she found it wasn't what she wanted. luckily, she figured it out before we commited, but imagine if I had chosen to be with her earlier.. it'd be a much bigger heartache.

 

Take care... she may genuinely think she wants this, but you have to ask why she would involve herself in an affair to begin with... many times, affair persons are addicted to the intense feelings than the actual person... like a drug addiction... always seeking the next high... b/c it isn't about the specific drug, it's about the high... 

 

actually, you both should seek counseling, if you truly want this relationship to last... it'll help you, before you get into another relationship.. then it'll get more complicated and more heartache for the both of you.

 

My AP and I are going to counseling. We are trying to start the REAL part of our relationship with a strong foundation. She had even bought some books to help us put the past behind us and move to build a loving relationship. I can see the effort she is putting in. 

 

To answer your question about her motivation to begin the affair, she knew I was in a bad marriage. She never attempted to start with me, but she’s always has a crush. I was the one that kicked it off and from there she was hopeful that I would start a life with her. The problem is I never really started the REAL life with her for 3+ years...she’s always been a secret. 

 

However, she is excited to start it now!

[Super Phantom]

You shouldn't have had an affair. First you should have hired a PI and investigated you wife to see if she is cheating. Now if what you have done is ever found out you can get taken to the cleaners and depending on what state you are in the other woman can get sued

[Prudence V]

On 12/12/2019 at 4:21 PM, 2BGoodAgain said:

All affairs are based on fantasy.

 

Really? Every single one? And you know this how? What was your research methodology, your sample size and strategy, the peer review on your paper and the citations it’s received since publication? 
 

I can tell you though, from personal experience, that that blanket statement is simply not true. My fAP and I are happily M for more than a decade, and our A was anything but fantasy. Perhaps yours was, and things didn’t work out, so you’re choosing to believe it was inevitable rather than accept that things could have been different. I can understand why such a ploy might be attractive to you. But please don’t tar all of us with your brush, because it’s not appropriate. 

[2BGoodAgain]

34 minutes ago, Prudence V said:

 

Really? Every single one? And you know this how? What was your research methodology, your sample size and strategy, the peer review on your paper and the citations it’s received since publication? 
 

I can tell you though, from personal experience, that that blanket statement is simply not true. My fAP and I are happily M for more than a decade, and our A was anything but fantasy. Perhaps yours was, and things didn’t work out, so you’re choosing to believe it was inevitable rather than accept that things could have been different. I can understand why such a ploy might be attractive to you. But please don’t tar all of us with your brush, because it’s not appropriate. 

Offended much? Such a strong reaction for a strong relationship that you seem to promote. I wonder why? 

 

Let me rephrase, all affairs are based on fantasy but a very very select few may lead to marriage ... though that may be an exception to the rule rather than a general rule. 

 

[JimmyNorth]

7 hours ago, 2BGoodAgain said:

Offended much? Such a strong reaction for a strong relationship that you seem to promote. I wonder why? 

 

Let me rephrase, all affairs are based on fantasy but a very very select few may lead to marriage ... though that may be an exception to the rule rather than a general rule. 

 

 

I believe that some affairs have partners that are genuinely in love, far beyond the honeymoon period or initial chemical rush associated with such relationships.

 

I genuinely love my AP (now gf officially) and she has always loved me. While there are serial MMs that just want the sex or the thrill, I believe that there are MM, MW, OW, and OM that’s are sincerely seeking true love. I think everyone here can agree that most humans seek safe and secure partnerships that contain deep levels of love and loyalty!!!

[2BGoodAgain]

2 hours ago, JimmyNorth said:

 

I believe that some affairs have partners that are genuinely in love, far beyond the honeymoon period or initial chemical rush associated with such relationships.

 

I genuinely love my AP (now gf officially) and she has always loved me. While there are serial MMs that just want the sex or the thrill, I believe that there are MM, MW, OW, and OM that’s are sincerely seeking true love. I think everyone here can agree that most humans seek safe and secure partnerships that contain deep levels of love and loyalty!!!

