This Door Can't be Left Ajar

[Lady Cathryn]

I am new here and find this forum incredibly helpful. I am telling my story in hopes others may find some helpful take-aways from my experience. I also hope others will chime in as to their opinion as to how all this went down and remind me of how stupid I was. I am only second day NC (and I blocked him on social media) but it's difficult cutting the tie with him after three and a half years. I can't go backwards though. It would remove any small shred of dignity I have left.

 

I got very hurt in this whole A. Extremely hurt. Yet it wasn't all his fault. We were equally at fault. I became a willing participant and I hate myself for that. I thought I was smarter and wiser. I never in my life fell for anyone married or in a relationship. I stayed far away from those men knowing it would lead to disaster. Until my MM came along. I fell hard and fast. We were not kids. We were both almost 60 when this whole thing started.

 

I met my MM online. We followed one another on Twitter several years ago due to common interests and common followers, and would occasionally respond to one another's tweets. He was witty, my age, very intelligent. I checked his profile and he was well-regarded professionally. No mention of a wife and children (as many married men often proudly state in their bio). No mention of wife or children in ANY of his tweets EVER (again, most men will tweet pics of wife, family and outings, or mention their family). Him, never. Not once. Interestingly enough, later on I found out that his wife follows him on twitter but he doesn’t follow her, he only follows his sons and his sister. He lives about 400 miles from me. 

 

After about a year of occasionally responding to one another's tweets he DMed me one night when he saw I was online. He said he was at his fishing "camp" (which is nicer than any house i have owned!) it was his second home which was on a lake. We started chatting back and forth about fishing and the good scotch that he was drinking and he said he wished I was there.  We said "goodnight." 

 

A few weeks later he DMed that he was going to his son's wedding not too far from where I lived. He didn't mention a wife going to this wedding with him, so naive me thinks "oh, he is single with a grown son." I said "well then, you should swing by and we can meet for lunch!" He said "I definitely would if I had more time, maybe next trip!"

 

So we continue our twitter flirtation for a few months and then one night the DMs convo got a wee bit sexual. It was mutual. Then MORE hot and heavy as days progressed. He still has not mentioned a wife. I am STILL thinking he is single because what kind of guy doesn’t mention a WIFE? I told him I was divorced for many years with a grown daughter and he finally admitted he was married …..when I ASKED him. I said "but what about your son's wedding? You didn't mention going with your wife, you said you wouldn’t mind seeing me if you had time." He said "my wife and I were probably on the out's then, as we usually are."

 

I should have RUN far and fast right then. DANGER DANGER. But I didn't. He spoke of his unhappy marriage. Separate rooms and no sex life for over a decade (I am quite certain this is true), staying in the marriage because his Dad had an affair and left his mom for the AP (my MM was in his late 20's when that happened but it affected him greatly.) He told me he had two more sons in college. The one that got married was from a previous marriage that dissolved when his own parents split up, that’s how freaked out he was over their divorce due to an affair.

He said if he and his second wife split the younger boys would be severely affected. I felt sorry for him. He seemed so lonesome in his marriage, so melancholy. I, in turn, was lonesome in my singleness after a decade of being alone with sporadic dates or short-term relationships but nothing really clicking long-term with anyone.

 

About a year into this the MM and I arranged to meet in person. It was exciting but turned out terribly sad for me. He told me he didn’t think he could leave his wife due to hurting his sons. I figured I could handle the arrangement. That I could just be his mistress. I fooled myself into believing it because I know how I am. I don’t like to share. I could NOT handle it. I wanted a real and meaningful relationship with him. To DATE him like normal people date. To be his priority. I didn't want holidays and weekends alone waiting for texts when he wasn’t busy with the family. I told him this. He replied "I can't give you what you want, need, and deserve." Did I hightail it then? Nope. Boy am I dumb.

 

We could not stay away from one another (online) though. We'd "break up" and get back together countless times. One of us would always cave in, and it was off to the heartache races again.

 

We arranged to meet again a year after the first meeting, but I bailed on the plan last minute and went on a vacation alone. To think. My feelings were out of control. I thought it best we didn't see one another. I didn't contact him, but I could not stop thinking about him. Our contact then became more sporadic….. then back to LOTS of contact, then sporadic and AGAIN we arranged to meet and AGAIN I bailed at the last minute. We didn't contact one another much at all for a couple of months. He said contacting me was hurting me… which it was. Yet I still longed for him. To feel his touch in person again. The sporadic contact made it worse. Always waiting for a message from him … always being disappointed when I didn’t get one…always a jolt of a high when I DID get one.

