How do I stop enabling my husband

[lil_missy]

Hi all, 

my marriage is at the brink of divorce and this is my last ditch effort to save it 

my husband and I have been married for almost 3 years and have a 3 yo boy. I’ve thought about leaving seriously for while now maybe a year or so, but the only things that stopped me is 1) too painful and 2) the thought of our son not having his family intact

we dated for 2 years before getting married  and during that time I saw very little red flags from him. But after we got married and got a mortgage the relationship slowly and surely devolved into a parent-child like relationship, with me being the parent and my husband being the child. 

He is always: 

- asking me for money 

- not contributing enough to the family financially 

- not doing housework 

- hiding debts from me, no transparency with what he does 

- losing things, can’t organise his own life 

I am always: 

- looking after our son 90% of the time 

- do 90% of housework 

- take on MOST of the financial responsibilities including paying mortgage n bills 

- have to organise HiS life for him, ei making sure he has lunch, he has things he needs etc 

this has gotten worse in the past 6 months 

I don’t need advise to tell me to leave, I already have my plan b in place, I have spoken to my mom about letting me n my son stay there, looked into childcare arrangements for him near my moms house, and looked into selling the house I share with my husband. 

My husband has agreed to selling the house and he accepts this is the end of our marriage if I wish so. I feel he would rather leave the marriage than face up to his responsibility as a father and husband. 

But my last ditch effort is I’m going to stop enabling his behaviour and see if it makes any difference for a few months 

for example today he asked for money to cigarettes and I said no. And he got mad and stormed off. In the past I said yes most of the time in fear of him getting angry at me, but I feel I’ve got nothing to lose now. 

So can you guys give me some advice on how I can stop enabling his bad behaviour? And any real life experience of being with a spouse in an enabling relationship? 

We don’t have money to go marriage counseling right now 

thanks 

[fishlips]

Why is he asking you for money? Does he work?

[mark clemson]

Sorry to hear about that. You stop enabling by stopping enabling. So, e.g. by not agreeing to give him money, don't make his lunch for him or do any organizing etc. So, I think you're off to a good start. Not sure it will make a difference but at least you're trying.

It sounds like it's possible he may have (clinical) depression or a similar psychological issue. Not sure if that makes any difference at this point, but something to be aware of (if I'm right).

I would beware of him circumventing you or pulling other tricks, esp. for the $. For example, he may try to access joint bank accounts. Also if he takes out a loan or something, you might be saddled with half of it. Hope that doesn't happen, but it might.

If you're in the US, many family lawyers give free 1/2 hour consults. So it's possible to go to a few different ones and get some free consultations. Consider doing this in advance of divorcing if you have questions. This can save you a little money and also it's good to hear from a few lawyers as IME not all of them play fully straight with clients. For example some will try to do unnecessary court motions (costing you time and money) for a divorce that's really likely to just wind up in a negotiated settlement anyhow. (Full disclosure: I'm no lawyer.)

[lil_missy]

23 minutes ago, fishlips said:

Why is he asking you for money? Does he work?

Yes he works, but right now all his moneys going to paying off his debts that he alone inccured and nothing left to contribute to the family. So I am paying for everything for the family. 

He also constantly loses his bank cards, or gets his bank account locked due to “ suspicious transactions “due to online gambling.  So even when he has money he can’t acces it 

Edited January 7, 2020 by lil_missy

[preraph]

Can I ask, had he ever lived on his own before you two lived together?  Or was his family always taking care of him and he never really grew into an adult?  

 

I think you have to probably go to counseling.  And you'll have to make some things his responsibility and be ready for him to fail if he doesn't follow through, but you've got to stop being his parent.  That never works.  It's not sexy for either of you once you become his mother figure.  Have you considered talking to his mom and dad?

[lil_missy]

16 minutes ago, mark clemson said:

Sorry to hear about that. You stop enabling by stopping enabling. So, e.g. by not agreeing to give him money, don't make his lunch for him or do any organizing etc. So, I think you're off to a good start. Not sure it will make a difference but at least you're trying.

It sounds like it's possible he may have (clinical) depression or a similar psychological issue. Not sure if that makes any difference at this point, but something to be aware of (if I'm right).

I would beware of him circumventing you or pulling other tricks, esp. for the $. For example, he may try to access joint bank accounts. Also if he takes out a loan or something, you might be saddled with half of it. Hope that doesn't happen, but it might.

