married 14yrs/ 2 kids/ not looking good

[trickynj99]

First off... to all posters i get so much looking back thru the previous posts and there is so much pain it makes me sad to see.. ihope by sharing experiences it can help others..it certainly helps me...

 

i'm 43, male..2 kids age 11 and 9

both my wife and i are terrible communicators, very unwilling to confront, very wanting to please.. but we're really nice people and there's no abuse or violence or threats.... but over time because of lots of things, work, anxiety, paxil, kid with majorADHD..sex life went to literally zero....this happened over about 5 yrs.. recently we FINALLY talked about it and i was shocked to find wife had fallen out of love with me. whatever that means....i thought things were bad, but lets work on them

 

i'm very successful at work, very well-liked and very adaptable, i go with the flow and certainly was doing that in the marraige...i do suffer from terrible anxiety and i was the one who drifted out of being interested in sex, and i'm guilty of watching way too much sports and video games!! as for my wife, she is terminally unhappy, has a narcissist mother, and spends 100% of her time making sure the outside world looks on our family and her as perfect..nothing is ever her fault, everybody she deals with seems to offend her in some way and i've read lots of self-help stuff that sums her up as "NOT COMMITTED TO HER OWN HAPPINESS"...dont get me wrong, i still love her she is very attractive to me and i've known how she ticks all along and want to work things out..i felt a little like i was the perfect personality for her.

 

so this spring when the (*#(#$ hit the fan , i worked on becoming perfect husband, i quit paxil ( a whole nother saga), said"yes dear" alot, was proactive in getting things done, lost 35lbs!!! i'm 6'2 190 now...but wife is still not moving off her stance...i dont love you.we are just friend stance..we are treating each other wonderfully for themost part.. we do care about each other..and although there is tremendous tension in our house it so far is usually not to bad..until recently..

 

so here's the thing...i'm getting fed up now... we have had 3 blow-ups and each time its the same...she says she's depressed, angry, lonely, lost..says things like.."I've given up my identity for this" (i work, she's the mom), "i didnt want this" (cant say what she wants), "i'm so UNHAPPY", (but wont do anything about it)...and the worst "i feel nothing for you"

 

so each time i basically said..ok i have to go..and she completely breaks down and the kids say whats wrong and we say mommy's having a bad day..the last time this happened she said maybe it would be better is she were dead...she is so focused on how this looks when i said i really need to go away she said i couldnt because what would she tell her mother!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

after she said that, i said that she needs help and needs to do SOMETHING to get herself on track and i would support her.. I got the number of a good psychiatrist and now she wont call.. she says thats "my choice, not yours"...

For some reason that really really got to me, and since then i cannot get out of mind that i should take the first step to end this.. (A) because maybe that will shock some sense into her (B) maybe its the right thing for me to leave.....but the problem is the kids..

 

i love them both sooooo much...truthfully, they come to me (especially the ADHD one) because my wife likes them to be perfect and doesnt always support them...if i leave, then they are with her!!!!! i make very good money and leaving job isnt an option at this time...(maybe will be in a couple yrs)..i feel so trapped and incapable of deciding what to do.. ..

 

i could go on and on(and i did!!!)...i'm posting this to get it off my chest and see if there are any pearls of wisdom out there cyberspace!!

 

thnx

[bkz]

Look at my thread if you havent allready here http://www.loveshack.org/forums/t71713/

 

Reading your post was like hering someone explain my wife to a T!!! She refuses to admit theres anything wrong with her (even when a phsycolgist tells her) and it everyone else, allways the victum. She tries enlessly to make eveyone think shes perfect and everything is perfect. I like you have lost wieght and made some very possitive changes in my life to be happier and make my wife happier with me, she is responding well but of course if things are going to work its gonna take time as shes very hot and cold right now. I felt at one point a month or so ago that I couldnt treat my wife kindly because of the pain she was causing me and thats just not fair to her or the kids (I have 3 ages 4,5 and 7) so one Sunday I packed my stuff and moved out. She accused me of deserting our kids and leaving herself stuck to explain ect.......basically puting everything on me as if it were my fault. It was a real eye opener for her I believe even thought it was for only a week. Since then shes mentioned sepperation a few times and ive told her shes free to leave anytime, im going no were at this point. Guess what im trying to say is leaving for you may be a good idea? It was of course the hardest thing ive had to do in my life but I feel it was the right thing. Good luck and if your want your marriage to work you have to believe theres hope, thats what keeps me on this roller coaster ride rather than giving up and moving on. Hope my ramble helped a bit.

