2 years in... need convincing that this will not work

[Patheticallydespererate]

I actually don’t know where to begin....I have been on here for quite some time reading everyone’s stories and hoping to find the strength to finally walk away from my 2 year affair. We are both married and have children and we tell each other that we want to be together but not right now as his children are still quite young. My husband isn’t a bad person, I think we’ve just grown apart and I fell in love with another man. I haven’t slept with my husband for nearly 2 years as I have fully disconnected from him. My AP says he hasn’t slept with his wife but deep down I know he is lying to me ... I feel like I’ve put my life on hold for this person but nothing will come of it. I feel I’m always there for him and he is as well but not the way I am. I cry nearly every day thinking about what I’m doing to my family, I feel disgusted in myself and l’m at a low point where I feel I don’t even deserve my family. Like many on here, I too believed our affair was different but I’m starting to wake up and see the harsh reality of it all. It’s all about him and when I try to talk to him about my feelings he just shuts me down and blames everything on me. I have many outbursts... especially when I attack him about his wife posting stuff in social media when they are out together etc...I’m jealous, insecure and I’m an emotional roller coaster and he puts up with my nonsense and I don’t know why he does. Sometimes I think it’s because he truly loves me but then I think because it’s easier to put up with me than to start again and find another AP. Happy with advice, criticism.... anything. I just need to hear the hard truth from all of you.

[Pleasant-Sage]

I couldn't begin to give you advice but I wanted to let you know that you have been heard. Sometimes we get ourselves into trouble and don't know where to begin digging ourselves out.

 

You need to figure what's important to you in order to establish some sense of direction because right now you are spiraling downward out of control.

 

Is there anything you enjoy about your family?

Edited December 20, 2019 by Pleasant-Sage

[BlindsidedTwice]

I’m sorry you are here, but congratulations on reaching out for help. That is a big first step. You actually sound quite sane and logical for someone in the midst of an affair.

 

You may get some harsh comments here. Everyone is coming from different opinions and backgrounds. Take it all with a grain of salt, but the comments/posts that upset you the most are really important. Read and reread them. There’s something in there that’s speaking to you.

 

I am a former married other woman, so no judgements from me. I know your pain. The guilt and shame from my past still haunt me everyday, but at least I get to live honestly in the present. When I tell my husband that I’m going somewhere or doing something, that’s what I’m actually going to do. There is no more sneaking around, which feels incredibly freeing.

 

My affair was similar in time length as yours. I felt disconnected from my husband too. I was still sleeping with him - to not raise suspicion - but I did not feel in love with him anymore. It has been 5 months since my affair ended and I can honestly say that my feelings for my husband are coming back. It has taken a lot of work. I am in therapy, exercising outside daily, journaling, reading, planning and going on date nights with my husband... etc. The work is worth it. I am starting to feel like myself again. I am starting to feel strong again. I am starting to feel less pathetically desperate. 

 

No story is exactly the same. If you truly do not want to be with your husband anymore, then start to take steps forward in that direction. Whatever you decide, moving forward is better than staying stagnant where you are right now. 

[Starswillshine]

I cannot comment on what he wants or does not want. No one can say for sure. 

 

But one thing is for sure, even if you guys left your spouses and started a relationship, that relationship will be flawed and filled with issues from the beginning. There would be no trust. The questioning and insecurities will not go away. On top of all of this, you will need to deal with the fall outs. Blending families with people knowing you were affair partners, etc. It is not an easy task. If you know that a future together would still be filled with heart ache, anxiety, insecurities, and drama, why even start? 

[pennydrop]

I'm not going to call you PatheticallyDesperate. So I'll just say, my friend, I'm sorry you're going through it.  I just ended a 3-yr as the OW, so I get it.

 

You say, "he puts up with my nonsense and I don’t know why he does."  Because it's the cost of doing business with you. For a long time I thought, wow, my married guy has the patience of Job because he barely flinches in the face of my outbursts. But truly it was because he didn't care what I was going through. Just let it pass and she'll come back. Feed the meter. This guy who "loved" me let me twist in the wind, over and over and over.

