Am I just a crutch?

[Starswillshine]

24 minutes ago, MadlyDeeply said:

Thank you Mark, yes I've always appreciated what i do have with my h that's why i can't believe i risk it all, I must be mad.  My H is such a good person, best father for our children, the children are the best children i could have ever hoped for, we both love them so much. Best home we could ever have, we have so much in common too and the love is v familial like you said. I just don't know how to engage in any intimacy as i just don't have those feelings towards him anymore. 

I'm on day no two of NC with mm as i said I don't want any contact while in isolation, he wasn't happy about it and left on bad terms. I've wrote a list of bad characteristics to keep reminding myself! Each time i receive a text message I'm secretly hoping it's mm as I'm missing him as love him so much but I keep asking myself why or how can i! I'm hoping this time apart will help both of our marriages. If i can cope with 3 weeks of NC then hopefully i can do longer and longer until I realise I don't need him in my life at all😃

You cannot engage in intimacy with your husband right now because you are so caught up in this other man. You once had that with your husband, no? You can get it back, but first you have to separate yourself from this MM... who is NO prize. Pretty sad you will give up your great life for a serial cheat. 

[JimmyNorth]

On 3/27/2020 at 6:11 AM, MadlyDeeply said:

Thank you Mark, yes I've always appreciated what i do have with my h that's why i can't believe i risk it all, I must be mad.  My H is such a good person, best father for our children, the children are the best children i could have ever hoped for, we both love them so much. Best home we could ever have, we have so much in common too and the love is v familial like you said. I just don't know how to engage in any intimacy as i just don't have those feelings towards him anymore. 

I'm on day no two of NC with mm as i said I don't want any contact while in isolation, he wasn't happy about it and left on bad terms. I've wrote a list of bad characteristics to keep reminding myself! Each time i receive a text message I'm secretly hoping it's mm as I'm missing him as love him so much but I keep asking myself why or how can i! I'm hoping this time apart will help both of our marriages. If i can cope with 3 weeks of NC then hopefully i can do longer and longer until I realise I don't need him in my life at all😃

I bet that your MM won’t be able to handle NC with you for too long. If he really doesn’t want his wife, he’ll somehow make a way to contact you or even see you.

You are probably his drug of choice as well. He may soon have his withdrawals. 

[BaileyB]

On 3/27/2020 at 8:38 AM, Starswillshine said:

You cannot engage in intimacy with your husband right now because you are so caught up in this other man. You once had that with your husband, no? You can get it back, but first you have to separate yourself from this MM... who is NO prize. Pretty sad you will give up your great life for a serial cheat. 

Oh goodness, yes. Someday, you will look back on this time and the regret will be too much to deal with...

Of course you don’t have feelings of intimacy for your husband anymore, you are dreaming about another man. You simply cannot accurately evaluate one relationship when you are caught up in another relationship. It’s like comparing apples to oranges. Day to night. Fantasy to reality. Your poor husband doesn’t stand a chance compared to your affair partner... even your memories about what life was like with your husband are not reliable because now they filter through your experience in this affair. 

[MadlyDeeply]

Starswillshine I know that makes sense, it's just so difficult when you have such strong feelings for somebody else. I feel like I'm in love with my mm but also love him but don't trust him at all because of his past so don't think it could ever work between us anyway. He tells me i need to forget his past as he only wants me! Yes i used to have these feelings for my h but a long time ago. 
Jimmy before lockdown we were becoming even closer, he told me he loved me more than he loves his wife and that i complete him. At weekend he reached out saying he wanted to see me but i couldn't get out and didn't want to risk catching anything either, he was OK about it but we are now in NC again. I'm being strong and will not contact him, he is probably wondering why I'm pulling away but it's cause I don't want to hear how he is getting on with his W and also i know in my heart he will never be able to leave, as he obviously loves his security more than me. 
Bailey I'm getting stronger, everyone on here makes me feel strong and it gives me hope that i will be able to break away. It's just so hard cause he lives so close and often talks to my h. 

[BaileyB]

1 hour ago, MadlyDeeply said:

Starswillshine I know that makes sense, it's just so difficult when you have such strong feelings for somebody else. 

Bailey I'm getting stronger, everyone on here makes me feel strong and it gives me hope that i will be able to break away. 

Madlydeeply, your posts bring to mind that famous saying by Henry Ford, “whether you think you can, or think you can’t — you are right.”

