How did I end up in this mess

[DKT3]

It's the only way for her because she wants a relationship with the guy and not to be his other woman.  If she was asking how do I learn to become comfortable in my role as OW then advice on how to maintain her affair would be valid. 

Edited January 11, 2020 by DKT3

[FMW]

11 hours ago, Pocket said:

Telling her to get out if it is not the only way to solve it. 

My post was specifically about "do not listen to advice....".  As my reference to getting different opinions indicated, I agree with you there is more than one option.  I was simply disagreeing with the direction to "not listen" to an option that differs from the one you posited.  

Edited January 11, 2020 by Finding my way

[Hip Pocket]

12 hours ago, Pocket said:

Telling her to get out if it is not the only way to solve it. 

In fact, that’s running from her problem, not solving it. 

[Findingfreedom]

I was you years ago... I waited and waited and then it just turned to texting and he would love bomb me till I met up w him and then after he got what he wanted he’d lay low. It happened numerous times and everytime he somehow convinced me that he was going to be with me and all the things we’d do. Finally one day I just got tired... tired of listening to the same crap over and over... so I just blocked him... 

he is never ever going to be with you! I wasted 7 years of my life waiting.... don’t be me:(

[Daisydooks]

On 1/9/2020 at 10:01 AM, Pocket said:

Unhappy fool, do not listen to advice from people who have not enjoyed nor learned how to navigate in a long term EMR. Your “place” is exactly where you want to be. You have so much more power than you know, you just haven’t learned it yet or used it. You do get to demand whatever you want, whatever your needs are, not only in this R but every R. It is NOT your job to wait and wonder, don’t listen to this rubbish! 

 

From her first post... "I follow his rules about what I can and can’t do, yet here I am sad lonely whilst he’s planning a wonderful Christmas."

How is she supposed to navigate Christmas in 2020? Please enlighten us 

 

[Hip Pocket]

On 1/10/2020 at 4:49 AM, NomiMalone said:

@Pocket you raise an interesting alternative view here, and I don’t disagree.

However what you suggest doesn’t apply at all to Unhappy Fool (and the other 99% of OW on LS), who see being married to MM happily ever after as their end goal (instead of seeing the “beauty of not being married to MM.”)

As an OW, using your power to demand what you want from MM and setting ground rules only works if:

1)The OW is happy to remain a OW and doesnt have an end goal of being in a real relationship with MM. Few MM leave their marriages and certainly no one can demand that an MM divorce his wife. The OW can only choose to walk away when it becomes clear he’s not leaving.

And:

2)The MM is emotionally intelligent enough / understands women enough to know what the OW needs to stay happy and available to him (whether this be gifts, or daily calls etc.) He has to realise that in order for a woman to want to sleep with him, he has to make her feel desired, sexy, special and valued. It really is that easy. Forgetting his OW’s birthday, and being rigid about the little things that put her in “her place” is really not going to make her want to sleep with him. And really, how hard is it to type a birthday reminder in your calendar and pick up a cheap bottle of champagne? (Even though Unhappy Fool deserves better than a cheap bottle of champagne!) Just saying that that MM is seriously an idiot if he can’t even do something so simple to get himself laid. 

There is a current thread by a poster who’s happy being an OW. Perhaps these points are more relevant in a thread like that and not this OP’s thread.

Let’s let UF decide whether my posts are helpful to her.

If you would replace “OW” with “woman” you’d see how dismissive you’re being to women in general, including wives. And MM as well. Remember, these MM are husbands and if they’re going to buy their OW “a cheap bottle of Champaign” they’re likely to provide the same or similar for their BW. 
 

In any good R it’s about communication, not demands. 
 

Make no mistake, though I am not M to my MM I am indeed in a relationship with him. All of us in EMRs are in relationships with MPs. 
 

And finally, if the MM you describe are merely doing things to keep the sex going what is he doing to keep the M going? You basically described my ex-husband which is the reason I left him and opted for a kinder, sweeter, more meaningful R with my MM. In fact he is at my place today installing something for me while I am at work. We may or may not have sex when I get home, depends on my mood, and then he will take me out to dinner. Sounds like any ordinary M to me! I have to admit though it’s a lot hotter. 

[Hip Pocket]

21 hours ago, Daisydooks said:

 

From her first post... "I follow his rules about what I can and can’t do, yet here I am sad lonely whilst he’s planning a wonderful Christmas."