As I said, they can happen... but I firmly believe it’s the exception to the rule, and not very common... very rare in fact. But with added effort to overcome initial hardships, such relationships are possible. But not likely. 

 

It doesnt in any way way negate the feelings involved. Those feelings n hurts are real, regardless if misplaced or misunderstood.

 

 

[Prudence V]

22 hours ago, 2BGoodAgain said:

Offended much? Such a strong reaction for a strong relationship that you seem to promote. I wonder why? 

I’m a researcher. When students make claims in their papers that they can’t back up with evidence, they fail. When people make sweeping statements of opinion that they try to pass off as fact, I’m duty-bound to point out the limitations of their claims. Fake news is a disease. Promoting critical awareness and a respect for facts is vital. 

22 hours ago, 2BGoodAgain said:

all affairs are based on fantasy but a very very select few may lead to marriage ... though that may be an exception to the rule rather than a general rule. 

Let me fix that for you: 

 

22 hours ago, 2BGoodAgain said:

In my opinion, supported by my very limited experience of my own, single affair that didn’t work out, I need to believe that all affairs are based on fantasy so that I don’t feel to bad about my own one not working out.

I don’t dispute that more affairs don’t work out than those that do. That’s true of any kind of relationship. If all dating relationships, for example, worked out, we’d all be stuck married to our first bf/gf from primary school . 
 

I do dispute that just because your own affair was based on fantasy, that it’s valid to claim that every single other affair must also be. You simply don’t have that information. 

[2BGoodAgain]

20 hours ago, Prudence V said:

I’m a researcher. When students make claims in their papers that they can’t back up with evidence, they fail. When people make sweeping statements of opinion that they try to pass off as fact, I’m duty-bound to point out the limitations of their claims. Fake news is a disease. Promoting critical awareness and a respect for facts is vital. 

Let me fix that for you: 

 

I don’t dispute that more affairs don’t work out than those that do. That’s true of any kind of relationship. If all dating relationships, for example, worked out, we’d all be stuck married to our first bf/gf from primary school . 
 

I do dispute that just because your own affair was based on fantasy, that it’s valid to claim that every single other affair must also be. You simply don’t have that information. 

well, i'm glad you're doing research; keep doing that. I'd love to read what you conclude.

Good luck!

[2BGoodAgain]

On ‎12‎/‎13‎/‎2019 at 2:28 PM, JimmyNorth said:

 

My AP and I are going to counseling. We are trying to start the REAL part of our relationship with a strong foundation. She had even bought some books to help us put the past behind us and move to build a loving relationship. I can see the effort she is putting in. 

 

To answer your question about her motivation to begin the affair, she knew I was in a bad marriage. She never attempted to start with me, but she’s always has a crush. I was the one that kicked it off and from there she was hopeful that I would start a life with her. The problem is I never really started the REAL life with her for 3+ years...she’s always been a secret. 

 

However, she is excited to start it now!

I'm really GLAD to hear that!

 

I wish you both much luck! No one starts out perfect, like those movies... it's what you do AFTER it happens that matters the most, I think.

[pepperbird]

On 12/9/2019 at 10:50 AM, JimmyNorth said:

 

"She was actually faithful to me for over 3.5 years. But she just started to lose faith and wanted to feel desired. I wasn’t showing any promise and she ended up looking outside. However, the moment I committed she was elated. "

 

Sorry, but you have both shown each other that, when push comes to shove and you feel entitled to do it, you will be unfaithful.
Really, the "reasons" don't matter. What's it going to be the next time she feels that you somehow owe her something she isn't getting? Will she choose to cheat again?  How about you?
I would suggest that the two of you attend you counseling together to figure out (a) why you cheated ( and don;t blame your wife, that;s 100 percent on you) and (b) why she cheated( 100 percent on her).