[trickynj99]

wow bkz!!! i get chills reading your post and thread it hits so close to home..

 

dont know if you felt this way, in the end, but my wife needs help because she is a great person trapped in this cocoon of self doubt..i have helped her so much and in fact my wife freely admits that i am her A#1 supporter!!

 

her issues with her mom are absolutely HORRIBLE>> no abuse but her mom is just a terrible person and has 3 girls who ALL have had eating disorders in their youth...

 

i do feel like a jerk even thinking about this as a strategy but every moment i get closer to walking out the door just to prove to her that i will do it

 

your ramble helps alot thnx

[OldEurope]

From not just a female but human perspective I can tell you, that as SOON as someone (in this case, a wife) starts in with the..."I don't know what I want"...."I have given up my identity"..."Nothing is my fault"...."YOU have not made me happy, YOU are my problem".......I can assure you, that the unhappiness and blaming are that of someone who is actually unconsciously pointing the finger at herself. She is afraid to confront this, afraid to be made aware of the fact that SHE is an INDIVIDUAL and responsible for HER OWN happiness. Society makes us into couples, but Nature bore us as individuals. Once that inward, brutal process of self-honesty starts, only then will she climb out from this, as you wrote, "cocoon of self doubt". But to do that takes enormous reflection and courage, which surprisingly too few people have. So enough kicking yourself, this is about her own inability to define herself. You may be there to help, but you are in NO WAY there to take the blame.

[lindya]

From not just a female but human perspective I can tell you, that as SOON as someone (in this case, a wife) starts in with the..."I don't know what I want"...."I have given up my identity"..."Nothing is my fault"...."YOU have not made me happy, YOU are my problem".......I can assure you, that the unhappiness and blaming are that of someone who is actually unconsciously pointing the finger at herself. She is afraid to confront this, afraid to be made aware of the fact that SHE is an INDIVIDUAL and responsible for HER OWN happiness. Society makes us into couples, but Nature bore us as individuals. Once that inward, brutal process of self-honesty starts, only then will she climb out from this, as you wrote, "cocoon of self doubt". But to do that takes enormous reflection and courage, which surprisingly too few people have. So enough kicking yourself, this is about her own inability to define herself. You may be there to help, but you are in NO WAY there to take the blame.

 

Sums it up perfectly. Sadly, making people take some personal responsibility for their actions and feelings can be a hard slog indeed.

[trickynj99]

thnx - 2 more terrific responses. obviously it is very complicated and can not be summed up on a message board..

 

i have discussed the exact issue with her you are bringing up...she is rational about it and acknowledges the issue..i have kind of known this about her all along.. i remember her telling me one day before we married that i was making a big mistake in marrying her and she tried hard to break it off.

 

i have said to her that until she does something!! anything!@!!! to make herself happy, how can she ever be happy with our marraige??..

she agrees, but so far unwilling to do anything

 

We'll see what happens.. i keep inching closer to giving her an ultimatum but i have to be prepared for the wrong answer

[Owl]

Well, there are a number of statements in your post that send up red flags to me.

 

She "loves you, but isn't IN LOVE with you.".

 

She's lonely, not happy, only in this marriage for the kids, not for herself...it goes on and on.

 

I would SERIOUSLY wonder if she's not emotionally (at least) involved with someone else. Given the fact that your sex life is nil at this point too, it could even be a physical thing.

 

Is there a guy that she's 'friends' with? Someone she calls, emails, IM's, etc...very often?

