2 years in... need convincing that this will not work

[stillafool]

3 hours ago, elaine567 said:

I am not sure about actual marriage but it seems to me many, many OWs and MOWs are looking for a real relationship, not just "extra" from their MM.
As soon as love is mentioned, then she sees a "future" and if her MM lays it on thick then many women will be "led on" by his protestations of love and his "future faking".
Love is an important thing in many women's lives and MM tend to exploit this fact hence the backlash, when he is found to be wanting and his "love" was just a sham.
Many women do not believe a man could be so cruel as to profess love and not mean it as she often means every word.
Perhaps if men in affairs were more honest, "Look I don't love you, it is only a bit of fun and extra sex for me" then women would not get so hurt...

You're right Elaine but if these MOW want love isn't that why they married and have a husband?  Why not get their love from them?  Their love for their husbands is a sham.  Perhaps these women should tell their husbands "Look I don't love you, I'm only here for what you can provide".  Maybe they should think about that while crying over the MM's faults.

[Patheticallydespererate]

1 hour ago, BlindsidedTwice said:

 

That’s where we differ... My xAP left me. He said he had a “sketchy convo” with his wife and some sort of horrible dream, and then he was gone. I was devastated at the time, but now I am relieved. I understand that it will be much harder to choose to walk away. I wish I had walked away. Maybe I could’ve kept a teeny tiny sliver of dignity or self respect. 

 

He has reached out twice since then, with obvious intent to restart all parts of the affair... but I had already found LS, therapy, and my new honest authentic self. I have learned too much about affairs to ever go back.

Good on you for staying strong!! I know this will be my last .... the highs don’t out weigh the lows.... and the lows stay around for days and days 

[elaine567]

1 minute ago, stillafool said:

You're right Elaine but if these MOW want love isn't that why they married and have a husband?  Why not get their love from them? 

I guess  because they usually have tried that and the "love" they sought was not forthcoming for multifarious reasons.
They become "trapped" in marriages with men they no longer know or want to know.
They fall out of love and they want "more" out of life.
Along comes Mr MM promising the earth and suddenly there is a way out...
Only there usually isn't...

[DKT3]

Something you said earlier in your thread is something that I believe a vast majority of MW face but very few admit it, instead they chose to nitpick any and every thing about their marriage to justify it.  You dont value yourself!! That's a huge admittion.  And explains perfectly how you fall into this affair.  

 

Yes, most men in affairs are playing a game while most women are serious,  mean what they say, at least until they have to actually do it. 

 

Many of these men are very good at compartmentalizing affair vs marriage.  When they say I love you I want to be with you,  it's not necessarily a lie, but also not necessarily the truth. What many are really saying is I want status quo.  I want my wife and marriage when I with her, and you when I'm with you. Women tend to be different,  they tend to treat thier husband's poorly and cut them off as you've said you've done.  Quick side note....you do realize that there is a very good chance your husband is having sex, don't you? 

 

As far as MM relationship with his wife,  its likely not changed.  MM are almost forced to degrade his marriage to the MW/OW,  it simply doesn't work if he says, hey my marriage is great, I love my wife our sex life is amazing but I enjoy you as well. If he was say that to you would you been around for two years?  That is most like the case. 

 

In the end, MM go back into thier marriage,  MW have most often ruined their marriage divorce and wonder how they stood in front of that bus.

[DKT3]

1 hour ago, elaine567 said:

I guess  because they usually have tried that and the "love" they sought was not forthcoming for multifarious reasons.
They become "trapped" in marriages with men they no longer know or want to know.
They fall out of love and they want "more" out of life.
Along comes Mr MM promising the earth and suddenly there is a way out...
Only there usually isn't...

I can see that happening,  partly because people tend to  married for the wrong reasons,  and/or have ridiculous expectations (more often women then men).

 

However,  most other its flipped,  they become interested in another man THEN the marriage falls apart.  

 

This is what causes women, in part to fall so hard. They have essentially given up thier marriage and family for the affair.  That has to mean its special,  a once in a lifetime connection....until they are forced to admit it isn't. 

Edited December 21, 2019 by DKT3

[elaine567]

I know you choose to believe that "happy" women are somehow lured away into an affair and then try to justify their actions by moaning about their marriage  and their husband.
However I believe that there are legions of women in unhappy marriages, hoping and praying for some guy to sweep them off their feet and take them out of their "misery"...
They are so desperate to leave that they ignore the usual warnings about affairs...
They choose to believe in love, as they know love has the capacity to set them free... if not from the marriage, then from the heartache of being with a man she doesn't love.
Love tends to be the only thing worth jettisoning their life and their marriage for, so they seek it out... 

