Interesting Coronavirus situation. seriously!

[Redhead14]

2 minutes ago, Fletch Lives said:

Hehe! I forgot all about Corona beer. That poor company....... to be named after a virus. Ouch! 

Many a partier has imbibed too heavily on Corona and called into work the next day with a "virus"

[Gaeta]

21 minutes ago, justwhoiam said:

Folks,

just to clear this up, only less than half of the Italian regions have cases

Again, it's the traveling back and forth in airplanes that is at risk. Airplanes contains people from 10ths of countries that have cases. You don't know if the person sitting next to you was contaminated 24 hours prior and shows no symptoms but still is contagious. 

[Fletch Lives]

18 minutes ago, Redhead14 said:

Many a partier has imbibed too heavily on Corona and called into work the next day with a "virus"

 - This is true!

[Wanderlust2018]

1 hour ago, justwhoiam said:

Hmm, then landing in Rome makes even more sense if she's near Naples. Now she's less than 2 hours away from the Reggia di Caserta, amazing place, you can spend like two days there to visit everything (better than Versailles). Ask her to make sure it can be visited through her hotel (I assume she's staying somewhere). On the way back to airport, you could visit the Montecassino Abbey (the day before you leave maybe). Going to Sicily might be an option, but that road Salerno-Reggio Calabria is a nightmare even for locals, go figure for an American! 😁

You could visit Tivoli, there are the remains of an ancient Roman villa with pool and up on the hill the famous fountains. Make sure that sites are open.

I would avoid crowded places, like Florence. I love Lucca too. Anyway, if you have three weeks, you could tour Umbria. Make sure you stay in the very city center while in Perugia. In Umbria you can stop by wherever, and visit Assisi, Perugia, Orvieto, the Marmore Falls. Driving up to Tuscany you can stop in Arezzo. You can stay in a castle, in holiday farm, in a charming hotel... plenty of choices. The only thing you need to make sure is that you find places open. If you go to Perugia, you throw a coin into the well, like it's customary in Rome to throw a coin into the Fontana di Trevi 🙂 And you make a wish. Very romantic. My wishes always came true, so it worked for me 😁

8 days in Umbria, 2 days in Caserta, 2 days in Tivoli, 1 day in Montecassino, last day reaching the airport. You have one free week. You'd want to spend it in Tuscany. But if you want to try something different, you could take a ferry boat to Sardinia, with the rented car with you and then tour Sardinia a bit. March is rather cold weather and a bit windy, but interesting and off the usual track. Have a look at what Sardinia has to offer. It's more of a summer destination, but if you want to be travellers more than tourists, then go for it.

@justwhoiam Thanks for this. Sardinia looks lovely. I saw that flights to and from there from Rome are quite cheap, but I can also research the ferry. Appreciate the insight and perspective from someone else who’s there. I got another update from the person I’m connected to through social media a few min ago, said there’s just noticeably a lot less people at the usual sites and attractions, but otherwise, business as usual. That person is in Rome at the moment, and was in Florence a few days ago. One benefit would likely be rooms that are way inexpensive since demand has dropped off. 

Edited February 29, 2020 by Wanderlust2018
Content

[schlumpy]

1 hour ago, justwhoiam said:

You could visit Tivoli, there are the remains of an ancient Roman villa with pool and up on the hill the famous fountains. Make sure that sites are open.

I would avoid crowded places, like Florence. I love Lucca too. Anyway, if you have three weeks, you could tour Umbria. Make sure you stay in the very city center while in Perugia. In Umbria you can stop by wherever, and visit Assisi, Perugia, Orvieto, the Marmore Falls. Driving up to Tuscany you can stop in Arezzo. You can stay in a castle, in holiday farm, in a charming hotel... plenty of choices. The only thing you need to make sure is that you find places open. If you go to Perugia, you throw a coin into the well, like it's customary in Rome to throw a coin into the Fontana di Trevi 🙂 And you make a wish. Very romantic. My wishes always came true, so it worked for me 😁

8 days in Umbria, 2 days in Caserta, 2 days in Tivoli, 1 day in Montecassino, last day reaching the airport. You have one free week. You'd want to spend it in Tuscany. But if you want to try something different, you could take a ferry boat to Sardinia, with the rented car with you and then tour Sardinia a bit. March is rather cold weather and a bit windy, but interesting and off the usual track. Have a look at what Sardinia has to offer. It's more of a summer destination, but if you want to be travellers more than tourists, then go for it.