 

Then he contacted me this past June. He saw that I had had a date with another follower of mine. MM and I arranged to see one another first week in July. I didn’t cancel this time. It was wonderful to be with him in person again. We had gotten so close online. We made love. The morning I left we both said "I love you." Then he said "my marriage is a mess, but it's best we keep our distance. Even if you lived nearby I could not deal with the guilt (towards you AND my wife) nor the difficulty of seeing you and trying to juggle my homelife and worklife. It would be exhausting on many levels." (It would be. I understood that). He said that if we saw one another often he would inevitably have to make a choice between hurting me or hurting his sons by dissolving his marriage. He said he was terribly conflicted. He said "you are already hurting and it hurts ME to constantly know and see that. I don't love my wife and she does not love me but we are intertwined in many ways. Financially, our kids, our first grandchild, friends, work, and extended families."

 

I never wanted to be the one responsible for breaking up his family.  I wanted that decision to be his and his alone. I didn’t want that decision based on ME in any way, shape or form. Everyone would hate both me AND him from here to eternity. I wanted him free and clear because he WANTED it for himself. I didn’t want to enter into that decision making process. I wanted to date him like in a normal relationship. REALLY get to know him.... annnnnnd that wasn't gonna happen.

 

I ended up crying half the time I was in his city and all the way home. Just like the FIRST time I saw him...cried when we were together and cried all the way home. I seemed to spend our whole "relationship" crying and feeling bad about myself. Like I wasn't good enough, like I was being used, like he was being selfish, like I was being selfish. I felt insecure and needy and I am not normally like that. I felt "less than", I felt one inch tall, my self-worth was in the dumpster. He told me he truly cares about me, but he will have to care about me from afar from now on. That he's incredibly conflicted and engaging with one another isn’t helping. That hearts don't lie but he must do what he sees as the right thing for all involved (his family) not just he and I.

 

It's the hope that keeps you in. He always gave me hope. Saying he cared, saying he loved me, saying "never say never" or "my marriage is mess, my life is a mess, it is not as rosy as it appears to the outside world." I hung in for so long hoping he would see that life is too short to be  so unhappy. I told him he should try counseling with his wife to make things better between them. That maybe they could work things out. Find the intimacy again. That something has to be truly off in their 25 year marriage for him to have an affair because this was out of character for him. As it was for me. We are both very nice, very grounded, people who not only have similar baggage, but matching luggage.

I was his first affair in his whole life and I believe that. He was my first too. We both got in over our heads with each other. Two lonesome, practically senior citizens who wanted to feel loved, desired, appreciated and sexually alive. The consequences to both our hearts was devastating. I am glad no one else got hurt, but I bore the brunt of the pain. He, after all, has his home and family and that security to soften the blow.

 

I wish he had told me to go away a few months into this. I wish I myself had bailed. One of my first messages to him after this started was "you won't get hurt in this, nor your wife, but I guarantee that I will be the one left with a broken heart.” and “I am trying to have a normal relationship with someone already IN a relationship. It’s impossible." I KNEW this yet continued on. It was so hard to resist. Once the genie was out of the magic lamp the genie refused to go back in. 

 

So, sigh. I wrote him a long letter two days ago telling him I wanted a meaningful relationship with him or if not him with someone else. I didn't aspire to a half-assed, bull**** relationship. Not with him, not with anyone. I wished him the best, told him I cared, told him I loved him, told him I needed to get past this. He said he understood. He cried too. We both feel so connected to one another, we're similar souls. But as I also said to him "the only way we can ever have a real relationship is if you decide to divorce or you are a widower. I told him I can't live in that "never say never" limbo land any longer. It gives me hope. It's best we say "never EVER" and get on with our separate lives.” I said “I don't think we can be friends. We'll always have a magnetic pull. Maybe at some point down the road, but I can’t promise that.”

 

This all sounds stupid when I write it out, but I assure you there were a lot of very deep feelings involved. You CAN get VERY close to someone online. Maybe even closer and faster than IRL. All I want to do right now is send him some funny message or picture or link or have a conversation with him. Ugh. Never again will I be so foolish to get involved with someone who is spoken for. I got what I deserved. This whole A just gutted me.

