Novel Coronavirus COVID-19

[sothereiwas]

 

4 hours ago, justwhoiam said:

Russian sources (or rumors) stated that the Wuhan lab where they regularly experiment on viruses is like half a mile from the market that was accused of spreading the virus. And the experimenting involved a military operation ....

These Russian sources finally affirm that the coronavirus contains a strain of HIV, which would only be possible if the virus is man-made

Spin it all you like, this is pure propaganda and conspiracy theory BS, and that's that. Trying to prop it up by pointing out an antiviral used for HIV treatment is seeing some utility is pretty transparent, no matter how hard your backpeddler is engaged. 

[vla1120]

Ugh. Personally, I don't care one lick about the COVID-19 virus. I doubt it would be any worse than the common cold, if I did contract the virus, and I think it's being blown out of proportion, like SARS, etc. I DO worry about my husband since he is in the end stages of cancer and his immune system is so compromised. I think those are the only people who need to worry - people with compromised immune systems including the sick, the elderly, and very young children. Hmm. Maybe I should also be concerned about my anorexic daughter. She definitely has a compromised immune system. I just think the majority of us, who are healthy, do not need to worry about this like it is the biblical end of the world.

[serial muse]

Here is a helpful, non-panicky twitter thread with practical advice. Bottom line, this is an easily transmissible flu, containment is not possible, it's going to be everywhere so preparation including for possible school/office closures is important. It's not particularly serious/deadly but more dangerous to the elderly and immunocompromised. There's a lot we dont know about its transmission, partic asymptomatic, however, so stay tuned. 

Oh and also of course it's not engineered. Let's focus rationally on the problem at hand.

[pepperbird]

57 minutes ago, sothereiwas said:

 

Spin it all you like, this is pure propaganda and conspiracy theory BS, and that's that. Trying to prop it up by pointing out an antiviral used for HIV treatment is seeing some utility is pretty transparent, no matter how hard your backpeddler is engaged. 

I can;t help but think that if the Chinese/American/ Russian/ whichever government wanted to bio engineer a virus, they'd do it in a way that couldn't be detected. Otherwise, what's the point? Also, don 't many viruses mutate pretty rapidly? if they do, then again, what's the point?

My bets educated guess( not that it's worth much) is this is just one of Mother Nature's reminders to watch our step because she can still kick our collective behinds any time she wants to. 🤣🤣

[sothereiwas]

1 minute ago, pepperbird said:

I can;t help but think that if the Chinese/American/ Russian/ whichever government wanted to bio engineer a virus, they'd do it in a way that couldn't be detected.

Well in that case this was part of the Illuminati NWO test thinger, run as a false flag ... blah blah ....

[pepperbird]

2 minutes ago, sothereiwas said:

Well in that case this was part of the Illuminati NWO test thinger, run as a false flag ... blah blah ....

Gotcha...could it be the CDC Zombie protocol was for real?
you just never know. 🤣
If I remember correctly, this assumption often comes out when there's a major outbreak communicable disease. People love a good conspiracy theory.

[Libby1]

According to the BBC (who do usually fact check pretty well), Iran's death count is more like 200+ as opposed to the 35 or so that the authorities are claiming.  The BBC report I read claimed that hospital sources in Iran had told them this.

I'm concerned about volatility in the stockmarket influencing the way news is being filtered out.  I know that always happens to a degree, but I think it's probably more of a factor than usual just now.  I wouldn't be at all surprised if an important news update about this virus is released at some point this weekend while markets are closed, but I guess time will tell on that.

 

[elaine567]

Uk today

Seven new cases in 24 hours, including the first cases in Wales and Northern Ireland.
People who had been in Italy, Tenerife and Iran, 
AND a GP, who has never been out of the country and who had been treating patients all week. 
Our first "home grown" case.

ALSO  a British man from the quarantined Diamond Princess cruise ship in Japan has died from the virus today too
Not a good day...

