Intergenerational Courtships

[awalns]

On 12/26/2019 at 9:32 AM, CautiouslyOptimistic said:

 

Why can't men just have respect for all girls because it's the decent thing to do?  And what does respect mean to you?  

 

If girls have a "collective responsibility to be modest in their dealings with the world," for what do boys have a collective responsibility?

You keep harping on the guys, but again say NOTHING about the girls' responsibility.  It's difficult to respect your position if you can't answer this simple question.

 

On 12/26/2019 at 9:45 AM, CautiouslyOptimistic said:

 

Why is it any of your business?  Maybe she's depressed!  

Somehow I don't think so; the one I really like may indeed be depressed (it goes with her ADHD perhaps).

 

On 12/26/2019 at 9:44 AM, CautiouslyOptimistic said:

 

lol, let us know how well that goes over.

 

I'm currently watching season 5 of an Australian drama called "A Place to Call Home."  One of the female leads just said, "Men describe the world from their point of view, which they confuse with the absolute truth."

And women don't????

[CautiouslyOptimistic]

Just now, awalns said:

You keep harping on the guys, but again say NOTHING about the girls' responsibility.  It's difficult to respect your position if you can't answer this simple question.

 

I have answered your question.  I don't think girls have any responsibility to change their personality because men think a smile means they are romantically interested!  

[awalns]

Just now, CautiouslyOptimistic said:

 

I have answered your question.  I don't think girls have any responsibility to change their personality because men think a smile means they are romantically interested!  

That is just a wimpy copout.  So I will take it you choose not to answer the question.

[CautiouslyOptimistic]

1 minute ago, awalns said:

Somehow I don't think so; the one I really like may indeed be depressed (it goes with her ADHD perhaps).

 

OK, OP, have you actually had a relationship with a younger woman, prompting this entire thread, or are you just interested in young women here and there and none have responded to your romantic overtures (because you've "been misled" by them)?  Trying to bring this around to the original topic and why you posted in the first place.

[awalns]

1 minute ago, CautiouslyOptimistic said:

 

OK, OP, have you actually had a relationship with a younger woman, prompting this entire thread, or are you just interested in young women here and there and none have responded to your romantic overtures (because you've "been misled" by them)?  Trying to bring this around to the original topic and why you posted in the first place.

To bring awareness to this type of courtship; to show that it is not something where the man is perceived as a "pervert" and the girl as a "sugar baby".  It can indeed be a beautiful and lasting love just like any other between a man and woman.  It's NOT about age.

[elaine567]

As service workers are actually PAID to be nice, bubbly and smiley to customers and that tends to work out well for every one concerned, then perhaps it is YOU that are in the wrong by hitting on them... and making them feel uncomfortable enough to avoid you thereafter...

[CautiouslyOptimistic]

5 minutes ago, awalns said:

To bring awareness to this type of courtship; to show that it is not something where the man is perceived as a "pervert" and the girl as a "sugar baby".  It can indeed be a beautiful and lasting love just like any other between a man and woman.  It's NOT about age.

 

So, because of your son, you come into contact with a lot of young women you fancy, and so far haven't had any luck in getting them to be interested in you romantically, and are trying to educate the general public about why these young woman should see that a relationship with you would be a beautiful and lasting love?  Do you feel like the reason you haven't had any luck is because of society's perception, and not because of the girls themselves just not being into you?  

[awalns]

20 minutes ago, elaine567 said:

As service workers are actually PAID to be nice, bubbly and smiley to customers and that tends to work out well for every one concerned, then perhaps it is YOU that are in the wrong by hitting on them... and making them feel uncomfortable enough to avoid you thereafter...

No, I am very careful in my approach (perhaps TOO careful). I make dog gone sure that there is enough there before I even SUGGEST that we hang out (let alone you know what).

[awalns]

15 minutes ago, CautiouslyOptimistic said:

 

So, because of your son, you come into contact with a lot of young women you fancy, and so far haven't had any luck in getting them to be interested in you romantically, and are trying to educate the general public about why these young woman should see that a relationship with you would be a beautiful and lasting love?  Do you feel like the reason you haven't had any luck is because of society's perception, and not because of the girls themselves just not being into you?  

Both probably play a detrimental role.

[CautiouslyOptimistic]

2 minutes ago, awalns said:

I make dog gone sure that there is enough there before I even SUGGEST that we hang out (let alone you know what).

 

Has anyone taken you up on your suggestion to hang out?

[awalns]

1 minute ago, CautiouslyOptimistic said:

 

Has anyone taken you up on your suggestion to hang out?

That one girl has, the others never got far enough where I felt comfortable bringing it up.  They usually stopped talking to me by that time or didn't even knew I existed anymore.  We were often in a work environment and I don't think that's the best place to suggest this idea.  If only I could see them outside of their workplace, I would feel a bit more emboldened.

[CautiouslyOptimistic]

Just now, awalns said:

That one girl has, the others never got far enough where I felt comfortable bringing it up.  They usually stopped talking to me by that time or didn't even knew I existed anymore.  We were often in a work environment and I don't think that's the best place to suggest this idea.  If only I could see them outside of their workplace, I would feel a bit more emboldened.

 

What happened with the one who said yes?  What did you do? How'd it work out or end up?

