Is there any hope of salvaging this relationship? THANK YOU!

[MaxxNY]

Hello Everyone,

I would like to start by saying this is a great forum and I learned a lot by just reading. My situation is a little unique and I hope you can help me. 

I met "Jane" over the summer while she was in NY vacation. We hit it off right away, however since she is from Europe, we developed our connection by talking online on daily basis. Initially the whole thing was magical, she looked up to me, craved the conversations and was striving to please me in every possible way. After 3 months online, I asked her to come back. She came here for 7 days. She is beautiful, very personable and well spoken woman. We had great times together, visiting all the touristy places in NYC, staying at home or just hanging out with a slice of pizza. However, her drive to please me along with signs of jealous behavior lead me to believe she has an anxious attachment style. While here, she would make huge deals out of the fact that the waitress stood a little too close to me while taking our order, or the fact that as I spaced out while "looking" at two girls in front of us on a crowded subway. Little arguments over silly things like that put a lot of toll on our time together.

During our time apart, we discussed possible future together. She loves NYC, she also expressed interest in moving here to be with me. She was ready to come to US by either transferring with her company or a "fiancee visa". I was a bit skeptical, partly because of our arguments, partly because this happened so quickly. I asked her to look at the job transfer and to set up her life here so that in case things did not work out between us, she would not feel like she left everything just for me. Fast forward to November. I purchased my first apartment, and I am in the process of packing, organizing my move, scheduling the closing etc. I told her that I would love to have her spend Christmas/new years with me with a disclaimer that depending on when my closing is scheduled, our time together might be revolving around my move. Initially she had no objections and said she would love to spend more time with me no matter what we do. Once she arrived we had great times together, sprinkled with arguments over silly things. Initially I stood my ground when it came to seemingly illogical behavior, which lead to few major fights and tears. Towards the end of the trip she complained that she spent a major portion of her time here helping me pack, going to Home Depot etc. We however parted ways on good terms and looked forward to seeing each other in 2-3 months.

 

Beginning of January comes and I am officially moving. The entire process took a big toll on me. This combined with work and almost daily arguments over "we dont talk enough", "you keep sending me meaningless messages through the day at work" was hard. On one of the weekends I told her that the added stress of our arguments makes things very hard on me. I said I need to take a step back to deal with my life and see where I stand with the relationship. Initially she agreed, but then said she does not want to do it. I called her explaining that I really need time to deal with my move. She then said something to the effect of "if you leave now, you will force me to distance myself from you or do the same to you" I felt like it was an unnecessary game, so I did not get into it. 6 days go by, I deal with all my moving issues, and first thing Saturday morning I send her a text sharing some pictures and good news. I do not hear a response from her until the following Thursday. In the mean time I write that I would like to talk about our relationship and how she feels about continuing. When she reached out on Thursday she stated that she did not see her future with me. I supposedly abandoned her, she came to terms with that and is ok with us not being together. I was cought off guard because of how differently we looked at things. I apologized for making her feel like I abandoned her, and explained that was never my intention. I told her that I needed to deal with a lot of my things, but also acknowledged I should have made her part of that instead of backing off (avoidant attachment style).  I told her that if she was open to working on things to together, I would change the way we approach arguments and try to resolve them instead of backing off. When she insisted on it not working out, I said I respected her decision if she wanted to part ways. However, as soon as I said that she would throw in a comment like "so are you going to leave me now" 4 hours of back and forth and me finally saying that you cant have it both ways, and she either wants me in her life or not. Towards the end of the conversation she said that she does not see things working out, but is willing to see what happens. It felt like next two weeks were filled with booby traps. Nothing I said or did was right. When I tried to establish some time where we would put everything to the side and just talk about her day, that felt like I was "checking up on here". On the other hand, when I gave her, her space, she texts me towards the end of the day telling me she knew she would be disappointed because she waited for me to reach out to her all day. No, she did not take the time to say hello, I miss you or anything. I stopped arguing over silly things like that, and just went with the flow. However, it felt like the more I compromised the more aggressive she was becoming. I send her a picture sharing some of my weight loss and she is accusing me of taking pictures for other women.  It felt like trying to pet an angry pitbull, that tries to bite your hand off every time.

