stillafool Posted January 18, 2020 Posted January 18, 2020 39 minutes ago, fromheart said: I didn't say for one minute that girls don't get sleazed out, did I? What I said was that I found it disgusting, as do most men and boys. So you need to remember that it works both ways. As for implying that I am somehow responsible for this, this is a pathetic accusation. I'd be careful with accusations like that in real life, you'll get sued. You also need to accept that you will competing against younger women, and will loose. Unless you are the rare person who has developed themselves, and judging by the heartlessness you have expressed on this thread that clearly isn't the case. No man is going to care whether middle aged woman are looking at him or not, when the young women are looking at him. I am no exception. You have reading difficulties. Where did I imply you were responsible for anything? What have I said that is heartless? I'm just pointing out to you that everything you say about older women the same applies to older men. Of course there are those young people with daddy/mommy issues who will go for old but the majority of young people want their own age group which is natural. I'm not competing with anyone as I'm married and have been out of that game for decades. 1 1
Author hotpotato Posted January 18, 2020 Author Posted January 18, 2020 2 hours ago, fromheart said: No, you didn't hear the complaints. What a surprise. How would you like it if a man said 'he didn't hear the complaints,' when predating upon a girl? Would you hear it then? Yes, but not when its a boy. What a disgusting attitude. I'll tell you something, any sleazy, leering old hag acts inappropriately with the boys in my family they get dealt with. As I would do a man. First of all,hes not 14, hes 22, which is only 10 years younger than me. I'm not 50, 60, 70+ chasing someone who could be my grandchild. I'm not under a delusion that 22 year old men will want me when I'm 75, as so many men feel about young women. 1 1
Andy_K Posted January 18, 2020 Posted January 18, 2020 I'm 36. I don't complain about exes or having lost 'the one', but sometimes I do have to try not to complain about the fact I haven't found the one yet
HappySenior Posted January 18, 2020 Posted January 18, 2020 On 1/16/2020 at 4:41 PM, elaine567 said: It is not really surprising, the break up of a long term relationship or a marriage is a big deal. For most the biggest emotional trauma they've ever had to deal with. Quite a lot have been through therapy, MC or IC, and IME anyone who has been to a lot of therapy is very "open". Sometimes inappropriately so. Given any chance they will tell all their woes to anyone who will listen. As women tend to be pretty empathetic, then some men can take the opportunity to offload all their troubles onto the new gf, without seeming to understand she is NOT a therapist, nor does she want to be their mother "kissing it all better"... Once fixed, they often use their new found confidence and courage to "play the field" or start looking for the "one"... Hate to say it, but I'm probably one of those people who is too "open". I'm smart enough to not talk about ex's on a date (unless asked), and even then be a little circumspect. However, I do tend to reveal a little to much to people who I feel I can trust even though we've just met. I'm aware of it and trying not to do it as much though. But I have always been pretty much an open book - I find it difficult to lie. I also cry easily. I hate it, but it happens. I've learned to take an allergy pill if I get a little depressed about something and cry at night. That way it doesn't show as much in the morning. (Having seasonal affective disorder does not help - I do have a "happy light") Yet when I am not talking about the past, I can be lighthearted and playful. It looks like moodiness, but after the past few years I am convinced it is PTSD. Getting much better and I am trying a procedure to heal the wounds there. Some people are just not aware enough of their wounds to even attempt that. 1
fromheart Posted January 19, 2020 Posted January 19, 2020 (edited) 8 hours ago, hotpotato said: First of all,hes not 14, hes 22, which is only 10 years younger than me. I'm not 50, 60, 70+ chasing someone who could be my grandchild. I'm not under a delusion that 22 year old men will want me when I'm 75, as so many men feel about young women. Ok, so like I said if its legal and respectful, that's fine. Though I'll be straight up and say I'd encourage a 22 year old man to date women their own age or younger. A man dating a younger woman however, is natural as men take longer to establish themselves and women are in their childbirth prime at a younger age. That's nature's design, don't blame me for it. I wont be pursuing young women when I'm retired, because that would be pathetic. The problem that men in general are having is too much alcohol, bad food and obesity. I'm surprised no one hasn't pointed that out yet. Edited January 19, 2020 by fromheart
elaine567 Posted January 19, 2020 Posted January 19, 2020 2 minutes ago, fromheart said: A man dating a younger woman however, is natural as men take longer to establish themselves and women are in their childbirth prime at a younger age. A man is in his natural fertile state at the same time a woman is. Men over 35 are now proven to be past their peak. Society may have organised it that older men are "established" later on, but biology now tells us a different story as regards peak fertility for a good outcome for the mother and child.. 1