[awalns]

Just now, CautiouslyOptimistic said:

 

What happened with the one who said yes?  What did you do? How'd it work out or end up?

It's a work in progress.  She has been quite reclusive lately, somewhat depressed, just going through the motions of work and life.  When I tried to tag along with her at B&N about a month ago, she just gave me a lot of one word answers to my questions in a soft-spoken manner, and after a while wanted to be by herself.  Haven't seen her at all outside of work, but I feel it's important to be there as much as I can; it's a way that I show I care while she is going through this phase.  I want to offer my support by making the extra effort. 

[CautiouslyOptimistic]

3 minutes ago, awalns said:

Haven't seen her at all outside of work, but I feel it's important to be there as much as I can; it's a way that I show I care while she is going through this phase.  I want to offer my support by making the extra effort. 

 

I would strongly advise against this.  You are probably making her uncomfortable at her job.  

[elaine567]

2 minutes ago, CautiouslyOptimistic said:

You are probably making her uncomfortable at her job.  

That was my interpretation of the situation too.

Awains
She is showing all the signs of NOT wanting you around, so please listen to her.

[awalns]

9 minutes ago, elaine567 said:

That was my interpretation of the situation too.

Awains
She is showing all the signs of NOT wanting you around, so please listen to her.

I will keep your advice in mind. 

[awalns]

On 12/26/2019 at 10:28 AM, CautiouslyOptimistic said:

 

I would strongly advise against this.  You are probably making her uncomfortable at her job.  

Again I am VERY mindful of my presence.  I don't draw attention to her, I don't wave to her, I don't stare at her, I just go about my business of reading my books and having coffee and then leave after a time.  I am very aware of this kind of thing from other sites, so I take what was said to heart.

Also, in the 8 years I have come to know her, she has ALWAYS been honest and upfront with me.  If she were uncomfortable I am confident she would share that with me and I would honor her concerns.

About a month and a half ago I bought her a book to assist with her studies.  When I gave it to her at work she said she didn’t need it anymore but was so happy I got it from her.  She tried to hug me from behind the counter (didn’t work that great!), so after I got my coffee she came around and gave me a hug.  That was NEATO!!! (first hug I got from her in over 4 years).

[elaine567]

50 minutes ago, awalns said:

About a month and a half ago I bought her a book to assist with her studies.  When I gave it to her at work she said she didn’t need it anymore but was so happy I got it from her.  She tried to hug me from behind the counter (didn’t work that great!), so after I got my coffee she came around and gave me a hug.  That was NEATO!!! (first hug I got from her in over 4 years).

How old is she?

Edited December 26, 2019 by elaine567

[awalns]

So everything right now is sort of at an impasse.  I just have to continue on, doing what I need to do, and make the very most of whatever future opportunities come my way, whether it's with someone I know or someone I have not yet met.  Kind of tough since I have been on this road for 38 years.

[awalns]

Meantime I continue to learn about and discuss the intergenerational courtships that work for some but not for everyone.

[CautiouslyOptimistic]

38 minutes ago, elaine567 said:

How old is she?

 

I'm going to assume she's at least 24 since he said he's known her for 8 years and most places require employees to be 16.

[awalns]

Again not that this is unique to intergenerational courtships (although it’s probably more important here than in other situations), I want to again emphasize that EVERYONE has a responsibility to ensure that misunderstandings/unwanted advancements are prevented because the guy had the wrong impression or was misled.  Girls cannot just dress however they want, act however they want, go wherever they want and expect guys to stay in line or to tell them to beat it if they DO get the “wrong” idea.  It doesn’t work that way.  Everyone is expected to act in a manner that conveys his/her intentions, respecting the other’s wishes/space.  So ladies let’s keep that in mind as we try to prevent such situations in the future.

[mark clemson]

That view does NOT go over very well in areas of the US that are very hot in the summer. Are women who are not interested in romantic advances supposed to wear frumpy clothes in 95(F)+ heat?

I think you'd get a lot of agreement for this view in places like Saudi Arabia and Afghanistan. Heat notwithstanding. But not so much in much of the western world.

[elaine567]

10 hours ago, awalns said:

 Girls cannot just dress however they want, act however they want, go wherever they want and expect guys to stay in line or to tell them to beat it if they DO get the “wrong” idea. 

Really???
 

[basil67]

10 hours ago, awalns said:

Again not that this is unique to intergenerational courtships (although it’s probably more important here than in other situations), I want to again emphasize that EVERYONE has a responsibility to ensure that misunderstandings/unwanted advancements are prevented because the guy had the wrong impression or was misled.  Girls cannot just dress however they want, act however they want, go wherever they want and expect guys to stay in line or to tell them to beat it if they DO get the “wrong” idea.  It doesn’t work that way.  Everyone is expected to act in a manner that conveys his/her intentions, respecting the other’s wishes/space.  So ladies let’s keep that in mind as we try to prevent such situations in the future.

You said earlier in the thread that women shouldn't be teased, mocked or prevented by family or friends from pursuing a relationship with an older man.   Let me tell you this: If our daughter met a man who said this,  my husband and I would do everything in our power to prevent the relationship.   She was not raised to be a plaything for a man with a patriarchal attitude.

Edited January 7, 2020 by basil67