Romantic Relationship Expectations.

[Mysterio]

I have asked this before.

What do you want out of your Romantic Relationship in the short term to the long term?

For me at age 49.  I would like to meet a woman that looks at me in a romantic way.  Basically that means she desires to give me and receive from me Interesting Conversations and Laughs.  Indulging in Social/Recreational activities.  Lots of Physical affection.  There is Respect/Support/Flexability/Space between us and we work out any problems between us.  Thats Short Term.

 

In the long term.  Possible Marriage or Cohab after getting to know each other.  No kids.  or 1 if it happens.  

 

Whats your take?

[basil67]

My take is the same as I've given before:  You're spending an unhealthy amount of time in your own head dreaming about what it will be like.   Pretty much nothing in life turns out as we imagine it will, so stop living in your head and get out and live life.   See what comes at you.  

 

Edited March 23, 2020 by basil67

[Mysterio]

Living life to me is interacting with real people.  I am not a loner and I don't just not talk to people.  Corona has been a struggle for me.  I am not going out at this time due to the percussions that we all must adhere to.  I work in a hospital.  Corona in my city is being taken seriously.  

If I am not living life.  Then that means that I would have few friends and I would be at home all the time.  I still make good friends to this day.  Its that I don't feel like this side of my love  life should be this taxing.  

If l ask out a woman.  Unless she is with someone.  We should be able to go out.  No ghosting or excuses.  Its usually a dinner like cheap wings and Pop.  There is no heavy proclamation of love or trying to get her into bed.  I know I have to get out of my head.  Its just that my social environment sans Corona.  It feel like half the people are less sociable.  I am out.  More than I am in.  Nobody could just waltz up to my Condo block and come to see me without it being planned.  I do talk to people when I am out seeing bands.  Or if I take a Yoga class.

I have had friends that have plotted their life and pretty much things went their way.  Life is a mix of seeing what comes and making plans.  Its not really one of the other.  I am just curious to others experiences with Romantic Relationships.  Does it just work out.  Why do some of us have no problems connecting romantically.  Yet others do have Romantic Connection strife.  

 

If this was all about friends.  I have no problems for the most part.  It just works for me.  My other friends sometimes complain that they can't make friends.  I just don't get it.  I think if I was living in my head too much.  I would be saying more like the woman I meet has to be a certain race/height/weight/age.  

 

I hear you Basil.   I was just waning to see what others were experiencing.  For me.  I guess I don't like how when I make the effort.  Nothing major happens.  Yet is a woman likes me.  She would at least in the short term, be able to go out with me.  Without me making things difficult.  If I go to a dinner that does not mean Sex and Heavy Love talk.  Its an outing with possible potential.  

[basil67]

Actually, you make a good point about Corona.  And socialising in general.   Getting out and being social is pretty much all going to be on hold till this is over.

52 minutes ago, Mysterio said:

If l ask out a woman.  Unless she is with someone.  We should be able to go out.  No ghosting or excuses.

Sorry, but this is just unrealistic.  A single woman may not want to date a guy for a huge variety of reasons varying from her own personal circumstance to how she feels about the guy.   And even if she does accept, she may also change or mind at the last minute and may or may not give a reason why.   

Wanting 0 or 1 child at your age is also unrealistic.  You're 49 - most women who're in your age group already have kids.  Or if you go younger, odds are that she will want kids.  And more than one.  Sure, you could reject an otherwise perfect woman because she has kids or wants kids quicker than your timeline, but then you'll be back single again and have lost a woman who may meet all your other needs.

This kind of unrealistic thought process is why I urge you to not indulge in fantasies.  

Edited March 23, 2020 by basil67

[basil67]

I wanted to clarify...when I say "live life", I mean to let life happen and not try to control it.  Don't let the curve ball pass you by - hit it and do great things with it.

My story: I'm a couple of years older than you.   It was 1992 and I was 25.  I had been separated from my ex-h for all of two months.  I was going to enjoy single life.  Date a bit.  Rebuild a friend group.   Learn to be single again.  But then I met a guy who was great company.  Not my type physically.  Not the right time.  But we hit it off.   I didn't want kids, but he did.  He was a party guy and I was an introvert.  The only things we had in common were loving the beach, food and sex.  Yet here we are, still together nearly 30 years later.   It took compromise on both our parts.   But both of us preferred to compromise than lose each other.  

If I had held rigidly to timelines and what my life with a partner would look like, I wouldn't be with this wonderful man or have our great kids.  Romance never goes to plan.

