Novel Coronavirus COVID-19

[Libby1]

On 9/4/2020 at 2:26 PM, Weezy1973 said:

The US will surpass Sweden today in per capita Covid deaths, and will top Italy in a few days. In two weeks they will pass Spain and the UK if numbers keep tracking. 

I must admit I haven't paid much attention to the figures lately, but I had a look today.   If fatality rate is measured simply by dividing the number of deaths by the number of diagnosed cases since the start of the outbreak, in the UK and Italy so far we have a fatality rate of more than 10% whereas in the US you have a fatality rate of between 3 and 4%.  

Your number of cases really spiked after 22nd June, with far more reported cases than you had in the early months when European countries had their worst time, but you're not having anything like the corresponding number of deaths that the US and Europe were getting back in that terrible April period.  I'd think the most likely explanation for that is that you're having far more widespread testing now (plus in the last few months the virus has become far more of a problem in various South American countries, and that's bound to impact on the US figures) and have better treatment than there was back in April. 

So you still have a problem with the spread (I say you, assuming you're US based) - and inevitably there are accompanying deaths.  In the UK, figures of diagnosed cases went right down for a while - but with the easing of lockdown we're starting to see a rise again which has resulted in some restrictions being brought back in.

[Weezy1973]

10 hours ago, Libby1 said:

 If fatality rate is measured simply by dividing the number of deaths by the number of diagnosed cases since the start of the outbreak, in the UK and Italy so far we have a fatality rate of more than 10% whereas in the US you have a fatality rate of between 3 and 4%.  

I think the best measure at this point is Covid deaths per capita. Because the amount countries test is variable, any measure based on testing will be similarly variable. Also, deaths per case are just going down in general now, as the virus is infecting younger people who have stronger immune systems, and treatments are also better now.

[Piddy]

I heard yesterday that Australia is just getting thru with their winter flu season and it was mild.

The thinking is that with everyone practicing social distancing, wearing masks etc., that that helped tamp down the flu.

Hope because of this that we in the U.S. have a mild flu season as well.

 

[Piddy]

Just saw a great billboard.  It was for a funeral home.  It had a picture of the funeral director with a mask on.  And the caption was.

MASK-IT or CASKET

[Azincourt]

6 minutes ago, Piddy said:

Just saw a great billboard.  It was for a funeral home.  It had a picture of the funeral director with a mask on.  And the caption was.

MASK-IT or CASKET

The Europeans are thinking of making wearing a mask mandatory even just walking outside on the street. I like that!

[schlumpy]

On 9/4/2020 at 9:26 AM, Weezy1973 said:

The US will surpass Sweden today in per capita Covid deaths, and will top Italy in a few days. In two weeks they will pass Spain and the UK if numbers keep tracking. 

There is a caveat here Weezy. It should read "per capita reported deaths" Do you accept the numbers reported by China, Russia, India and Brazil?

[Weezy1973]

2 hours ago, schlumpy said:

There is a caveat here Weezy. It should read "per capita reported deaths" Do you accept the numbers reported by China, Russia, India and Brazil?

I trust UK, US, Italy, Sweden and Spain which are the countries in my quote. Unless what you’re trying to say is you can’t trust any of these numbers? And there’s a conspiracy to make the US look worse than it actually is? 

[nospam99]

@weezy1973. One more time.... read CDC Alert 2 from March about NO RESTRICTIONS on 'reporting' a death is due to covid. Read the CARES Act, also from March, for financial incentives to 'report' covid diagnoses and to intubate patients so diagnosed. Why are people forgetting or ignoring these factors? These are not 'news reports', 'fake' or otherwise. These are actions by the US federal government, documented by the agencies thereof. After reading those two documents, draw your own conclusions about whether the US government, specifically Nancy P, is 'conspiring' 'to make the US look worse than it actually is'.

[Tamfana]

On 9/4/2020 at 6:26 AM, Weezy1973 said:

The US will surpass Sweden today in per capita Covid deaths, and will top Italy in a few days. In two weeks they will pass Spain and the UK if numbers keep tracking. 

Not a surprise.  It's what happens when you hire someone who doesn't understand basics of science or economics.  

And now we know for certain that Trump had been told how dangerous the virus is since early February and chose to let thousands of American die.

He's so dumb he still doesn't understand the economy is affected by things. 

