I think it's over....

[jen_r]

We are engaged now for over a year. Set to marry at the end of this year. But I'm thinking of calling it off. 

We've been together for 6 years. He's 8 years younger than I am (him mid/late 20's - Me mid 30's). Money has been an issue for our whole relationship. Earlier this month I sat him down and said he needed to follow this financial plan or I couldn't marry him because I wasn't going to live my life paycheck to paycheck. I've never lived that way and never want to. He agreed to follow it. But, last night, he went out and blew a s*** ton of money and didn't even come home and I'm like....what the hell? This is never going to change is it? I know in my heart it needs to end, but I know once he's gone and out of my house I'm going to break down and spiral into depression. I don't really have any friends. We moved to a new state 2 years ago and I don't know anyone in this area. So I can see myself breaking down once I'm alone in my house for good. I'm really bad at being social and making friends and letting people into my life. I don't really have any hobbies. I'm getting depressed just thinking about all of this. 

 I feel like he's been given all the chances he didn't deserve and will never clean up his act.

I texted a friend last night (the only one i have left), and she said "Is that a real deal breaker for you?" Meaning the money. And I thought, "Isn't that a deal breaker for anyone??" I think financial stability is something everyone wants, no? Not money hungry - just stable. 

[d0nnivain]

No his money habits aren't going to change.  

Was he part of the financial plan or did you try to cram it down his throat?  If he didn't participate in it's creation it was doomed to fail. 

You say you have no friends & are bad at being social.  Well, now is the time to change that.   If you end this engagement, you can take some time to grieve your loss but you will have to pick up the pieces & move forward.  Taking action isn't as hard as you think.  If you have the self discipline to be good with money you have what it takes to put yourself out there.  Heck, join an investment club to focus on earning more money through the stock market.  Viola you have a hobby.  

[jen_r]

3 minutes ago, d0nnivain said:

No his money habits aren't going to change.  

Was he part of the financial plan or did you try to cram it down his throat?  If he didn't participate in it's creation it was doomed to fail. 

You say you have no friends & are bad at being social.  Well, now is the time to change that.   If you end this engagement, you can take some time to grieve your loss but you will have to pick up the pieces & move forward.  Taking action isn't as hard as you think.  If you have the self discipline to be good with money you have what it takes to put yourself out there.  Heck, join an investment club to focus on earning more money through the stock market.  Viola you have a hobby.  

He wasn't a part of the planning. Because any time I mention money - theres a fight. He says, "I don't make enough money to save or do x, y, and z." I've told him countless times that he does make enough. So I just wrote up what he makes, his bills, what he can spend and what he's going to put into savings. He said "It looks good on paper, but It's not do-able." I basically said you're doing it or I'm out. It's clear, he can't do it. But it drives me mental because I don't understand why??

I had been looking up the stock market and trying to learn how it works lol so thats not a bad idea. 

[JTSW]

Just now, jen_r said:

I just wrote up what he makes, his bills, what he can spend and what he's going to put into savings. He said "It looks good on paper, but It's not do-able." I basically said you're doing it or I'm out.

You have a very sensible head on your shoulders i agree with you here.

But i think he may have seen this as particularly controlling.

So he rebelled against that by blowing a ton of money.

He's immature and I think he still has allot of growing up to do.

[jen_r]

1 minute ago, JTSW said:

You have a very sensible head on your shoulders i agree with you here.

But i think he may have seen this as particularly controlling.

So he rebelled against that by blowing a ton of money.

He's immature and I think he still has allot of growing up to do.

The times before this weren't controlling. I was just at my witts end and needed him to know that there was going to be change or we weren't going to be together.

[JTSW]

Just now, jen_r said:

The times before this weren't controlling. I was just at my witts end and needed him to know that there was going to be change or we weren't going to be together.

I don't think you were controlling at all.

You are very sensible indeed.

He probably felt it was controlling because of his spending spree in response.

You're too good for him and don't think his spending habits will change.

What about going to stay with your parents or your friend for a while after you broke up with him?

[d0nnivain]

Financial incompatibility is the leading cause of divorce.   He doesn't stick to a budget because he doesn't want to.  It's as simple as that.  

Enjoy learning more about the market.   It will keep your mind occupied while filling your wallet

[Legatus]

I agree that he perceived it as controlling because of his habits but it wasn't. You are very sensible to look at finances before you tie the knot, hell everybody should do it every once in a while regardless if you're in relationship or marriage.

He doesn't seem like he wants to follow a plan. It could be that despite his age he hasn't grown into that mindset that it's nice to put some money aside for things you want to do in the future and that you can do it while still enjoying your present life. 

From what I can tell this is a deal-breaker for you and you should honour it. If you tried times and times again, and he didn't even consider taking it seriously - you are falling into an abyss of trying to teach him these things without getting anywhere..