Towards the end of the two weeks, I told her how much I care about her, and how much I miss the "old" her where she was relaxed, sweet, and we had great time together. I told her that I can not continue with her constantly arguing, but if she is willing to take her gloves off, and just work with me I will be the happiest man alive....The only thing she got out of that was "I am ready to leave". My attempts to explain were just met with "you already made your decision, lets not go back and forth". At that point I just said "ok" and went silent. 

It has been two weeks, and I have not heard from her at all.I ordered roses for valentine's day to be delivered tomorrow. However, I am not sure if and how she will respond to that. 

I really care about the girl, and miss all the good times we had together. She claims that she wants a long term partner to be her "rock" a person she can count on no matter what. I know that is not the feeling she got lately, but thats ultimately what I want too. On one other hand, the little arguments over silly things, and her insecurities made things really difficult. I guess I am hoping that somehow we can reconcile and I can put her in state of mind where she feels comfortable and secure with me. I want this to work out, and I want us to be there for each other long term. However, I want this to be a peaceful and content relationship. Is this possible at this point???? Please help!!!! Thank you in advance

 

M

[MaxxNY]

P.S. At this point it feels like going "no contact" is the only way to have her come back without taking shots at me. However, her anxious attachment style might have lead her away from me already. 

[zeyta]

I am sorry to tell you, but this relationship doesn't look healthy at all...

How long do you know each other?

[d0nnivain]

She is not a person who has peaceful relationships.  You love who you thought she was when she was on her best behavior when you 1st met her.  You have to evaluate how you feel about the anxious insecure person who demands more then you can give who she actually is.  

[MaxxNY]

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Edited February 13, 2020 by MaxxNY

[MaxxNY]

donnivain, Zeyta, thank you for your responses. We met in August of last year. Spent virtually every day talking online and about 30 days together between both trips. 

d0nnivain, naturally I would say I do not feel good because it caused a lot of arguments. However, based on my readings it is possible to change ones attachments style over time. What I hope to do is get to a point where she relaxes and feels comfortable/secure enough to realize I am in this for long term 

[ExpatInItaly]

OP, this is not going to work. 

She is too far away and too immature and unstable for the sort of relationship you seek. Sorry man, but you are wasting your time on this. 

[chillii]

 

 

Hi op.

Man it's way way way over simplistic to think her thing is just some attachment style.  lt's her personality and thinking, her head. l wouldn't think for a second , get things all just right and she;ll be all fixed and happy.

l knew someone sounds a lot like her , there is no fixing or keeping them happy , she'll just keep on picking and twisting up any old which way anything she feels like in the second or on the day, They seem to thrive on brain fk , There's no logic'ing her out of it or common sensing she;ll just twist it all up into little spears and just keep on throwing them at anything and everything whenever she;s a bit of color and take great joy in doing your head in like she's been doing so well already.

lf ya do get back with her to try again please don't commit in any way until you see where things go because l'd just about guarantee you probably haven't seen nothin with her yet, this is her honeymoon phase.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[MaxxNY]

Thank you for your replies. After receiving flowers for valentine's day she called me complaining why I would send her a romantic gift after we have not spoken for two weeks. 

There was some back and forth, we start talking the same day, and one of the first things she says is that the flowers make her feel very sad. When I try to be supportive I only get that I dont understand her. She turns her phone off on Valentine's Day evening(Friday) and does not come back online until the next day around 4pm her time. When I see her online, I ask if everything is ok. She does not respond, I call her she just messages me to "stop". I ask why she has not responded, and she just says that its too much for her to handle. 

I follow up with a text message next day saying that I will respect her request and will give her space. I assure her that I am not leaving but she is the one that needs to initiate contact. She is not happy about that. After some back and forth I tell her that she can not have it both ways. She either wants to work it out or not. She then calls to tell me that she does not want to send mixed messages and she sees no hope of things working out. I calmly agree to part ways, and we hang up. I follow up with a nice message thanking her for all the good times, and telling her how much I enjoyed us being together. 