I dated a few guys while this A was going on. I didn't put my life on hold. I tried to get out there in dating land. No one seemed to measure up to him. I thought only of him through every date. If he knew I was seeing someone he said he understood yet he also reined me back in too. He knew how I felt about him.

He had everything I envisioned I wanted in a man from a very young age. Depth, intelligence, humor, great career, great father. If I had known from the get-go that he was married I would have kept it platonic. I know many married, attractive men and I wouldn’t think of flirting with or enticing them. They are off-limits. But he and I established a friendship first and then it got way out of control.

I am sad but so weary of crying….. and also realistically? At my age? I often think he was the last love of my life. The dating pool is quite small. Awaiting the widowers now I guess or maybe I’ll be a cat lady.

 

 

[BaileyB]

I’m so sorry that you are hurting. I can understand how you feel lonely and this online relationship filled that void. Online relationships tend by their very nature to create a false sense of intimacy. 

Sure, there were plenty of times you could have swerved and boy, do you wish now that you would have. It never fails to amaze me how women fall for the “I can’t break up our family - even though my kids are adults, grown and out of the house” excuse. This, while the MM engage in behavior that if it is discovered, is much more hurtful to those they love than an amicable divorce would ever be...

I wish you all the best moving forward. Best wishes.

[2BGoodAgain]

sometimes falling for someone online is faster and deeper b/c you don't see the whole picture of the other person, and you interject your own feelings/thoughts and fill in the blanks.

i know it seems impossible, but it happens often. and by the time you see the other bits, b/c you've already fallen, you don't care or see the obvious.

my 12yr A had it's many break ups... sometimes, we'd not talk for a couple of years, sometimes a few months,... we'd have conversations that lasted lifetimes way into the night, where we'd forego normal healthy amounts of sleep just to hear the other person's voice.. etc..

afterwards, i question myself now on what/how i perceive what "love" is... 

we tell ourselves things like.."i've never acted this way before" or "i would always stay far away from things like this" or "i've never met anyone who affected me like this"... it may be true or it may be just yourself rationalizing that this relationship is somehow so special, it's kinda ok for it to happen... or it was just bound to happen, you had no control over it.

personally, i think it's a fallacy we tell ourselves. an out. an excuse.  but right now, none of that matters... i know.

you're hurting and your mind knows what is right, but your heart doesn't care... i had many break ups and many just giving in to my AP... and she to me..  there really is no easy way to extract or remove these feelings you have developed for him... the only thing i can tell you is that you have to keep NC and avoid anything that reminds you of him... trust me, your mind will do it on its own, even when you aren't consciously wanting to... b/c it always will bring you pain.

as for him, i know he means something very special to you, but he's pretty common... what i mean is.. his responses, his excuses not being with you.. for the kids... etc... i think we've all heard it all. in the end, no matter what excuses he gives you, it's basically, you aren't worth leaving his life at present for. it's harsh and i'm sure some may rebuke me for not being understanding, but honestly, when you truly love someone, you'll find a way to make it work... you'll become braver, you'll be willing to risk more, etc... 

i don't doubt he may care about you. that's not the issue here, but whereas you want to share his life, he doesn't with you. not when it means losing what he has.

so in the end, he doesn't love you like you love him. regardless of whether or not, what you feel or what he feels is "love"... the pain is real.

as for dating other guys, trying to get over him etc... moving on with your life... you shouldn't date anyone when you're not ready...

and also, him reining you in,... that's his selfishness... he knows he'll cause you pain, but he still brings you in... b/c his needs trumps yours every time. That's not love, honestly... he might use the excuse that b/c his love for you is to great, he can't help himself, etc... a passive aggressive way to make you feel special, etc.. but it's a lie, a deceit.... he doesn't care about your pain b/c his needs trumps yours.

True love, i think, means he puts your needs above his own needs/pain/suffering.. but he doesn't. If he truly loved you, no matter how much he may miss you, no matter how much he wants you or hurts b/c you aren't there.... he'd leave you alone, b/c he knows you hurt b/c of him... that's what love should look like... caring about YOU above himself.

protect yourself, your worth, your heart... short term gain by giving in to him = long term pain for you and a longer path to recovering from your current pain.

i wish you much luck.

 

[BaileyB]

3 minutes ago, 2BGoodAgain said:

sometimes falling for someone online is faster and deeper b/c you don't see the whole picture of the other person, and you interject your own feelings/thoughts and fill in the blanks.