How is she supposed to navigate Christmas in 2020? Please enlighten us 

 

Well if she’s still reading and participating in this thread I’d advise her to change the dynamics of the R if she wants to remain in it. But now I’ve already explained all that up thread.

[Daisydooks]

1 hour ago, Pocket said:

Well if she’s still reading and participating in this thread I’d advise her to change the dynamics of the R if she wants to remain in it. But now I’ve already explained all that up 

I am attempting to understand the dynamics. Since I left my ex, curiosity has always been there when it comes to cheating and affair dynamics. I didnt care to hear him tell me after 12 years together. I didnt trust him not to lie and trickle truth. I was disgusted with him. I left the house and never returned. Communication with him stopped dead on DDay. They never ended up together because of what he did on DDay. He chased me out of her house when she was positive he would stay. I handed him right to her on a silver platter and he ran for me. It was clear to her then he was a lying asshat.  It was a rude awakening to see him chase after the "awful cunt of a wife" he had made me out to be. I entertained none of it, did a full 180 on him, and was STONE cold. No words. No nothing. He was an addict, and I had stayed for many years so his cheating was just the straw that broke the camel's back. 

I found myself here years ago out of utter curiosity one evening trying to piece together what happened in my own R. So I am asking because I do not understand, not to be a dick. Lol! I'm sorry if I sound like a combative dick.  From what I read here, you are the exception, not the rule and given what my ex did when I found out and confronted him (I delivered a bag of his s*** to her house while he was there) so he could stay the evening. She was well aware and expected him to be happy, and stay. Lol. Lord. He chased me right out of her house, crying, apologizing, you name it... and treated her like garbage. He didnt mean a word he said to her and when caught, was "so sorry" for what he had done to me. I felt sorry for her after. She wasnt an awful person. He was a sick man

You seem to have it all together here with your MM and he has found time for you so if that's what she wants (and maybe it is) simply telling her to "change the dynamics" doesn't help, but telling her how to might. Im genuinely attempting to understand the dynamics you feel you can change in a R like this if he wants to stay married and not be outed. Where does your MMs wife think he is? The deception you know he is capable of is attractive to you? Or is that unattractive? You seem to be swooning over his ability to cheat and lie. What is hot about this? Lol. I'm disgusted reading it so I just dont understand.  I'm trying to though. What is hot about a man who does this? 

If UF came to you and said, "I need help communicating my desires, what do I SAY to him about needing to see him on Christmas Day?" Word for word, how would you go about this with your own MM if being together was a make it or break it to you?  Or have you long since accepted you dont get to see your MM on Christmas/during the holidays, too? Is that your compromise if he comes over and fixes something randomly and takes you to dinner? Do you go to another city, or is he risking his marriage every single time you're out together on dates? Do you just flip out, cry, stomp your feet and ignore him for 4 weeks until he comes crawling back with bread crumbs for you? How does that change the dynamics positively? That's insane to have a relationship like that.

You just simply accepted your place, and he sees you within the confines of his schedule where it wont ruin his marriage? I assume he isnt taking a call from you at dinner with his wife, and I assume you wouldnt be allowed to visit at the hospital while his wife is bedside with him if anything were to happen and surely, you arent the first emergency contact on the list. If he died tomorrow, would you be able to attend his funeral? Would you even know he was dead?  

Christmas is for family. She isnt part of his and she knows her place in his life because this is a R that works for only him. Surely you know this when reading her story. Or do you see yourself in her, at a time when you also didnt communicate your needs? 

Do you get time on Christmas with your MM? Or do you settle for the 27th when he can sneak away without alarming anyone? Where does his wife think he is while he is playing Mr Fix-It today? This just sounded braggy and gross. Lol. I'm sure he has better things to do at his OWN house than fix your s*** for you. 

You are the "other" woman, as in not the first or only. I will continue to use OW when describing secondary women because you are secondary/the other/not the one or only one 

[Hip Pocket]

4 hours ago, Daisydooks said:

I am attempting to understand the dynamics. 

I'm disgusted reading it so I just dont understand.  

 

It’s not really worth anyone’s time explaining the dynamics when you’ve already decided that you’re “disgusted” by them. I’m here to support UF on her thread so I think I’ll pass on this one. 

[Daisydooks]

3 hours ago, Pocket said:

It’s not really worth anyone’s time explaining the dynamics when you’ve already decided that you’re “disgusted” by them. I’m here to support UF on her thread so I think I’ll pass on this one. 