She then sends a response by saying "I wish things went differently" Seeing that she is not ready to let things go, I go with the flow but dont ask for 2nd chances. She finally says that perhaps if we did ABC, things would get better. I agree, and we start talking about fixing the relationship. Right away she shows concern by asking "How do I know you are serious, you are not already talking to other women etc" I assure her that I want to make things work with her. She mentions some issues she has been insecure about. One of them being my status on Facebook. Previously I did not announce our relationship because I prefer to keep my life private. This time I take the initiative and change my status to being in a relationship with her. She questions it now and asks why I change it so easily where in the past I would not have done it. I tell her that I understand that things that may be trivial to me may mean a lot to her and Im willing to meet her half way if it makes her feel more secure about the relationship. Two days later she still has not confirmed our relationship status on facebook. She brings up another insecurity of hers, me camping over weekends with friends and acquaintances. Despite my assurances that its just a bunch of people camping on the weekends she escalates the issue to a point where nothing I say matters. She hangs up  almost crying saying that this was a mistake and I have not changed at all...

When I text her saying it was great talking to her but Im sad to see her get so upset over something so trivial, she tells me that the back and forth has her emotionally worn out, and that I dont understand her. Instead of helping her relax I just add to her emotional stress. She says she cant do this anymore. Then she follows up with another message saying how the relationship puts her in a lot of stress and impacts her negatively. She says I should reconsider my approach or just let her be. 

I respond by proposing how we should approach problems differently....I get radio silence for two days. 

Im noticing a pattern when she is insists on not wanting to be with me, and when I am ready to let things go, she pulls me back in. I am having a very hard time deciding if she truly cares about me and needs help with her insecurities, or she is already seeing someone else and is just manipulating me to keep me around just in case. 

I care about this girl A LOT, but I have NEVER been in a situation like this. I am so freaking confused and honestly a little mind f*****d. Is she playing games to draw me in, or is she being malicious? Could she be that manipulative????

[d0nnivain]

Yes, she is that manipulative.  She likes knowing you are dangling at the end of her string

[ExpatInItaly]

Forget this girl, OP. 

My guess is that she is seeing someone else, but trying to distract you from that by making a lot of senseless noise about how you are the untrustworthy one. 

Yes, she is manipulative. She is immature. At worst, she is not emotionally stable. You can't a have a relationship with this girl, especially a long-distance one. You're wasting your time here. 

[S2B]

SO much drama over things that should be nothing! Do not contact her again!

she is mean. Why would you waste one more minute taking her sneaky style of abuse?

get some counseling ASAP... no one should beg a gal like that to see them again. 
 

date available gals in your area.

she was able to pretend to be all nice by phone/text. You need to be capable of establishing if a gal is kind and loving in person - not by phone.

[zeyta]

I really do not understand at all her behaviour. To me, it seems she is way over past overreacting small things to make it more difficult and this is way too confusing to be considered even a relantionship (certainly not a healthy one, at all). 

Either she has some serious problems and she has do deal with them alone, or she is playing you and you are falling for it. I mean, rarelly LDRs work well...And if someone is acting like this, after a few months only, then this will not work at all. 

Save yourself some more problems and leave this relantionship. Block her and go live your life with someone who can make you happy. 

 

[MaxxNY]

Thank you for following this wicked story and all your advice. After being up for half the night I wrote her a message telling her that all the back and forth arguments over silly things and stress is really not how I wanted this to turn out. I outlined the beginning of our relationship and went over all the great things that made us click so well. I mentioned how she could hardly wait to talk to me every day, and counted the days to seeing me in person. I told her that is where we need to be in life instead of spending our lives clashing over BS. I told her what we need if we ever expect to find our way there (Respect, conflict resolution, trust). I was very honest, open and non confrontational. 

She responded in a very pleasant way thanking me for being open and agreeing on most of the things I outlined. She stated that she is currently experiencing too much stress that is not allowing her to come back to the point where she was before we started arguing. She admitted that my honest attempts are not "reaching" her the way they should and she is not able to get rid of i the anxiety and get back to normal on her own. 

I thanked her for her honesty, told her to take care of her health and wished that she finds her inner peace. This is the point where I am actually ready to exit the stage. 

She responds again by saying this is probably most considerate thing I did/said since she got back, more so than the flowers I sent.

 

At this point I am done with my responses. The feeling I am getting is that she is being nice, hones and open to allow herself to leave and probably move on with whomever without any guilt. Your take on this is highly appreciated. Thank you again for all your insight and wisdom.