 

Sorry, but this is just what it looks like to me. She's clearly emotionally detaching herself from you, and at the same time basing all of the blame for this back on you and your family...this is CLASSIC affair script.

[trickynj99]

owl.. i hear you loud and clear. that possibility is there..this all started as our sex life went to crap(partially because of me) and i started getting into the internet and porn. i came clean to her that's what started all this

 

i am going to say i doubt very much she has the time. ...my MOM of all people wonders about your question as well.. there is no computer guy in her life as we all use the same compy and i can see all of our histories..hehe..honestly tho, if i find that out it would be a big relief and then we can go from there.

 

i think its more the previous poster that she needs to commit more time to herself and our happiness than to looking to the outside world for all her validation..the people that love her are right there for her and she is pushing us all away..i can only think that's because she is so unhappy with herself..

 

thnx all for taking time to post...its making me more resigned that i need to demand her to take some responsibilty for her own mental state and see what happens from there

[Falcon554]

I got the I love you but not in love with you to. She was having an affair, she saw the guy one time the seperated from me and now we are getting a divorce. Big difference is my wife went nutso. Tattos, taning, weightloss. She is reliving her youth. She is 37 acting like 16.

 

I was lucky, my wife told me 2 weeks after the affair started, she could of kept it going for a long time.

 

Good luck

[trickynj99]

Falcon sorry to hear that....

 

i'm pretty sure its not the case here but i admit i do not know for sure.. obviously i am in "real-time" here and going back and forth on my options..

 

its funny after i get home from work one option is to run down the computer where i am now and avoid the whole situation for another day..

 

what hasnt worked is being incredibly supportive, losing 30+ lbs and trying to do more things with her...all the self-help stuff that makes sense...if i tell her i love her she says that makes her feel sad for me!

 

i did see the psychiatrist phone number on the counter so maybe she called..she's out with the kids now so maybe we'll talk tonite. probably not

[GuySimple]

Trick...99

 

Wow, all I can say is that you're not alone. Right down to the kids ages and situations. Myself…2 kids the same age one with special needs.

 

The only thing different is that my wife works and has become quite successful in a short period of time. Now I'm in the way but she is worried that if we part what people will say; what the kids will say, etc., etc.

 

She has refused to see a councilor because she "knows herself well".

 

When you get an answer buddy let me know. Me, I'm on the verge of throwing in the towel. I feel myself aging a lot over the past few years and I really don't want to do it anymore.

[trickynj99]

big handshake to you bro! i wish you all the best and hope you dont feel as unhappy and obsessed as i do...feel free to post some details and we can chat

 

and to think i got off the paxil for this ****!

 

right now i'm reading divorce books, how to stop your divorce books, blah blah blah..

 

for the last six months i have been using the theory that if i'm the best i can be, then she will figure a way through our own issues... i have taken responsibility for causing the sexual problems that began this mess, i have taken steps to corrrect my issues, now i want to help fix "us", but her own issues are not letting her pursue a good outcome for us.

 

she is stuck in you hurt me/i dont love you, - so we are stuck..i know i'm being wimpy about it, but our future(and my wonderful kids) is hanging right there in front of me, makes it tough to do what i think needs to be done.

 

right now i'm doing 2 step strategy...being "perfect..hehe" has not worked, so now i go 100% the other way, no more flowers, no more calls or emails during the day, no more kisses on her forehead or i love you's .. when she started in yesterday on her family issues i told her i was tired and rolled over.. this all felt very empowering to me....she cant have it both ways ..my goal is to get her to come to me with the whats wrong and then i can really engage in a "discussion" that she won't have with me when i'm being mr nice

 

.. i have already packed a bag in my closet for what may happen, hell she may even find it..

 

i know this all sounds so manipulative but i am desperate

 

thnx all

[Falcon554]

Try this place http://www.marriagebuilders.com/ubbt/ubbthreads.php. They maybe able to help you. Gave me some good advice. I hope it all works out.

[GuySimple]

Our situation has been going downhill for a few years now. I felt that we were drifting apart. She was working all the time, mostly at home, which meant the kids had to fall under some cone of silence. When I took issue with this she accused me of not supporting her career. So I sucked it up.