fromheart Posted January 19, 2020 Posted January 19, 2020 (edited) 22 minutes ago, elaine567 said: A man is in his natural fertile state at the same time a woman is. Men over 35 are now proven to be past their peak. No, this is incorrect. A woman's child bearing prime is in her 20s, a mans can go on for way longer than that. And I have no issue with saying that men take longer to develop mental maturity. The problem is that men are not looking after their health, so their bodies are falling apart quicker. If data is based upon fat alcoholics who can't run for a bus, which is becoming the average man, the data isn't going to be accurate. Edited January 19, 2020 by fromheart
elaine567 Posted January 19, 2020 Posted January 19, 2020 The reality that research was male orientated, and so men were never considered as being ever past their peak, all that "trouble" was due solely to women.... Now we know different, and with more and more research being conducted, the true impact of male age on fertility is now being discovered. Yes we can "blame" men not looking after their health, but we don't actually know that men who do look after their health are any better... I personally think it is an age thing and fit men will be no different from unfit men... 1
fromheart Posted January 19, 2020 Posted January 19, 2020 (edited) 9 hours ago, elaine567 said: Yes we can "blame" men not looking after their health, but we don't actually know that men who do look after their health are any better... I personally think it is an age thing and fit men will be no different from unfit men... Come train with me sometime, and decide if I am lacking in virility for yourself. I offer free introduction classes by the way. I think you want to believe that women and men have the same situation, with regards to child bearing. This is not the case. Women have their child bearing prime in their 20's, for men it lasts a lot longer. This is how nature has designed us. And as men like myself are seeing, you become more attractive to younger women as you get older. IF you work on yourself. A young woman comes into her prime very quickly, a 20 year old female has a sexual power a young man generally doesn't have. However, a man can have a similar peak later on. We all get the same deal, one way or another so there's no need for bitterness. Not implying you yourself are bitter, but there certainly are some older women who don't want younger women and men to be happy. Edited January 19, 2020 by fromheart 1
Author hotpotato Posted January 19, 2020 Author Posted January 19, 2020 10 hours ago, fromheart said: Ok, so like I said if its legal and respectful, that's fine. Though I'll be straight up and say I'd encourage a 22 year old man to date women their own age or younger. A man dating a younger woman however, is natural as men take longer to establish themselves and women are in their childbirth prime at a younger age. That's nature's design, don't blame me for it. I wont be pursuing young women when I'm retired, because that would be pathetic. The problem that men in general are having is too much alcohol, bad food and obesity. I'm surprised no one hasn't pointed that out yet. Hmmm I dont know. As others said, sperm quality goes down. Men peak sexually in their 20s, too. Theres a stark contrast between men in their 20s and later. You have a lot of hang ups about older women, yet older women seem good enough for alpha males like Chris Hemsworth and Jason Momoa. I know a man who was married to a woman 20 years his senior until she died, and he is quite rich. My ex is in his 50s, and hes hitting the wall despite being into fitness. Having sex with him was nothing like being with the younger guy. With age that's unavoidable. Most women who come at him already have kids by the younger guy but want to move into my ex's house. 3
fromheart Posted January 19, 2020 Posted January 19, 2020 Just now, hotpotato said: Hmmm I dont know. As others said, sperm quality goes down. Men peak sexually in their 20s, too. Theres a stark contrast between men in their 20s and later. You have a lot of hang ups about older women, yet older women seem good enough for alpha males like Chris Hemsworth and Jason Momoa. I know a man who was married to a woman 20 years his senior until she died, and he is quite rich. My ex is in his 50s, and hes hitting the wall despite being into fitness. Having sex with him was nothing like being with the younger guy. With age that's unavoidable. Most women who come at him already have kids by the younger guy but want to move into my ex's house. With respect, you don't know. I've met men older than me who train hard and they are still virile. Wouldn't say I have hang ups about older women, I just am more attracted to younger women. What's this example about a man getting rich by an older female partner dieing? Is there supposed to be some attraction to being a male gold digger? Because I find this concept pathetic. To be honest, if your 50 year old ex wasn't performing in bed it may have been because he wasn't that into you. When men are in bed with younger women, all this ED nonsense mainly goes out of the window.
