Question: When/How to Tell Dates I Will Never Kiss Them?

[RecentChange]

For me absolute 100% deal breaker. Kissing is the first step in sexual intimacy and required in relationships for me.

I would want to know this information before considering a date with someone, because I would cancel as to not waste either of our time. 

[stillafool]

Yes it will be a deal breaker for some guys so tell them before you go out that you don't kiss.  Some men won't mind as they just kiss to please the woman because most women like and need to be kissed.  There are men who could care less about kissing and want to get straight to sex.  Are you down for sex? 

[RecentChange]

1 minute ago, stillafool said:

 There are men who could care less about kissing and want to get straight to sex.  Are you down for sex? 

Would you say this is true of a man looking for a long term relationship? That even long term - kissing doesn't matter?

The men I have been with seemed to really enjoy kissing (and it was obviously a big turn on).

The only partner I had who didn't kiss as much - was my long term FWB. Lots of kissing in the beginning, but as time wore on, he kinda withdrew from kissing, as he was struggling with keeping his emotions at bay. In my experience, even for men, kissing can be more intimate and emotional. 

Without so much kissing, it was easier to draw the "this is only sex" line in the sand. 

 

 

[Daisydooks]

I would share this on a dating profile so you weed out men who are not ok with this. It would save time, money and energy for all parties involved if you share it before ever setting up a date.

Yes this will be an issue for most, but sharing this early on will prevent more upset than sharing after you have met. 

How old are you? I feel you must be young if you're asking these 2 questions specifically. They both suggest you have very little real world/hands on experience and are asking more adultier adults for advice who maybe have more experience dating. Has this been a problem for you so far in life? What have you been faced with from men?

Is it JUST kissing you are not ok with? Hugging, touching, cuddling all ok? Sex? Kissing, but not on the mouth? I hope we can help in some way.  

[stillafool]

1 hour ago, RecentChange said:

Would you say this is true of a man looking for a long term relationship? That even long term - kissing doesn't matter?

Well I have had women complain to me that their partner doesn't want to kiss them anymore but go straight to sex which infuriates them.  So I'm sure they are out there.  I don't know if OP is looking for a long term partner or just a FWB.

[RecentChange]

Just now, stillafool said:

Well I have had women complain to me that their partner doesn't want to kiss them anymore but go straight to sex which infuriates them.  So I'm sure they are out there.  I don't know if OP is looking for a long term partner or just a FWB.

I would think if no strings attached sex is what the OP is offering, she would have no problem finding men who would agree to easy sex on exchange for no kissing.

But that isn't the jist I am getting at all.

[Kitty Tantrum]

I mean, if it's ONLY that sort of kissing that's off the table, it might not be such a huge impediment.

I have a hard time wrapping my head around the idea that you'd be so put off by kissing, but still up for sexual intercourse and all the other various intimacies associated with human life partnerships.

Whatever reason or principle prevents you from wanting to kiss... does that really not extend to any other messy bodily exchanges? Or is there going to be more than just kissing that you end up not wanting to do?

[Saba the Spotted One]

Hey guys! Thanks for all the replies! I expected a lot, and there are too many to answer them each individually, but thank you all for responding. I will try to answer the broad themes that I see emerging. Of course, I’d love to see your replies if any of this helped you out:

Explanation (in thread): I know, I know. Everyone is dying to know why I take this position. But for several reasons, I think it is irrelevant to the answers I am seeking from this thread, and also that it is best I don’t attempt that here. For one thing, it is part of a much larger worldview that I have, and explaining all that here would take an essay, would derail this thread, and is not necessary for people to answer the two questions I asked. In short, I think it best to leave the explainer at that, but I do want to correct a few people who clearly didn’t read my opening post:

To the person(s) who suggested therapy: as I said, it is not an emotional hangup. I have strongly held personal convictions. They are unusual and not kissing is of course very uncommon in the cultures from which I expect to draw my dates, but in fact, not kissing romantically (as another poster pointed out)* is NOT uncommon more broadly: in fact, the majority of world cultures don’t do romantic kissing. I don’t need therapy for this. The same person suggested a physical reason. I was very clear in the initial post, and this is not the reason.

I don’t blame people for not understanding my position, because I have not explained it, or not knowing my broader situation, because I have not detailed it. That is all fair. But I do hope you will read what I did say and not continue to suggest it is something (physical problem, emotional hangup, etc.) that I explicitly said it was not.

*Here is a link to a story about the study in question, if you are interested: https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-3161388/The-countries-don-t-kiss-Study-reveals-half-world-DOESN-T-smooch-disgusting.html

Explanation (to partner): absolutely I would explain to any partner why and what my reasons were. That seems as obvious to me as it does to you. I just don’t think it’s the best thing to attempt that in this thread, and I hope you will be understanding.