If you're in the US, many family lawyers give free 1/2 hour consults. So it's possible to go to a few different ones and get some free consultations. Consider doing this in advance of divorcing if you have questions. This can save you a little money and also it's good to hear from a few lawyers as IME not all of them play fully straight with clients. For example some will try to do unnecessary court motions (costing you time and money) for a divorce that's really likely to just wind up in a negotiated settlement anyhow. (Full disclosure: I'm no lawyer.)

Hey, thanks so I should stop doing things for him basically and just look after myself and my son, until he is able to look after himself. 

Right now he can’t look after himself let alone his family. 

But the issue is financially I cannot supportive all 3 of us. I am doing it now but it is not sustainable. So I guess realistically it means I have to leave him

why do you think he has depression? 

It makes me alil annoyed coz if anyone has depression it should be me, with the huge burdens on my shoulders. But he basically takes no responsibility for anything and gets to blame it on depression? 

[schlumpy]

I noticed that "I love him or I care about him" was absent from your reasons for staying. I do not think I could stay with my wife if she had no more feeling for me then a casual acquaintance. I've read of people who do this for the children and it certainly is up to you.

What about traditional husband work such as mowing the grass, home maintenance, getting the care repaired or oil changed? Does that fall in your lap also? I'm not trying to trip you up I'm just wondering if he ditching that stuff too.

 Your enabling has created stable long term pattern for him that is ingrained. It will take a lot of retraining for him to turn it around even if he wants to. I would search the internet for some books on how to stop being the enabler and see if you can't find one or two at the library.

It may give you some insight into what it takes to accomplish the deprogramming. It may be more then you wish to take on considering your lack of feelings.

 

 

 

[RecentChange]

Well if he is willing to give up the marriage - sounds like it's as good as done.

Marriage is wonderful but it's also WORK. Unless both parties are willing to do their parts it is destined for failure. 

It's clear from your posts that you two have not commingled funds.

Does he work? Is he under employed? Why doesn't he have money? Is he squandering it away on junk?

How old are both of you? How was he living his life before he met you?

Glad to hear you have a plan B, and I think stopping the enabling is a good idea. He is going to have to get used to paying his own way sooner or later. 

In marriage, we have always commingled funds - mine is his, his is mine - but that also means no hidden debts, agreement on what we spend money on etc. 

[lil_missy]

4 minutes ago, preraph said:

Can I ask, had he ever lived on his own before you two lived together?  Or was his family always taking care of him and he never really grew into an adult?  

 

I think you have to probably go to counseling.  And you'll have to make some things his responsibility and be ready for him to fail if he doesn't follow through, but you've got to stop being his parent.  That never works.  It's not sexy for either of you once you become his mother figure.  Have you considered talking to his mom and dad?

He has never lived on his own and his mom babied him til he met me at 32. 

So yes I agree with you that is the root of the problem. His mom gave him whatever he wanted when he was young, paid off all his debts, let him do drugs at home. I have said this before, She has spoilt him to the point of basically ruined his life. He never suffered any consequences for his actions. 

Whenever he does get his way he just blows up and his mom gives in. 

I have talked to his mom many times her standard response is “ I’m so sorry he is this way, he has always been this way, I know how hard it is for you, just hang in there it will get better “ 

[basil67]

 

Deleted.  My questions answered already.

Edited January 7, 2020 by basil67

[RecentChange]

12 minutes ago, lil_missy said:

Due to online gambling. 

Well there ya go. I was going to ask, what is wrong with him, does he have a gambling addiction?

Looks like the answer is YES.

Sorry but an addict is not husband nor responsible father material. 

A man with debts who is asking his wife for money has NO BUSINESS GAMBLING EVER.

Might as well crumple up money and throw it down the rat hole. Money he doesn't have.

I wouldn't give him another cent - why bother? He is just going to throw if away.

Sorry you are going through this. But he is choosing gambling over you his wife. Over his child. Over his family and his future. 

[lil_missy]

3 minutes ago, schlumpy said:

I noticed that "I love him or I care about him" was absent from your reasons for staying. I do not think I could stay with my wife if she had no more feeling for me then a casual acquaintance. I've read of people who do this for the children and it certainly is up to you.

What about traditional husband work such as mowing the grass, home maintenance, getting the care repaired or oil changed? Does that fall in your lap also? I'm not trying to trip you up I'm just wondering if he ditching that stuff too.

 Your enabling has created stable long term pattern for him that is ingrained. It will take a lot of retraining for him to turn it around even if he wants to. I would search the internet for some books on how to stop being the enabler and see if you can't find one or two at the library.