Indeed. It’s really easy to create a fantasy around the person, and the relationship, that is often not reality. 

And, it’s really hard to give up the fantasy... the fantasy that he would leave his wife, and come for you, and save you from the loneliness that you feel... It’s easy to understand how you became involved. Unfortunately, reality pales in comparison to the fantasy...

[2BGoodAgain]

36 minutes ago, BaileyB said:

Indeed. It’s really easy to create a fantasy around the person, and the relationship, that is often not reality. 

And, it’s really hard to give up the fantasy... the fantasy that he would leave his wife, and come for you, and save you from the loneliness that you feel... It’s easy to understand how you became involved. Unfortunately, reality pales in comparison to the fantasy...

reality... his selfishness, his greed, his excuses.... 

online can be a great tool to see a person's soul...  but it also takes longer to see the things that would have been obvious face to face.... 

of course, if someone really wanted to, they could hide anything...face to face or online.

[Lady Cathryn]

Thank you Bailey and 2BGoodAgain for your insightful and honest replies (and kind words).

I realized the whole time that I filled a void in his marriage. I asked him many times if he and his wife talked about his unhappiness. He always said “I don’t want to talk about her” or “it’s complicated.” Or “none of my friends have happy marriages.”

When a man of 60 has spent his whole life working hard to become chairman of the board of a company he thinks long and hard about splitting up marital assets and disrupting his family and that intricately woven cloth of a long marriage. There’s a part of me that understands that. Bury yourself in work, golf, fishing, scotch, and your close men friends and suck up the rest. It’s the path of least resistance.

He swore he wasn’t using me, he said he was terribly confused. But as BaileyB said his needs trumped mine. I think sometimes wealthy men have a sense of entitlement. I am far from wealthy, I’m the passionate artist hippie chick ... his wife’s opposite in every way. 

I wasn’t ready to date others during that period in time, it was more like I felt I SHOULD. Now I have zero desire to date and I know I won’t be ready for awhile. 

I keep thinking of that saying “there’s no fool like an old fool.” For a brief moment in time we recaptured some youth I suppose, a burning desire not often felt. Maybe that’s something to be grateful for.

 

 

[Lady Cathryn]

Btw this forum has been a godsend. When I start wallowing in what-if’s I realize by reading others stories here that other people have THEIR stories and THEIR pain and this life is one long learning experience.

[Lady Cathryn]

I think this has been spoken of here. Although I do not for one minute think my MM was a psychopath ... the intermittent reinforcement came heavily into play, as affairs are the nature of that particular beast. Maybe that’s what makes you crazy in the end   http://psychopathsandlove.com/intermittent-reinforcement/

 

 

[2BGoodAgain]

1 hour ago, Lady Cathryn said:

Thank you Bailey and 2BGoodAgain for your insightful and honest replies (and kind words).

I realized the whole time that I filled a void in his marriage. I asked him many times if he and his wife talked about his unhappiness. He always said “I don’t want to talk about her” or “it’s complicated.” Or “none of my friends have happy marriages.”

When a man of 60 has spent his whole life working hard to become chairman of the board of a company he thinks long and hard about splitting up marital assets and disrupting his family and that intricately woven cloth of a long marriage. There’s a part of me that understands that. Bury yourself in work, golf, fishing, scotch, and your close men friends and suck up the rest. It’s the path of least resistance.

He swore he wasn’t using me, he said he was terribly confused. But as BaileyB said his needs trumped mine. I think sometimes wealthy men have a sense of entitlement. I am far from wealthy, I’m the passionate artist hippie chick ... his wife’s opposite in every way. 

I wasn’t ready to date others during that period in time, it was more like I felt I SHOULD. Now I have zero desire to date and I know I won’t be ready for awhile. 

I keep thinking of that saying “there’s no fool like an old fool.” For a brief moment in time we recaptured some youth I suppose, a burning desire not often felt. Maybe that’s something to be grateful for.

 

 

it's a process... hang in there... there will be ups and downs... times where you think you're in the clear... then realize you've still got a ways to go.. but just keep at it.. before you know it, you'll be cleared of it all... 

keep yourself busy, mourn the relationship, work out or do whatever hobbies keep your mind focused and clear... 

[2BGoodAgain]

1 hour ago, Lady Cathryn said:

I think this has been spoken of here. Although I do not for one minute think my MM was a psychopath ... the intermittent reinforcement came heavily into play, as affairs are the nature of that particular beast. Maybe that’s what makes you crazy in the end......

you know, i think some people do this unconsciously.....i'm sure there are people who manipulate others, etc... but some do it without realizing they are.. like passive aggressive people.. it's just natural for them to do this.