elaine567 Posted January 19, 2020 Posted January 19, 2020 This not about virility or performance in bed, this is about sperm quality, the viability of pregnancies, the health during pregnancy of the mother and the resulting health of the child, all of which are negatively affected by the increasing age of the father of that child. 2
Author hotpotato Posted January 19, 2020 Author Posted January 19, 2020 14 minutes ago, fromheart said: With respect, you don't know. I've met men older than me who train hard and they are still virile. Wouldn't say I have hang ups about older women, I just am more attracted to younger women. What's this example about a man getting rich by an older female partner dieing? Is there supposed to be some attraction to being a male gold digger? Because I find this concept pathetic. To be honest, if your 50 year old ex wasn't performing in bed it may have been because he wasn't that into you. When men are in bed with younger women, all this ED nonsense mainly goes out of the window. Are these older men still having sex 2,3,4x in a span of a few hours without little blue pill? Maybe I was unclear in what i said, and you missed the point which I was trying to say nicely. Also, if a young woman wants someone virile and trains, plenty of younger guys fit the bill. No one said my ex had ed. I said he wasnt like guys in their 20s who are sexual bunnies. Mens sexual abilities naturally decline through life. You'd rather blame me who was a full 21 years younger than the ex (and still in my 20s when we met)than admit reality. He hasn't been with me for years anyway, and he fully admits age is catching up to him sexually. The 43 year old can start but not finish #2. He admits hes not the same as a 20 something. Yes, people can look good longer by having a healthy lifestyle. No, the rich guy is someone I know. He was well to do well before she died. He started a business and pulled himself up. He did not by any means marry her for a settlement. Hes so wealthy he can travel to europe just for a car part, and his house has been on TV.
Author hotpotato Posted January 19, 2020 Author Posted January 19, 2020 5 minutes ago, elaine567 said: This not about virility or performance in bed, this is about sperm quality, the viability of pregnancies, the health during pregnancy of the mother and the resulting health of the child, all of which are negatively affected by the increasing age of the father of that child. One could argue on both points against older men! Aging sperm and decrease in performance are both valid concerns. Imagine being a younger woman with a healthy sex drive, and your older bf is fine having sex once or twice a week bc his testosterone has dropped so much.