[mark clemson]

Yeah, probably sometimes its the one case and sometimes the other.

 

People change over time and it's certainly possible for a MM or MW to become unhappy or grow apart but stay for practical reasons or due to kids etc (with or without resorting to an affair). This doesn't of course mean that what DKT3 is talking about doesn't happen - no doubt it does too. The more smitten the MW becomes with her AP the more the pretty good husband seems so blah and BTDT in comparison at least for some, no? Cognitive dissonance probably plays a role in that as well.

[DKT3]

13 minutes ago, elaine567 said:

I know you choose to believe that "happy" women are somehow lured away into an affair and then try to justify their actions by moaning about their marriage  and their husband.
However I believe that there are legions of women in unhappy marriages, hoping and praying for some guy to sweep them off their feet and take them out of their "misery"...
They are so desperate to leave that they ignore the usual warnings about affairs...
They choose to believe in love, as they know love has the capacity to set them free... if not from the marriage, then from the heartache of being with a man she doesn't love.
Love tends to be the only thing worth jettisoning their life and their marriage for, so they seek it out... 

No, they chose fantasy and fairy tales,  they put that slipper on not realizing at some point it has to come off.

 

I absolutely know there are loads of women unhappy in thier marriages...but I also recognize that the vast majority of women dont cheat...so here is the thing, if we subscribe to this ideology that unhappy women cheat, then we would have 100% infidelity.  Every woman ever married has been unhappy with the marriage and husband at some point,  or will be at some point. No, no, there is another contributing factor in infidelity.  That is what women dont want to face. It's much easier to say my husband and marriage caused me to cheat. Its simply never, ever the truth. Unless he forces another inside, at which point that's a crime and not cheating at all. 

 

Too often the advice is "it's the husband". That's flawed, and why second marriage among women fail at a higher rate then men. 

 

Women are human just like men, women are weak just like men, women allow themselves to be carried away with physical attraction and desire just like men. The difference is women then have to justify the desire by blaming the husband.  Its understandable since women also carry the larger burden of maintaining the marriage in the first place.  It's hard to admit I fked up my marriage,  even more so for women since they've usually made the most effort 

[Naivewomen]

DKT3 is right!! I fcked up my marriage! I believed in the fantasy and fairytale. The glass slipper (which ironically is the exact same analogy I used to my AP) I'm back to being Cinderella. The fantasy is equivalent to MM's escape with the exception that they do not blame their wives for anything like women do. I did infact nitpick on everything!! My husband's sneezes even annoyed me. He stood no chance against the power of my own delusional fantasy.  I preferred the escape over mundane. I blameshifted to justify. 

I came to the realization that MM would have continued indefinitely as long as he remained safe and it was convenient for him. 

They mean what they say while in the current situation women tend to take it home with them. It's a big gender difference and will always end!!

I consider myself lucky eventhough it's still difficult but I am fortunate my H stuck around. He showed up and stepped up to the plate around the home especially with my children when my focus was off of everyone that was most important to me. 

Affairs will ruin lives! Please get out ASAP and remain connected to your family. 

[Patheticallydespererate]

9 hours ago, DKT3 said:

Something you said earlier in your thread is something that I believe a vast majority of MW face but very few admit it, instead they chose to nitpick any and every thing about their marriage to justify it.  You dont value yourself!! That's a huge admittion.  And explains perfectly how you fall into this affair.  

 

Yes, most men in affairs are playing a game while most women are serious,  mean what they say, at least until they have to actually do it. 

 

Many of these men are very good at compartmentalizing affair vs marriage.  When they say I love you I want to be with you,  it's not necessarily a lie, but also not necessarily the truth. What many are really saying is I want status quo.  I want my wife and marriage when I with her, and you when I'm with you. Women tend to be different,  they tend to treat thier husband's poorly and cut them off as you've said you've done.  Quick side note....you do realize that there is a very good chance your husband is having sex, don't you? 

 

As far as MM relationship with his wife,  its likely not changed.  MM are almost forced to degrade his marriage to the MW/OW,  it simply doesn't work if he says, hey my marriage is great, I love my wife our sex life is amazing but I enjoy you as well. If he was say that to you would you been around for two years?  That is most like the case. 