It may give you some insight into what it takes to accomplish the deprogramming. It may be more then you wish to take on considering your lack of feelings.

 

 

 

I do love him, at least I think I still do. But it is hard to love and respect someone that has let you down so much by not taking on any responsibility that I think a husband should. 

He does not mow the lawn or do any house maintenance unless I nag him to death, even then most of the time his dad comes over and does those things for us. 

He has been spoilt his entire life 

[RecentChange]

6 minutes ago, lil_missy said:

I have talked to his mom many times her standard response is “ I’m so sorry he is this way, he has always been this way, I know how hard it is for you, just hang in there it will get better “ 

Sounds like he needs to go back to mommy then. He hasn't learned how to be a man and doesn't sound like he is willing to work hard to become one. 

I don't think it will just get better on its own. Unless HE wants to grow up and take responsibility.

Heck - living like a perpetual late teen sounds like a blast. His parents really failed him by not installing responsibly

[fishlips]

He sounds more like a child than a man. That could be helped with counseling, but the gambling is far more serious. Unless he is willing to get help with that problem, your best bet is probably leaving. Is he willing to admit he has a gambling problem and work on it with you? If you love him and he is willing to change, counseling could help. If he isn't willing to change, then it's pretty much hopeless.

[schlumpy]

1 minute ago, lil_missy said:

I do love him, at least I think I still do. But it is hard to love and respect someone that has let you down so much by not taking on any responsibility that I think a husband should. 

He does not mow the lawn or do any house maintenance unless I nag him to death, even then most of the time his dad comes over and does those things for us. 

He has been spoilt his entire life 

I think you are fully justified from what you have laid out, to put the pressure on him. He will either respond or he will bolt and run. Please do some reading on to how to do it so properly so he has a real chance of reforming. Make sure his mother is on board so he doesn't have plan B to turn to. 

It puzzles me as to how a person like yourself ends up with someone that is opposite of what you wanted. Good luck to you.

 

[preraph]

Well, he stayed at home getting babied too long and I hate to say it, but I don't hold out much hope for this to work in a way that would be acceptable.  You don't need a second child and dependent.  You need a MAN.  Don't take up with anyone who hasn't ever lived on their own successfully.  I'm glad you have a backup plan.  You can't undo what his mom did for years, which is spoil him and wait on him and give in.  

 

And in advance, my advice is when you divorce, MAKE him take joint custody so he HAS to grow up some and take some responsibility and so that YOU can have a job and social life 3 and a half days a week.  Yes, he will just attempt to dump the child on his mother on his days, but maybe when he does right after she thinks she's gotten him out of the house, she'll finally grow a spine.  

And just know that legally, you can't move off far away and take the child, so if that is part of your plan, you can't.  So make him take joint custody because he isn't going to contribute enough financially and be reliable in that regard to just get money from him.  

Edited January 7, 2020 by preraph

[mark clemson]

3 hours ago, lil_missy said:

why do you think he has depression?

Some people who have depression have a great deal of difficulty "dealing with" life in general such as holding down a job, taking care of themselves, even getting out of bed in extreme cases. However the other things you described a few posts down could certainly also explain his "failure to launch" approach to life. So perhaps I was wrong. At any rate, totally agree the situation is a major load on your shoulders as well.

Edited January 8, 2020 by mark clemson
typo

[lil_missy]

4 minutes ago, mark clemson said:

Some people who have depression have a great deal of difficulty "dealing with" life in general such as holding down a job, taking care of themselves, even getting out of bed in extreme cases. However the other things you described a few posts down could certainly also explain his "failure to launch" approach to life. So perhaps I was wrong. At any rate, totally agree the situation is a major load on your shoulders as well.

I’m not ruling out that he has mild depression, after all he has been under this pressure from me for the past couple of years and regular arguments so I know he is miserable in this marriage currently also. But sometimes we do have fun, we do have good times, esp with our son. I don’t think his lost his general enjoyment of life, and neither have I. Just fed up with the situation

[lil_missy]

3 hours ago, schlumpy said:

It puzzles me as to how a person like yourself ends up with someone that is opposite of what you wanted. Good luck to you.

 

To be honest, I feel like I probably shouldn’t have ended up with him either. I’m super organised, like to set goals in life and he is super content, no goals whatsoever except enjoy life with the ones he loves kinda guy. 

When we met, he loved me like no one has ever loved me. And to me he was the quintessential bad boy that was reformed, or so I thought. From what I knew he had a bad past but when we met he seemed to have moved on from that and held a very good job. 

