newbby Posted November 24, 2005 Share Posted November 24, 2005 button pusher, i am very interested in buddhism i understand it is more of a philosophy than religion. i am just wondering though, i dont believe in the christian definition of god at all, but believe in god as the universal energy, as everything and all is connected etc. i thought i was close to buddhism in my beliefs (not that it matters) though it appears i am not. Link to post Share on other sites
newbby Posted November 24, 2005 Share Posted November 24, 2005 toni, if your nana was still alive she would want you to be happy, if she is looking at you from another plane, she wants you to be happy. so whatever makes you happy is the best thing you can do. Link to post Share on other sites
newbby Posted November 24, 2005 Share Posted November 24, 2005 toni, if your nana was still alive she would want you to be happy, if she is looking at you from another plane, she wants you to be happy. so whatever makes you happy is the best thing you can do. Link to post Share on other sites
ButtonPusher Posted November 25, 2005 Share Posted November 25, 2005 am very interested in buddhism i understand it is more of a philosophy than religion. i am just wondering though, i dont believe in the christian definition of god at all, but believe in god as the universal energy, as everything and all is connected etc. i thought i was close to buddhism in my beliefs (not that it matters) though it appears i am not. Like I said, buddhism doesn't deny the existence of a god, or a universal energy. It focuses on what you can change about yourself. There was a group of early christians called gnostics, that didn't view god as a being, but as something which fits into what you believe as god being an energy, for want of a better word, that binds the universe together. For them entering heaven was about attaining a oneness with the universe. I know the way I put it sounds silly, but its been awhile since I've read about the gnostics. When I read about them, it sounded very much like buddhism. Just that buddhists call it nibbana, and the gnostics say that they come to "know" god. Link to post Share on other sites
jayteresa Posted November 25, 2005 Share Posted November 25, 2005 The bible is a book, a written book, just like Madonna wrote a book for kids- work it out people! Link to post Share on other sites
Confused5433 Posted November 25, 2005 Share Posted November 25, 2005 Toni, You ask the right question and you have every right to feel as you do. Everyone in this earth at one point or another has asked the same things and some did get the answers and some didn't...why??? I've analyzed, and reflected so much about the purpose of our lives, the existence of a greater being and the reasons for pain and suffering. After making mistakes, questioning and almost becoming an atheist...I realized that this life is a TEST!!! God is REAL, no doubt in my mind. Now, how can you find this out....very simple You don't have to pray at every hour of the day, read tons of christian literatures (which would be helpful) or join a church. Just PAY ATTENTION TO THE SIGNS (aka The Holy Spirit). SOmetimes, when we need God the most is when he manifest himself to reasure you that we are not alone. Be open, start to believe in him, accept him and you will see that it is true. Just try it, you have nothing to loose. I'll tell you my testimony real quick. One day, I was waiting in a line of ten to use a public phone. I was there for about 10 min, thinking about the meaning of life, about sins, religion...is questioning God, and so confused about life. I was so distraught and depressed, when all of a sudden the man standing in front of me turned around and said:"Do you go to a church", I said no. He then pulled out his card (he was a preacher) and told me that if I ever had any doubts or questions to get in touch with him. Then all of a sudden, he took off. He was waiting for the phone just like me, but instead he had a calling to bring me peace...it was the most indescribable, eye-opener, wonderful feeling to know that God is here, among all of his creation. I didn't feel alone or confused anymore, I became a believer that day. So be patient, be open and receptive to his grace. God uses people, circumstances and even his amazing creation in nature (I have a butterfly testimony too). Some people might think this is crazy, but it doesn't matter, we all are searching for our truths and I only wish one day you experience what I did and become a believer. ABout suffering and death....I believe in Karma. "What goes around, comes around" that might be a reason for a suffering, is the prize to pay. But I also see suffering as the best opportunity to find the truth. When we are happy, have money, have significant others, cars, nice clothes, go to parties..etc Are you even thinking of God...;of course not, you're having the time of your life, what