 

In the end, MM go back into thier marriage,  MW have most often ruined their marriage divorce and wonder how they stood in front of that bus.

I read your comment several times as it’s hit hard as there are many truths. The problem is... in my head I think I know all this but refuse to believe it. Well until I found this forum and read so many stories. It truly has been an eye opener. 

[Patheticallydespererate]

9 hours ago, DKT3 said:

Something you said earlier in your thread is something that I believe a vast majority of MW face but very few admit it, instead they chose to nitpick any and every thing about their marriage to justify it.  You dont value yourself!! That's a huge admittion.  And explains perfectly how you fall into this affair.  

 

Yes, most men in affairs are playing a game while most women are serious,  mean what they say, at least until they have to actually do it. 

 

Many of these men are very good at compartmentalizing affair vs marriage.  When they say I love you I want to be with you,  it's not necessarily a lie, but also not necessarily the truth. What many are really saying is I want status quo.  I want my wife and marriage when I with her, and you when I'm with you. Women tend to be different,  they tend to treat thier husband's poorly and cut them off as you've said you've done.  Quick side note....you do realize that there is a very good chance your husband is having sex, don't you? 

 

As far as MM relationship with his wife,  its likely not changed.  MM are almost forced to degrade his marriage to the MW/OW,  it simply doesn't work if he says, hey my marriage is great, I love my wife our sex life is amazing but I enjoy you as well. If he was say that to you would you been around for two years?  That is most like the case. 

 

In the end, MM go back into thier marriage,  MW have most often ruined their marriage divorce and wonder how they stood in front of that bus.

 

6 hours ago, Naivewomen said:

DKT3 is right!! I fcked up my marriage! I believed in the fantasy and fairytale. The glass slipper (which ironically is the exact same analogy I used to my AP) I'm back to being Cinderella. The fantasy is equivalent to MM's escape with the exception that they do not blame their wives for anything like women do. I did infact nitpick on everything!! My husband's sneezes even annoyed me. He stood no chance against the power of my own delusional fantasy.  I preferred the escape over mundane. I blameshifted to justify. 

I came to the realization that MM would have continued indefinitely as long as he remained safe and it was convenient for him. 

You’re right.... it is a delusional fantasy. I was repulsed by my husband because I thought my AP could do no wrong but my husband hasn’t done anything wrong .... he should be repulsed by me. He has given me time and space to sort my head out, where really that time is being used fantasising about my AP. 

[Naivewomen]

That's right! You have figured it all out now! When the lows outweigh the highs like it did for me it's time to end it in a mature manner. You MM will understand (maybe not initially). Please do not let your heart lead over your brain! Difficult trust me I know but it's a necessity now!

[spiderowl]

If you are crying every day and this guy shuts you down when you want to talk about anything important to you, it does not sound like he is making you happy.  I think you know this is not working for you.

 

Were you distanced from your husband before you met this guy or was that as a consequence of meeting him?

[Patheticallydespererate]

5 hours ago, spiderowl said:

If you are crying every day and this guy shuts you down when you want to talk about anything important to you, it does not sound like he is making you happy.  I think you know this is not working for you.

 

Were you distanced from your husband before you met this guy or was that as a consequence of meeting him?

 

He shuts me down because he thinks I’m overreacting to things or if I need reassurance or if I question his intentions. I do it often as I’m quite insecure. He shuts me down because I think I’ve hit the nail in the head on a few things.

 

I was in a low place when I met my AP.... I wanted a 3rd baby and H didn’t. My husband is a big gambler .... and I’m not blaming this as the cause of me stepping out and finding someone .... I’m just lonely. I feel like I’m not good enough and don’t do anything right and here comes along a man that thinks I’m the best thing that ever happened to him. I did believe that, however the last few months of the fog clearing and being on here... he thought I was the best purely for selfish reasons. I’m as gullible as they come. 

[mark clemson]

On 12/20/2019 at 1:35 PM, Patheticallydespererate said:

 deep down I know I have to.... to save my family and to save myself. I have recently been thinking of ways on how to end this and I thought about writing an anonymous letter to his wife?? Is this gutless and selfish... I know it’s cruel as well.

 

There are a multitude of views on this particular" move." Some would say it's cruel to NOT tell her, others would agree with your statement, still others would say "don't bother" as you're not likely to be believed, etc.