I sounds wonderful. I'll be saving your post.

[justwhoiam]

3 minutes ago, Wanderlust2018 said:

@justwhoiam Thanks for this. Sardinia looks lovely. I saw that flights to and from there from Rome are quite cheap, but I can also research the ferry.

Well, the advantage with the ferry is freedom. You can go anywhere whenever with your car. People who fly there either stay in the resort for the whole vacation or rent a car there. See what's more convenient. The ride (round trip) with a small room is €414. 8 hours for departures from Civitavecchia, which might be more convenient than Livorno. I have done it from Piombino, but I just checked and there are no rides from there until June (too bad because the ride from there was like 5 hours). I've heard people who had been to the Seychelles, and they said Sardinia was better!

4 minutes ago, Wanderlust2018 said:

That person is in Rome at the moment, and was in Florence a few days ago. One benefit would likely be rooms that are way inexpensive since demand has dropped off. 

I'm in the North. In the middle of it all. So I guess you get the whole picture 🙂

Another option would be the Amalfi coast, Capri, Anacapri... but in the spring there are lots of old people visiting, and as you said you're in your 50s, I'd go elsewhere.

[Wanderlust2018]

3 minutes ago, justwhoiam said:

Well, the advantage with the ferry is freedom. You can go anywhere whenever with your car. People who fly there either stay in the resort for the whole vacation or rent a car there. See what's more convenient. The ride (round trip) with a small room is €414. 8 hours for departures from Civitavecchia, which might be more convenient than Livorno. I have done it from Piombino, but I just checked and there are no rides from there until June (too bad because the ride from there was like 5 hours). I've heard people who had been to the Seychelles, and they said Sardinia was better!

I'm in the North. In the middle of it all. So I guess you get the whole picture 🙂

Another option would be the Amalfi coast, Capri, Anacapri... but in the spring there are lots of old people visiting, and as you said you're in your 50s, I'd go elsewhere.

@justwhoiam I did give thought previously to Amalfi, Capri. I’ve always wanted to visit and see that area. 

Edited February 29, 2020 by Wanderlust2018
Add user

[justwhoiam]

1 minute ago, Wanderlust2018 said:

I did give thought previously to Amalfi, Capri. I’ve always wanted to visit and see that area. 

Then maybe. I guess most groups with older people are sent to Ischia. Ischia has spas. I'm not sure if you're familiar with the hotel star system in Italy, but remember that it's on a regional base, so what's 3 star in a region may be up to a 2 star in another region. In Campania (the region of Naples, Amalfi, Capri, Ischia, Pompei, etc.) a 4 star hotel might be like a 2 star elsewhere. So pay attention to that.

[justwhoiam]

25 minutes ago, schlumpy said:

I sounds wonderful. I'll be saving your post.

The Reggia di Caserta is where they also shot a Star Wars episode, if you're familiar with it. Another famous Italian location of the Star Wars saga is in my region though, the Villa del Balbianello, around 40 miles from me 🙂

[contel3]

5 hours ago, Wanderlust2018 said:

 

Bit surprised why nobody didn't adress the quarantine issue. Health issues aside, if there is only ONE person at the hotel you're staying who has the virus, you're stuck there for weeks. I recommend choosing locations with very few guests. 

[justwhoiam]

52 minutes ago, contel3 said:

Bit surprised why nobody didn't adress the quarantine issue. Health issues aside, if there is only ONE person at the hotel you're staying who has the virus, you're stuck there for weeks. I recommend choosing locations with very few guests. 

Yeah, a remote possibility but still a possibility.