Edited February 17, 2020 by a LoveShack.org Moderator
Edit quote

[Lady Cathryn]

3 hours ago, 2BGoodAgain said:

it's a process... hang in there... there will be ups and downs... times where you think you're in the clear... then realize you've still got a ways to go.. but just keep at it.. before you know it, you'll be cleared of it all... 

keep yourself busy, mourn the relationship, work out or do whatever hobbies keep your mind focused and clear... 

That’s the plan 2BG. You’re quite correct. Right now it’s akin to pushing a boulder up a hill though 😞. I actually deactivated my twitter account today because just logging on makes me cry. I can’t go there.... at all. It’s like going to a place you and your ex would hang out. Maybe I’m weak but I feel it’s necessary to totally disconnect.

[Lady Cathryn]

1 minute ago, Lady Cathryn said:

That’s the plan 2BG. You’re quite correct. Right now it’s akin to pushing a boulder up a hill though 😞. I actually deactivated my twitter account today because just logging on makes me cry. I can’t go there.... at all. It’s like going to a place you and your ex would hang out. Maybe I’m weak but I feel it’s necessary to totally disconnect.

 

2 hours ago, 2BGoodAgain said:

you know, i think some people do this unconsciously.....i'm sure there are people who manipulate others, etc... but some do it without realizing they are.. like passive aggressive people.. it's just natural for them to do this.

I honestly think it was unconscious but it was definitely a way of managing down my expectations. I realize this now. Hence the pull me close then “flee” then pull me close (in a cyber sense).

Life is so damn clear in the rearview mirror.

 

[Lady Cathryn]

I appreciate your support Bailey and 2BG ... sometimes I think people don’t realize that 60 year olds have fragile hearts too. And they still enjoy sex and touch. Love has no age boundaries. It’s almost more poignant when you’re older as you’re well aware of time ticking by. 

[Luna66star]

The fact he didn't mention he was married until later on is a red flag.  He knew what he was doing and purposely withheld that information.  Why is a MM online to begin with? He's not happy at home & looking for a distraction.  My MM said I was the first woman he couldn't say no to and he never cheated before me.  Well he cant say no to anyone especially for favors as he said he wants people to like him.  Do you think he could say no to a woman who wants him? Not likely.  They are very good actors.  I'm not saying your MM cheated before you came along.  Think about it.  He had to lie and sneak around on the wife, keep things from her.  Just food for thought.

He doesn't love you enough to leave.  Its harsh to hear.  He has too much to lose.  As long as there are women out there to engage these men and sleep with them, the "I want my cake and be able to eat it to" policy will live on forever.  

 

 

[Miss Spider]

Wow this was so sad to me. My heart really hurts for you.  Also the way you describe him, deep, witty, intelligent... your perfect man. I can see how easy it would be to fall for him. He tricked you. I  don’t know. We all do dumb things sometimes. I hope you learned from this and move on a stronger woman. Good luck 

Edited February 18, 2020 by Cookiesandough

[Lady Cathryn]

2 hours ago, Luna66star said:

The fact he didn't mention he was married until later on is a red flag.  He knew what he was doing and purposely withheld that information.  Why is a MM online to begin with? He's not happy at home & looking for a distraction.  My MM said I was the first woman he couldn't say no to and he never cheated before me.  Well he cant say no to anyone especially for favors as he said he wants people to like him.  Do you think he could say no to a woman who wants him? Not likely.  They are very good actors.  I'm not saying your MM cheated before you came along.  Think about it.  He had to lie and sneak around on the wife, keep things from her.  Just food for thought.

He doesn't love you enough to leave.  Its harsh to hear.  He has too much to lose.  As long as there are women out there to engage these men and sleep with them, the "I want my cake and be able to eat it to" policy will live on forever.  

 

 

True Luna, he let me THINK he was single. That was quite duplicitous. He and I both hang out on a part of Twitter known as FinTwit. It’s all finance and market  and day trading people  and he’s in finance so it’s a legitimate place to be for him. But yes, he still had to hide our conversations and she probably wondered what he was doing holed up in his office/den every night for hours. When I went to see him he passed me off as a *business meeting* I am sure.