[chillii]

l'm a bit older than you and was married. But later n single again l found there were still quite a few women around late 30s ,  40s , still hoping to have kids, one older hoping to adopt if she couldn't have one. l mean most have yeah but not all and some still hope too. My sister got preg at 45 , her h was 59 , they've been very happy. and have a beautiful little family., ps , actually their daughters a model now..

As far as the rest , just sounds like a natural start give or take , to good relationships to me . lf your keen on each other there's none of the other bs l mean you both want this . All that other crap is just no bodies, so many round here seem to just waste time on just no body anybodies .

Edited March 23, 2020 by chillii

[chillii]

But yeah , ya can't plan or thinks it's gonna or will be this or that , it could be anything. Nothing wrong with knowing what your looking for though , that's smart.

[basil67]

Having flexible plans are the key.  It's like how every parents has all these plans about how they will raise baby and then reality kicks in.   Flexibility is the key to life

[basil67]

Argh grammar ^   Sorry.

[chillii]

13 hours ago, basil67 said:

Argh grammar ^   Sorry.

Not forgiven , go and stand in the corner for 2 days.

[chillii]

kidden

[preraph]

"If l ask out a woman.  Unless she is with someone.  We should be able to go out.  No ghosting or excuses. "

I hope you didn't mean that the way it sounds.  Because it sounds like if a woman is single, she ought to have to go out with whoever asks her out, whether she wants to or not!

[RecentChange]

On 3/22/2020 at 10:24 PM, basil67 said:

My take is the same as I've given before:  You're spending an unhealthy amount of time in your own head dreaming about what it will be like.   Pretty much nothing in life turns out as we imagine it will, so stop living in your head and get out and live life.   See what comes at you.  

 

THIS. I have said it before as well.

"Romantic relationship expectations"? Honestly not something I have ever thought about, day dreamed about nor crafted in my head what it should look like. 

I am a here and now in the present kind of person. I was when I was young, I am now.

I never once imagined what my dream guy would look like, nor what kind of looks he would give me, nor how our conversation would flow etc.

[Mysterio]

On 3/24/2020 at 3:42 PM, preraph said:

"If l ask out a woman.  Unless she is with someone.  We should be able to go out.  No ghosting or excuses. "

I hope you didn't mean that the way it sounds.  Because it sounds like if a woman is single, she ought to have to go out with whoever asks her out, whether she wants to or not!

This is the way I am thinking.  I see a woman or she is put into my hemisphere so to speak.  I engage her in conversation.  Once we have a repore with each other.  If she is single.  I ask her out for Lunch/Dinner.  Not some expensive resturant.  Just a place where we can talk.  If she is attached.  She would decline me.  If she is single.  I don't see why she would say no.  She can say no and decline.  I won't pry beyond that.  I guess I see myself as casual and chill.  Nothing is going to happen beyond us having a meal and talking.  No Sex or heavy duty proclamations of love towards her on my part.  

I guess I always thought that going out should be easy.  So for me.  Its going out for dinner/talk is whats would lead into dating.  I don't see why a woman that I have a repore with, would be anxious.  Now if I said lets go Hiking/Beach off the bat.  Thats a time consuming activity that one can't just get out of.  Dinner and talking is about an Hour and a half at best.  I am at the point where I don't understand Dating.  

 

Once again it feels like women around me are way more lacklustre about going out.  I can't pick the right ones and have them happy that I asked them out.  It always feels like a struggle.  I don't bring ups Sex and heavy commitment.  Its talking about our worlds.  What do you think about this and that.  No heavy vibes from me towards them.  Even if I do like them in a romantic way.  Anything like dating them is off by at least outing #5.

 

Any women can decline me, but I don't get why any would do so if we have a repore and she knows me a little bit.  Yet even if we go out.  Most it could ever be is like a cheap dinner date for one hour and thirty minutes from start to finish.  If she has the time.  

 

What am I missing?  I am going with the flow.  No Sex or Heavy duty romantic commitment.  If your on Tinder.  Its not to make new friends.  I am talking with a girl right now.  The other one flaked.  

 

[basil67]

It's 'rapport'

I agree that you're much more likely to get a 'yes' once a rapport has been built.  But despite knowing the theory, it's not working for you.  At what point does dating a new woman break down?   Are you getting first dates?   

If you can't get past the first few dates, have you ever asked any of the women why?   

My only other thing to add is that you don't come across as casual and chill to me.  You've got lots of rules, expectations and timelines about how you would conduct a relationship and it sounds all a bit uptight.

Edited March 26, 2020 by basil67

[Mysterio]

Ok.  I have been corrected about the spelling of Rapport.  Thank you for that sincerely.  Some words I spell out phonetically.  The T is silent.  