God?? Who is God? But you know what, when everything is taken away from you, then the only real truth is that God will always be with you. He will be the only real comfort in your life. Then you learn to see life with a different perspective, you give importance to what really matters which is your family, being good to others, beign a helpful and compassionate person, etc. Everything you read in the bible. That will fulfill you and in return give a relationship with God, it will give you peace, hope and satisfaction because you are doing the right thing...and don't we all want to do the right thing, deep down??? I hope you discover this truth and the day you do, please share your testimony so that others can finally find the truth. My love to you and your nana in heaven and may GOD BLESS YOU!!! Link to post Share on other sites
Author Toni_no12002 Posted November 25, 2005 Author Share Posted November 25, 2005 Thankyou.I do want to believe im just finding it hard at the minute.Im still upset about my nanna and all my family are still upset about it especially my mum.She hasnt cried since she died and im worried.When my grandad died about a year and a half ago my nanna didnt cry once.She was really depressed though.We talked to the doctors and he said that the cancer could have started because of my grandad dying.She got it a couple of months after he died and i feel so awful because she must have been so upset.We didnt realise how badly it had affected her.Obviously she would have been devastated about it but i never thought that this would happen. Maybe i want to believe in god because it will make me happy that shes in no pain anymore and that she is with my grandad and her mum and dad etc.I feel so guilty even though i know i couldnt have stopped it. maybe shes where she wants to be now with my grandad i mean.It still doesnt stop me wanting her back though and my grandad.Sometimes i dont think ill ever stop getting upset about it.Life sucks sometimes! Link to post Share on other sites
newbby Posted November 25, 2005 Share Posted November 25, 2005 Maybe i want to believe in god because it will make me happy that shes in no pain anymore and that she is with my grandad and her mum and dad etc.I feel so guilty even though i know i couldnt have stopped it. maybe shes where she wants to be now with my grandad i mean.It still doesnt stop me wanting her back though and my grandad.Sometimes i dont think ill ever stop getting upset about it.Life sucks sometimes! whether you believe in god or not, your nana is in no pain anymore. people die and you cant stop that fact. you have nothing to feel guilty about. either way you look at it, if god exists in the way you are thinking about it then your nana is with your grandpa. if god doesnt exist at all then your nana is still where your grandpa, in non existence, and either way your nana is not unhappy. religion and beliefs are for the living. life is hard. your nana is okay, you need to make yourself happy for you. in life. Link to post Share on other sites
newbby Posted November 25, 2005 Share Posted November 25, 2005 Like I said, buddhism doesn't deny the existence of a god, or a universal energy. It focuses on what you can change about yourself. There was a group of early christians called gnostics, that didn't view god as a being, but as something which fits into what you believe as god being an energy, for want of a better word, that binds the universe together. For them entering heaven was about attaining a oneness with the universe. I know the way I put it sounds silly, but its been awhile since I've read about the gnostics. When I read about them, it sounded very much like buddhism. Just that buddhists call it nibbana, and the gnostics say that they come to "know" god. thankyou for your reply. no it doesnt sound silly at all, it sounds very much the way i feel it. its very interesting about the gnostics. there seem to be many branches of christianity. Link to post Share on other sites
Author Toni_no12002 Posted November 25, 2005 Author Share Posted November 25, 2005 Yea i suppose either way she isnt in any pain.Im glad of that but sometimes i still want her here,i know thats selfish but i suppose everyone wants to have people who have died back that they care about. Link to post Share on other sites
sylviaguardian Posted November 28, 2005 Share Posted November 28, 2005 I don’t understand why some people think science and religion are mutually exclusive. Is this some sort of bias or snobbery? Apex, This is not a kind of snobbery. I don't bash people who are religious. All I am saying is that it is very difficult to believe in evolution in the same time as believing that God created man. The two are fairly mutually exclusive. That said, it is of course possible to accept the scientific viewpoint i.e. that evolution is a random process and to be 'spiritual' at the same time. Syl Link to post Share on other sites
