trackdayguy Posted February 10, 2020 Share Posted February 10, 2020 This was the heading of a recent post. I did make me chuckle. The guy was talking about asking his sweethearts Father permission to marry her. Great gesture, but an ancient tradition dragged unknowingly into the 21st when the father owned all the women in his household. I'm guess he was asking for ownership transfer. Might seem harmless but it's very destructive. Listening to how some couples talk to one another you'd think they did own each other. Link to post Share on other sites
d0nnivain Posted February 10, 2020 Share Posted February 10, 2020 I think the modern trend has changed it to asking for the parents' blessing. I'm an only child & I was over 40 when DH & I got engaged. My father was hurt that my husband didn't talk to him first. It's important to understand the culture & the perspective involved. Link to post Share on other sites
basil67 Posted February 10, 2020 Share Posted February 10, 2020 (edited) Daughter is a staunch feminist. If someone my daughter was in a relationship with asked my permission or blessing, I'd recognise incompatibility straight up. Edited February 10, 2020 by basil67 Link to post Share on other sites
Author trackdayguy Posted February 11, 2020 Author Share Posted February 11, 2020 5 hours ago, d0nnivain said: I think the modern trend has changed it to asking for the parents' blessing. I'm an only child & I was over 40 when DH & I got engaged. My father was hurt that my husband didn't talk to him first. It's important to understand the culture & the perspective involved. I’m sorry to hear he was hurt, but that’s a choice he made. I don’t think most people think it through. Like you said it important to respect the culture. But sadly the ack of asking permission raises lots of questions about ownership. How is that helpful ? Link to post Share on other sites
major_merrick Posted February 11, 2020 Share Posted February 11, 2020 In my community, I think most men ask the girl's father for permission. At least, if the girl has a decent father. I think the "asking" tradition is sort of a sweet formality where the answer is already known ahead of time. I mean, you want in-laws who like you....so you'll already have had plenty of interaction with them and you know if there's issues. If there's issues, you'll probably elope anyways. I don't see much issue with the de-facto "ownership" idea because it also confers a great deal of protection. I wish my own father had actually seen fit to protect me or care about me like that. My husband is a really great father in that regard - his girls are definitely "daddy's princesses." And you only get to be a princess when your daddy is The King. I don't see that dynamic in a negative light. 2 Link to post Share on other sites
Daisydooks Posted February 11, 2020 Share Posted February 11, 2020 (edited) 14 hours ago, trackdayguy said: This was the heading of a recent post. I did make me chuckle. The guy was talking about asking his sweethearts Father permission to marry her. Great gesture, but an ancient tradition dragged unknowingly into the 21st when the father owned all the women in his household. I'm guess he was asking for ownership transfer. Might seem harmless but it's very destructive. Listening to how some couples talk to one another you'd think they did own each other. My dad was asked before he died. But it was more of an intention talk. WE had decided we wanted to spend forever together before this chat. He knew I wanted to marry him, he knew I would say yes, he knew what I wanted down to my ring size by the time he asked me. He made his intentions known with my parents. Not just my father. My fiance intended to marry me and wanted my parents blessing in that. Of course they told him that was lovely, but he'd have to ask me as I'm kind of the boss of that. Hahahaha It came down to ME saying yes and ME making life altering decisions regardless of my parents blessing. I was not being given away. I lived alone for years and was capable of being alone, happy being alone and truly enjoyed my time alone. I didnt need approval, but it was nice they fancied him enough to give their blessing and well wishes. When my mom was young, a man offered my grandfather 2 cows and 4 goats for my mother. Even then his response was "why don't you ask her?" Hahaha My mother was never one to allow anyone to make her choices for her, even as a young adult living with her parents. My mother grew up all over the world because my grandfather was stationed for work all over the map. The cow/goat proposition came at a time when they lived in Trinidad. Haha My mother did not marry the man with the cow and goat offer and didnt get my grandfather's blessing anyhow. Even if he did, my mother had no interest in that or being traded for livestock. Edited February 11, 2020 by Daisydooks Link to post Share on other sites
Els Posted February 11, 2020 Share Posted February 11, 2020 I agree with you - that's also why H and I did not ask my dad, we aren't going to support a "tradition" like that. Although, in our culture the "ownership" thing is even more pronounced, with the man literally giving stuff to the girl's parents in exchange for permission... like she's a goat being traded off for 2 sacks of grain or something. Yuck, yuck, yuck. Link to post Share on other sites