On 12/9/2019 at 10:50 AM, JimmyNorth said:

 

 

 

[2BGoodAgain]

On 12/15/2019 at 10:49 AM, Prudence V said:

I’m a researcher. When students make claims in their papers that they can’t back up with evidence, they fail. When people make sweeping statements of opinion that they try to pass off as fact, I’m duty-bound to point out the limitations of their claims. Fake news is a disease. Promoting critical awareness and a respect for facts is vital. 

Let me fix that for you: 

 

I don’t dispute that more affairs don’t work out than those that do. That’s true of any kind of relationship. If all dating relationships, for example, worked out, we’d all be stuck married to our first bf/gf from primary school . 
 

I do dispute that just because your own affair was based on fantasy, that it’s valid to claim that every single other affair must also be. You simply don’t have that information. 

 

that's interesting. why do you feel the need to overwrite someone else's words with your own, as if they were yours? can't you let others voice their opinions since everyone's advice/comments/thoughts here are all opinions, after all. Why feel the need to fix anyone at all? It isn't your job or duty to "fix" anyone.  let them be themselves; if they take your advice, they'll let you know, and if not, go in peace and wish you the best... 

[JimmyNorth]

5 hours ago, pepperbird said:

 

Sorry, but you have both shown each other that, when push comes to shove and you feel entitled to do it, you will be unfaithful.
Really, the "reasons" don't matter. What's it going to be the next time she feels that you somehow owe her something she isn't getting? Will she choose to cheat again?  How about you?
I would suggest that the two of you attend you counseling together to figure out (a) why you cheated ( and don;t blame your wife, that;s 100 percent on you) and (b) why she cheated( 100 percent on her).

 

 

We are actually attending counseling together. We are invested in creating a solid foundation. Don’t buy into this ”once a cheater always a cheater” crap, that’s all bull.

 

There were legitimate reasons that caused a disconnect between us during that time, namely me just not being committed or being there, which is why I can’t put 100% blame on her!!

[pepperbird]

7 hours ago, JimmyNorth said:

 

We are actually attending counseling together. We are invested in creating a solid foundation. Don’t buy into this ”once a cheater always a cheater” crap, that’s all bull.

 

There were legitimate reasons that caused a disconnect between us during that time, namely me just not being committed or being there, which is why I can’t put 100% blame on her!!

It's not about blame. It's about recognizing the potential and taking steps to address the behavior so it doesn't happen again.

btw, unless she is a marionette with you pulling the strings, her actions are 100 percent on her. She is an adult, not a child.

[JimmyNorth]

10 hours ago, pepperbird said:

It's not about blame. It's about recognizing the potential and taking steps to address the behavior so it doesn't happen again.

btw, unless she is a marionette with you pulling the strings, her actions are 100 percent on her. She is an adult, not a child.

 

That is true. But also remember I unfairly kept her as a mistress for nearly 4 years. She had pleaded for me to commit prior and I just didn’t. 

[pepperbird]

20 hours ago, JimmyNorth said:

 

That is true. But also remember I unfairly kept her as a mistress for nearly 4 years. She had pleaded for me to commit prior and I just didn’t. 

I'm a huge believer in that people repeat, often without intending to, patterns of negative behavior if they provide even some small benefit.

What you already no for sure about this woman is that :
(a) she places very little value on sexual fidelity.  If she did, she would have found some other outlet for her angst instead of cheating on you.

(b) you both have been willing to excuse your decisions to cheat, and sir, that doesn't bode well for you. It would be different if you said" I know cheating is wrong. I hurt a lot of people, but I am learning better ways of acting so I won't make that same choice again".  You aren't saying that about either one of you. Instead, you are making excuses. I'm not big on the "once a cheater, always a cheater" maxim, but there can be a kernel of truth there, especially if someone frames infidelity as something that happened "to" them, not something they chose.

I don't think either of you are bad people at all, but I do think you need to be a lot more realistic. Cheating is not the inevitable end result of feeling ignored or not getting your own way- it was a choice she made, and it sounds like one she actively chose.  She has shown you "herself" and what she can and did do when she felt entitled to do it. What will happen the next time she doesn't feel you are giving her enough attention?