Edited September 15, 2020 by Tamfana

[Weezy1973]

4 hours ago, nospam99 said:

After reading those two documents, draw your own conclusions about whether the US government, specifically Nancy P, is 'conspiring' 'to make the US look worse than it actually is'.

In order for any rational person to conclude that there’s a conspiracy to inflate the numbers of US Covid deaths, one must actually show that there are large numbers of non-Covid deaths being  reported as such. That’s called evidence. You’ve provided none. It’s an unsubstantiated conspiracy theory, supported by supporters of the current president. 

 

[nospam99]

@weezy1973. NO. It is not necessary to 'actually show that there are large numbers of non-Covid deaths being reported as such'. Referencing the CDC Alert and the CARES Act which create a mechanism for false reporting is sufficient to show a conspiracy on the part of the US federal government. If you choose to ignore that evidence, that's a personal decision on your part.

Nevertheless, NBC news (I wish I could post a link but that will get moderated away) posted a story about the death counts and underlying medical conditions on August 30. In that story NBC quoted the CDC as reporting that only 9683 of the deaths in the US had only covid on the death certificate. What did everyone besides those 9683 die of? How about the 9 other underlying medical conditions listed in the same story. Where there's smoke there's fire, especially in the US.

[basil67]

10 minutes ago, nospam99 said:

Nevertheless, NBC news (I wish I could post a link

You can post links now

If someone has high cholesterol and has a heart attack, their cause of death will reference the heart attack not the unnderlying cause of cholesterol.    Just as the death cert of someone who's COVID causes respiratory failure will have COD of respiratory failure.  

Edited September 15, 2020 by basil67

[nospam99]

@basil. Thanks!

https://nbc25news.com/news/local/cdc-94-of-covid-19-deaths-had-underlying-medical-conditions

[basil67]

40 minutes ago, nospam99 said:

@basil. Thanks!

https://nbc25news.com/news/local/cdc-94-of-covid-19-deaths-had-underlying-medical-conditions

So the question is, would they have died on the day they did if they didn't contract COVID?   They could well have lived many years and finally died from something else.

[Weezy1973]

4 hours ago, nospam99 said:

Referencing the CDC Alert and the CARES Act which create a mechanism for false reporting is sufficient to show a conspiracy on the part of the US federal government.
 

Uh nope. Not even close. 

 

4 hours ago, nospam99 said:

In that story NBC quoted the CDC as reporting that only 9683 of the deaths in the US had only covid on the death certificate.

So this might be relevant if it was different from how the WHO directed Covid reporting to happen. This is how reporting Covid deaths happens in the vast majority of countries. Covid would be considered the cause of death even if there were pre-existing conditions. The US isn’t some special snowflake. Most  countries are reporting Covid deaths the same way. No conspiracy.

Edited September 16, 2020 by Weezy1973

[Veronica73]

Woohoo! My area”s hospitals are back to being locked down. Adult inpatients can have no visitors unless they are unable to make Healthcare decisions for themselves, or they are about to die. Thank you schools for bringing everybody back. And also people who refused to lock down in the beginning, or to socially distance and wear masks afterwards. Now we get to drag this whole thing on until next spring at least. Half-ass measures don’t work. But that’s all we’re going to get here because it’s everybody for themselves. And anybody’s opinions are apparently as valuable as educated experts’ opinions. Yay USA!

[nospam99]

@Weezy. Now that I can posts links (though it's trivial to google), here is CDC Alert #2.

https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/data/nvss/coronavirus/Alert-2-New-ICD-code-introduced-for-COVID-19-deaths.pdf

Pay particular attention to the last question and the bolded part of the answer. Please provide a link to a WHO document issued PRIOR to or at the same time as the CDC document. Anything on the part of WHO AFTER the CDC set the 'if anyone dies, code it as covid' standard on March 24 is just tagalong. Also please provide a link to any news report similar to the NBC news report providing a significantly lower count of deaths due SOLELY to covid in other countries. 9600 compared to 190k+ in the US. If you need another link for the 190k, I'll find it. What are the world numbers? Is anyone outside the US even reporting 'deaths with covid the only cause on the death certificate'? Do foreign countries even bother with trivial administrative record keeping like recording the cause of death? What controls are in place either in the US or elsewhere to audit and confirm reported causes of death?

Edited September 16, 2020 by a LoveShack.org Moderator
Removed inappropriate comment, fixed link.