 

You say, "Sometimes I think it’s because he truly loves me but then I think because it’s easier to put up with me than to start again and find another." See above. Sunk cost fallacy. It is easier. Your entire relationship is about what is easiest for HIM.

 

The words you choose don't bode well for a future relationship: shut you down, blame you; attack him, deep down I know he's lying (he is). These will be the raw materials for building your relationship. This dynamic is terribly unhealthy at best and truly f-ed bordering on abusive at worst.

 

Out of the hundreds of thousands of words exchanged with my ex married guy, there was one thing that was flat-out chilling, speaking of his future retirement and moving to another state, "It's not as if we'd stop seeing each other...." Doesn't sound like much. But this told me, albeit backhandedly, A) he wasn't leaving his wife, ever, and B) he expected me to fill the role of OW indefinitely. Me accepting s***-for-crumbs for the rest of my life. That's not someone who loves me, nor, maybe more fundamentally, is it someone who respects me. Ultimately my well-being was something I had to wrestle out of his hands, and he put up a damn good fight. Me being diminished was absolutely to his advantage. Me thinking he was anything other than a garden variety douchebag supported the entire construct of our affair. (And believe -- I did some heavy lifting.)

 

The work I have to do-- and maybe this resonates for you -- is around WHY I feel more comfortable accepting less than what I need. What draws me to the chaos. Best of luck to you. You're not alone.

Edited December 20, 2019 by pennydrop

[mark clemson]

What's there to convince you of? You are already seeing that it will not work.

 

If you wish to add fuel to that fire, I'll point out that a D-day would probably wreck both your marriages and possibly wreck the rest of your life to a certain extent.  Also, if they ever found out about the affair (and they would through a slip-up or logical inconsistency) your children would hate him and his children would hate you for hurting their other parent.

 

So there's that to consider.

[2BGoodAgain]

coming from a 12yr affair, i can tell you... you need to shut it down. 

 

it's hard b/c your AP is giving you something that you don't have in your own marriage. I'm not saying this to save your marriage, i'm just thinking what's good for you. 

 

you can again reconnect with your hubby, mebbe... but you can't so long as you have your AP in your life. The more time i spent with my AP, the less and less i felt for my relationship partner. To a point where one day, i looked at her, and i didn't hate her, but i didn't know what i felt. 

 

it's gonna be the hardest thing to do, but if you truly value your own happiness and a future, you need to stop all contact with your AP. Remove his contact info, everything. If it's too hard to say goodbye and you know you'll relapse, then send an email/text and end it. Then block him on everything.

 

But only do this if you are serious, b/c you're right, he won't change. and to be honest, b/c i was in his shoes.. .he's only using you to supplement what he doesn't have in his marriage. That's why he can go back to his marriage and be happy b/c you give him what he doesn't get in his marriage. You are his fantasy, grass greener on the other side, not reality. 

 

Not reality = you will always be on the side lines at best, at his convenience. He only puts up with you b/c you give him what he wants in the end. That's why. He may like you, he may convinced himself he loves you, but he loves how you make him feel... not you the person.

 

I'm telling you this b/c i was him for the longest time .. i didn't think i was torturing my AP, but i really was...  she tried many times to separate herself from me, but i kept coming back to her.. and she'd relent and take me back b/c she was weak against me.. of how i made her feel.

 

Don't waste any more years on this. Your feelings may be real, but this isn't real. Besides, do you honestly want to be with a man who only thinks about himself above you?

 

I'm not saying go back to your marriage and try to make it work; but if you think there's a chance, try it. If not, end that marriage and find your own happiness. 

 

But your AP isn't where your happiness lies. He's just using you to keep his marriage going.

 

Good luck to you.