I say this because you say in almost all of your posts - “I know this needs to end, but I’m not sure if I can end this relationship because I love him so much...”

It’s like, because you have feelings for this man, you have lost all ability for rational thought and self determination. And, I know that is not the case. 

If that line of thinking was valid, one would have to argue that a woman who lives in a home with a man who beats her should stay with her abuser - because she loves him to much. Feelings, are no excuse for poor decisions that put your emotional or physical health at risk.

So, if you know this relationship is not healthy for you - and you know this, he is a serial cheat who is disregarding your wishes, and in so doing he is putting the happiness and stability of both your families at risk by continuing to contact you - you need to resolve to stay firm in your decision to end it. 

His request that you communicate and/or see each other is so unbelievably disrespectful, given your decision to end contact. His suggestion that you should “forget his past” - which let’s be honest, is also his present considering he is still married and chasing another woman than his wife - and that he “loves you more than her” is manipulation at its best. It’s manipulation and he is accomplishing his goal of confusing the heck out of you and weakening your resolves such that he can continue as he has been...

Don’t give him the satisfaction. You are the creator of your own destiny... 

Edited March 30, 2020 by BaileyB

[Beca L]

6 hours ago, BaileyB said:

Don’t give him the satisfaction. You are the creator of your own destiny... 

Great words !! I'm trying to adopt this myself, thanks 

[Beca L]

On 3/21/2020 at 2:53 PM, elaine567 said:

Guys in 35 year marriages rarely leave. They have far too much invested.

I have to agree with you here, or if they do leave they will most likely go back. 

@MadlyDeeply please listen to this advice, I learnt this the hard way and I'm still trying to recover from the pain. 

[Beca L]

On 3/21/2020 at 3:05 PM, BaileyB said:

Men are often pragmatic. They generally tend not to make emotional decisions. I see that in the way my partner discusses his divorce and the possibility of a future marriage. He looks at it in what I would say is a very cold, realistic, and pragmatic way. I am like you, I tend to be very emotional. It’s amazing to me how two people can look at the same situation/same decision in a very different way. Don’t make the mistake of thinking that he “thinks” as you do - they don’t. 

BailyB you are so insightful and I agree with your comments. It has taken me a long time to recognise this in my own experience with my xMM but he does not think the same as I do. It has been painful to accept this but in a way it's reassuring that I'm not going crazy, he's just cold and pragmatic, feelings and emotions were not involved in his decision to return to his BS.

Take note of this MadlyDeeply, whatever MM says to you, he will most likely do the opposite because he will be thinking what decisions will be in his best interests for HIS future and what will make HIS life easier in the long term. 

Hope you are ok and coping with NC, it's the only way. If he wants to leave his BS, let him. But let him do it all on his own without you as his back up plan and OW waiting in the wings. Let him come to you as a free entity and ready to start a fresh but only after he has done the hard work of ending his marriage and sorting out his family and financial affairs in the appropriate way. This period of isolation will help you get through the NC as it doesn't really give you a choice. Take the time to reflect on if you really want to stay married to your H and how you see you future after this terrible crisis is over. Stay safe. 

[Beca L]

On 3/22/2020 at 9:13 PM, BaileyB said:

Many on this board would say, the heartbreak only grows worse with time. 

Unless you are the rare breed who doesn’t mind if the man you love sleeps with another woman every single night, your loneliness, resentment, and heartache is likely to grow with time. It’s normal to want to be with the man you love. It’s normal to want to share your life with him. The fact that you are here, asking these questions tells me that you want more.

It may seem like a possible solution, to continue as you have been... But the longer you stay, the harder it will be when it finally ends - or when you decide to walk away because you want more than he can offer...

Another great comment and piece of advice. After two years of hanging on for my xmm to leave again I can agree the heartbreak did get worse, knowing they remain sleeping with their W every night is the worst thing. But no more, I'm approaching 15 weeks NC and determined to keep going. Hope this can give you the motivation you need. You can do it. He's not worth it and as someone said earlier they are 

 

On 3/22/2020 at 5:22 PM, ExpatInItaly said:

the least reliable choices for a long-term and monogamous relationship. 

Sending you good wishes........you can do this, do not contact him. Let him go ! 

[JimmyNorth]

3 hours ago, Beca L said:

I have to agree with you here, or if they do leave they will most likely go back. 

@MadlyDeeply please listen to this advice, I learnt this the hard way and I'm still trying to recover from the pain. 

Let me throw a “But” in here..