So I want to make things clear.  I am not standing by some woman and then asking her out, from the first time I lay eye on her.  Its Conversation about whats going around us/what do you think about this and that.  The more she bats it back to me so to speak. The more I may feel inclined to ask her out.  If I make plans with her and she flakes.  To me it means that she thinks I like her romantically and if she is not into my physical looks.  I will get the flakey decline/ not getting back to me, when I am setting up our outing.

Whats your vibe about casual and chill.  When the women flake.  I don't verbalize my discontent.  All I think is that all we would be doing is spending time together, talking about our lives and what we think about this and that around us.  Thats it.  Over a meal.  I am not fawning over a woman and then playing fantasy BF/GF in my head.  At least 90% of the time.  

It amuses me that some people think that I am rigid about timelines and expectations.  Basil.  If you set me up on a Date with a woman, Corona free, that is say 39 to my 49.  Then you ask her how it went.  You should be hearing the following.  Mysterio and I met up.  He seems like a pleasant guy.  We talk about Greta Van Fleet sounding like Led Zeppelin.  If AC/DC are getting back together with singer Brian Johnson.  The Economy.  How Corona changed the world.  How are parents raised us.  Who are best friends are.  Where we would like to travel to.  Fave Movies.  Health regimes.  What books we are reading.  What if this happened to us.  How do we think we would react.  Thats what you will be hearing.  

 

I won't be saying to her.  We are going to be BF/GF by Nov 2020.  We will get engaged in 2022 and have kids in 2024 and be together until we pass into the next life.  She should cut her hair short and dye it Red and Blonde.  I guess that friendships and dating are different.  I don't think I am that rigid and uptight.  I do have a sort of timeline.  I am not going to be having kids and marriage with her until yr 2 a best.  We both have to vet each other.  I know that I posted  Romantic Relationship Expectations to head up this post.  I just wanted to gage peoples vibes about how there lives are.  

Right now  I still adhere to my Intermitten Fasting.  A co- worker who has not seen me in a while said I lost a  lot of weight.  I was around 220 for almost 10 yrs.  I crept up to that, because  I was not thinking about my eating habits.  I am not 192 lbs.  I should be in the 170's.  Like 175 lbs or so.  I am getting there slow and steady.  

 

My romantic expectation will be tempered by the type of woman I meet.  So I am not expecting to get my way totally.  Just my way enough where her and I are chill with each other.  LOL.

 

Edited March 26, 2020 by Mysterio

[preraph]

8 hours ago, Mysterio said:

This is the way I am thinking.  I see a woman or she is put into my hemisphere so to speak.  I engage her in conversation.  Once we have a repore with each other.  If she is single.  I ask her out for Lunch/Dinner.  Not some expensive resturant.  Just a place where we can talk.  If she is attached.  She would decline me.  If she is single.  I don't see why she would say no.  She can say no and decline.  I won't pry beyond that.  I guess I see myself as casual and chill.  Nothing is going to happen beyond us having a meal and talking.  No Sex or heavy duty proclamations of love towards her on my part.  

I guess I always thought that going out should be easy.  So for me.  Its going out for dinner/talk is whats would lead into dating.  I don't see why a woman that I have a repore with, would be anxious.  Now if I said lets go Hiking/Beach off the bat.  Thats a time consuming activity that one can't just get out of.  Dinner and talking is about an Hour and a half at best.  I am at the point where I don't understand Dating.  

 

Once again it feels like women around me are way more lacklustre about going out.  I can't pick the right ones and have them happy that I asked them out.  It always feels like a struggle.  I don't bring ups Sex and heavy commitment.  Its talking about our worlds.  What do you think about this and that.  No heavy vibes from me towards them.  Even if I do like them in a romantic way.  Anything like dating them is off by at least outing #5.

 

Any women can decline me, but I don't get why any would do so if we have a repore and she knows me a little bit.  Yet even if we go out.  Most it could ever be is like a cheap dinner date for one hour and thirty minutes from start to finish.  If she has the time.  

 

What am I missing?  I am going with the flow.  No Sex or Heavy duty romantic commitment.  If your on Tinder.  Its not to make new friends.  I am talking with a girl right now.  The other one flaked.  

 

A woman whether she is attached or not is only going to agree to go out with you if she has some physical attraction to you or already knows she likes your personality. Women do not just go out with random men just because they're unattached. They are not as desperate as men so they don't want to do that and we'll wait until there is one they're interested in. So your thinking is just wrong on that. you need to wait to ask a woman out until you think she has expressed some interest not solely because she isn't attached. That means nothing.