[spiderowl]

She might have an ‘ulterior motive’ of being concerned for you, given that we don’t know which way the epidemic is going to go in Italy.

Young people have died too, including the 33-year-old doctor who tried to warn the world about the virus.  Health services are at risk of being overwhelmed as it looks like around 13% of people diagnosed need Intensive care. Your girlfriend has a better idea of the impact as she will have been hearing from people on the ground, relatives and friends.

She may have other reasons but it is worth taking her concerns seriously. Being truthful about where you have travelled is important for authorities to be able to minimise the impact of the virus.

Edited February 29, 2020 by spiderowl

[Wanderlust2018]

6 hours ago, spiderowl said:

She might have an ‘ulterior motive’ of being concerned for you, given that we don’t know which way the epidemic is going to go in Italy.

Young people have died too, including the 33-year-old doctor who tried to warn the world about the virus.  Health services are at risk of being overwhelmed as it looks like around 13% of people diagnosed need Intensive care. Your girlfriend has a better idea of the impact as she will have been hearing from people on the ground, relatives and friends.

She may have other reasons but it is worth taking her concerns seriously. Being truthful about where you have travelled is important for authorities to be able to minimise the impact of the virus.

Let’s be pragmatic and get down to basics here...

Again, as I’ve suggested already, if she’s SO concerned, then why on earth would she herself stay there? I mean, she’s due to return to the states in 30 or so days. All this talk about bringing it back or spreading it from MANY of the responses here, it would clearly be better to get out now...period. This if one truly believes it will spread and multiply there. 

@justwhoiam commented and LIVES in northern Italy and pointed out that where my “friend” is, there’s been one case, and that’s an hour or two away. This info is also readily available online. 

So again, I’ll go back to the fundamental elements:

*If it’s so bad, then return now yourself. It’s a complete and total contradiction, period! It’s so bad here, yet I’m staying, and you really need to reconsider coming. Seriously? I can’t believe that all the brilliant minds on here offering advice don’t see that glaring issue, first and foremost. 

*Ive now received two other reports, from people I know, who are also there, right now, that contradict some of what she’s “suggested.” @justwhoiam also added in some contradictory information. Hmmmm that seems a bit interesting now, doesn’t it!?!? 

*My suggestion, in light of all this “panic” of immediately heading south, or somewhere else, such as entirely different county, once I arrived, was not even remotely embraced or validated. There’s no tie or commitment to Italy for either of us, period. It just happens to be where she is and where I was invited. How about Portugal? No cases of any virus there, and not an arduous trip from Rome. And this is a woman who is nomadic and has trips lined up every 2-3 months. Ive seen her literally look at 3-5 destinations on her iPad to use her timeshare. She is not a person who needs a travel plan and seems to actually prefer going with the flow as such. Odd, eh?!?!

*She’s  well aware that I am completely capable of taking care of myself. She’s also aware I’ve traveled extensively, at times solo, to third world countries and also parts of the globe that many would consider “questionably” safe. As far as being concern about my “well-being” she has never struck me as the overly sensitive, caring, I’m really looking out for you type of woman, which I don’t have a problem with, but for the sake of this thread and my original question, nah, I haven’t seen or experienced that from her...at all. 

Finally, I’m going to just say, we seem to live in such a paranoid society in this day and age...and it’s rampant. I could leave my house tomorrow and get killed in a car crash. Does that stop me from getting behind the wheel? Of course not. Same applies to everyone on here. I’m just not one to live my life in a world of fear and paranoia. If I get whatever virus and unfortunately die, at least I did so doing what I love (travel), and what makes me happy and that’s that. Perhaps I’m just more comfortable and accepting of life and death. After all, it’s just a matter of when and not if for all of us and that doesn’t scare me at all...

 

 

[contel3]

I don't mean to sound harsh, but so what if she has ulterior motives?

You've been dating casually for three months….I know for me it would be enough to only be a little worried about a situation to not want a casual fling around. Casual means I want you around when things are going not only good, but great. Maybe she's like me. I agree that she wouldn't stay if she was very worried.