While it’s true many MM in long term marriages may stay or go back, there are definitely some that will exit their marriage and go on with there new and fresh OW that revived his life and overall passion back up.

The trick here is that it takes time to unwind a long term marriage both logistically AND MENTALLY!! I don’t say mentally because the MM is in love with the BS, but it’s because the MM has guilt and feels bad for leaving the long term marriage, kids, etc.... so MM’s at this stage have to do some soul searching and really think about how they want to live the rest of their lives. And sometimes a MM will decide to start a brand new chapter with the hopes of a better way of life with the OW turning into a girlfriend or fiancé. 

[S2B]

On 3/17/2020 at 9:01 AM, Beca L said:

Ok I get your point but I think that’s just nostalgia. Affairs are not the cause of a marriage break down but sometimes just the symptom. These marriages were on the rocks for months or even years before the affair happened. What are they really fighting for ? If a marriage is over it’s like flogging a dead horse. You remember all the good times and the effort put in over the years, children shared, special times etc but ultimately if you are no longer happy with that person and you are not living a true, honest and fulfilling life then make plans to divorce. It takes much more strength to divorce and move on and I truly believe that. WS and BS take the easier option, the safe secure option. They go back to what they know and keep flogging away at it. The OW and OM are ceremoniously dumped, left heartbroken and devastated. They were promised a mirage. 

Affairs aren’t the cause of a marriage breaking down? It was TWO people who took the vows not THREE!

anytime there’s three people in a marriage a ton of heartache and pain follows!

so saying an affairs isn’t a cause is ridiculous. 
let’s get the facts straight about any affair!

[Beca L]

1 hour ago, S2B said:

so saying an affairs isn’t a cause is ridiculous. 
let’s get the facts straight about any affair!

Ok so you are saying all marriages are perfect until some conniving OW/OM shows up and steals the poor innocent WS spouse from their partner ???? 
I don’t think so. Yes, a marriage involves 2 people not 3 and they made their vows. What I’m saying is the OW/OM is often a victim just as much as the BS. The WS sucks them in with all their lies and deceit and betrays two women /men all for their own selfish needs. 

If these marriages were so amazing and wonderful and going well in the first place then there would be no need for an affair. (I do realise that some WS have affairs even when there marriage is going well but I’m not referring to these types of affairs) 

The fact that these marriages were broken or on the rocks led to the BS starting an affair, this is was a symptom of a dysfunctional relationship. The OW/OM did not cause the break down of the marriage. The only two people responsible for that is the WS and the BS. 

[JimmyNorth]

5 minutes ago, Beca L said:

Ok so you are saying all marriages are perfect until some conniving OW/OM shows up and steals the poor innocent WS spouse from their partner ???? 
I don’t think so. Yes, a marriage involves 2 people not 3 and they made their vows. What I’m saying is the OW/OM is often a victim just as much as the BS. The WS sucks them in with all their lies and deceit and betrays two women /men all for their own selfish needs. 

If these marriages were so amazing and wonderful and going well in the first place then there would be no need for an affair. (I do realise that some WS have affairs even when there marriage is going well but I’m not referring to these types of affairs) 

The fact that these marriages were broken or on the rocks led to the BS starting an affair, this is was a symptom of a dysfunctional relationship. The OW/OM did not cause the break down of the marriage. The only two people responsible for that is the WS and the BS. 

I agree with Beca. For the most part, if a marriage is wonderful and both partners still want eachother every night, I don’t see why a spouse would even venture to seek a OW. Why take on that headache.

For many years I loved and wanted my BS. I wanted affection and I wanted the closeness. I had no desire to grab another woman to fulfill my needs. But after so many years of trying and getting burned out, when I met my OW, it was truly a breath of fresh air.

Not to sound cliche, but my OW gave me what I needed to feel alive again.

[Beca L]

7 hours ago, JimmyNorth said:

While it’s true many MM in long term marriages may stay or go back, there are definitely some that will exit their marriage and go on with there new and fresh OW that revived his life and overall passion back up.

JimmyNorth, I think that you are possibly the exception to the rule. I think that circumstances in both the WS and the OW /OM lives also has a lot to play with how things pan out. I know that your OW didn’t have kids so things may have been easier for you after you left BS. 
For MadlyDeeply and myself there are so many more factors involved. This makes the decision far more complicated. However I agree that some WS do have the foresight and the courage to make that move to leave a broken marriage and pursue a new life with OW/ OM.

[MadlyDeeply]

Thank you all, don't know what I'd do without you. 