 

She took more and more stuff on at work and also not for profit work. Basically we haven’t had so much as a dinner out together without the kids in over a year and it has been 4 years since we have done an overnighter without the kids.

 

So a month or so ago we were having a discussion about our relationship and she say’s “I don’t love you anymore and I haven’t for a few years”. Now the first thing that went through my mind was all the things to the contrary she said to me over the years and it hurt to think that she was just saying them. I’m certainly not the model husband by any stretch but I at least was true to my feelings for her.

 

So I suggested that we get help. She’s not interested. So I go alone. The councilor actually say’s that divorce is probably the best option. This blew me away so I went to another and she said the same think. So I asked why. She say’s look do you honestly think that your wife will ever love you the way you want after making such a definite statement about the way she feels. Secondly, even if she did are you ever going to get past the feelings you have right now toward your wife, what she put you through etc.

 

So I said absolutely I want her back. So they said OK and let me talk. Now I didn’t tell my wife that part of the discussion with the councilor.

 

So were we are now is me having tried the sales pitch and been Mr. Model H. She has been nice but in a friendly sort of way. Every now and again I need to talk about it so a week ago I suggested that maybe I move out for a while. I wanted her to say “no please stay it is all a big mistake”. Didn’t happen. She was emotional but it was more worrying about our relationship with the kids if we split. Her sister is in a relationship where the kids have become the battleground.

 

I don’t think that would happen to us. We are both very good parents and speaking from my perspective I am a better parent without her, much more relaxed.

 

So, here we sit. The courage to go is the only thing holding me back right now. The whole logistics of moving out, cost etc. I’m not as worried about our kids. They have said they want a close family which honestly we haven’t been for a while and they see that. I do want to find someone else who can make me feel like a husband and not a care-giver.

[trickynj99]

Couple things that are very similar...we havent had sex in over 4 yrs..

reasons were stress, paxil, kids, my insecurity(performance/weightgain) and what can never be said, she was being an absolute brat about her "issues" and our ADHD kid was a huge wedge. she can't stand having a "problem child", but not because of how hard it is to deal with but because of how "people think about her", and how"people wont like her"

 

so no sex for a while, and i get into internet porn(sad but true), and finally like you she says why no sex and we talk and i say i'll quit the paxil, i love you and i always have ..she says i havent loved you for yrs, i'm so alone..me me me me

OUCH!

 

and of course, i'm a liar and betrayer for jerking off to porn!!! and i abandoned her and how can i ever be trusted...

 

the other facet of this is her terrible family where her mother is a narcissist of the highest order and has given my wife no coping skills at all(sounds like this part is different than yours)..my wife spends ALL of her energy pleasing people outside the family...no energy for herself or her family

so she can't even began to talk about things reasonably, every conversation ends with "Dont you dare make this aboutme!!!", "dont you dare twist this around""...its really infuriating..

 

Couple of thoughts for you.. there is abook i just read called "DIVORCE BUSTING" by michele wiener davis...its very results oriented (good for men) and really hit me hard because it points out that alot of the stuff we do that we think is common sense is making it harder to get back...

[ThumbingMyWay]

Trickynj99,

 

hey...I just went off Paxcil 1 week ago. What were your physical and emo syptoms when coming off of this...and how long did it take for them to pass?

[trickynj99]

well if you are off over a week you should be in good shape

 

i am not an alarmist, i took the medicine to help reduce anxiety and when i went off it...starting about the 3rd or 4th day i had a week from hell where i literally did not feel grounded in reality, all kinds off wierd thoughts, 3 days of virtually no sleep and then some of the most intense awful dreams ...i was in business meetings and in one case the woman i was talking to looked at me and said what the hell are you talking about and i couldnt even really remember ..that was the worst...after about 10 days i felt "normal"

[trickynj99]

Well

 

i have been trying to work this whole thing out for those who might have read the previous messages...

 

i have really chilled out and have stopped pursuing the wife, she has quietly responded after angrily telling me that she wasnt stupid and knew what i dwas doing..