d0nnivain Posted February 11, 2020 Share Posted February 11, 2020 It's not about ownership. It's about getting the blessing. . . knowing that you are being welcomed into both families. Had somebody asked my father's permission he would have laughed in the guy's face & told him I'm a grown woman who makes my own choices. Heck when I was 19 some guy thanked my father for letting me go out with him. My father did laugh at that guy before assuring him that he didn't need to thank my dad because I was going out with him not my dad & I made my own choices no matter what. DH knew how traditional my father was but just didn't think to get dad's blessing. When I told DH how hurt dad was DH's reaction wasn't the gracious mea culpa I wanted but it was part & parcel of a bigger issue where back then DH didn't think through the consequences of his actions; he has improved considerably since then. Overall I think the point being missed entirely on this thread is consideration, respect & civility. They have seem to have disappeared from modern life & that is sad. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Author trackdayguy Posted February 11, 2020 Author Share Posted February 11, 2020 (edited) 39 minutes ago, d0nnivain said: It's not about ownership. It's about getting the blessing. . . knowing that you are being welcomed into both families. Had somebody asked my father's permission he would have laughed in the guy's face & told him I'm a grown woman who makes my own choices. Heck when I was 19 some guy thanked my father for letting me go out with him. My father did laugh at that guy before assuring him that he didn't need to thank my dad because I was going out with him not my dad & I made my own choices no matter what. DH knew how traditional my father was but just didn't think to get dad's blessing. When I told DH how hurt dad was DH's reaction wasn't the gracious mea culpa I wanted but it was part & parcel of a bigger issue where back then DH didn't think through the consequences of his actions; he has improved considerably since then. Overall I think the point being missed entirely on this thread is consideration, respect & civility. They have seem to have disappeared from modern life & that is sad. I agree with the respect issue 100%, but cant we find another way to do it. Edited February 11, 2020 by trackdayguy Link to post Share on other sites
pepperbird Posted February 11, 2020 Share Posted February 11, 2020 We spoke to my mom and dad, but it was more about seeking the advice of two people who were older and had experience we didn't. The only question they asked was if we thought getting married at point was a good idea or if we felt we should wait for a bit. WE were fresh out of uni., had to real future trajectory except that we wanted to get married. None of us saw it asking for "permission". I was a 25 year old and could do what I wanted. It was more about getting advice form the two people who knew me better than anyone else in this world. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
thefooloftheyear Posted February 11, 2020 Share Posted February 11, 2020 It's more of a ceremonial thing at this point....I mean women also wear white wedding dresses today, even if they screwed every guy in town...😂 I'd feel a bit bad if the guy my daughter finally settles with doesn't do it...Knowing me, i'd initially make a joke of it, but I dunno...I just cant believe how people now have to crap on anything that is considered a tradition....Or in the case of the wedding dress, just followed those traditions that suit them.. I remember it...It was a fun night...We all had a good time and I took them all out to dinner on my dime...They were impressed.. TFY 1 Link to post Share on other sites
pepperbird Posted February 11, 2020 Share Posted February 11, 2020 22 minutes ago, thefooloftheyear said: It's more of a ceremonial thing at this point....I mean women also wear white wedding dresses today, even if they screwed every guy in town...😂 I'd feel a bit bad if the guy my daughter finally settles with doesn't do it...Knowing me, i'd initially make a joke of it, but I dunno...I just cant believe how people now have to crap on anything that is considered a tradition....Or in the case of the wedding dress, just followed those traditions that suit them.. I remember it...It was a fun night...We all had a good time and I took them all out to dinner on my dime...They were impressed.. TFY It was the first time my husband e er really met my parents. He was so nervous. As a joke, I told him that he could tell if they liked him, because if they did, my mom would use her good china. If they didn't like him, he'd get the Royal Chinette.🤣 he got the china, not the paper plates 1 Link to post Share on other sites
thefooloftheyear Posted February 11, 2020 Share Posted February 11, 2020 1 minute ago, pepperbird said: It was the first time my husband e er really met my parents. He was so nervous. As a joke, I told him that he could tell if they liked him, because if they did, my mom would use her good china. If they didn't like him, he'd get the Royal Chinette.🤣 he got the china, not the paper plates That's funny...😂 I know when I did it....FIL just stood there and looked at me serious....then he grabbed me by the throat(in a joking way, )….We laughed, then he gave me a big hug and we all just enjoyed the moment... Not a single second did I ever think about the "ownership" thing being mentioned in this thread....No more than many women think about their previous long lost virginity when they are shopping for the dress..TBH, its the first time I had ever heard it characterized that way.... TFY Link to post Share on other sites
pepperbird Posted February 11, 2020 Share Posted February 11, 2020 Just now, thefooloftheyear said: That's funny...😂 I know when I did it....FIL just stood there and looked at me serious....then he grabbed me by the throat(in a joking way, )….We laughed, then he gave me a big hug and we all just enjoyed the moment... Not a single second did I ever think about the "ownership" thing being mentioned in this thread....No more than many women think about their previous long lost virginity when they are shopping for the dress..TBH, its the first time I had ever heard it characterized that way.... TFY I always thought it was more about a parent letting go of their child and marking the transition to their new life. It's actually kind of sweet. Link to post Share on other sites
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