[elaine567]

The problem with Covid -19 it is a multi-system disease and it tends to cause severe disease in anyone who has an underlying health condition.

So most patients that die will also have other conditions pre or post Covid, and these other conditions will be listed on the death certificate.
Deaths from pure Covid are likely not that common.

[elaine567]

https://www.health.org.uk/news-and-comment/charts-and-infographics/understanding-excess-deaths-countries-regions-localities

Edited September 25, 2020 by a LoveShack.org Moderator
Removed embedded image.

[elaine567]

The thing about Sweden is that it is a huge country with a smallish population. It is mainly rural
The Swedes are a naturally socially distanced kind of a people.
A large proportion of them live alone, they are naturally compliant and obey authority. 
They understood the virus and understood what to do, they didn't need lockdowns to keep themselves safe.
Few were acting like idiots and ignoring safe  practices.
I read somewhere that along with  the care home cases, a lot of their cases were within the densely populated areas of Stockholm and amongst the migrant population that live there in big families in overcrowded areas.

As one person said the Swedes have their own saunas and gyms they don't need to crowd into busy leisure centres and commercial gyms... they do their own thing.

"On Sunday morning the Danes are in their beds,, the Norwegians go to church, and the Swedes wash and polish their Volvos."

[Weezy1973]

@nospam99 here is an article to help clarify the numbers. Again, unless you have evidence that deaths are being categorized as Covid deaths for people that didn’t have Covid, you’re doing nothing more than pushing an unsubstantiated conspiracy theory.

 

https://www.google.ca/amp/s/www.wbir.com/amp/article/news/health/coronavirus/cdc-statistic-on-covid-19-deaths-does-not-mean-only-6-percent-died-of-the-virus/51-fa6bcf24-5f2a-44fb-9b2d-5bc9e499242a

Edited September 16, 2020 by a LoveShack.org Moderator
Removed political comments in non-political forum.

[LivingWaterPlease]

I'm in the USA and went to my family practice Dr. today. While there I questioned both he and his nurse about covid. I was surprised to hear that they've tested many but haven't had one person with a serious reaction to the disease. So they haven't treated anyone for the disease. Told me many of those they've tested have been asymptomatic. The ones they've tested who had symptoms went home and got well.  

The nurse told me her son-in-law who has MS just had it and got over it within a few days. And my Dr. told me that if I get it I shouldn't worry because "you're a robust seventy-year old with no underlying health problems. you'll be fine."

That wasn't at all what I expected to hear. My Dr. has a busy practice. He's in his fifties, not just starting out with his business.

Edited September 16, 2020 by LivingWaterPlease

[schlumpy]

2 hours ago, LivingWaterPlease said:

The nurse told me her son-in-law who has MS just had it and got over it within a few days. And my Dr. told me that if I get it I shouldn't worry because "you're a robust seventy-year old with no underlying health problems. you'll be fine."

 

Thanks you so much LWP. That makes me feel so much better.

[QuietRiot]

2 hours ago, LivingWaterPlease said:

I'm in the USA and went to my family practice Dr. today. While there I questioned both he and his nurse about covid. I was surprised to hear that they've tested many but haven't had one person with a serious reaction to the disease. So they haven't treated anyone for the disease. Told me many of those they've tested have been asymptomatic. The ones they've tested who had symptoms went home and got well.  

The nurse told me her son-in-law who has MS just had it and got over it within a few days. And my Dr. told me that if I get it I shouldn't worry because "you're a robust seventy-year old with no underlying health problems. you'll be fine."

That wasn't at all what I expected to hear. My Dr. has a busy practice. He's in his fifties, not just starting out with his business.

Chances are, they got hit by a low viral load which lead to a well recovery, some aren't so lucky and wind up with a whiff of a large viral load and if they do survive, may wind up with organ damage or months of suffering. Sometimes it'll come, then... you'll feel better...a couple weeks later, you feel bad again. It's a VERY unpredictable disease.

[LivingWaterPlease]

1 hour ago, QuietRiot said:

Chances are, they got hit by a low viral load which lead to a well recovery, some aren't so lucky and wind up with a whiff of a large viral load and if they do survive, may wind up with organ damage or months of suffering. Sometimes it'll come, then... you'll feel better...a couple weeks later, you feel bad again. It's a VERY unpredictable disease.

So sorry for the ones who suffer. You must be a health care worker?  Or have you had it yourself? I hope you haven't suffered but it's also hard to watch others suffer.