Ugh I was stupid. Disappointed in myself. I know he never cheated before, that’s just not him, I know he was wracked with guilt, but no sex for over a decade over rode that for him. I think it was a perfect storm of loneliness meets opportunity and attraction. I really thought he was heading for divorce tbh, he was clearly very unhappy. But yeah, I (we) should have kept it friends only until he was certain and free.

No he doesn’t/didn’t love me in a 25 year attachment way. He loved me as someone he wish he had met before his wife (but I guess they all say that huh?) We are complementary opposites. He once said he wasn’t even sure what love is. 

Rejection is difficult, feeling used is debasing, yes he cares yet you’re right not enough. I once said to him “you’re marriage can’t be THAT BAD or you would have left years ago.” He said “we’re great housemates, we live well together.” I suspect many marriages are like that.

thank you for taking time to reply and sharing your experience, Luna. It means a lot to me. 

[Lady Cathryn]

1 hour ago, Cookiesandough said:

Wow this was so sad to me. My heart really hurts for you.  Also the way you describe him, deep, witty, intelligent... your perfect man. I can see how easy it would be to fall for him. He tricked you. I  don’t know. We all do dumb things sometimes. I hope you learned from this and move on a stronger woman. Good luck 

Ohhh Cookies it’s hard and sad for both of us. I know he cares for me very much, it’s just that realistically he’s in his marriage until the end and I don’t think he himself actually came to that conclusion until the end of our affair.  the reality of divorce and hurting his kids and wife was too much for him to contemplate. I blame myself for not being smarter and wiser. So now I pay the price of stupidity which costs a huge chunk of my heart. 

[Lady Cathryn]

I woke up angry today. I wildly fluctuate between wishing him well (in my thoughts) to wanting to just slap him and tell his wife. I’m a mess.

The very nature of this whole thing was a form of emotional abuse. Pull me close, push me away, pull me close, manage my expectations. 

I accepted some very poor behavior for a very long time. 😕  This is what bothers me the MOST. My lack of walking away in the beginning when I was being emotionally slapped in the face.

I was at a very low point in my life when we met. I thought I met the man of my dreams. 

[Difficultstuff]

I hesitate to respond in that for me it was very different: an EA of about a year with a woman engaged and younger (I'm single), and I got away very easy in some respects. But I do relate to the thought that I could have walked away earlier, the push-me pull-you dynamic, and your ambivalent feelings towards him. I tend to wake up very roughly too these days. Many others here have obviously also been through similar, at different levels of severity. You sound very self-aware, but also very self-punitive, so I guess the point then is to work out why that is with compassion and without perpetuating it. Probably not much else I can say to ease that pain, other than that some people here really do understand and empathise. All best.

[2BGoodAgain]

16 hours ago, Lady Cathryn said:

 

I honestly think it was unconscious but it was definitely a way of managing down my expectations. I realize this now. Hence the pull me close then “flee” then pull me close (in a cyber sense).

Life is so damn clear in the rearview mirror.

 

life is pretty 20/20 once it's over.

when i read your link, i realized my last "trip" with my AP.... THAT was what was happening...exactly... but i knew she wasn't doing it consciously.... she was just doing it unconsciously. She'd be nice one moment, then suddenly unreasonably argumentative and picking fights on anything i'd say.. then i realized, something internal was going on with her... a conflict between enjoying her time with me and at the same time rejecting it b/c it may not have been what she thought she wanted or didn't want to admit she wanted? who knows... i don't think she knew why she was so angry with me. and me, constantly apologizing b/c all i wanted was a last harrah with her, to leave good memories, etc.. and end it, but i realize perhaps not. Consciously i was ending it, but unconsciously, i didn't realize how much i enjoyed being with her... even with her dramatics. 

how it got all flipped around with me being the one who was trying to keep it going or making it last... is beyond me. But honestly, i deserved it. It must have been hell for her the last 12 years of always breaking it off with me, b/c i wouldn't accept her and dealing with it alone.

at any rate, thank you for that link, it helped explain a lot of my own reactions and what was going on... i couldn't quite put my finger on it, before... i hate not knowing.