[Beentheretoooften]

Do all OW enter affairs looking to get married??  Or do they start in them for the extra attention/emotional/sex???  I think both parties enter affairs not looking to get married.  Everyone agrees on that. So why do MM get continuously bashed for leading on the OW?   It makes no sense. If she falls in love and he doesn’t, why is it his fault everytime.   And please don’t tell me it’s because he tells her he loves her and blah blah blah.   Could you make a case that if OW could control their emotions better then the affair could just be “extra” for both parties.     

[2BGoodAgain]

9 minutes ago, Beentheretoooften said:

Do all OW enter affairs looking to get married??  Or do they start in them for the extra attention/emotional/sex???  I think both parties enter affairs not looking to get married.  Everyone agrees on that. So why do MM get continuously bashed for leading on the OW?   It makes no sense. If she falls in love and he doesn’t, why is it his fault everytime.   And please don’t tell me it’s because he tells her he loves her and blah blah blah.   Could you make a case that if OW could control their emotions better then the affair could just be “extra” for both parties.     

 

it's not about fault or blame...

 

it's about helping this person make a decision that she already knows she needs to but lack the power to pull away....

 

we've all been there or seen it... we aren't absolving her of any responsibility.. that's not the point of this post.. she's asking for help, basically... that extra push... 

Edited December 20, 2019 by 2BGoodAgain

[elaine567]

33 minutes ago, Beentheretoooften said:

Do all OW enter affairs looking to get married??  Or do they start in them for the extra attention/emotional/sex???  I think both parties enter affairs not looking to get married.  Everyone agrees on that. So why do MM get continuously bashed for leading on the OW?   It makes no sense. If she falls in love and he doesn’t, why is it his fault everytime.   And please don’t tell me it’s because he tells her he loves her and blah blah blah.   Could you make a case that if OW could control their emotions better then the affair could just be “extra” for both parties.     

I am not sure about actual marriage but it seems to me many, many OWs and MOWs are looking for a real relationship, not just "extra" from their MM.
As soon as love is mentioned, then she sees a "future" and if her MM lays it on thick then many women will be "led on" by his protestations of love and his "future faking".
Love is an important thing in many women's lives and MM tend to exploit this fact hence the backlash, when he is found to be wanting and his "love" was just a sham.
Many women do not believe a man could be so cruel as to profess love and not mean it as she often means every word.
Perhaps if men in affairs were more honest, "Look I don't love you, it is only a bit of fun and extra sex for me" then women would not get so hurt...

[2BGoodAgain]

2 minutes ago, elaine567 said:

I am not sure about actual marriage but it seems to me many, many OWs and MOWs are looking for a real relationship, not just "extra" from their MM.
As soon as love is mentioned, then she sees a "future" and if her MM lays it on thick then many women will be "led on" by his protestations of love and his "future faking".
Love is an important thing in many women's lives and MM tend to exploit this fact hence the backlash, when he is found to be wanting and his "love" was just a sham.
Many women do not believe a man could be so cruel as to profess love and not mean it as she often means every word.
Perhaps if men in affairs were more honest, "Look I don't love you, it is only a bit of fun and extra sex for me" then women would not get so hurt...

 

I'm iffy about that one... i think MOWs may THINK they want a real relationship, but I'm not convinced... I don't necessarily think they want a distraction or 'extra'... but i don't honestly think they know what they want... they just want something opposite from the relationship they're in, thinking they'll be happier b/c it's different, rather than seeing what they truly want. (shrug).. like i said, i'm not convinced either way, but prob leaning more on they don't know what they truly want.

[elaine567]

Seems to me,  women know exactly what they want most of the time, but women are pretty good at trying to keep the peace or they hide what they really want in case it scares a man off.
Women are pretty quick to jettison the marriage, separate and divorce if they are not happy, it is usually the MM who stalls  and makes excuses.
Married women are often just looking for a replacement husband, men are not looking for a new wife, they have one of those already.

[2BGoodAgain]

1 minute ago, elaine567 said:

Seems to me,  women know exactly what they want most of the time, but women are pretty good at trying to keep the peace or they hide what they really want in case it scares a man off.
Women are pretty quick to jettison the marriage, separate and divorce if they are not happy, it is usually the MM who stalls  and makes excuses.
Married women are often just looking for a replacement husband, men are not looking for a new wife, they have one of those already.