 

My advice is to consider speaking to a lawyer in your state/region, explain the situation fully, and find out what ramifications there might be. It sounds like you expect this to end the A, but there to be no blowback. That may not be realistic. He might seek revenge by telling your husband, or SHE might insist he tell as part of reconciliation (if there is to be one). Your BH might then (quite understandably) seek a divorce. In some states BS's can actually sue the affair partner. So, I'd look into all the parameters before doing this, so you make a fully informed decision.

[Hip Pocket]

On 12/20/2019 at 12:23 AM, Patheticallydespererate said:

I actually don’t know where to begin....I have been on here for quite some time reading everyone’s stories and hoping to find the strength to finally walk away from my 2 year affair. We are both married and have children and we tell each other that we want to be together but not right now as his children are still quite young. My husband isn’t a bad person, I think we’ve just grown apart and I fell in love with another man. I haven’t slept with my husband for nearly 2 years as I have fully disconnected from him. My AP says he hasn’t slept with his wife but deep down I know he is lying to me ... I feel like I’ve put my life on hold for this person but nothing will come of it. I feel I’m always there for him and he is as well but not the way I am. I cry nearly every day thinking about what I’m doing to my family, I feel disgusted in myself and l’m at a low point where I feel I don’t even deserve my family. Like many on here, I too believed our affair was different but I’m starting to wake up and see the harsh reality of it all. It’s all about him and when I try to talk to him about my feelings he just shuts me down and blames everything on me. I have many outbursts... especially when I attack him about his wife posting stuff in social media when they are out together etc...I’m jealous, insecure and I’m an emotional roller coaster and he puts up with my nonsense and I don’t know why he does. Sometimes I think it’s because he truly loves me but then I think because it’s easier to put up with me than to start again and find another AP. Happy with advice, criticism.... anything. I just need to hear the hard truth from all of you.

 

I’m just aghast with all of the stereotypes and vilification for the MPs on this thread. 
 

First, I’d like to say I hope you resolve this turmoil, whatever it is. Having said that, I wonder why it is you believe that your MOM is lying to you. Do you not trust men? Do you have FOO issues? If he as the MM is a liar does that automatically make you as the MW a liar? I’m just trying to understand. And I think it would be wise to see an IC about all of this. 
 

I think he tolerates you or “puts up with your nonsense” because he cares. Look, it’s not that hard to start an affair but he’s staying with you and willing to work on issues with you. He’d dump you in a hot second if he felt you weren’t worth it so please stop stressing about this. 
 

You say you are putting your life on hold. Did he ask you to stop sleeping with your H? Are you expecting him to leave his M for you? 

 

It feels like you stopped feeling desire for your H so you began an affair and now that you’re in it your feelings are growing for the MOM. Don’t blame him for that because it’s only natural. 
 

I think if you focus only on the present and enjoy the time you have with him you’ll stop feeling like your life is on hold and you’ll stop complaining about what you see on social media. He can’t help what his W posts and those are likely fake smiles for the camera anyway. 
 

So, if you get IC, stop looking at SM, cut him some slack and have trust in him, I think you’ll feel a lot better about your relationship with him. Once that part of your life is stable then you can focus on how this is affecting your family. I’ve been in my affair for many years and I can honestly say it has not affected my family.

 

Hugs to you. 

[DKT3]

Most people in affairs are just people making poor decisions...some are just not good people. 

Edited December 28, 2019 by DKT3

[SKYEP]

On 12/20/2019 at 5:40 PM, Beentheretoooften said:

Do all OW enter affairs looking to get married??  Or do they start in them for the extra attention/emotional/sex???  I think both parties enter affairs not looking to get married.  Everyone agrees on that. So why do MM get continuously bashed for leading on the OW?   It makes no sense. If she falls in love and he doesn’t, why is it his fault everytime.   And please don’t tell me it’s because he tells her he loves her and blah blah blah.   Could you make a case that if OW could control their emotions better then the affair could just be “extra” for both parties.     

Agree with you on controlling emotions. 

I've been seeing a MM for 3 years because I don't want a conventional relationship. Judge me, hate it, I don't care. It works for both of us. Im under no illusion that he will ever leave his wife and, for the time being, we are giving each other what is missing in our lives. 

[Piddy]

Is it a human condition to live a lie?  I still say it's all about the sex.  Would any of the people involved in affairs keep the affair going if there was no sex?  My guess is for a man it's all about the sex and for the woman it's still about the sex, but they get some additional emotional benefit from it. 