"Sounds like any ordinary M to me! I have to admit though it’s a lot hotter." This made me choke a bit, yes. Sorry, you sounded like you get off on the pain of others and it is a hard read. 

That's fair if you dont want to enlighten me, but in support of UF, if UF came to you and said, "I need help communicating my desires, what do I SAY to him about needing to see him on Christmas Day?" Word for word, how would you go about this with your own MM if being together was a make it or break it to you?

[Hip Pocket]

14 hours ago, Daisydooks said:

"Sounds like any ordinary M to me! I have to admit though it’s a lot hotter." This made me choke a bit, yes. Sorry, you sounded like you get off on the pain of others and it is a hard read. 

That's fair if you dont want to enlighten me, but in support of UF, if UF came to you and said, "I need help communicating my desires, what do I SAY to him about needing to see him on Christmas Day?" Word for word, how would you go about this with your own MM if being together was a make it or break it to you?

UF has already come here for support and I have already offered it. 
 

And I don’t know how you jumped to the conclusion that I get off on somebody else’s pain. Nobody is in pain at all so there’s nothing for you to worry about. 
 

My point about my EMR being hotter than M was based on my own life account. I was in a long term M and my EMR happens to be hotter than my M was. Sorry if my life experience hurts you. 

[Daisydooks]

32 minutes ago, Pocket said:

UF has already come here for support and I have already offered it. 
 

And I don’t know how you jumped to the conclusion that I get off on somebody else’s pain. Nobody is in pain at all so there’s nothing for you to worry about. 
 

My point about my EMR being hotter than M was based on my own life account. I was in a long term M and my EMR happens to be hotter than my M was. Sorry if my life experience hurts you. 

 I am in no pain, Pocket. I promise. I wish you well and sincerely hope you continue to have happiness in your life, even if it's a choice I wouldnt make for myself. 

It was the statement about your affair being hotter than marriage that disgusted me a bit. I was honest. Nothing else. That's all. Again, your life experiences hurt me not. Not once have I said I was hurt or in pain because of your actions. I have been hurt in the past because of my ex and I can very much compartmentalize that. It was all on him. No one else... not even the OW. In fact, had we not met the way we did, she would be someone I could be friends with. She owed me nothing but she was a nice woman

I wasnt even hurt by my own OW, so I promise you as an OW I dont know, you havent hurt me with your words or experiences.  I'm sorry if it came across that way and I confused you. 

Edited January 15, 2020 by Daisydooks

[Hip Pocket]

3 hours ago, Daisydooks said:

 I am in no pain, Pocket. I promise. I wish you well and sincerely hope you continue to have happiness in your life, even if it's a choice I wouldnt make for myself. 

It was the statement about your affair being hotter than marriage that disgusted me a bit. I was honest. Nothing else. That's all. Again, your life experiences hurt me not. Not once have I said I was hurt or in pain because of your actions. I have been hurt in the past because of my ex and I can very much compartmentalize that. It was all on him. No one else... not even the OW. In fact, had we not met the way we did, she would be someone I could be friends with. She owed me nothing but she was a nice woman

I wasnt even hurt by my own OW, so I promise you as an OW I dont know, you havent hurt me with your words or experiences.  I'm sorry if it came across that way and I confused you. 

I wish you well too. 
 

I guess I don’t get why you’d be disgusted with my statement though. It’s my life and I know which R made me happier and more satisfied. Do you think that, because it’s an EMR, that I don’t deserve to be happier or feel more satisfied? I only ask because you reacted to my statement in UF’s thread and I think she could benefit from the answer...as long as it was constructive of course.

[Unhappy fool]

Sorry I haven’t read any of the new replies on here - I am so sad and incredibly low but I wanted to post a little update 

 

MM came to see me yesterday.  When he had gone and I felt upset that I missed him already and couldn’t even phone to chat later in the evening.  That he’d gone off to his other life I was ashamed of how jealous I was I did some thinking 

 

Today I told him it was over.  He phoned and asked what was going on.  He told me  I made him happy, I was wonderful and he thought we had something special, but he appreciated that it was difficult for me that I only got snatches of time and apologised that he Had caused me upset.  I said a few other things about how he made me feel and that was that.  He said he needed to think- and I said that’s all I need to know if you can’t think of anything to make me stay and YOU want to think! 
 

so now I feel sick sad upset and very very low and wish I’d never said anything 

[AriesMan83]

Unhappy fool,

You have done a right thing by ending the affair.You have taken your power back to make the right choices about your life by ending it.