Maybe it's the opposite. Another possibility is she just doesn't want you around for whatever reason like group dynamics or having met someone she's into…..your arrival might disrupt her fun. If she's travelling so much she's probably not taking it nearly as seriously as you are.

If she's going to flake on you, I wouldn't book another trip with her. She's probably not really feeling it anymore, but I don't think it really matters whether the culprit is corona or having more fun without you.

[justwhoiam]

3 hours ago, Wanderlust2018 said:

@justwhoiam also added in some contradictory information. Hmmmm that seems a bit interesting now, doesn’t it!?!?

What was contradictory? 😕

[littleblackheart]

4 hours ago, Wanderlust2018 said:

Finally, I’m going to just say, we seem to live in such a paranoid society in this day and age...and it’s rampant. I could leave my house tomorrow and get killed in a car crash. Does that stop me from getting behind the wheel? Of course not. Same applies to everyone on here. I’m just not one to live my life in a world of fear and paranoia

100% in agreement with this.

 

Lots of people are still travelling everywhere in Europe (and elsewhere too, no doubt). My son is going on a trip to Spain in a few days, I'm going back home to France via a stop gap to Swizerland soon, and most of the people around me are travelling all over the globe. Life moves on, virus or no virus. The main thing is to carefully plan your trip.

 I personally could not leave things up to assumptions (I hate leaving things 'up in the air' because I get confused by lack of clear, straightforward communication - misunderstandings  can easily happen) but I also know there are people who try to wriggle out of any situation. But if your instincts tell you she has ulterior motives, then go with that; after all, you know her better than any of us here!

 

As an aside, my sisters and I are planning a trip to Italy for my little sister's 40th next year, so this thread has been great!

[schlumpy]

Do you feel more for her then you are admitting? You have no formal claim that she needs to recognize. If she does have another interest, then I don't see that as wrong since she has every right to find someone that she can spend her life with.

On the other hand, I can understand not wanting to be another stud in her stable that she can ride when it suits her or put on standby while she rides another. You have a right also to find someone who thinks you are number one and exclusive.

I'm not sure you will be able to move forward with her after this incident. 

 

[elaine567]

6 hours ago, Wanderlust2018 said:

. Perhaps I’m just more comfortable and accepting of life and death. After all, it’s just a matter of when and not if for all of us and that doesn’t scare me at all...

You, you and more you.
Have you never considered that most of these precautions are there to stop the virus spreading and to stop putting the vulnerable at risk.
And to try to prevent mass chaos in our health systems and to save lives...
You may not be particularly vulnerable but if our health systems are clogged up with coronavirus sufferers requiring specialist medical care, then that is going to start impacting on all of us.

[Wanderlust2018]

4 hours ago, justwhoiam said:

What was contradictory? 😕

@justwhoiam Her suggestions that there were incidents or rumored of rioting and looting stores for supplies. Which you said weren’t true. 👍

[Saracena]

21 hours ago, Redhead14 said:

My point is that if this guy decides to go over there, risks exposure, he's risking bring it back here or spreading it else where.  He's just one more potential "carrier".  The reason SARS, etc. isn't still an issue was that containment was quicker and successful.  What's the big deal if he re-schedules?  Most airlines are allowing refunds/ticket changes, etc.

Absolutely. The first, very recent case in Northern Ireland was someone who had flown from one of the hot-spots in northern Italy to Dublin, followed by a (lengthy) train journey to Belfast. Heaven know how many others have been infected along the way. What that person did was grossly irresponsible. At the very least why not get tested before they commenced their journey.

In addition,  travel restrictions should ideally have been imposed or at the very least people who had flown from that region quarantined for a set period when they landed.

[Wanderlust2018]

26 minutes ago, elaine567 said:

You, you and more you.
Have you never considered that most of these precautions are there to stop the virus spreading and to stop putting the vulnerable at risk.
And to try to prevent mass chaos in our health systems and to save lives...
You may not be particularly vulnerable but if our health systems are clogged up with coronavirus sufferers requiring specialist medical care, then that is going to start impacting on all of us.