We got pregnant by accident and we were so happy, it goes without saying at the time we were definitely gonna give marriage a chance. 

In short - this union was not well thought out on my behalf, it’s not that I didn’t love him but I did see have concerns and chose to ignore them and hope for the best 

either way here we are, we’ve committed to eachother and this family. I want more than anything for this work out, I’m even  willing to lower my standards somewhat, but not to an extent where He is basically a dependant of mine. 

 

Edited January 8, 2020 by lil_missy

[lil_missy]

When we first met, he was charming and good looking but also very genuine and down to earth. He treated me so well and loved me and accepted me exactly the way I am and he still does. We had so much chemistry and for the first two years we were together , without responsibilities, it was blissful, even though I was concerned about his financial situation. 

But when family responsibilities set in, he really really let me down. 

But he still loves me n accepts me like no one ever has, I guess that’s the only reason I’m still hanging in there. 

He had a 10 year relationship before me and they were engaged, but she eventually left him. I don’t really know why but I’m starting to think she prob felt the way I did after so many years 

[Mr. Lucky]

 

12 hours ago, lil_missy said:

Yes he works, but right now all his moneys going to paying off his debts that he alone inccured

When you're a couple, what kinds of debts are his "alone"?  He works full time but doesn't have any money to contribute to family expenses?

If he's gambling away entire paychecks, this is more about addiction than compatibility...

Mr. Lucky

[Redhead14]

Send him home to his parents so they can finish the job they started and were failing miserably at anyway.  This is not a man who should be the role model for a child.  Your #1 priority is your child PERIOD.  The basis for any decisions you make should be all about what is best for the child.  Children have strong senses for tension and discord and unhappiness in the home.  This will fester until it explodes and the child will suffer. 

He needs to get help for his gambling addiction and soon.  Get him some names and give them to him and tell him you expect him to make an appointment by Xdate.  If he doesn't you will start divorce proceedings.  You say there isn't enough money for counseling?  There would be if he stopped gambling and moved in with his parents. 

Do you have more than 1 car?  If so, make sure one of them is in your name, at least.  Also, get yourself a credit card in your name only and put it away.  Do not use it or let him know you have it.  Also, get a bank account in your name only and start putting even $5 week in it.  You should document when he goes out gambling and where he goes (if you know), days and times, etc.  Each time he asks for money, record the day and how much, etc. (if you give it to him).  Pull all your financials together with bank records and highlight withdrawals by him, etc.  Get yourself prepared for life as a single mother, in the likely case, that he either runs or you do have to initiate a divorce. 

The first step to stop enabling him is to stop enabling yourself to give/make any excuses for him and to draw a line in the sand so that he understands you will not tolerate his crap anymore PERIOD.  This is not the home you want for your child or you.  You deserve a partner who is a fully functioning and contributing party to the marriage.  He isn't. 

 

Edited January 8, 2020 by Redhead14

[d0nnivain]

Does he want to change & does he know that you are on the brink of divorce?  If not, step one is to talk to him about how his behavior is pushing you out the door. 

Assuming he wants to change, the on line gambling has to stop.  There is just no getting around that.  Send him to GA meetings.  Consider going to the G-Anon equivalent of Al-Anon -- a support group for people like you in love with addicts.  They will give you tips for stopping the enabling behavior.  If you can drag MIL along, that may help. 

Next you two will need a budget & a chore schedule.  

In the short term you have to treat him a bit more like a child regarding his money.  Get him off all accounts.  Have his paycheck direct deposited into your account & then give him limited cash per week. 

Meanwhile realize that although expensive, MC is an investment & it's all cheaper then divorce.  

If he's unwilling to work, walk sooner rather than later before he sinks you financially too. You will probably have to garnish his wages to get CS.  Best wishes 

[lil_missy]

Thanks all for your perspectives, I’ve decided to separate from my husband.

i had hope even today, but after speaking to him he shattered all my hopes, we just don’t see eye to eye. He cannot see his responsibility as a husband and father, and nothing I say can’t change that. I can’t believe it took me this long to realise the kind of man he is , a man child that feels entitled to take care of. He could never take care of me n my son, he only puts himself first 

[Mr. Lucky]

Sorry to hear.  I doubt we have to tell you to be very careful with any accounts or assets he has access to, he has even less reining him in now.  I’d move quickly to get new accounts open and funds transferred.  Have you spoken to a lawyer?  You might want to strike preemptively, though your H doesn’t sound like he’d be in a hurry to get things in order.  Expect the same conduct during separation and divorce - and then some...

Mr. Lucky