Apex Posted November 29, 2005 Share Posted November 29, 2005 This is not a kind of snobbery. I don't bash people who are religious. All I am saying is that it is very difficult to believe in evolution in the same time as believing that God created man. The two are fairly mutually exclusive. That said, it is of course possible to accept the scientific viewpoint i.e. that evolution is a random process and to be 'spiritual' at the same time.Don’t you think there is something unusual about two creation stories in the bible? Evolution doesn’t explain the existence of matter, and the supply of nuclear energy (mostly solar) used to fuel life. The universe has a beginning and an end so there is no endless cycle. Link to post Share on other sites
Moose Posted November 29, 2005 Share Posted November 29, 2005 Don’t you think there is something unusual about two creation stories in the bible?No.....I don't. Explain to me where you get 2 versions......... Link to post Share on other sites
Apex Posted November 29, 2005 Share Posted November 29, 2005 No.....I don't. Explain to me where you get 2 versions.........The 7-days creation story is the first and the oldest. The Adam and Eve creation story is the second. Link to post Share on other sites
Moose Posted November 29, 2005 Share Posted November 29, 2005 The 7-days creation story is the first and the oldest. The Adam and Eve creation story is the second.Your talking about 2 different things. The creation of the Earth, and the creation of man. Not two different accounts of either.......so there is not 2, "stories"........ Link to post Share on other sites
Pocky Posted November 29, 2005 Share Posted November 29, 2005 There are several theology books available regarding the two creation stories if people are interested in exploring this idea further. With examination, early Genesis is seen to have two differing creation stories; this difference in accounts is often attributed to the theory that the Bible was written by four sources - J, E, P, D. Specifically speaking, the creation stories are associated to J and E. One-A-Day-Tan Link to post Share on other sites
Moose Posted November 29, 2005 Share Posted November 29, 2005 Thanks Pocky. I'm starting a new thread on the subject so as not to hijack this one. Toni, I sincerely hope that you find the peace you're looking for. I've been praying for you......I know, I know......some people take offense when Christians say that, as if we believe we have some divine power that others don't. Not true. I am truthfully hoping that you will find God and be added to His family. Link to post Share on other sites
quankanne Posted November 29, 2005 Share Posted November 29, 2005 All I am saying is that it is very difficult to believe in evolution in the same time as believing that God created man. The two are fairly mutually exclusive. That said, it is of course possible to accept the scientific viewpoint i.e. that evolution is a random process and to be 'spiritual' at the same time. I've never thought them to be mutually exclusive because they're dealing with mankind/humanity: one is from the physiological aspect, the other the spiritual. You really cannot have one without the other when you're talking about a viable entity endowed with a soul, IMHO ... In fact, La Civilta Cattolica published a story in its Nov. 19 edition that calls the Bible and evolutionary science "perfectly compatible," according to a story that ran on the national Catholic wire service: www.catholicnews.com/data/stories/cns/0506617.htm "And the reason is that the Bible is a book that does not try to give a scientific teaching, but a religious teaching," it said. Link to post Share on other sites
Author Toni_no12002 Posted November 30, 2005 Author Share Posted November 30, 2005 no offense taken Hopefully ill find some answers.Im unsure where they are but ill find them. Link to post Share on other sites
sylviaguardian Posted November 30, 2005 Share Posted November 30, 2005 I've never thought them to be mutually exclusive because they're dealing with mankind/humanity: one is from the physiological aspect, the other the spiritual. You really cannot have one without the other when you're talking about a viable entity endowed with a soul, IMHO ... Well that is kind of what I was saying. Whilst I find an evoluntionist account to be more plausible, that does not mean that I believe that humans do not benefit from any kind of spirituality. However, the two seems to be fairly exclusive from my point of view. How can one reconcile an evolutionary account where the evolution of man is due to a series of random factors that happen over billions of years and an account where the earth is made in seven days? In fact, La Civilta Cattolica published a story in its Nov. 19 edition that calls the Bible and evolutionary science "perfectly compatible," according to a story that ran on the national Catholic