are my 'ghosted' detector and reaction reasonable

[Happy Lemming]

@nospam99

Any updates?? Have you heard from her??

[nospam99]

@HL. Nope. She had said she'd be home on Thursday so I sent her an OKC message yesterday. IMO there's 'still time' for her to respond. If she ends up being yet another 'big one that got away', it won't be the first time. OLD remains 'the Wild West'. Monthly dance party tonight :D

Ooops. This is the 'job interview' lady, not the ghost lady.

Edited February 22, 2020 by nospam99

[Happy Lemming]

Hang in there!!

Fingers crossed for the "job interview" lady...  (this the one where you said you were unemployed, at the moment) Right??

Enjoy the dance party!! Go "cut a rug" and have some fun!!

[CautiouslyOptimistic]

If ballroom dancing isn't something she regularly does, I would not suggest this as a first date.  I would not want to have such close physical contact with a complete stranger on a first date.  But, I'd be open to trying ballroom dancing somewhere down the line.  Just my opinion.  

[nospam99]

@CO. [sigh] Either I'm not providing enough information clearly or folks are not paying attention. I did not ask the 'ghost lady' to go dancing. Dancing only started as a question I threw into my first OLD message to her as an 'icebreaker'. My intention was to see if I could expand on our set of common interests with an activity that is fun for couples. She actually responded that dancing was something that she'd like to do. My next 'goal', had I not been ghosted, would have been to set up a first face-to-face meeting that would NOT have included any plans to go dancing. I didn't get the opportunity to arrange that meeting because the OLD message exchange did not continue.

[elaine567]

Older people tend to be set in their ways.
They have usually over the years sorted out their own interests
You decided to bring up an interest, ballroom dancing that you have but it was not an interest she had, it was not on her profile.
Instead of dropping it with it being a dead end, you tried to lock her down into discussing more about YOUR interest. 
She I guess has no interest in ballroom dancing so she gave up.
As you keep mentioning dancing, then are you getting a bit obsessed?
 

On 2/21/2020 at 4:35 PM, nospam99 said:

 I know where she lives and I know a great Italian restaurant nearby which is also near a very good dance studio.

1 hour ago, nospam99 said:

Monthly dance party tonight

[CautiouslyOptimistic]

1 hour ago, nospam99 said:

@CO. [sigh] Either I'm not providing enough information clearly or folks are not paying attention. I did not ask the 'ghost lady' to go dancing. Dancing only started as a question I threw into my first OLD message to her as an 'icebreaker'. My intention was to see if I could expand on our set of common interests with an activity that is fun for couples. She actually responded that dancing was something that she'd like to do. My next 'goal', had I not been ghosted, would have been to set up a first face-to-face meeting that would NOT have included any plans to go dancing. I didn't get the opportunity to arrange that meeting because the OLD message exchange did not continue.

OK, I guess I misunderstood.  Did you ask her if dancing was still "in play?"  If so, do you think she interpreted this as your request to go dancing on a first date?

[preraph]

Seems like the best place to meet one would be at the dance party itself.  An old friend of mine went to one of those about 20 years ago stag.  As usual, he was focused on "his type" (too young and good looking for him) and not paying attention to others.  A woman asked him to dance and he was halfway pissed off because it was interrupting his obsessing over the one who was "his type."  But turns out he wasn't dealing with any garden variety wallflower, and she was very outgoing and extroverted and managed to wake him out of his obsessive stupor.  She wasn't his type, but she has two tremendous assets, plus a very outgoing sense of humor, so she pulled him right out of his OCD shell and married his ass, and they are still married today.  He went from terminally single at 40 to instant family.  I didn't think he could sustain that, but their connection was strong enough to motivate him, I guess.  

[nospam99]

@elaine.

I really don't like to publicly share the content of messages I receive on OLD. I'll make an exception in this case to explain why I thought it was appropriate to continue to discuss dancing with 'ghost lady'. Her first message to me included ...

''I would love to take lessons in ballroom dancing. I love to dance''

I interpreted that statement BY HER as a reason for me to think it appropriate to mention dancing in messages to her and to consider a dance lesson in a FUTURE date subsequent to meeting.

My mention of the dance party tonight was part of a response to Happy Lemming's question which I took to be generically checking up on my dating adventures. Since he and I (and others) have discussed my need to broaden my romantic search beyond OLD, I thought mentioning the dance party, a 'real life' social activity, was a valid part of my answer. My other major activities for socializing include skiing and hiking. I've been criticized on LS about skiing because people seem to think it's 'too active' for women in my dating pool. Hiking events are available now.But I'm enough of a 'fair weather hiker' that I prefer to restrict my hiking to the less slippery and relatively mud-free months between May and October.