elaine567 Posted January 19, 2020 Posted January 19, 2020 Yes, virility and bed performance are very important when considering an older partner. What woman really wants to get into "ageing" male sexual issues a decade or two before she has to? But this is about the fact that if a man wants to reduce the risks to minimal, then he needs to start fathering children before 35... it makes no difference whether he is "virile" or not. 4
carhill Posted January 19, 2020 Posted January 19, 2020 (edited) On 1/16/2020 at 10:08 AM, hotpotato said: My ons did this (43) and my latest ex who was 50 at the time. My ons and I talk every now and then on the phone. I could try to see him again as we agreed we would both like to. Day one he talked about her and how he wanted to work things out. This woman has to be in his life bc they have kids together. They were together 10 years. My latest ex just loved his 2nd ex wife. In fact, he told me he didnt love me like he loved her. If 'ons' stands for one night stand or friends with benefits or similar, that makes sense. He would be looking elsewhere for a loving or romantic relationship and men typically are creatures of comfort and the exW of ten years they know each other's stuff, all the games, all the buttons, all the sexual and romantic peccadilloes. He'll take that over the unknown, especially if there aren't another pair of cowboy boots at her door. Latest ex, same, but I would caution one thing; when you hear 'love' from a man, try not to process it through your own emotional understanding of the word. It can be, and often is, very different for a man. All the stuff you'd be going 'why, she xxx and he xxx, how can he possibly love her' is often meaningless when understanding the minds and emotions of men. On 1/16/2020 at 10:08 AM, hotpotato said: One of my fav youtubers went through it, too. Her bf (45?) wanted to move back in with the ex supposedly for the kids. Yup, a man who loves his kids, many do, will walk through fire and eat nails for those kids. Women know this. Some baggage, resentment among the possibilities, can result because he knows she knows and actions she takes on that information may cause a more generalized resentment. Seen that a lot with male friends who divorced in their 30's and had kids but that was back when judges routinely ruled women were the preferred parent to raise children. Times have changed and I think such resentment has lessened as a baggage factor. On 1/16/2020 at 10:08 AM, hotpotato said: I think men by age 35 have met the one. That's not something I can relate to. I dont want to hear them nearly sob about it when we just met. How am I supposed to feel? Maybe they have, maybe not, no doubt most have met one, or two, or maybe more they want to see if they are the one. Sometimes marriages are like that. Some turn out to be the one, some not. Since the divorce rate is pretty high for lifetime first marriages, I'd say not has a pretty good foothold. Don't blame you a bit for not wanting to hear their sob stories. That gets old. However, tip, neither do we other men and we shut them down fast. It's often brutal. I saw this during my D and learned to internalize things more as my father trained me poorly in that regard. Men do not complain to other men, well they can but expect to be beaten down for it. Perhaps younger people in your generation are different, IDK. For men of my age, their wives are their emotional vulnerable place; if not them, a woman in general. That's how the script was written. If you don't want to hear it, cut them off by changing the subject and see if they get the hint. If they do, prospects may be good. That means they listen to you and respect your feelings. There might even be a bit of empathy there. Never know. While it seems the thread veered into sexual dysfunction and healthy child bearing, and I agree people can have sexual baggage, I think that's more a potential health issue that all men deal with, not varying too much, rather than individual as the anecdotes in the OP shared. Results vary. The sperm that resulted in my existence came from a WW2 survivor in his mid-40's and a mother in her late 30's. I'm pushing 61 and have been healthy all my life and sane enough to caregive for a psychotic parent at the end of her life. Moments of baggage, sure. I'd place healthy cynicism right at the top of the stack. We all have our stuff. Good luck! Edited January 19, 2020 by a LoveShack.org Moderator
Author hotpotato Posted January 19, 2020 Author Posted January 19, 2020 (edited) 19 minutes ago, carhill said: Latest ex, same, but I would caution one thing; when you hear 'love' from a man, try not to process it through your own emotional understanding of the word. It can be, and often is, very different for a man. All the stuff you'd be going 'why, she xxx and he xxx, how can he possibly love her' is often meaningless when understanding the minds and emotions of men. What do you mean? Obviously, he loves here and is very emotional towards her in both negative and positive ways. He flat out told me he didnt love me like he loved her. How am I supposed to take that? Frankly, I think the break up was much of his fault. Hes difficult to talk to, says mean things, and always thinks hes right. He cant see the first two faults bc of the last one. Everytime his relationships break up, it's the other person's fault. Edited January 19, 2020 by hotpotato