 

can't disagree with the MM stalling, etc.. that happens more than not...

 

but that's my point, MOWs looking to replace the position.. it's not necessarily the person they're looking at, but the spot...

 

just b/c you're moving forward, doesn't necessarily mean you're moving into a better position. 

 

 

[Beentheretoooften]

@elaine I would say that most A’s started in the way of, this is just about extra.  I mean, there’s no way Ap’s are going start an affair by saying I love you?   Mine started with me saying those exact words that you mentioned.  But it doesn’t change how affairs progress.  Women just by nature love more and want to have a magical fantasy ending, when if they stepped back and looked they would see clearly that it is impossible.   

[elaine567]

3 minutes ago, Beentheretoooften said:

@elaine I would say that most A’s started in the way of, this is just about extra.

It may be for many men, but it seems many women think they have a wonderful close friendship with a great guy, a guy that "gets her". That then leads to her falling in love...
When he brings up the L word, then it is perfect, they were meant for each other. 

[Patheticallydespererate]

8 hours ago, BlindsidedTwice said:

I am a former married other woman, so no judgements from me. I know your pain. The guilt and shame from my past still haunt me everyday, but at least I get to live honestly in the present. When I tell my husband that I’m going somewhere or doing something, that’s what I’m actually going to do. There is no more sneaking around, which feels incredibly freeing.

 

 

I love how you said that you now live free. I can’t wait for that day. Can you tell me how your affair ended? And did you at any point cave in? Thank you for your support 

[BlindsidedTwice]

4 minutes ago, Patheticallydespererate said:

I love how you said that you now live free. I can’t wait for that day. Can you tell me how your affair ended? And did you at any point cave in? Thank you for your support 

 

That’s where we differ... My xAP left me. He said he had a “sketchy convo” with his wife and some sort of horrible dream, and then he was gone. I was devastated at the time, but now I am relieved. I understand that it will be much harder to choose to walk away. I wish I had walked away. Maybe I could’ve kept a teeny tiny sliver of dignity or self respect. 

 

He has reached out twice since then, with obvious intent to restart all parts of the affair... but I had already found LS, therapy, and my new honest authentic self. I have learned too much about affairs to ever go back.

[Patheticallydespererate]

6 hours ago, pennydrop said:

The work I have to do-- and maybe this resonates for you -- is around WHY I feel more comfortable accepting less than what I need. What draws me to the chaos

 

I do have a lot of work to do around this. I still think that I’m not worthy even for my AP. I have such low value on myself and this situation is making it worse. What was the final straw for you? 

[preraph]

So therapy is probably in order because your self-esteem is so low.  You should take time for yourself and go work on that and you can have support while seeing the therapist for breaking off with the other guy or your husband or both.  But get help so you feel stronger.  

[Patheticallydespererate]

4 hours ago, 2BGoodAgain said:

I'm telling you this b/c i was him for the longest time .. i didn't think i was torturing my AP, but i really was...  she tried many times to separate herself from me, but i kept coming back to her.. and she'd relent and take me back b/c she was weak against me.. of how i made her feel.

Thank you for taking the time to respond. It’s nice to get a males perspective as well. I too am weak and he knows this. I find it hard to believe that he doesn’t love me the way I do but reading your post and others.... it seems they are only saying things to get what they want and to keep us hooked. He talks about our future all the time and says he doesn’t see a future with his wife.... is that all part of the game plan? Can I ask you a personal question? During the times when you didn’t know how to felt about your relationship partner, did you continue to sleep with her? He claims he hasn’t slept with his wife since we started the affair. 