@elaine567 Of course I have. No different than when I go about life considering the uninsured family who shows up in the E.R. for simple conditions such as head lice and tie up life-saving resources, the many people  who refuse to get an annual flu shot (with influenza killing massive amounts of people annually), anti-vaxxers, etc.

It sounds like you should just stay locked up inside your home, where you’ll be nice  and safe. 

[Wanderlust2018]

1 hour ago, schlumpy said:

Do you feel more for her then you are admitting? You have no formal claim that she needs to recognize. If she does have another interest, then I don't see that as wrong since she has every right to find someone that she can spend her life with.

On the other hand, I can understand not wanting to be another stud in her stable that she can ride when it suits her or put on standby while she rides another. You have a right also to find someone who thinks you are number one and exclusive.

I'm not sure you will be able to move forward with her after this incident. 

 

No, not stronger feelings, for me, getting the run around or being fed a bunch of BS is a major pet peeve.

@littleblackheart sort of summed it up, and I’m similar in that I don’t particularly like lack of clarity, trying to draw assumptions, etc. 

No issue with whatever she wants to do and with whomever, but just be clear about it and say so if that’s the case. Who knows, the “one” could be a European national I meet if I were to go solo and do my own thing. Just saying....

[contel3]

33 minutes ago, Saracena said:

Absolutely. The first, very recent case in Northern Ireland was someone who had flown from one of the hot-spots in northern Italy to Dublin, followed by a (lengthy) train journey to Belfast. Heaven know how many others have been infected along the way. What that person did was grossly irresponsible. At the very least why not get tested before they commenced their journey.

I agree. It's just a lack of consideration for other people. I might be a bit biased though... at the place where I work, there's a lot of American tourists. They're pretty much the only tourists who will cough straight into your face right now....and not even apologize. Makes me want to smack them lol. This thread is really getting on my nerves!

Edited March 1, 2020 by contel3

[Wanderlust2018]

1 hour ago, contel3 said:

I agree. It's just a lack of consideration for other people. I might be a bit biased though... at the place where I work, there's a lot of American tourists. They're pretty much the only tourists who will cough straight into your face right now....and not even apologize. Makes me want to smack them lol. This thread is really getting on my nerves!

@contel3 It’s getting on mine as well... There are plenty of other forums on here in the health section where folks can share their unsolicited medical and health related opinions, that in no way address the original and main question of this particular thread. 

[SincereOnlineGuy]

On 2/28/2020 at 10:20 PM, Wanderlust2018 said:

So here I am, the “at times” dispenser of advice, seeking advice...

Backstory: Met a gal back in early Nov., and we know some of the same people within our respective circles. We’ve been dating as what I would describe as on a very casual basis. This has included a few trips together, one of which was to (oddly enough) a former elementary school classmate mine, who she also knows. Our time together has been enjoyable, but I’m nowhere near falling for her and I don’t feel or sense that she’s falling for me, which is fine. 

But this is where it gets interesting... So I have a major birthday coming up, as in within about 2 1/2 weeks from now. Many weeks ago, she invited me to Italy to join her (she’s a dual U.S. and Italian citizen) during the time of my birthday. I’ll say she’s a dual citizen lightly since she barely finished going through the “hoops” to get her Italian citizenship she was born here in the U.S., and is as American as I am. In fact, I think her Italian “roots” are more at her grandparents level and what not, but ok. I honestly think it’s more of a “novelty” for her that anything. She left the U.S. for Italy about 3 weeks ago with plans to stay through around the first of April or thereabouts. It was actually her that sourced up a really great airfare for me to join her for about 9 days spanning my birthday, with plans to visit several cities together, all of which, coincidentally, are in northern Italy.

So...we’ve been in contact while she’s been there discussing plans and what not, but ever since this Coronavirus thing, it’s gotten even more interesting...