[jen_r]

52 minutes ago, Legatus said:

I agree that he perceived it as controlling because of his habits but it wasn't. You are very sensible to look at finances before you tie the knot, hell everybody should do it every once in a while regardless if you're in relationship or marriage.

He doesn't seem like he wants to follow a plan. It could be that despite his age he hasn't grown into that mindset that it's nice to put some money aside for things you want to do in the future and that you can do it while still enjoying your present life. 

From what I can tell this is a deal-breaker for you and you should honour it. If you tried times and times again, and he didn't even consider taking it seriously - you are falling into an abyss of trying to teach him these things without getting anywhere..

I'm waiting for him to come home from his night out to have the talk. Cause yes...it is a deal breaker and I keep telling myself its over and were broken up to lessen the blow. I feel like I'm already mourning it.

[Legatus]

Quite possibly. Your expectations of it being over are already creating a mechanism to deal with it.

[scooby-philly]

Agree with the previous posters:

• His behavior will not change any time soon - his perception of things is the problem
• You were not controlling. Controlling would be to block his cards, take his cash, track every penny he spends.
• There are 8 key areas of compatibility:
  • Finances
  • Sex (frequency, style, etc)
  • Lifestyle (like how many nights out a week, time spent together,)
  • Communication - which means transparency, vulnerability, openness, honesty, level, type, and frequency of communication, and communication style
  • Religious Practice
  • Political Views
  • Love language

The most important one though - Timing

I'm a firm believer, through bad experience, that a lot of relationships aren't meant to last - because the timing was off. From what you shared, it sounds like you've learned a hard lesson not to move with/for another person until you see them and your compatibility in those 7 other areas. Of course, love is a risk, but financial compatibility is one of the easiest to figure out by their activity, spending, shopping, lifestyle choices. 

 

As someone else suggested, it will crush you, but use the time to heal and focus on yourself. Learn and grow from the opportunity. Who know's, this may have been the universe's sign that you need to get out. And if you go past 2 or 3 years and you don't know the truth of someone in those 7 areas, you should either find out ASAP or split. The fact that you've been together so long and are only now considering splitting is concerning. I doubt this is the first, or even second, or even third time you've run into this problem. Accept people for who they are NOW, not who you want them to be or who they could be.

[Legatus]

27 minutes ago, scooby-philly said:

The most important one though - Timing

I'm a firm believer, through bad experience, that a lot of relationships aren't meant to last - because the timing was off.

Not that I never disagreed with it but after last weekend I am a firmer believer that this is true than ever before. But how do we define that timing is off? To me it would mean that one of those 7 areas are not really at a level where you could call it compatible. The only differentiation here is that timing off implies that a change could be made and with time those areas would create strong enough bond to last. Almost like timing is a summary of those 7. In some places you will fit better and not so much in others but the sum of those parts defines whether it's a good time. Would you agree @scooby-philly

[scooby-philly]

@Legatus I think the problem with "timing" is that too often we only realize it was off in hindsight. If I were to look at my 3 ltrs the first two were not timing issues. my first ex (who i was actually engaged to) was not right for me. She was cold, angry, bitter, not affectionate, and couldn't open up. Nothing would have changed that in the long run. And since she was not used to having anyone support her mixed with a belief that no one would ever help her, a lot of what I did was either not noticed or trivialized when others started questioning why she was marrying me. I was frustrated in my job and after having had enough, quit, with nothing lined up, which turned out to be one of the smartest moves I made in my career. That said, while she was supportive in the beginning, when we got closer to wedding day and people started asking her about the situation, her attitude changed. Not like I was being a bum and sitting on my butt drinking or playing video games all day. I was networking, learning, working on me, still taking care of things around the house, still helping her at times with her business, etc. For me, timing has come into play only with the last ex. She was a lot younger than me, had no real prior dating experience, still lived with a shaming, controlling, conservative family. She was afraid of her own shadow and really unable to open up. Who knows, maybe if I had met her 2 or 4 years later things could be different, but in the end, I only recognized in hindsight that I was way beyond her in emotional maturity and not just career, money, and general life experience. But...there were things I ignored or didn't attribute to her immaturity that were really clear. So, it can be factor, but it's not always a factor.

So for example, with this post, it seems like timing really isn't an issue. Because at the end of the day they're just not compatible in terms of finances. Maybe he will change in 5 to 10 years, and you could say it's timing, but that's not known to the poster right now. 