wire service: QUOTE] I've read the article. It states an opinion but doesn't provide any evidence for it. Also it says: "In other words, it doesn't try to teach 'how' man appeared historically," it said. Instead, the Bible teaches who man is in relation to God and the world, what is man's spiritual condition, and what is man's destiny, it said." I could be wrong here, but I thought the bible DID explicitly talk about where man came from i.e. the creationist accounts. I agree with the poster who said that it is easier for them to not believe than to believe. I have no problem with people who are religious (each to their own) my only problem with religion is the way that organised religion seems to lead to so much intolerance and violence. Sylvia Link to post Share on other sites
Apex Posted November 30, 2005 Share Posted November 30, 2005 However, the two seems to be fairly exclusive from my point of view. How can one reconcile an evolutionary account where the evolution of man is due to a series of random factors that happen over billions of years and an account where the earth is made in seven days?Science is not an all or nothing deal. There is nothing unusual about scientists disagreeing with each other. Is it possible to disagree with human evolution and still believe in the validity of the Maxwell equations? I don’t think Darwinism or archaeology in general have contributed to technological development. Einstein didn’t believe in random processes. Was he wrong? I could be wrong here, but I thought the bible DID explicitly talk about where man came from i.e. the creationist accounts.The bible has many authors. I have no problem with people who are religious (each to their own) my only problem with religion is the way that organised religion seems to lead to so much intolerance and violence.A number of organized Christian groups did wonders during the civil rights movement. They seemed to prefer civil disobedience over outright violence. I think Christianity made them strong whereas liberalism stripped them of their pride and dignity. Was “survival of the fittest” one of the motivating factors for the Nazis? A number of Churches have accepted the Big Bang theory for the origin of the universe. Link to post Share on other sites
slubberdegullion Posted November 30, 2005 Share Posted November 30, 2005 I think Christianity made them strong whereas liberalism stripped them of their pride and dignity.On the contrary, it was the liberal ideological bent that was provided the foundation for the civil rights movement in the US. If you want to see conservative Christendom in action, take a look at the exclusivity of many of the funamentalist movements in the Bible Belt. Was “survival of the fittest” one of the motivating factors for the Nazis?Social Darwinism wasn't, and isn't, relegated to Nazis. Besides, Darwin never said "survival of the fittest." Go read On The Origin of Species book first. A number of Churches have accepted the Big Bang theory for the origin of the universe.Yes, some have. Others still believe in Archbishop Usher's 1664 declaration that this rock upon which we live was created 6,000 years ago, in 6 days. Link to post Share on other sites
quankanne Posted December 1, 2005 Share Posted December 1, 2005 I could be wrong here, but I thought the bible DID explicitly talk about where man came from i.e. the creationist accounts. yeppy ... but based on a spiritual/faith perspective. Commonsense tells us that the way we measure time is not how a Creator measures it. What's the joke about the man asking God how much a second, a minute and year are worth, and God tells him that each translates to in his time? I would think that it would be much like that, that our concept of time is way, way different than his. That's the only way I could get the seven days' thing to work out, by approaching it figuratively rather than literally. my only problem with religion is the way that organised religion seems to lead to so much intolerance and violence. a lot of us feel this way, even believers. Throw a human factor into that big pot we call 'spirituality,' and sooner or later someone is going to try to be top dog with his or her view. I see it a lot here in East Texas, where the Protestants view Catholics as something akin to devil-worshipers, rather than fellow Christians. Pretty dang sad when you understand that Protestantism is rooted in Catholicism, which is rooted in Judaism ... Link to post Share on other sites
Author Toni_no12002 Posted December 1, 2005 Author Share Posted December 1, 2005 sometimes i feel that some people take religion too seriously. Link to post Share on other sites
ButtonPusher Posted December 1, 2005 Share Posted December 1, 2005 sometimes i feel that some people take religion too seriously. You were warned when you started this thread Link to post Share on other sites
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