Am I obsessed with dancing? I plead 'not guilty'. While it's fun on its own, I also see it as my best 'meet women socially in real life' option at this time of year. It also has the advantage of being an 'all-year' activity.

Do you still feel like questioning whether my interest in dancing is obsessive? Or were you just being critical for its own sake?

[preraph]

Since dancing lessons were what she discussed, and she hasn't had any yet, then maybe she doesn't know how to dance at all yet and so didn't want to go to a dance.  

[nospam99]

@preraph. I did not ask 'ghost lady' to go to a dance. The dance party I'm planning to go to tonight stag is just an event for ME to get out.

@HL. I'll answer here because you asked here and my PRC topic about her has long since been resolved and the topic turned into a (pretty interesting) discussion of the economics of senior relationships. 'Job interview lady' has sent me a message. I'll respond (of course) and see if she's 'up' for a real life meeting.

[Happy Lemming]

17 minutes ago, nospam99 said:

My mention of the dance party tonight was part of a response to Happy Lemming's question which I took to be generically checking up on my dating adventures. Since he and I (and others) have discussed my need to broaden my romantic search beyond OLD, I thought mentioning the dance party, a 'real life' social activity, was a valid part of my answer.

I think this is great that you are going out to this Dance Party!! I'm a proponent of meeting people in "Real Life"!!

I really enjoy swimming and that is how I met my long-term girlfriend.  She likes it, as well.

And yes, thanks for answering my inquiry about "Job Interview Lady" (as we have nick-named her), best of luck and hoping she agrees to a "real life" meeting.  Have some suggestions ready!!

[Cookiesandough]

On 2/21/2020 at 11:26 AM, SumGuy said:

Not really, it's more filtering.   I don't ask out women I'm not feeling that potential for conversational connection via messaging.

It certainly doesn't mean that 100% progress to a second date.

 

I'm definitively meeting women from per-internet.  Almost all 50+.   It actually helps as it is common back and forth that we are old school and the best way is to just meet in person.  Cut to the chase so to speak.  Messaging is really just a simple filter (maybe more for her to make sure my messages are not just crude propositions) and for me to ask a few ice breaker questions/topics for in person conversation.

You would be surprised by how many people do not possess that ability 

[Ellener]

On 2/21/2020 at 9:51 AM, SumGuy said:

I think ballroom dancing or even dinner is a lot for a first meet.

me too. 

As for 'ghosted', why does everything have to be 'a thing'?

I forgot to turn off my match.com so was still getting messages, but a. I'm seeing someone, early days so not exclusive, but I don't have time to see more than one person b. I'm in the middle of moving house and super busy.

I do politely say 'no thanks' and wish people luck with their search because that's just....English. And I've now switched off the match so people can't see my profile. But there really is no issue one way or another with the guys who just wrote to me- I'm simply not available or engaged in any way with them.

[nospam99]

Back on topic for an active scenario, Job Interview Lady (not the same woman as my OP was about) OLD messaged (I'm being specific about communication mode because I think it is an independent variable) me yesterday afternoon. I replied within the hour. Both messages were 'typically chatty' i.e. were mostly friendly small talk. MY message ended with ''I'd like to meet you.'' and a direct question about arranging a meeting. It's been less than a day, so I don't think I've been ghosted YET. If she does not respond, how long is the wait before I assume she's ghosting me? Given that today is a non-work day and tomorrow is the beginning of the work week, my thought is that if I don't have a message in my 'inbox' by this time tomorrow, I'm ghosted.

[Happy Lemming]

Wasn't the "job interview lady" traveling until Thursday?? Or am I confused??  If someone is traveling there is no guarantee that they are getting signal.  I ran into that problem the last time I traveled, but I have a really crappy cell-phone.

If that individual is traveling, I'd give them 24 hours after they return home to acknowledge your communication. 

If this woman is not traveling and I'm confused, I'd expect a return communication within 24 hours (especially if you inquired about meeting)  Personally, I think I'd include some suggestions or inquiry about what food they enjoy (but that is just me).

Fingers crossed for you!!

By the way, did you have fun at your "Dance"??

[nospam99]

@HL. Job interview lady was traveling until Thursday the 20th (time flies when you're having fun). And she did get back to me earlier today. We're still communicating and (now) 'moving along'.