Bailey your so right about that quote, and i have lost all my sense and absolutely hate feeling like this, so out of control. You wouldn't believe some thoughts I've actually had about this mm. The worst one being if we were ever together, i have told myself i would have to put up with him seeing others as that's what he has always done, and i can't expect to change him, how could i even think of lowering myself like that? How could i even think this would be acceptable to me or i could be happy living like this. Shows my mind is all over the place.
He does try to make me jealous a lot too,  which I really don't like and that in itself is helping me to say goodbye, as i often think how could someone who says they love me try to cause me to feel bad. I've just always told myself it's cause of his insecurities but I hate it really. 
Obviously there are so many good things I love about him too otherwise I wouldn't have put up with him for over two yrs. When we are together apart from my jealousy i never want it to end. 

 

My m was definitely on the rocks before my a, that's why i am in this a. If i was happy in my m, it would never have crossed my mind to cheat. When I'm in love i give a 100%. My mm was there when i was at my lowest point, he made me feel alive again. He says the same.

Beca you are doing so well, bet you feel so much better for it, physically and emotionally, obviously must still hurt so much at times too, not seeing at school must be really helping you, so proud of you. 

JimmyNorth i love hearing from you but you are definitely a rare mm, can i ask how long you was married and did you just have the one affair? Would you still have left your W if your ow had young children? 
We have not even said our goodbyes yet, I'm just distancing myself with the help of the isolation rules. We have not spoken since Saturday which is a long time for us. I'm just preparing myself for when the time comes and to try to make mm think too. 

[mark clemson]

4 hours ago, MadlyDeeply said:

 The worst one being if we were ever together, i have told myself i would have to put up with him seeing others as that's what he has always done, and i can't expect to change him, how could i even think of lowering myself like that? How could i even think this would be acceptable to me or i could be happy living like this.

Indeed, this sounds about right for your particular case. Taking off those rose colored glasses...

[MadlyDeeply]

My rose tinted glasses on not on all the time now, recently I've been taking them off! I feel so sad today, feel like i want to be faraway somewhere left to cry it all out. Can't believe i got involved with him, its so difficult cause see him so often, as he lives so close to us and when i see him, it makes me think of his nice side, need to start thinking of his bad side whenever i see him! I don't need to talk to him do i (need to be strong like Beca) shall just try my best to ignore him. I need a list of things to help remind myself that saying goodbye is the right thing to do! 1. No mm of 35yrs would ever leave W, that can be at the top!!! 2. I could never trust him, would have to share him. 3. Protect my sexual health. 4. No more jealousy. 

Can you please add to my list my friends? 

Obviously my children are the most important part of my life but they are the biggest part with or without mm.

[S2B]

What I’m saying is - IF any spouse wants to cheat... that spouse should get the divorce and finalize it BEFORE starting any new relationship. Any affair just causes harm to all involved. Proper order is key.

im not going to guess why anyone would cheat (there are a million reasons) just end that M if it’s not working.

[JimmyNorth]

6 hours ago, MadlyDeeply said:

Thank you all, don't know what I'd do without you. 

Bailey your so right about that quote, and i have lost all my sense and absolutely hate feeling like this, so out of control. You wouldn't believe some thoughts I've actually had about this mm. The worst one being if we were ever together, i have told myself i would have to put up with him seeing others as that's what he has always done, and i can't expect to change him, how could i even think of lowering myself like that? How could i even think this would be acceptable to me or i could be happy living like this. Shows my mind is all over the place.
He does try to make me jealous a lot too,  which I really don't like and that in itself is helping me to say goodbye, as i often think how could someone who says they love me try to cause me to feel bad. I've just always told myself it's cause of his insecurities but I hate it really. 
Obviously there are so many good things I love about him too otherwise I wouldn't have put up with him for over two yrs. When we are together apart from my jealousy i never want it to end. 

 

My m was definitely on the rocks before my a, that's why i am in this a. If i was happy in my m, it would never have crossed my mind to cheat. When I'm in love i give a 100%. My mm was there when i was at my lowest point, he made me feel alive again. He says the same.

Beca you are doing so well, bet you feel so much better for it, physically and emotionally, obviously must still hurt so much at times too, not seeing at school must be really helping you, so proud of you. 