Stay strong on NC.Affairs are like an addiction.You will go through withdrawal like an addict.You will feel like contacting him or meeting him..Pls don't do that.Block him on phone,social media,email I'd etc.Create a mental block.Whenever he enters your thoughts,start thinking about your work or hobbies or thing to do at work or at home.Keep yourself busy.It will be extremely difficult and hard to do but with time he will become a distant memory.With time and NC you will develop indifference to him.

Pls get into IC to find out why you thought its OK to have an affair?An IC can help you heal and develop better coping skills and strong boundaries.

Pls read the book"Not Just Friends" by Shirley Glass.It will give you a better idea about affairs.Pls Google and read about Limerence. 

 

[Unhappy fool]

I never thought it was ok. I am disgusted with myself and no one can hate me more than myself.  I didn’t plan it the friendship gradually turned into more. Yes it is my fault I am responsible for my actions and could’ve stopped it

I don’t need to block him, he won’t be back in contact.  I feel absolutely horrendous 

[2BGoodAgain]

10 minutes ago, Unhappy fool said:

I never thought it was ok. I am disgusted with myself and no one can hate me more than myself.  I didn’t plan it the friendship gradually turned into more. Yes it is my fault I am responsible for my actions and could’ve stopped it

I don’t need to block him, he won’t be back in contact.  I feel absolutely horrendous 

i beg to disagree... how you feel now will have ups and down, yes n no... i highly recommend you block any possible contact with him from you to him or him to you.  From his prospective, he isn't thinking about you.. at least, not compared to how he thinks about himself. He is his own 1st priority. so if it gets bad enough, he WILL contact you first. b/c you are 2nd priority, compared to his 1st priority: himself. I know this, b/c I was him... I self deluded myself, at the time... saying i just miss her b/c i love her so much... but upon deep reflection, I was being incredibly selfish... i was just thinking about how she made me feel, instead of seeing the pain n problems i caused her. And this isn't even considering the relationship both my AP and I were in, and how we were selfish to our relationship partners.

So for your sake, NC/block him.

Also, if you don't block him, you're fooling yourself.. it's like a victim way of saying, no affair could happen b/c reasoning A,B,C... but that's just opening up yourself for that possibility to actually happen. What if reasoning A,B,C happens? then what? you let it happen? Be proactive, if you truly detest what you've done, then protect yourself/relationship.

Also from YOUR prospective... most AP goes thru up and downs... disgust/attraction/need... what you feel right now, may not be how you feel later when you may go thru withdrawal symptoms of "missing" him, when really you just miss the way he makes you feel.

a suggestion. the choice is always yours. Good luck to you.

 

 

Edited January 17, 2020 by 2BGoodAgain

[AriesMan83]

Unhappy Fool,

Pls block him in every possible manner.Don't give him the power to contact you.Pls do it for your well being.

What I mean by "Why did you think it was OK to have an affair" is that you should go to IC to find out why you did it?You say you knew it was not ok but you still did it.How did you justify to yourself about having an affair in spite of knowing it was not right?Affairs are a very complex problem.Your IC can help you change your thought process.IC will help you become an authentic person.Pls read the book "Not Just Friends" by Shirley Glass.

Affairs are like an addiction.You will go through the withdrawal just like an addict goes through when he/she quits drugs/alcohol etc.You will feel like talking to him or contacting.Contacting him will make you feel high but after the contact is over you will guilt and shame again.Any break in NC will put you back to square one in your path of getting out of infidelity.

It will take time but you have to develop indifference towards him.

[AriesMan83]

Unhappy Fool,

It's a good thing if you feel horrendous about your affair.It's a step in the right direction.Use it as a lesson in becoming an authentic person and to never do something that will make you feel guilty and ashamed like this.

I will also suggest you to not wallow in self pity.It keeps you concentrated on your pain and not at the pain caused to your family.Pls work hard in peeling all the layers of infidelity with your IC.

Have you confessed to your husband??

[BlindsidedTwice]

3 hours ago, Unhappy fool said:

Today I told him it was over.

Congratulations on this enormous step!!! I know it feels horribly sad... but here comes the hard part... sticking to it.