 

[2BGoodAgain]

13 hours ago, Lady Cathryn said:

Ohhh Cookies it’s hard and sad for both of us. I know he cares for me very much, it’s just that realistically he’s in his marriage until the end and I don’t think he himself actually came to that conclusion until the end of our affair.  the reality of divorce and hurting his kids and wife was too much for him to contemplate. I blame myself for not being smarter and wiser. So now I pay the price of stupidity which costs a huge chunk of my heart. 

that's what it means when some say affairs are fantasy. it isn't trying to diminish what you're feeling.. the pain is real, but the love aspect of it... it can be confusing for everyone.. and the less self-aware you are... the more you think you're really in love with them... on both sides... but once you peel away the fantasy, you start seeing why the other person is so .... attractive, drawing... it's like a dream... you know that GREAT dream where you don't want to wake up from? Where you FEEL so ... drawn to it... it's so attractive... well, that's what affairs feels like...

it's a dream b/c it's a fantasy... it calls out to the core of your inner being... and we confuse that for "the love of your life" type of deal.. though that's just both a rationalization for the affair or justification for being in a relationship you normally wouldn't be in... and also to make it special... but many times, we're drawn to how that person makes you feel and not the actual person.

anyway, i realize now, that when i thought my A with my AP was that once in a life time love... it was really, she appeared to meet a lot of the criterias of what i thought i needed long term, but it may have really been more short term needs that were being met for the negative realities of my relationship or situation of my life at the time.

B/c it wasn't just sex or sexual tension, though that was there... there was a connecting, having fun, conversations for days... literally.. but in the end, when you put reality together... all of it... it just wasn't going to work.

[Lady Cathryn]

1 hour ago, 2BGoodAgain said:

B/c it wasn't just sex or sexual tension, though that was there... there was a connecting, having fun, conversations for days... literally.. but in the end, when you put reality together... all of it... it just wasn't going to work.

Exactly so. And with me, I think deep down inside I knew that but I kept investing. 

[Lady Cathryn]

1 hour ago, 2BGoodAgain said:

life is pretty 20/20 once it's over.

when i read your link, i realized my last "trip" with my AP.... THAT was what was happening...exactly... but i knew she wasn't doing it consciously.... she was just doing it unconsciously. She'd be nice one moment, then suddenly unreasonably argumentative and picking fights on anything i'd say.. then i realized, something internal was going on with her... a conflict between enjoying her time with me and at the same time rejecting it b/c it may not have been what she thought she wanted or didn't want to admit she wanted? who knows... i don't think she knew why she was so angry with me. and me, constantly apologizing b/c all i wanted was a last harrah with her, to leave good memories, etc.. and end it, but i realize perhaps not. Consciously i was ending it, but unconsciously, i didn't realize how much i enjoyed being with her... even with her dramatics. 

how it got all flipped around with me being the one who was trying to keep it going or making it last... is beyond me. But honestly, i deserved it. It must have been hell for her the last 12 years of always breaking it off with me, b/c i wouldn't accept her and dealing with it alone.

at any rate, thank you for that link, it helped explain a lot of my own reactions and what was going on... i couldn't quite put my finger on it, before... i hate not knowing.

 

My AP too. The last time we were together was awful. He made a point to be busy with his phone because of messages from his son. Basically he ignored me. I knew right then it was the end. He was entirely disconnecting but not honest enough to look me in the eye and be truthful. Truth hurts but lies hurt so much more. 

[Lady Cathryn]

3 hours ago, Difficultstuff said:

I hesitate to respond in that for me it was very different: an EA of about a year with a woman engaged and younger (I'm single), and I got away very easy in some respects. But I do relate to the thought that I could have walked away earlier, the push-me pull-you dynamic, and your ambivalent feelings towards him. I tend to wake up very roughly too these days. Many others here have obviously also been through similar, at different levels of severity. You sound very self-aware, but also very self-punitive, so I guess the point then is to work out why that is with compassion and without perpetuating it. Probably not much else I can say to ease that pain, other than that some people here really do understand and empathise. All best.

Self-punitive absolutely. Well said.

Also known as “beating myself up” which my Dad used to tell me that I am so good at. 
 

People here truly do understand. I’m glad you got away (relatively) unscathed but the waking up rough ... you’re still processing it all I think.

 

 

[2BGoodAgain]

59 minutes ago, Lady Cathryn said:

My AP too. The last time we were together was awful. He made a point to be busy with his phone because of messages from his son. Basically he ignored me. I knew right then it was the end. He was entirely disconnecting but not honest enough to look me in the eye and be truthful. Truth hurts but lies hurt so much more. 

lies hurt b/c you expected more from him. As I did from her, but in the end, she omitted certain things... omission of facts is the same thing as a lie, when you're with a person you supposedly "care" about, etc.