 

after a nice long 1 hour fight, we calmed down ...she basically said she wants to stay together, that she loves our life together and our kids but she doesnt feel she loves me and doesnt know if she ever will. she says she wakes up every day wanting to "feel" differently but it never happens..she says that she is starting to wonder if we should separate for a while but not until after the holidays.. i bought it all hook line and sinker now i feel like even more of a loser

 

the circular thinking pattern i'm in is so terrible, as i'm half dying to get back to where we were a great couple and half dying to run far far away from her

 

either way i'm dying

 

right now all that seems to make sense is wait it out "for the kids" but i know that is not a good answer either

 

.....just venting away into cyberspace!!.......

[OldEurope]

Dear Tricky99,

 

Don't die. Just regroup, regain your dignity, and remember that you are an INDIVIDUAL, and not some component part of a "couple"-- a unit which, people forget, works ONLY when the individuals involved as distinct, singular persons "work"--i.e. each partner has his/her own act together.

 

A marriage is not about loving a lifestyle without loving the life. Let your wife go figure out what she wants--this crises is about her own identity. Only she is "projecting", as the psychologists say, it upon you/your marriage. This is very common, and very wrong.

 

Use whatever "free" space you have or will have to do some of the things you have put off--those sailing lessons, learning karate, taking up a foreign language, plowing through a great piece of literature, biking across Montana. Anything that is busy BUT creative busy--not routine busy.

 

Life is too short, too interesting, for people to be dragged down by the deadened weight of others. No one is saying to break anything off yet--just do not let whatever "empty" time suddenly happens pull you into its vacuum.

 

O E

[megabit15]

Dear Tricky99,

 

Don't die. Just regroup, regain your dignity, and remember that you are an INDIVIDUAL, and not some component part of a "couple"-- a unit which, people forget, works ONLY when the individuals involved as distinct, singular persons "work"--i.e. each partner has his/her own act together.

 

A marriage is not about loving a lifestyle without loving the life. Let your wife go figure out what she wants--this crises is about her own identity. Only she is "projecting", as the psychologists say, it upon you/your marriage. This is very common, and very wrong.

 

Use whatever "free" space you have or will have to do some of the things you have put off--those sailing lessons, learning karate, taking up a foreign language, plowing through a great piece of literature, biking across Montana. Anything that is busy BUT creative busy--not routine busy.

 

Life is too short, too interesting, for people to be dragged down by the deadened weight of others. No one is saying to break anything off yet--just do not let whatever "empty" time suddenly happens pull you into its vacuum.

 

O E

 

Fantastic advice!! Your happiness does not depend on the wife. Go have some fun - maybe after a while she'd even want to go with you. (no guarantees) At least you'll be around normal people too.

 

Something else that comes to mind: Maybe you could take the kids out and enjoy them - fly kites, play catch, kick a ball, climb trees, go hiking or to a quiet beach - someplace where your ADHD guy can run like mad without getting into too much trouble. (My son was ADHD when he was younger - he was a handful in public!) You can show them what it is to be loved without having to live in the straightjacket of perfection. Doesn't have to be both kids together either - some one on one time does wonders for their self esteem. Just as long as YOU can relax, laugh with them and y'all are free to be yourselves.

 

BTW- My sister has been married now for 17 years. They went through a stretch after about 7 years where she did not love her husband anymore (she had good reason at the time) but didn't want a divorce. Lasted for about 2 years. She quit depending on him for her happiness and somehow they fell back in love. They've been reasonably happy together now for many years.

[trickynj99]

First of all let me say that you guys are great and thanks for trolling these message boards with your sage advice..its very helpful to me so thnx

 

another friend of mine says..life is long, but it can really speed up sometimes...

 

right now its speeding up.....the difficulty i'm feeling is that literally every day i go home from work and think this might be it.

 

its interesting oldEur what you said about projecting. Although my issues with Paxil/stress/porn are real, i am facing them.. my wife will take ZERO responsibility for her role in this..and keeps telling me to stop projecting my problems on her!!!!!!!!!!!