[Els]

Oh for chrissakes. Antibiotics and antiviral work against a variety of organisms that are susceptible to them. It is 100% normal for such drugs to be used to treat a wide range of infections

[Libby1]

18 hours ago, vla1120 said:

Ugh. Personally, I don't care one lick about the COVID-19 virus. I doubt it would be any worse than the common cold, if I did contract the virus, and I think it's being blown out of proportion, like SARS, etc. I DO worry about my husband since he is in the end stages of cancer and his immune system is so compromised. I think those are the only people who need to worry - people with compromised immune systems including the sick, the elderly, and very young children. Hmm. Maybe I should also be concerned about my anorexic daughter. She definitely has a compromised immune system. I just think the majority of us, who are healthy, do not need to worry about this like it is the biblical end of the world.

Very sorry to hear about your family's health problems.  It's completely understandable that coronavirus isn't your priority and that you feel it's being blown out of proportion.

According to this report, at the moment researchers think the fatality rate is around 1% - though coming up with a figure is extremely difficult.  The report goes into possible explanations as to why fatality figures vary (quite dramatically in some cases) geographically.  SARS caused less than 800 fatalities, whereas current figures for coronavirus are just short of 3000, with most of those having occurred in Wuhan where it quickly got out of control due to lack of containment in the first few weeks.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-51674743

The report suggests that researchers currently take the view that in the majority of cases the symptoms will indeed be mild.  So in some countries they wouldn't be detected/counted among figures.  I think, the reason the WHO is advocating strong measures to contain the illness is that even if the actual fatality rate is 1%, we shouldn't forget about the number of ultimately non fatal cases that are nonetheless serious enough for hospitalisation. 

So it's not so much a case of whether a healthy and relatively young person needs to worry about coronavirus killing them (since although it's always a possibility, it's generally a very remote one)....more a case of being aware that if something like this spreads very rapidly, health services might be hard pressed to cope with the percentage of cases that become serious enough for hospitalisation.  In Wuhan, new hospitals had to be built in a matter of days in order to cope.  An achievement most other countries would find impossible to replicate.

We can look back on other viruses such as SARS and regard them, with hindsight, as having been blown out of proportion.  However, had health authorities under-reacted to them we might not have that luxury today.

Edited February 29, 2020 by Libby1

[pepperbird]

20 hours ago, sothereiwas said:

Well in that case this was part of the Illuminati NWO test thinger, run as a false flag ... blah blah ....

I really don't think there's much anyone can learn form "the numbers" right now. Sure, a lot of people in China/Iran wherever may have caught the virus, but what does that really mean?
Who makes up these populations? Do they already have access to health care, clean water, enough food? Are they tightly crowded in together? If they are sick, can they choose to stay at home or dot hey have to continue to go to work to put food on their table?

The virus may mean very different things to someone living in an overcrowded, polluted city who may be working long hours and not get enough to eat than to a well fed person who has access to adequate health care and even OTC medications.

[pepperbird]

2 hours ago, Libby1 said:

Very sorry to hear about your family's health problems.  It's completely understandable that coronavirus isn't your priority and that you feel it's being blown out of proportion.

According to this report, at the moment researchers think the fatality rate is around 1% - though coming up with a figure is extremely difficult.  The report goes into possible explanations as to why fatality figures vary (quite dramatically in some cases) geographically.  SARS caused less than 800 fatalities, whereas current figures for coronavirus are just short of 3000, with most of those having occurred in Wuhan where it quickly got out of control due to lack of containment in the first few weeks.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-51674743

The report suggests that researchers currently take the view that in the majority of cases the symptoms will indeed be mild.  So in some countries they wouldn't be detected/counted among figures.  I think, the reason the WHO is advocating strong measures to contain the illness is that even if the actual fatality rate is 1%, we shouldn't forget about the number of ultimately non fatal cases that are nonetheless serious enough for hospitalisation. 

So it's not so much a case of whether a healthy and relatively young person needs to worry about coronavirus killing them (since although it's always a possibility, it's generally a very remote one)....more a case of being aware that if something like this spreads very rapidly, health services might be hard pressed to cope with the percentage of cases that become serious enough for hospitalisation.  In Wuhan, new hospitals had to be built in a matter of days in order to cope.  An achievement most other countries would find impossible to replicate.