JimmyNorth i love hearing from you but you are definitely a rare mm, can i ask how long you was married and did you just have the one affair? Would you still have left your W if your ow had young children? 
We have not even said our goodbyes yet, I'm just distancing myself with the help of the isolation rules. We have not spoken since Saturday which is a long time for us. I'm just preparing myself for when the time comes and to try to make mm think too. 

I was married 20 years. I fought for affection 15 of those years. Then I got burned out. When OW came around I was definitely vulnerable to attaching to her.

All my kids are over 16 years old and they were sick of parents being unhappy. To be honest, if they were still babies or still young I may have still fought for marriage. Maybe that’s why I fought for marriage so long. However, we are all adults now and I felt I could not stay unhappy forever.

This was my First real affair long term with a OW where I experienced real emotions However, about 11 years ago I had a one night stand with a ex-gf. But that was nothing to me. I was just frustrated at home, but I still wanted my wife at that time. But with my current OW, I actually fell for her. 

Its in my opinion that even the most serial cheater MM can be vulnerable to falling for a woman that mesmerizes him. It can happen. Unless the guy is a total robot, men, no matter how hard core they are, can meet a woman that literally screws them all up and take over their heart.

Trust me, put the right girl in front of a MM (of course given they are in a loveless marriage), and they will be addicted to that woman to the point where they WILL do what it takes to keep her!

[Beca L]

1 hour ago, S2B said:

 

im not going to guess why anyone would cheat (there are a million reasons) just end that M if it’s not working.

Yes, I agree completely. 

[MadlyDeeply]

S2B i agree with you too if no children, infact i would go to solicitors tom if we had no children. I get on fine with my h, just not in love with him and the children are the happiest children in the world so it's not that easy to just go get a divorce and split up family unit. 

JimmyNorth thank you for sharing more details. I'm so happy you have now found true happiness, does your girlfriend read the stories on here? Tell her I'm so happy for her that her mm wasn't a robot and has proved his love to her. I would love to come on here and tell you my mm isn't a robot but don't think I'm going to have the same happy ending😭Hopefully he will start missing me again soon, as this hurts like hell, missing him like crazy but I'm being super strong not going to contact him. I need him to miss me. He seems so genuine and has always said how much he loves me and can't imagine life without me so we will see. Trouble is he can't imagine life without his W though can he after 35yrs, I don't stand much of a chance. Right back to being strong! 

[Starswillshine]

6 hours ago, MadlyDeeply said:

 I need a list of things to help remind myself that saying goodbye is the right thing to do! 1. No mm of 35yrs would ever leave W, that can be at the top!!! 2. I could never trust him, would have to share him. 3. Protect my sexual health. 4. No more jealousy. 

Can you please add to my list my friends? 

 

5. Protect your mental health

[mark clemson]

6. His wife would probably rip him a new one financially after that much time and he'd likely be leaning on you for support into old age.

7. Sometimes they leave their wife and then go back...

[JimmyNorth]

7 hours ago, MadlyDeeply said:

S2B i agree with you too if no children, infact i would go to solicitors tom if we had no children. I get on fine with my h, just not in love with him and the children are the happiest children in the world so it's not that easy to just go get a divorce and split up family unit. 

JimmyNorth thank you for sharing more details. I'm so happy you have now found true happiness, does your girlfriend read the stories on here? Tell her I'm so happy for her that her mm wasn't a robot and has proved his love to her. I would love to come on here and tell you my mm isn't a robot but don't think I'm going to have the same happy ending😭Hopefully he will start missing me again soon, as this hurts like hell, missing him like crazy but I'm being super strong not going to contact him. I need him to miss me. He seems so genuine and has always said how much he loves me and can't imagine life without me so we will see. Trouble is he can't imagine life without his W though can he after 35yrs, I don't stand much of a chance. Right back to being strong! 

Maybe you will get surprised and see that your MM is actually going crazy without you after a period of no contact.

Madly, let me ask you this question. When you guys are together does he feel connected to you? Are your sexual experiences with him beyond the scope of “just having fun” and brings him to a whole new level of high. While he is with you, does he cling on you and want more of you? If you noticed these things about him, then most likely he is hurting like you right now. He just has to deal with his BS at the moment and is probably dealing with his internal struggle. 

Even if a guy is a player and has many women he sleeps with, usually they get attached to “that one special” woman that can teach him to not play her by doing the NC method. 

[Miss Clavel]

my gut reaction to this is, call the wife. i'd sit down with her and ask her if she wants the house and kids. let her know you are gonna end up with her husband. cuz you love him, madly.

then go and tell your husband. pack, leave.

good luck