 

my kids are great//11and 9 ...I'M the one that plays with them...i spend alot of quality time with them and frankly it makes my wife jealous..again which is part of her issue.

 

All roads are leading to a separation.. my wife is basically saying lets not take that step until after the holidays. I tentatively agreed to that...

 

2 days later I'm thinking the kindest most loving thing i can do for her is to

walk out the door and force her to deal with this situation

 

has anyone ever been in a situation where you decided to "separate later??"

[OldEurope]

Hi Tricky, hope you are well...

 

 

Just another quick comment on "projecting": This kind of phenomenon where one person absolutely refuses to accept any blame whatsoever for a relationship's unfortunate downfall is a classic kind of denial--denial, that is, to confront oneself and admit that there is a big black hole of problems that are not anyone else's making, but just a festering blot of low self esteem.

 

The very fact that YOU, sir, are reflective, analytical, thinking through your own mistakes or things that might have been better handled is to my mind an essential of any "partnership". Again: a couple is made of two INDIVIDUALS--each must be self aware or all is really lost.

 

Sigh, we've all had so much warning. Didn't Socrates warn humanity: "Know Thyself"? Is it all so different some 2600 years later, here on Loveshack (!)

 

Concering "Separate Later"--I am not sure what you mean here, but could this just be a term for procrastinating the inevitable?

 

I have written elsewhere that I am a big believer in NC. I think it can jar the daylights out of someone who has been taking his or her partner/marriage for granted. That sudden space, silence, hollow room envelopes that person and suddenly there they are saying, "Wait a minute: I loved this person once". OR, NC has another effect--it confirms, for better or worse, what that person long ago decided would be the relationship's fate.

 

As for the person doing the NC---I see nothing but long term benefits: strength, a rebounded character, steeled nerves (life requires them) and an eye on the future, a whole new clean up, clean out and excellent new set of chances. "Rightly done", even a devastating breakup can later improve a person on every level.

[Owl]

Tricky-

 

Your postings just continue to bring up alarm flags to me that she's involved with someone else. Now she's refusing to accept ANY responsibility for what's going on, and she's asking for time away from you!

 

I'm sorry friend, but almost ANYTIME one spouse is asking for time away from the other, it's because they've already got someone else lined up and they're looking to spend time WITH THEM.

 

You really need to start doing some spywork here. Monitor her call/computer usage. I really do think you're facing a bigger situation than you've realized.

[Ladyjane14]

You can't "fix" your partner. You can only work on YOU. You can't make your partner take on responsibility in the relationship. You can't make them do ANYTHING.

 

You can, however, decide that you, yourself, have had enough....and move on.

 

That said, unless you are fully prepared to "move on", I think it would probably be a huge mistake to issue ultimatums. You would likely to lose your family dynamic. Usually, an ultimatum would represent a 50/50 chance for reconciliation. I think possibly, your particular ultimatum wouldn't have odds that good.

 

Your wife's depression will NOT respond to bullying. Frankly, and I don't mean this harshly....your anxiety is your problem, not hers. It's NOT incumbent on her to be responsible for that. Just as her depression is not something that you can ultimately be responsible for.

 

There comes a point in a woman's life, when her threshold for withstanding bullsh*t is really LOW. Usually, that point is somewhere around 35-40 years of age. Female midlife crisis.

 

She's covered up in her multiple roles as mother, daughter, wife, cook, maid, etc., and she realizes that she is NOT living up the goals she set for herself in her youth. Her life is just continuing to go by, but she's never getting what she wants out of it. The future looks bleak.

 

And instead of her man being the 'knight in shining armor' that she once featured him to be, rescuing her from a life of drudgery....he's just another drain on her limited supply of energy and patience.

 

I've seen ALOT of threads here lately, where men are NOT getting what they want out of their marital relationship. Too many are in a Mexican Standoff, with one partner pitted against the other as adversaries, each one wanting their own way.