We can look back on other viruses such as SARS and regard them, with hindsight, as having been blown out of proportion.  However, had health authorities under-reacted to them we might not have that luxury today.

So long as it's a measured response and not used to make political hay.

[gaius]

The flaw with the theory researchers are currently using is with this virus most mild cases are still likely to be counted. Because even if someone has mild symptoms and doesn't seek treatment they're so infectious that everyone around them is going to end up infected. At some point someone in that group is going to get it bad enough that they seek treatment. Then that person and all their contacts come under scrutiny and testing. At least in countries not named Iran.

The governor of Georgia gave a press conference yesterday and gave some details on how the new federal task force is prioritizing working with states to enable rapid testing on the state and county level, so they don't have to send tests to the CDC and wait days for results. Which should be priority one and apparently is.

I still think they should start training and equipping army units to come in and set up mobile hospitals on short notice but I'm not the president.

[pepperbird]

4 minutes ago, gaius said:

The flaw with the theory researchers are currently using is with this virus most mild cases are still likely to be counted. Because even if someone has mild symptoms and doesn't seek treatment they're so infectious that everyone around them is going to end up infected. At some point someone in that group is going to get it bad enough that they seek treatment. Then that person and all their contacts come under scrutiny and testing. At least in countries not named Iran.

The governor of Georgia gave a press conference yesterday and gave some details on how the new federal task force is prioritizing working with states to enable rapid testing on the state and county level, so they don't have to send tests to the CDC and wait days for results. Which should be priority one and apparently is.

I still think they should start training and equipping army units to come in and set up mobile hospitals on short notice but I'm not the president.

It's not like that here either. privacy laws and all. It may well be like that in a lot m ore places than people realize.

[Libby1]

9 minutes ago, gaius said:

I still think they should start training and equipping army units to come in and set up mobile hospitals on short notice but I'm not the president.

I know it's probably treading on dangerous ground to mention the president's approach in this matter, but I'd worry that his focus on the impact coronavirus is having on the Dow Jones index is encouraging him to minimise this issue to a degree where containment problems might build up.  Temporary testing centres and quarantine facilities where people can be assured that they're not going to be slammed with an unmanageable bill for doing the right thing (ie getting their symptoms checked out) seem like a very good idea to me.  While stopping flights from high risk areas will obviously help, it doesn't address the problem of existing cases spreading.

[SincereOnlineGuy]

"The only thing we have to fear is fear itself"

 

~ F. Roosevelt

 

 

(now quit fanning the flames)

 

 

[pepperbird]

The military is already well trained in setting up temporary medical centres on  a moment's notice- they do so quite frequently during emergencies such as flooding, wildfires and other disasters. They are also well trained in triage, isolation and outbreak containment. They have experience in what to do with germs that make this one look like a day at the beach. There's units that do nothing more than train for this sort of thing. It's their job and they know how to do it well.

I highly doubt there's any conspiracy, there's any bio engineering or anything nefarious going on. Wash your hands, don't cough or sneeze on others, stay at home if you're sick and stop paying attention to the latest chicken little headlines. Chances are, any "facts" aren't even verified and a lot of it is just gossip.

 

[preraph]

The first U.S. coronavirus death in Washington State.  Press conference at 1:00, but I don't know what time zone.  Anyway, the early reports don't say the age of the person or any details.  But there's more in around the Seattle area, which isn't much of a surprise.  

[Watercolors]

This is all reminiscent of the 24/7 hysteria created by the media with SARS and MERS. Lots of misinformation online and being broadcast on tv and the radio about the Corona virus. The fear mongering by the media is guided by the government to keep people in a perpetual state of fear, distracted, so that the gov can spend exorbitant amounts of tax payers money on 'war' and 'surveillance' to keep us safe. Safe from what or whom? 

Henry Kissinger said there has to be an enemy either real or imagined. Right now the "enemy" is the Corona virus. News programming uses a hierarchy of, if it bleeds, it leads  Fear-based news programming has 2 goals: 1) grab the viewer's attention with a problem that effects them personally, and 2) the only way to the viewer can get the solution to the problem i.e. information they need, is to watch the newscast. Sensationalism and fear-mongering is the new norm for our pop culture programming. The truth just isn't a priority anymore for news and media outlets. 