Am I Asexual? – Short and immediate answer: No. Not at all. I find it fascinating that so many people seem to have jumped to this conclusion. I know that my position is very unique in the culture I’m in but I was surprised to see people jumping to this conclusion. But, one of the reasons I fielded this question here was to ferret out the type of responses I might get on average and this is interesting to me.

Other “No”s?: -- Short answer: this is only one of two “no goes” I have with regard to culturally assumed “intimate” activities. The other is, from what I can tell, significantly more minor of an issue. I am fine with basically everything else, e.g. cuddling, and of course sex (as I said, I am not asexual). Oral sex, while not something I dream about, is not a no go, and something I’d be willing to do for a partner. Also, as to other types of kissing: yes, it is mostly just this type of kissing that is at issue here. Kissing on the neck, etc. is fine.

And while I don’t expect people to get it, for the record, NO this has nothing to do with any idea that bodily fluids are gross.

Again, it was interesting to me just how much people do connect romantic, mouth-to-mouth kissing to intimacy. To me it is no such thing. Again, I don’t expect you to understand where I am coming from without me explaining, and I do understand that me not explaining here will lead to people making assumptions that are way off base. I accept that. Its my choice, by choosing to drop something that most people have never come across before without a lengthy “this is why I think this way” intro. But as I said, on balance, I still think it most appropriate I leave the explainer where its at. In any case, you guys sound as foreign to me as I know I sound to you (I know you will not understand this either: story of my life).

Am I looking for hookups? –No! I am looking for a monogamous, long-term relationship, and I’ve got a bit of what some would call morals: I am not looking to be intimate until after marriage.

Again, I think this relates to people equating kissing so much with intimacy, that they can’t imagine a person who cares a great deal about intimacy but doesn’t see kissing as an expression of that. I know you have almost certainly never met someone with my worldview before, and so will not understand why I see it this way. I hope that you will simply accept that I do, because that is the truth.

Thank you again for all the replies. I look forward to any further replies.

[SumGuy]

Hey to each their own but the Daily News article, take it with a grain of salt.    This jumped out at me:

"For instance, data suggests 15 cultures our of 33 studied in North America where kissing is not present."   

Really?  What in the world are those 15?  How are they dividing cultures?   I understand in native arctic peoples romantic kissing is not a thing, are they dividing that up into multiple cultures?

I'd be much more interested in percentage of population as I in no way believe 15/33 rds (or almost 50%) of people in North America refrain from romantic kissing.

I generally think kissing is common because it feels so good when you got good dental hygiene. 

[Saba the Spotted One]

10 minutes ago, SumGuy said:

Hey to each their own but the Daily News article, take it with a grain of salt.    This jumped out at me:

"For instance, data suggests 15 cultures our of 33 studied in North America where kissing is not present."   

Really?  What in the world are those 15?  How are they dividing cultures?   I understand in native arctic peoples romantic kissing is not a thing, are they dividing that up into multiple cultures?

I'd be much more interested in percentage of population as I in no way believe 15/33 rds (or almost 50%) of people in North America refrain from romantic kissing.

I generally think kissing is common because it feels so good when you got good dental hygiene. 

Hey, this could derail the thread, but I'm a data person so I'll bite: I agree this sounds strange. I am from North America and also struggle to imagine 15 separate cultures within NA at all (much less 33). Not sure what they are talking about exactly here. Haven't read the original study yet. Should do. And certainly, 50% of people in NA don't refrain from romantic kissing (I wish). My point though, was that romantic kissing is not a universal, which isn't affected by the legitimate and interesting question of how they defined a culture for the study. Thanks for the reply. 

Edited February 28, 2020 by Saba the Spotted One

[SumGuy]

I'm the first one to agree that it is not universal, and purely cultural.  Nothing right or wrong in it either way.  

 

[SumGuy]

My simple take, is that kissing is a pretty key part of sex for me, but can see it not being necessary for deep intimacy.   Heck I sometimes feel the most emotionally intimate and at ease with my girlfriend when we are sitting side by side cozy and reading.  

Nevertheless, it would probably be a deal breaker for me.

[chillii]

lt would actually be fine with me. l much more enjoy kissing her face and body than lips as such

[littleblackheart]

 1. Have you had intimate partners before, and did they care? If you have, you already know that your own dealbreaker is not a dealbreaker for everyone so you're fine.

 

2. Have you actually ever kissed someone, or is it strictly a belief?

 

3. Could you hold off on this belief for someone you truly, deeply cared about if they asked you to?

Depending on your answer to question 3, I personally would have a problem with it regardless of the rationale behind it, more because it's a dogma and I'd wonder about what other 'dogmas' you have.

 

My personal 'non negociatables' are character or personality-based (bigotry, racism, religious fanatism, egocentrism, overly judgemental, lack of empathy, criminality, abuse, violence of any kind, anger management issues, all round shadiness, having irrational fears or too strongly-held beliefs, whatever they are). 