@HL but off topic for my ghosting questions ...
I did have fun at the dance. But that was just the dancing. None of the ladies (a couple of them pretty hot) acted 'interested'. It's worth mentioning for people who don't ballroom dance (I assume including HL) that it's a VERY social activity. People are super polite, respectful, and friendly. I'm losing count, but I think I'm up to my fourth monthly ballroom event in a row, plus about three swing dance events. I've posted about these events before in 'meeting in real life' topics. The 'crowd' is mostly older than me, though last night, for the first time, three 'much younger' couples, apparently 20-somethings, did show up. They seemed to be dance newbies, friends of each other, and each of these young couples pretty much danced with each other. The other circumstance that mitigated against me easily using the event to try to meet one of the women is that there were, as usual, a few more men there than women. Even one of the women remarked that it was quite the reverse of what any of us would have remembered from high school dances (50 years ago in caves :p ). The net affect of the ratio was that opportunities to approach a 'wallflower' were almost non-existent because all the women were dancing almost all the time. As usual, plenty of apparent 80-somethings of both genders and I danced about 25% with the 'older' women.

[nospam99]

Like a lot of ISO topics, this one has veered off to specific questions and criticism of ''the OP's'' (MINE in this case) tactics.

But I would appreciate additional posts with opinions about generally applicable (to all 'searchers') questions like ...
- how long it takes before it's wise to conclude you've been ghosted
- how to react (move on?)
- what to do if you want to try to 'recover' the contact

[Happy Lemming]

38 minutes ago, nospam99 said:

(1) - how long it takes before it's wise to conclude you've been ghosted
(2) - how to react (move on?)
(3) - what to do if you want to try to 'recover' the contact

(1) I don't know how to define "ghosting", but we are both older mature men, who learned common courtesy a long time ago. If a person can't get back to me in a timely manner (24 hours), then I don't want to date them.  It takes just a few seconds to e-mail, message or text back, especially with today's modern cell phones and computers.  Years ago we were at the mercy of those answering machines with the two cassette tapes in them and we still managed to communicate in a timely manner.  There are expectations I require from someone I'm going to date.  If I'm going to plan the date, make reservations or get tickets and pay for the date, the least she can do is return my communication in a timely manner.

(2) I move on when I haven't heard back from someone in 24-48 hours.  I was dating this one woman for a few months, left a message for her asking to confirm our weekend plans.  I didn't hear back from her, so I did my own thing that weekend.  I did hear back from her about a week and a half/2 weeks later, she said she was mad at me and didn't want to see me at that time, but was free this upcoming weekend.  I told her she had already been replaced, which was true.

(3) I don't "recover" the contact.  I refuse to be put on the "back burner and left to simmer".  I do understand that she may not be able to see me one particular day or weekend, and I will suggest another date/time.  If I don't hear back after two voicemail messages left two days apart, then I'm done and don't want to "recover" the contact.  Again, common courtesy at play here, if she is incapable of that, then she is not for me.  This woman can be a "Christina Hendricks" look-a-like, but if she isn't going to meet me half way and return my call, I don't want her.

[Cookiesandough]

I’d say 24-48 hrs is a good rule. If they haven’t answered by then, you can conclude your message was ignored. Shouldn’t bother with people who ignore your messages.  Talk to others. 

[SumGuy]

2 hours ago, nospam99 said:

(1) - how long it takes before it's wise to conclude you've been ghosted
(2) - how to react (move on?)
(3) - what to do if you want to try to 'recover' the contact

All of it depends upon context...it's different if you have a specific place and time planned, have dated or have never met.   Also how the conversation was left.  It does matter how you phrase things.

I'll break it down into types of initial interactions

(a) the "hi" message.  Not really that short but your initial reaching out to them with words.

(b) You said hi and heard back and have sent another conversational message

(c) you asked to meet, and by this I mean directly and not in a passive manner.   Pick your own segue then just ask "Would you like to meet for a drink next week?"

(d) she said yes, now you directly provide a place and time:  "How does the Cantina there in Anytown sound next Wednesday at 7pm?"  or "How does next Wednesday at 7pm sound?  Thinking the Cantina or the Pub, leaning towards the Cantina?  I'm not very familiar with Anytown so open to suggestions."

(1) on (a) or (b) is doesn't even matter, there is nothing to "ghost"  I just let them get back to me whenever.  On (c) I keep an evening or two open but after 3 days or so will generally figure not going to hear so may not keep an evening open if get busy.  On (d) I keep the time I proposed open not matter what.