Are you in IC? Do you exercise outside? What are your hobbies? Can you write in a journal? I'd suggest reading everything you can about affairs - they all tend to be very similar... Once you can recognize the patterns, you can get yourself out of the fog. Can you volunteer anywhere?  Do you have female friends who you can spend time with?  Do you have any goals or dreams that you've been wanting to pursue? It's time to take care of yourself. Put in the hard work. You can feel better.

There is a lot of support to be found here on LS - keep posting. We will help you.

Edited January 17, 2020 by BlindsidedTwice

[Unhappy fool]

I can’t get my head straight I can’t think I just feel extremely sad and bereft.
 

 I have no idea what made me do it. I just ignored a few of his messages today as felt fed up that he just seemed to pick me up and put me down at will.  The next think I’m texting I can’t do this anymore we want different things - he telephoned me and then that’s it 3 years gone in a blink.  I wrote him a letter a few weeks back pages and pages, he’ll never read it now and will never know how some of the things he said and did made me feel.

I tend to work 12 hour days so don’t have much time to volunteer.  
 

I’ve isolated myself from friends, not making plans just in case he wanted to see me, or not knowing if I’d be sad or low as he hadn’t been in touch and therefore I wouldn’t want to go out ( so thus avoiding me needing to cancel on them)

I used to enjoy running not a hobby really I suppose, but I did do it frequently.  That’s fallen by the wayside recently  ( unless things have been good between us then I’d go. If I felt unsettled I wouldn’t)
 

Im sorta regretting my decision to say I want more than this, I deserve more therefore I’m walking away.  It’s more painful than I ever expected. Im wondering what he’s thinking and I am struggling to imagine never seeing/speaking to him again.  Never feeling him hold me in his arms.

wow this is tough 
 

 

[AriesMan83]

Unhappy Fool,

You are grieving the end of your affair.You are going through the withdrawal process..It's OK to feel it..Don't look back..Move ahead..

Pls block him..Don't let him contact you..

Pls maintain a healthy diet and eat well.Take care of your health..Start running again..Go out with your friends.Maintain physical and mental NC and you will come out of it strong..

Keep posting..There are people here who can help you.

 

[BlindsidedTwice]

25 minutes ago, Unhappy fool said:

I just ignored a few of his messages today as felt fed up that he just seemed to pick me up and put me down at will.

Remember this feeling and hold on to it.  You are not a toy.  

Reach out to your friends. It will be hard to not talk about this part of your life, but try to listen to them. Ask them what's going on with their lives. Give your love to them.

I would definitely recommend a run!!! Running is the best 🤩 in my opinion. You can cry while you run. You can have angry imaginary conversations. Sounds like you work really long days, but if you can, try to run outside. There is just something about moving your body outside in nature.

I know it's nearly impossible this early on, but try to not think about "never feeling him hold me again" thoughts.  Find a way to mentally block those thoughts, or put them to the side, for now. Sometimes a visual helps. I used to imagine running into deep dark woods (which represented my memories of xMM) and then physically turning around and running out of the woods. Once I was out of the woods, I could find a safe healthy honest thought to land on.  

Stay strong. You will not regret this decision once you feel your freedom and happiness coming back. 

Edited January 17, 2020 by BlindsidedTwice

[Bittersweetie]

UF, two things:

Do not fall into the trap of calling yourself disgusting, hating yourself, etc. You are not disgusting. Yes, you made some choices that hurt and may not have been the healthiest choices. But who hasn't? I believe what shows a true person is how they handle the poor/bad/hurtful choices they make. So, instead of entering the vicious circle of "I did bad things, I hate myself" kind of thinking, try thinking about, what kind of person do I want to be now? And take steps toward that person. 

And second, I agree with Blindsided...try not to think of things in a "never again" sort of way. Thinking that way is too overwhelming for anyone. Instead, take it one day at a time. You will not have contact today. You can do one day. You are strong enough for that. One day at a time.

[FMW]

As has been suggested, start scheduling your free time (instead of saving it for him "just in case").  Revive old interests and hobbies, check out new ones, take a night class on something that interests you.  Reach out to your old friends you lost touch with and invite them to dinner, be open to meeting new people and making new friends.  Start filling your life with things that make you feel good about yourself.  

It will take time to stop missing him, to stop hurting.  But it will get easier over time if you stick with your resolve to stay away from him.  You're never going to be happy if you don't break away from him.