 

 

M

Edited February 18, 2020 by MaxxNY

[ExpatInItaly]

Yes, you're best to move on, OP. 

When you have to try to campaign for someone's love and attention - particularly when the relationship was as short as this one - you are barking up the wrong tree. She's already gone. 

[Purepony]

Yeah... she’s seeing someone else and she’s confused 

 

leave and give it a few months and you’ll probably hear from her 

 

[MaxxNY]

Purepony , thats what Im thinking too. The fact that when we briefly spoke about working things out, the first line out her mouth was "How do I know you are not seeing other girls already" leads me to believe she may have been looking for comfort with someone else. Furthermore, when trying to reassure her, I changed my Facebook status to being in relationship with her. She responded by saying "why now?" and never confirmed that change. leaving my status as "in relationship with someone" but making her appear as single. I will wait a day or two and change it back to being single. 

The fact that she tuned her phone off for valentine's day night, then gave me that "this is too stressful, I didnt want to talk" was probably a way for her do do whatever she wants that weekend without being questioned. In the mean time Im sitting here like an ass**le trying to figure out how to make things work. 

After our last conversation two days ago I decided to go full NC. Wishing her well, and going silent is probably the best course of action

Edited February 19, 2020 by MaxxNY

[MaxxNY]

The fact that she tuned her phone off for valentine's day night, then gave me that "this is too stressful, I didnt want to talk" was probably a way for her do do whatever she wants that weekend without being questioned. In the mean time Im sitting here like an ass**le trying to figure out how to make things work. 

 I have a feeling she will have her rebound with someone else. Either she will end up with someone that is able to "handle" her motions or it will be a rebound and she will circle back around to me

[ExpatInItaly]

It's probably not so much a rebound as a pattern of short-lived and unstable relationships, OP. 

She has been showing you some red flags for a while. It's unlikely that yours was the first relationship to light up and burn out quickly for her. My strong suspicion is that this is typical in her dating playbook, going from one fling to the next. 

You are better off without her. This didn't have the legs to last. 

[MaxxNY]

Thank you expat. I suppose what attracted me to to me was how intensely she got invested into the relationship. She looked forward to talking to me, counted the days to see me, and did everything she could to please me. One thing out of the ordinary was her enjoying being degraded behind closed doors. Other than this becoming so intense in a matter of months, what were some of the red flags I should have noticed? Thank you

[ExpatInItaly]

5 hours ago, MaxxNY said:

Other than this becoming so intense in a matter of months, what were some of the red flags I should have noticed? Thank you

Becoming so intense so quickly - especially when you've spent little time together in person - is a red flag. 

So was the irrational jealousy she displayed. 

So was the fact that she was already talking about getting a fiancee visa. 

Stay away from people who light up so quickly and appear to have ulterior motives (ie. immigration) It's not love that drives them. 

[zeyta]

5 hours ago, ExpatInItaly said:

Becoming so intense so quickly - especially when you've spent little time together in person - is a red flag. 

So was the irrational jealousy she displayed. 

So was the fact that she was already talking about getting a fiancee visa. 

Stay away from people who light up so quickly and appear to have ulterior motives (ie. immigration) It's not love that drives them. 

Controlling behaviour too

Immature, lack of trust...etc

[Daisydooks]

Run. Dont walk. 

Thank your lucky stars she lives as far away as she does and that you dodged a bullet here. 

Dont pursue this unless you want to be here in a few years writing about a  nasty and disgusting divorce. 

This woman is bad news. 

[MaxxNY]

Thank you everyone. I guess what appealed to me so much was her initial drive and commitment. Later on she would describe how close she is with her family and how much she wants to establish that bond in a relationship. As big as NYC is, it can be a really lonely place with a sea of superficial relationships. I really had high hopes for this one. 😕

[chillii]

She kinda by her standards from going on your first post , sounded quite calm and nice in this latest stuff, as l say going on her earlier stuff. The reason l mention it is because that's exactly how that ex would be when we made up. Few wks later , boom. Anyway , sorry it didn't work out op and yeah l agree with the other one , you'll probably hear from her again in a few mths.

Ps, thee camping sounds like fun, wish l could round up some people and do a bit of that myself.