[Betrayed&Stayed]

On 12/14/2019 at 7:46 PM, JimmyNorth said:

I think everyone here can agree that most humans seek safe and secure partnerships that contain deep levels of love and loyalty!!!

 

Your lack of self-awareness is mind-blowing. First you're upset that your Affair Partner cheated on you. Now, you speak of safe, secure, and loyal partnerships. Like the partnership your wife would want and expect from a husband?

[JimmyNorth]

2 hours ago, Betrayed&Stayed said:

 

Your lack of self-awareness is mind-blowing. First you're upset that your Affair Partner cheated on you. Now, you speak of safe, secure, and loyal partnerships. Like the partnership your wife would want and expect from a husband?

 

You have to know that I was a committed and faithful husband for 15 years. I held on even through her darkest periods. My wife was just not giving back what I put in. There was a hug disconnect and divorce was imminent.

 

Now I have to admit that I should have done the right thing first and filed divorce and THEN begin a real relationship with AP (or gf if you will), but I did everything ass backwards. So I’m paying the price. I know what I want in a partner and what kind of connection matters to me. I’m not a serial cheater or some selfish dude. I truly have very GOOD intentions on being the perfect mate.

[2BGoodAgain]

2 minutes ago, JimmyNorth said:

 

You have to know that I was a committed and faithful husband for 15 years. I held on even through her darkest periods. My wife was just not giving back what I put in. There was a hug disconnect and divorce was imminent.

 

Now I have to admit that I should have done the right thing first and filed divorce and THEN begin a real relationship with AP (or gf if you will), but I did everything ass backwards. So I’m paying the price. I know what I want in a partner and what kind of connection matters to me. I’m not a serial cheater or some selfish dude. I truly have very GOOD intentions on being the perfect mate.

hmm...

 

a serial cheater and a 1 time cheater...  might mean something to someone removed from the situation, but when you cheat on someone... whether 1x or multiple times... it hurts the same to the person you cheat on.

 

just a thought...  a serial cheater always started with cheating 1x the first time.

[HappiDays]

After waiting for so long she may have been exploring the possibility of moving on and that's why she got involved with someone else, to see if she could. Because she is still in love with you she most likely realized that at that point she couldn't.

 

Since it was only with one man, plus the fact that she's single (and in reality really DIDN'T "belong" to you therefore giving her every right to explore possibilities regarding her future), I think it's unfair to accuse her of being a cheater. I'm surprised it took her that long.

 

IMO the fact that she told you about it, when she owed you no explanation whatsoever considering you were still with your wife, speaks volumes about her honesty and her feelings for you and your relationship.

[JimmyNorth]

8 hours ago, HappiDays said:

After waiting for so long she may have been exploring the possibility of moving on and that's why she got involved with someone else, to see if she could. Because she is still in love with you she most likely realized that at that point she couldn't.

 

Since it was only with one man, plus the fact that she's single (and in reality really DIDN'T "belong" to you therefore giving her every right to explore possibilities regarding her future), I think it's unfair to accuse her of being a cheater. I'm surprised it took her that long.

 

IMO the fact that she told you about it, when she owed you no explanation whatsoever considering you were still with your wife, speaks volumes about her honesty and her feelings for you and your relationship.

 

She only told me about it when I caught her...BUT..... I will admit that you are absolutely right. She waited a long time and still loved me throughout all 4 years and even during that 3 month period. We are now a fully committed couple, open to the public and she couldn’t be more happier.

 

Not to get graphic or anything, but she swears up and down that she could not have orgasms with the other guy. At first I was like “ya right” because she ALWAYS has legit orgasms with me, so I thought she was just naturally good at having them (and no, she doesn’t fake with me, trust me I know!!). But after talking to some other women who have had short flings (2-5 times of sex with some man) before, they confirm that sometimes they could not orgasm and had to fake it. And they did not want affection and left right after having sex.

 

They say it’s quite possible that my girl just wanted the attention but really didn’t have the mental capacity to even orgasm, which does match what my AP says.