 

And yes, I doubt most couples with healthy, loving, caring, relationships that go 10, 20, 50 years are 100% compatible on all 7 categories. But the question is how compatible they are in the the ones they are compatible on and how incompatible they are with the other(s). You could be looking for a financially stable guy, who wants sex every day,  likes a quiet life with only a few social events each moth, has a decent relationship with his family, knows how to communicate, is politically open minded, loves quality time and touch, which you do too and you know how to provide that for him and he knows how to provide it to you, and boom - it won't work because you want to go to church every weekend and he does not and you can't reconcile it because he refuses to go and you refuse to stop nagging him about it or he feels judged because of certain things you or others say or do. But a different couple could be the same level of compatability in those other 6 areas and incompatabile, at first, with religion, but he learns quickly that it's important to his partner so he does 1-2 times a month and the woman understands that he's still a good, moral, kind man and sees the effort he puts in and loves him even more because of it, and never nags him, and doesn't tolerate anyone - family, church goers, friends, from speaking ill about him not going more. Just an example, but I think it speaks to why it's so important that parents let kids start dating in HS, that college kids date seriously (meaning they try to date in college) and that people should live together before marriage (of if one or both has to move back home for finances) that families' understand they need to be independent and do their own thing - cause the more you experience the sooner, the more you learn and the better success you will have in the long run.

 

Sorry for hijacking your post OP!

[Legatus]

That's exactly how I think. My best LTR and LDR at the same time was with a woman 8 years older than me. She was and still is mostly responsible for the person I am now even though I broke up with her when I quit my job few years back to work with NGOs around South America, and I knew I couldn't waste her time (she wanted a family even though she still travels more than I do and more than when she was a Singapore Airline flight attendant). 

I think what you explained supports my theory. That if the sum of those parts isn't enough you could say it's timing issue. With the aforementioned ex, she asked me once why did I think we worked so well. Totally different lives, countries, continents, but I told her that there were so many little things in those 7 areas that they could support the whole world. it's the same as if you put let's say three humongous pillar underneath your house or you have 100 small ones. I prefer the latter because then one pillar is easy to replace and doesn't disrupt the balance of the house. 

[scooby-philly]

6 hours ago, Legatus said:

 She was and still is mostly responsible for the person I am now even though I broke up with her when I quit my job few years back to work with NGOs around South America, and I knew I couldn't waste her time (she wanted a family even though she still travels more than I do and more than when she was a Singapore Airline flight attendant). 

I think what you explained supports my theory. That if the sum of those parts isn't enough you could say it's timing issue. With the aforementioned ex, she asked me once why did I think we worked so well. Totally different lives, countries, continents, but I told her that there were so many little things in those 7 areas that they could support the whole world. it's the same as if you put let's say three humongous pillar underneath your house or you have 100 small ones. I prefer the latter because then one pillar is easy to replace and doesn't disrupt the balance of the house. 

No - it's not necessarily a timing issue. It could be. With the relationship you talked about it was perhaps timing or just lifestyle. The issue about timing is often it takes YEARS to find out that timing was wrong for one or both of you. But others times - like if there's a 8 or more year age gap and one person is ready for a family and other isn't, then it's pure timing. Or I often think of someone in there mid 20's meeting someone else who's great for them, but who's in med school and they can't really commit to a relationship or much of one and the other party isn't interested or personalty wise able to deal with seeing someone just once a week for a few hours at best. And yes, there at lots of things that make up each pillar - and I should probably put some real thought into this - so it's not like most of the time there's ONE HUGE thing that ends a relationship or makes it incompatible, but sometimes, drug abuse, cheating, insane fiscal irresponsibility, someone wanting kids and the other 100% no, it is one thing. That's what makes love and relationships so difficult. And why people are truly blessed if they find someone "forever".

[schlumpy]

He's not following the financial plan because there are no consequences if he doesn't. I'm sorry you've spent all this time with him but this relationship will not work unless you are willing to forego your need for financial stability. Don't compound your error by getting married.

I understand your fears. No one wants to be by themselves but somewhere down the road you will glad you got out. 

[stillafool]

22 hours ago, jen_r said:

I'm waiting for him to come home from his night out to have the talk. Cause yes...it is a deal breaker and I keep telling myself its over and were broken up to lessen the blow. I feel like I'm already mourning it.

But he's already told you and shown you he is not going to do it.  You can't make someone do something, especially a grown man.  It is up to you to decide what you are going to do not what you are going to try to make him do.  You are his gf not his mother so stop acting like it.

[JTSW]

Just now, stillafool said:

But he's already told you and shown you he is not going to do it.  You can't make someone do something, especially a grown man.  It is up to you to decide what you are going to do not what you are going to try to make him do.  You are his gf not his mother so stop acting like it.

She means that she is going to talk to him about breaking up.

[stillafool]

If this is the case just break up and tell him why.  I'm sure he's already expecting it.

[Alex90]

What did he blow the money on? Was it spent on something or gambling related? The reason I ask is it seems like gambling could be a possibility here from what I have read.

Apologies if this has already been answered, I haven't had time to read the thread in depth yet