 

If the onset of male midlife crisis is experienced at approximately age 40, and the onset of female midlife crisis is experienced at approximately age 35, and the average age gap between married couples is 3-5 years with the man being the elder of the two..... Well, you can do the math. You can see the possibilities for adversarial behavior there.

 

So, if your wife is "projecting", and maybe she is, aren't you doing the same? "Projecting" personal problems onto the relationship.

 

You say that you've made changes, and it sounds like they were good ones.

....so this spring when the (*#(#$ hit the fan , i worked on becoming perfect husband, i quit paxil ( a whole nother saga), said"yes dear" alot, was proactive in getting things done, lost 35lbs!!! i'm 6'2 190 now...but wife is still not moving off her stance...

 

But it also sounds like you didn't get immediate results for your trouble, reward for all your hard work. While it's difficult to deal with disappointment, by your earlier post, it's only been six months since you began your campaign.

 

so here's the thing...i'm getting fed up now... we have had 3 blow-ups and each time its the same...she says she's depressed, angry, lonely, lost..says things like.."I've given up my identity for this" (i work, she's the mom), "i didnt want this" (cant say what she wants), "i'm so UNHAPPY", (but wont do anything about it)...and the worst "i feel nothing for you"

 

so each time i basically said..ok i have to go..and she completely breaks down and the kids say whats wrong and we say mommy's having a bad day..the last time this happened she said maybe it would be better is she were dead...she is so focused on how this looks when i said i really need to go away she said i couldnt because what would she tell her mother!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

This example right here says to me, your changes are contingent on her behavior, therefore NOT true changes. They haven't lasted with any duration, and you're frustration is showing. How long did it take for your marriage to become disharmonious? Was it time measured in YEARS? How can you expect to prove your case in mere months?

 

You wife says, "I feel depressed, angry, and alone...." 'I don't feel any love for you...'

 

And then you WITHDRAW. That's not consistant with the changes you've made! That's not stepping up to the plate and proving that you're a person she can emotionally trust. That's making her problems about YOU. As if you were somehow to blame for her EMOTIONS. You're reacting to a perception of blame unfairly cast. Where did she say that "it's completely YOUR fault" that she is unhappy?

 

Why can't her emotions just be whatever they are in the moment? What would've happened if you had NOT personalized her statements, but rather taken her in your arms and said, "It's okay to feel like that sometimes. I understand. Sometimes I feel like that too. But I'm still right here for you, and I have faith that we're going to make it through this together."

 

I'm NOT saying that guys have to be doormats. That same example can work for women in the same situation. When there is no infidelity present, but rather the problem is more of a communications issue, there doesn't have to be this contest of wills. When one person loses, and that person is your spouse, your partner, your teammate....you can't win! You're supposed to be on the SAME TEAM.

 

Sometimes, getting what you want requires that you do more work than is strictly fair. But I guess it all depends on how badly you want what you want. Life isn't always fair.

[Topper]

Of course we are only hearing one side of the story here. Still some of the things I am reading were true to what happened to my marriage.

My wife also was attempting to live up to some unrealistic Martha Stewart world. Every thing on the outside looked perfect . The truth is it was far from perfect. Like others have said our sex life went to near zero and like others I turned to the net. I have to say the net kept me from having a real affair.

If she refuses to seek any help. If she will not go with you to see someone then there just is not any hope at all. She has to meet you some part of the way. She has to take at least one step in your direction. You can not save your Marriage on your own. My advice is Move out and do it now. Why wait until after the holidays? That only helps her Ilusion of perfection. Get a Lawyer to write up an agreement about child visitation and who pays for what. She may come around Then again she may never come around you will always be The bad guy because you walked out. You need to do what is best for you and your kids. The only reason she is staying in this hell with you is because she has a nice home and all the pretty things. She has made her own hell with this need for perfection. The right home in the right part of town the right cars and getting the Kids into the right schools. All that looks god from the outside but will not get you any real happiness. To do that you have to dig deep , look inside and find out who you really are. Good luck I have been there and I have to say i am by far a much happier man now I was in the slow death that was my marriage. My ex is still an extremely unhappy woman. Good Luck. There is a light at the end of this dark road.