[Patheticallydespererate]

2 hours ago, elaine567 said:

I am not sure about actual marriage but it seems to me many, many OWs and MOWs are looking for a real relationship, not just "extra" from their MM.
As soon as love is mentioned, then she sees a "future" and if her MM lays it on thick then many women will be "led on" by his protestations of love and his "future faking".
Love is an important thing in many women's lives and MM tend to exploit this fact hence the backlash, when he is found to be wanting and his "love" was just a sham.
Many women do not believe a man could be so cruel as to profess love and not mean it as she often means every word.
Perhaps if men in affairs were more honest, "Look I don't love you, it is only a bit of fun and extra sex for me" then women would not get so hurt...

I agree! I definitely saw a future with this guy... he said all the right things and is still saying it. He talked about marriage about 1 month into our affair. I sound so stupid as I write .... but I have fallen for the I love you, forever ever and as you mentioned “future faking”. 

[Patheticallydespererate]

At the moment my AP is upset and angry with me because I’m going away with the family over Xmas. He has been away previously with his family but lied about it but I’ve been upfront. I’m lacking courage in ending this affair as I know I’ll miss the attention and excitement that he gives me but deep down I know I have to.... to save my family and to save myself. I have recently been thinking of ways on how to end this and I thought about writing an anonymous letter to his wife?? Is this gutless and selfish... I know it’s cruel as well. She uncovered a few texts from me to him earlier this year ... but she obviously forgave him ... and no doubt still has her suspicions. 

[Bittersweetie]

I was a MW. I think it is difficult to gain clarity when one is in the midst of the drama itself. You mention you are going away with your family. Maybe take that time to focus on yourself and your family, and push away thoughts of MM and the affair for now. Like a period of no contact in order for you to start getting your thoughts together.

 

You say things like you're weak and lacking courage, which is a way to defer responsibility. It may not feel like it, but you do have control, you have a choice every moment. It is up to you, though, what kind of person you choose to be moving forward. You do not sound happy. Whether that is regards to the affair or marriage or both I don't know. But if you are this unhappy, then start making changes. They don't have to be huge life-shattering things, but think about the small steps you can take today and then take them. You are in control of your own choices in your life.

 

I, too, live freely now, though I arrived here by a different path than Blindsided. My A ended though I was still mentally involved...until I had a d-day. It was the worst day of my life. But I made a choice to be honest with my husband regarding everything, not just my affair. I had decided I no longer wanted to be a person who lied or cheated anymore. Yes it was very difficult and painful and there were many dark times. But I worked hard on myself and my marriage and supporting my husband. We are still together ten years later, and I am much happier now, living honestly and authentically, than I ever was in the affair. 

 

I agree with PP that therapy may be useful to you. I also read many books on relationships and self-esteem, and read many online posts about others' experiences. Good luck to you. 

[preraph]

She's chosen to be blind rather than leave him behind, so there's no point ruffling his feathers.  She already knows.  She's decided to go along with his lies.  And so have you for that matter.  So all you need to do is tell him you're leaving and block him from your phone and social media and not poke the bear by looking at his social media or making contact, and just move on.  I guess you better hope he doesn't decide to contact your husband out of spite.  But your husband knows something is going on anyway, so...

[stillafool]

4 hours ago, Beentheretoooften said:

Do all OW enter affairs looking to get married??  Or do they start in them for the extra attention/emotional/sex???  I think both parties enter affairs not looking to get married.  Everyone agrees on that. So why do MM get continuously bashed for leading on the OW?   It makes no sense. If she falls in love and he doesn’t, why is it his fault everytime.   And please don’t tell me it’s because he tells her he loves her and blah blah blah.   Could you make a case that if OW could control their emotions better then the affair could just be “extra” for both parties.     

Forget it.  Around here the MM is the blame for the affair and everything else.  It's as if the OW never had a brain to tell her it's wrong to have sex with someone else's husband and cheat on their own.  

 

OP your MM listens to your jealous rage because he wants to keep you soft.  He knows you are somewhat uncontrollable and if he doesn't keep you soft you may tell his wife out of jealousy and then he would have to throw you under the bus.  He's doing it to protect himself.  I'm sure he's afraid of you and doesn't know what to do about it.