(2) Kind of answered this in (1)

(3) Not sure what recover means.  I don't hound or chase people but have no problem reaching out to see what is up or to close things off.  If at (a) or (b) just leave it unless (b) was going real good.   I don't get all hurt or pissed off so it's more a matter of hope all is OK, hadn't heard back, realize things happen or you may have met someone you want to give it a chance with.  In any case, no hard feelings, I wish you luck but if it doesn't work out feel free to look me up.  Then leave it at that.

 

The thing is I don't stop searching before I meet someone at all.   So if they do or don't get back to me it doesn't change my plans much at all.

Edited February 24, 2020 by SumGuy

[chillii]

Personally op , it's been a few posts now l think it's time you explain the dancing thing again for the 10th time , sorry man couldn't resist, don't worry it was quite obvious the first time you mentioned it it was only in a convo sense.

l remember back when there was someone in mine and tbh , we were so alike and so just looking for each other so to speak , l was a pretty dumbfounded when all she sent back was one word replies , then another , then nothing. On mine they went into you contact only after answering your email , but then you'd see when they were last on or if they were online now, and if they'd opened your last email or she'd looked at your page again.

So if no reply after a few days but you knew she'd been on or read your message but nothing welllll, obviously it was a no go.  Me l'd let those hover for a few more days , maybe this or that who knows but if nothing by then l'd write it off and delete her.  This one after a few days of nothing l sent her one more just saying what a shame.  

l know , but who care, it was a shame. l left her in my contacts another wk or so ,just encase, still nothing , deleted her. But others if we'd talked and it was just flat, l delete those in a few days later. Not to give them a second chance but you get a thing saying someone deleted you sooooo, l'd kinda be gentle about it.

 

 

 

Edited February 24, 2020 by chillii

[clia]

On 2/22/2020 at 12:24 PM, nospam99 said:

@CO. [sigh] Either I'm not providing enough information clearly or folks are not paying attention. I did not ask the 'ghost lady' to go dancing. Dancing only started as a question I threw into my first OLD message to her as an 'icebreaker'. My intention was to see if I could expand on our set of common interests with an activity that is fun for couples. She actually responded that dancing was something that she'd like to do. My next 'goal', had I not been ghosted, would have been to set up a first face-to-face meeting that would NOT have included any plans to go dancing. I didn't get the opportunity to arrange that meeting because the OLD message exchange did not continue.

I feel like you are telling us what happened in dribs and drabs, which makes it really difficult to give you any advice.  You said above that after the initial question about ballroom dancing, you later said this:

Quote

you and I had 'sort of started' to 'talk' about ballroom dancing. Is that still 'in play'?

She had indicated a POTENTIAL interest in dancing but had not committed. We had not reached the point of speaking on the phone or planning a face-to-face meeting. Still too 'passive' on my part?

I know you didn't technically ASK her to go dancing, but when you followed up with another question about dancing, she definitely may have perceived that you were heading that way.  I know I would've perceived that you were gearing up to ask me to go dancing.  I think that's the point some people in this thread were trying to make about why she might've ghosted you.  

As for your other questions:

Quote

(1) - how long it takes before it's wise to conclude you've been ghosted
(2) - how to react (move on?)
(3) - what to do if you want to try to 'recover' the contact

 If you ask a direct question asking her out and don't get a response within 48 hours, you should consider yourself ghosted and just move on.  Someone who is truly interested doesn't forget to respond.  If you are just chit chatting, it becomes a little more murky, but I think the same 48 hours pretty much goes if you were the last to communicate.      

[nospam99]

@clia. I am indeed providing information about my communication with a woman, who is only as example of ghosting, in dribs and drabs. The details of my communication with her are private, not only to me, but more so to her. I've tried to make it clear that the advice I'm looking for is NOT how to deal with the example woman, but how to GENERALLY recognize and react to ghosting.

[thefooloftheyear]

I dunno...

In the simplest of terms, if someone is interested in you, they are anxiously waiting/expecting contact....They aren't going to give milquetoast half assed boilerplate responses and they wont wait a long time to return contact...That's pretty much been my experience...And that doesn't even just apply to dating, its even true of others we keep close or generally want to hear from..

Now....having said this, I do know that there are "games" that get played...People will deliberately not immediately respond as to not seem desperate or to show that they aren't hanging on every word of the other person...I dunno...Id expect that at an advanced age, these little head games aren't as common, but I cant say for sure...

At the end of the day, if someone is doing all the lifting and the only contact from the other party is sporadic and not timely, also lacking in substance or flirting, etc.....Then id say its a dead deal...Im not exactly sure that the contact mentioned in the thread is true "ghosting" in the basic sense of the word, but to me, it would indicate very low interest or only interest to not be rude by not contacting at all...

.02

TFY