I'm speaking from the perspective of never having cheated, but have been cheated on.  I'll never understand it.  If you're that unhappy have the integrity to leave your spouse / partner and move on with your life.  Cheating partners seem to want their cake and eat it too.  It seems to me to be an extremely selfish act.  These opinions are all stating the obvious I know.

I can honestly say I have no sympathy for someone who cheats because they have no empathy for anyone else themselves.  I don't come to this from religious beliefs or pretend to be morally superior to anyone. 

But I just don't understand the complete lack of human decency.  Speaking from the perspective of a cheating victim it's the worst emotional experience you can have.

I think if before a person decided to enter into an affair, they really thought about it, they wouldn't do it.  But as we know humans many times don't think with their brains, they think with other body parts instead.

[Beentheretoooften]

11 hours ago, SKYEP said:

Agree with you on controlling emotions. 

I've been seeing a MM for 3 years because I don't want a conventional relationship. Judge me, hate it, I don't care. It works for both of us. Im under no illusion that he will ever leave his wife and, for the time being, we are giving each other what is missing in our lives. 

Are you single or married?   Not that it matters I’m just curious.   I just hope you dont change your mind of what you want as this gets to 4,5, 6+ years.  

[mark clemson]

2 hours ago, Piddy said:

 I still say it's all about the sex.  Would any of the people involved in affairs keep the affair going if there was no sex? 

I can honestly say I have no sympathy for someone who cheats because they have no empathy for anyone else themselves.

Speaking from the perspective of a cheating victim it's the worst emotional experience you can have.

 

There are emotional affairs that do not involve sex, just as there is "unrequited love", times apart, and LDRs that do not involve sex but can sometimes involve a great deal of emotion. Some people might argue that EAs aren't actually affairs but more like deep friendships with mutual romantic feelings. However, if that "friendship" involves romantic interest in another person that is hidden from the spouse, I think there's a good case for it to be considered an affair.

Who knows what empathy other people may or may not have. Many WS's here seem to have guilt over their role - no doubt that in part due to empathy for those they are deceiving. Why else would they have it?  That statement sounds a lot like a Vegan claiming that meat-eaters have no empathy for any animals just because they eat meat. Never mind all the dog, cat, and horse lovers out there.

Not to minimize your distress, which no doubt was very real, but there are actually plenty of people who have dusted their hands off and moved on from infidelity with limited distress. I saw a statement the other day from a woman who likened divorcing her WH to scraping gum off her shoes and walking on. I'm not saying there aren't plenty of very distressed victims of Ddays, there definitely are, but not everyone is highly emotional and experiences it extremely traumatically.

[Hip Pocket]

On 12/20/2019 at 2:13 PM, stillafool said:

Forget it.  Around here the MM is the blame for the affair and everything else.  It's as if the OW never had a brain to tell her it's wrong to have sex with someone else's husband and cheat on their own.  

 

OP your MM listens to your jealous rage because he wants to keep you soft.  He knows you are somewhat uncontrollable and if he doesn't keep you soft you may tell his wife out of jealousy and then he would have to throw you under the bus.  He's doing it to protect himself.  I'm sure he's afraid of you and doesn't know what to do about it.

Or he is simply in love with her and wants her in his life. Is it so hard to believe that a MP actually loved the OP? I loved my OP. 
 

PD, I hope you find a solution to the problem. In any R there are ups and downs and affairs are no different. Maybe you are just in a bad patch that will improve in a short while. Do you have any updates for us?

[stillafool]

24 minutes ago, Pocket said:

Or he is simply in love with her and wants her in his life. Is it so hard to believe that a MP actually loved the OP? I loved my OP. 
 

 

No it's not hard to believe a man could love a woman and if he is simply in love with her he can divorce and have her.

[Beentheretoooften]

It’s never that easy.   You know that too 

[Piddy]

5 hours ago, mark clemson said:

Not to minimize your distress, which no doubt was very real, but there are actually plenty of people who have dusted their hands off and moved on from infidelity with limited distress. I saw a statement the other day from a woman who likened divorcing her WH to scraping gum off her shoes and walking on. I'm not saying there aren't plenty of very distressed victims of Ddays, there definitely are, but not everyone is highly emotional and experiences it extremely traumatically.

Obviously if you're not in love with your partner and are indifferent to them, then it may very well be easy to move on.  But if the cheated on partner does still love their cheating partner then it can be devastating.  Not to mention if any children are involved.