stillafool Posted January 19, 2020 Posted January 19, 2020 1 hour ago, elaine567 said: This not about virility or performance in bed, this is about sperm quality, the viability of pregnancies, the health during pregnancy of the mother and the resulting health of the child, all of which are negatively affected by the increasing age of the father of that child. I think older sperm is linked to autism isn't it? 1
carhill Posted January 19, 2020 Posted January 19, 2020 28 minutes ago, hotpotato said: What do you mean? Men process and describe love differently; we often see discussions of that on these forums. 11 minutes ago, stillafool said: I think older sperm is linked to autism isn't it? Given the apparent widespread occurrences of spectrum disorders in young people, I'd need to see statistics on how old their parents are, particularly generational parenting, where the man is older, post-40 and the woman is in her 20's, so prime childbearing period. Else, results could be muddied by the mother's own genetics and age. Morgan Eastwood is a great example of old sperm, young eggs. Really old sperm. She seems pretty healthy and normal, as 23 yo women go anyway. But I have it on good authority that the sperm is quite special, a gift from God
elaine567 Posted January 19, 2020 Posted January 19, 2020 They looked at the older men and younger woman pairing and the results were the same. The younger woman did not reduce the risks. 1
sothereiwas Posted January 19, 2020 Posted January 19, 2020 48 minutes ago, elaine567 said: They looked at the older men and younger woman pairing and the results were the same. The younger woman did not reduce the risks. AFAIK this isn't strictly true, but the results, after correcting for female age, tend to sometimes show that older sperm is slightly 'less good' than younger sperm in terms of the outcomes for the offspring. One thing that needs to be noted is that the biggest reason this wasn't noticed until recently is that the contribution toward issues in children due to age of the female parent dwarfs the similar contribution that is probably attributable to men.
OatsAndHall Posted January 19, 2020 Posted January 19, 2020 (edited) At almost 40 years old, I KNOW that I am way better in bed than I was in my twenties. I have far more experience with sex than I did back then, I'm more comfortable in the sack and I have more stamina. Yes, in my twenties, I could go a few more rounds but those rounds weren't nearly as enjoyable for me or my partner as they are now. I still have a great libido but that comes down to taking care of myself; I exercise, eat right and do a lot of things that keep my hormones in sync and flowing. And, I've learned a few little dietary tricks over the years; taking in combination of saturated fats and cruciferous veggies increases my libido in a big way. If my gf and I go out to dinner, I tend to order red meat of some kind, a ton of veggies and I avoid eating too much starchy food. I don't stuff my face, I take in the natural macro and micro nutrients that boost libido and I'm good to go. It's even better if I've lifted some weights before dinner; my testosterone is high and my libido falls right in line. It shouldn't come as a surprise when a guy who doesn't take care of themselves later in life struggles in the sack. They're very lifestyle tends to axe murder their ability to perform; just based on what they're doing to their endocrine system. A sedentary lifestyle coupled with a poor diet is a recipe for ED form a hormone standpoint. Edited January 19, 2020 by OatsAndHall
Els Posted January 19, 2020 Posted January 19, 2020 (edited) While increased age does increase the risk of low motility and genetic defects in sperm, men typically don't have the absolute cut-off that women have in terms of "natural" reproductive ability. It is worth noting that in this day and age, in countries that allow commercial surrogacy like the US, women technically don't have an absolute cut-off anymore, either. A woman can freeze her eggs at 30, and at 50 she can pay for a surrogate to carry her fetus, so she will technically still be a biological mother. (In 20 years' time we will probably have ectogenesis and the ability to perform meiosis on somatic cells anyway, so there will not even be a need for egg freezing or surrogacy, but I digress.) But, just because you CAN do something, doesn't mean you should. There is good reason why most reputable adoption agencies have age limits for the parents - it's generally considered irresponsible and unethical for a 60-yo man OR woman to be a parent to a newborn, for obvious reasons. No kid wants to be saddled with an invalid parent at the tender age of 15. Edited January 19, 2020 by Elswyth 1
stillafool Posted January 19, 2020 Posted January 19, 2020 3 minutes ago, Elswyth said: No kid wants to be saddled with an invalid parent at the tender age of 15. Or without a parent is more likely. I am seeing more celebrity women and women with money hiring surrogates to carry their babies. I think more and more younger women will be doing this so they can get on with their careers without worrying about a bio clock.
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