She’s a sharp woman, who comes from a pharma background. I work in medicine myself and quite closely with some of the most prestigious universities and experts in the world (MD level, including infectious disease experts) and in an environment where I’m getting more of the “real story” and ramifications in my opinion, than all the media hype. This is not to say the Coronavirus isn’t a serious thing, but in medicine circles, it’s a bit of a different and objective view. 

Which brings me to the point of my post... Thus far, since the outbreak of the virus in Italy, I’ve received nothing but dramatic msgs from her that my senses and gut tell me are her trying to discourage me from coming, and perhaps not due to the Coronavirus. In one exchange, just a few days ago, I suggested that I fly into Rome as we had originally planned (my ticket is booked) and then we switch directions and go south (think Sicily, as opposed to north) or, grab one of the cheap flights from Rome to Athens and/or to somewhere like Santorini to keep some distance between the “outbreak” and us. She’s a self admitted “planner” and free spirited person who can afford to do things like that (which I can afford too) and she didn’t bite on that idea AT ALL, the heading south. We’re both multi time travelers/visitors to Europe (separately over the years) and I know that it isn’t that difficult to get around over there, hop to a different country, as I’ve done it many times, as has she. Today, more dramatic msgs about how there’s no hand sanitizer in country, stories of people “rioting and looting” stores to obtain essentials because she’s there and is getting the “Italy version of news.” In one of her msgs today, she stated “I hope you made a back up plan” for a trip, meaning an entirely different trip for me to celebrate my birthday, without her. I find it a bit odd that if she’s so concerned about the state of affairs there, why wouldn’t she pay the change fee on her ticket, which she can very easily afford, and return to the U.S. now? I don’t know...my senses and gut are now telling me to forget her and either go on the trip solo (I’ve done solo trips abroad many times and have no issue with that)  or just cancel this trip altogether and do my own thing someplace else which is fine too. 

Sure, she could be sharing her “intel” plainly and simply out of concern, but I really do feel like there’s an ulterior motive. I’m an adult and I don’t need to be talked in or out of anything. I’m able to make my own choices and live with the ramifications, if any. 

Thoughts?

 

This is a fun human puzzle indeed.

 

BUT we pause for appropriate acknowledgement of your being in the medical field (and her too) and generally calculating the TRUE risks (vs. the hype).

 

One thing you don't touch on in this first post is the realistic chance of her projecting your potential fear and being driven by that, as much as by the shared general & knowledge-based calculations.

I don't think this is at all parallel to those threads where somebody here reports some romantic hope being suddenly distant (in connection, not miles) except potentially from the perspective of the one writing here while pining.

 

And I'm not sure that having already planned it  is a grand reason to be making a non-essential trip to northern Italy at this point in time.  And it might not be the location itself  which is the unreasonable risk, but rather the means of transit to get to that location.   (if you could be in Mork from Ork's egg, and be shipped to Geneva, and then on a flatbed train car into northern Italy right now... then fine... chances are you would get there, and enjoy a concern-free trip)  (but the interaction with travel hubs in the general vicinity, and with the scores of people who had passed through recently, may pointlessly boost your chances of running into the virus)

 

The human hype in Northern Italy right now might be unbearable for some (less likely so for an educated medical professional)... so that doesn't enhance a potential vacation.

 

Consider, too, that IF this were your family... and IF someone in the house was sick (with something not potentially lethal)... and everyone else was doing fine, and going about their typical life...  you would still likely exercise the caution that had you not AS often putting yourself in the same path as the person who was ill (again, clarity, if it was something potentially deadly, like Coronavirus, they'd be in a treatment facility and not at your home)...  MAYbe everyone would use the other bathroom in the house, while the sick person used the first one... if only for a few days or a week.

Your not going to Italy at this time is sliiiiiiiiiiiiiiightly reducing yet another conduit for the virus to move from place to place.

 

 

Beyond that, you sound like we need you on some other, related threads right now.

 

(* note:  I was in the throes of typing this when the latest update arrived)

Edited March 1, 2020 by SincereOnlineGuy