 

 

Edited February 28, 2020 by littleblackheart

[basil67]

I think that saving intimacy till marriage would be an even bigger dealbreaker than not kissing.   If I was looking for partner, then we're now talking about a double dealbreaker.

[elaine567]

I think asap and make sure that they realise it is a hard and fast rule and that you are NEVER going to be up for changing your mind
Many people enter relationships thinking that such "rules" are just there to be broken, IF the right person comes along ie them... 
Make it crystal clear and that will save a lot of hassle later on

[Fletch Lives]

Unless you find an international group online of people who don't like to kiss, or are a super model, in this country you will have a very hard time finding a relationship.

[preraph]

You definitely need therapy. And your daily mail study is bunk. I live in the US and we have people from all over the world and they all kiss.

[CautiouslyOptimistic]

15 hours ago, Saba the Spotted One said:

 

To the person(s) who suggested therapy: as I said, it is not an emotional hangup. I have strongly held personal convictions.

Fascinating.  So it's not a matter of not LIKING it, it's a matter of conviction for reasons we probably just won't understand.  Correct?

You sound like an intelligent and nice person and I believe there's a lid for most pots, so who knows?  You might find exactly what your'e looking for.  You may need to expand your cultural/ethnic filters to do so.  

[Saba the Spotted One]

 

8 hours ago, basil67 said:

I think that saving intimacy till marriage would be an even bigger dealbreaker than not kissing.   If I was looking for partner, then we're now talking about a double dealbreaker.

This was bad wording on my part. Any confusion is my fault. I should have said sex, rather than intimacy, as I do not have a problem with say, cuddling, pre-marriage. I know for a fact that there are plenty of people out there who respect a "no sex till marriage" principle, so I don't expect a real problem with this. Its just about compatibility of principles.

5 hours ago, preraph said:

You definitely need therapy. And your daily mail study is bunk. I live in the US and we have people from all over the world and they all kiss.

Your persistence that everyone with any unconventional (for your culture) beliefs or positions is somehow in need of therapy to change them is an unfortunate position to take, but since there are plenty of conventional people for you to be around I suppose you will not find it too problematic in your life. And, unless you have met and discussed this issue with someone from every small culture around the world, you certainly cannot say they do not exist. In any case, have a good day.

5 hours ago, CautiouslyOptimistic said:

Fascinating.  So it's not a matter of not LIKING it, it's a matter of conviction for reasons we probably just won't understand.  Correct?

You sound like an intelligent and nice person and I believe there's a lid for most pots, so who knows?  You might find exactly what your'e looking for.  

Thank you. I am sure that there are people out there to be found, but I wanted to see the responses and how open people within my potential pool might be. I also wanted to get a rough gage on how open the average person might be. As to my reasons: You are correct. I said this in my initial post but I guess a lot of people overlooked it? Anyway, yes. Thanks for the reply.

[chillii]

l'd say being female will help it out a bit bc l've know a few other guys that aren't really into kissing either. l remember one even complaining to me she's always trying to pash me drives me nuts. No need even mentioning it to anyone in general though it;s your thing and no one else's business but if you meet someone your interested in though and it's looking both ways then yeah it would pay to let him know about then because he might be one that is.

Edited February 28, 2020 by chillii

[Saba the Spotted One]

What I am getting in general here, seems to be about what I expected: Almost everyone does it, but there are different views about it: 

There is a group of people for whom its really important, and they have a hard time even comprehending someone else not doing it. For these people, its a 100% dealbreaker.

Then there are others that are more open. They may do it and like it, but they are willing to potentially consider a relationship without it, if other things work out. 

I'm also hearing that there may be a minority of people who lean "no kiss" already. 

Thanks again for all replies.

21 minutes ago, chillii said:

l'd say being female will help it out a bit bc l've know a few other guys that aren't really into kissing either. l remember one even complaining to me she's always trying to pash me drives me nuts. No need even mentioning it to anyone in general though it;s your thing and no one else's business but if you meet someone your interested in though and it's looking both ways then yeah it would pay to let him know about then because he might be one that is.

Thanks for the reply and advice. I did wonder if being hetero female would help, because I got the impression that kissing was a bigger deal to girls on average. 

[LivingWaterPlease]

Someone asked you if you'd ever done it (kissed). But, you didn't answer. Did you just overlook it or you don't want to answer?

[SincereOnlineGuy]

On 2/26/2020 at 5:33 PM, Saba the Spotted One said:

So basically, as a non-kisser, how do I date kissers (or preferably, find other non-kissers in a kiss-obsessed society)?

I’d love to hear your takes on it. Be honest. Thanks in advance for replies.

You may as well be writing:

 

"As a lesbian, how can I date only straight women?"

 

 

[K.K.]

I like your name, Saba the Spotted One.

Is that like a leopard or someone with Vitiligo? I’m curious. No offense.