The R-naught of the Corona virus is claimed to be 2:2 (2 people infected by every 1 person infected with the Corona virus). It's a cold virus. Less than 2% of people who get this type of cold virus develop pneumonia and die from it. Just like with SARS and MERS.  

Edited February 29, 2020 by Watercolors

[carhill]

It appears, based on personal content from forum members on another forum who live in WA, one of them has a grandmother in the hospital who tested positive and indicate there are others at that same hospital also testing positive. More details coming. Since elderly are one high-risk group, best wishes and prayers. The woman you refer to was in her 50's and 'medically challenged' or similar.

2 hours ago, preraph said:

The first U.S. coronavirus death in Washington State

Also, we haven't heard much about Mexico.

I did hear from a pilot stuck in Italy due to their handling of the situation. He was there to instruct sim training for his airline and got caught up in it. His video of the local street scenes and stores were quite instructive. He arrived a couple weeks ago with a cold and has been wearing a mask since. He sounds pretty good, recovered from the cold well. Listening, I wondered if the immune system kicking up for the cold virus might help or hurt if exposed to coronavirus, could see that going either way, even though no immunity to corona.

News conference:

 

[carhill]

The info/anecdote on WA was just updated to reflect the facility involved is a SNF, not a hospital, and there are apparently a number of patients testing positive. Given SNF's focus on custodial care and therapy, not critical care, hope they can protect the non-infected patients. I remember when my mom was in a 99 bed facility, it was easy to see how any communicable illness or pathogen could race through that place with a bunch of mostly elderly and infirm residents there. 

[gaius]

2 hours ago, carhill said:

The info/anecdote on WA was just updated to reflect the facility involved is a SNF, not a hospital, and there are apparently a number of patients testing positive. Given SNF's focus on custodial care and therapy, not critical care, hope they can protect the non-infected patients. I remember when my mom was in a 99 bed facility, it was easy to see how any communicable illness or pathogen could race through that place with a bunch of mostly elderly and infirm residents there. 

Yeah, that's just about the worst place is could get into. And most likely the first sizeable outbreak in the US.

It's officially started it seems.

[gaius]

6 hours ago, pepperbird said:

The military is already well trained in setting up temporary medical centres on  a moment's notice- they do so quite frequently during emergencies such as flooding, wildfires and other disasters. They are also well trained in triage, isolation and outbreak containment. They have experience in what to do with germs that make this one look like a day at the beach. There's units that do nothing more than train for this sort of thing. It's their job and they know how to do it well.

I know they have chemical warfare and medical units. I'm not sure how well prepared they'd be if called on to help supplement local hospitals and set up isolation facilities to house and treat patients though. One of the reasons the HHS messed up so badly with the rescue flight is it's been so long since we've had to deal with something exactly like this. Few are fully prepared and I doubt the military would be any different. Getting them adequate supplies, training from the CDC and positioning them in a location where they could deploy rapidly to anywhere in the country would be a wise precaution.

I guess the CDC has sent an emergency response team to the nursing home in Washington state. How many people that involves I don't know, but if we start seeing multiple outbreaks I don't know if they'll have enough personnel to adequately intervene.

[elaine567]

UK tonight
"Retired doctors and nurses could be called back into service to help the NHS tackle the coronavirus epidemic, as part of an urgent "battleplan" being drawn up by the Government."
What a brilliant idea...
Mobilise a workforce of old people to fight an infection that appears to be more severe if not fatal in the old...
 

[carhill]

Experience has value and if otherwise healthy they should be safe especially in hands-off roles. A lot of active medical personnel are older too. The job doesn't generally destroy their body like more hazardous/physical work does and as long as their mind is sharp they can work to quite an old age and many do. I remember my dad's doc making house calls well into his 70's. I was nearly 50 when my dentist who'd cared for my teeth since a toddler finally retired. Not uncommon. Probably even more common now as people live longer. Best wishes to those who answer the call. The lives they save could be ours.