[Mysterio]

Desperate to me is a man that goes straight for sex and being heavy duty with a woman.  Thats thirsty and desperate.  I don't think that I am that way.  I like being cool about things.  Not hot on the box.  

 

[preraph]

That's fine but it's not going to change who will go out with you and who won't.

[Ellener]

15 hours ago, Mysterio said:

Any women can decline me, but I don't get why any would do so

that there.

There could be 101 reasons, some nothing to do with you, and in any case women don't need to explain themselves.

Go with the flow a bit more I'd say, especially as things are now when most people's plans and dreams have gone on hold and anxieties are high.

[basil67]

16 hours ago, Mysterio said:

 If I make plans with her and she flakes.  To me it means that she thinks I like her romantically and if she is not into my physical looks.

Or it may be that she feels she's not getting a sexual vibe from you.  Or with second thoughts, doesn't think there's adequate rapport.   Or something better came up.   

 

Quote

Whats your vibe about casual and chill.  When the women flake.  I don't verbalize my discontent.  All I think is that all we would be doing is spending time together, talking about our lives and what we think about this and that around us.  Thats it.  Over a meal.  I am not fawning over a woman and then playing fantasy BF/GF in my head.  At least 90% of the time.  

It amuses me that some people think that I am rigid about timelines and expectations.  Basil.  If you set me up on a Date with a woman, Corona free, that is say 39 to my 49.  Then you ask her how it went.  You should be hearing the following.  Mysterio and I met up.  He seems like a pleasant guy.  We talk about Greta Van Fleet sounding like Led Zeppelin.  If AC/DC are getting back together with singer Brian Johnson.  The Economy.  How Corona changed the world.  How are parents raised us.  Who are best friends are.  Where we would like to travel to.  Fave Movies.  Health regimes.  What books we are reading.  What if this happened to us.  How do we think we would react.  Thats what you will be hearing.  

You've listed a whole lot of things you'd talk about - but please tell me that you don't go in with an actual plan of what to talk about.  I'm sure you don't, but just checking.   Also you've previously mentioned rules about how quickly you'd move forward in a relationship...now this 39yo, it's likely her fertility clock is ticking loudly for a baby or two and not waiting too long.  Or perhaps she's got a child or two.  If you're both really into each other, will you be flexible?  

And I really really hope she doesn't walk away saying "He seems like a pleasant guy" because if she does, it's WELCOME TO THE FRIEND ZONE.  Pleasant is insipid.   "Oh, I guess he's pleasant" is what a woman says to her girlfriend when she's trying to find something positive to say about a guy she's thinking about dumping.

5 hours ago, Mysterio said:

Desperate to me is a man that goes straight for sex and being heavy duty with a woman.  Thats thirsty and desperate.  I don't think that I am that way.  I like being cool about things.  Not hot on the box.  

Rules and judgement.  Not a good look.   Sure, a woman who wants a relationship doesn't want a guy who only wants sex.  But she will want a guy who wants a relationship, can flirt and build sexual tension.   More than likely, she will wants sex with him after a few dates too.  Make no mistake, the guy who can do this is the guy who's winning the race.   Your approach is another route to FRIEND ZONE.   Also, what if she really likes you wants to take you home after the second date?

All is not lost though.  Identifying where you are going wrong is the key to making it go right.  

Edited March 26, 2020 by basil67

[Mysterio]

Basil.  Here are my Random thoughts.

I don't have a script in my head that I try to plug into a date.  The Sex vibe for me is may be what I am missing.  How do you create a Sex Vibe?  All I am thinking is that I hope that the woman and I that are going out.  There is a great vibe between us.  Getting to Sex will happen in time.  I am not thinking about trying to bed her.  It's there. Yet its number 8 on my list of connecting with her.  I just feel like coming on like gangbusters with the Sex Vibe will turn her off.  

I have a Friend named MK.  He and his wife waited for about 2 yrs before they did the deed.  He told me.  They are rock solid to this day.   I just don't think that the Women around me are thinking something like( When am I gonna get laid).  To me its Conversations that will lead to Sex and fun and the formation of a Romantic Relationship.  Not just Sex from the start.   I can't imagine meeting a woman when I am out and about.  Then interaction #3 us straight sex.  Maybe Interaction 8 with 6 weeks of dating.  

I want things to be smooth.  Even if it does not last.  I am not the man that is lets talk about sex and what we like and what not.  I am more.  What do you think about this and that.  Adding and Subtracting factors when it comes to situations that affect our lives.  

 

I want the woman to see me like this.  Mysterio is Cute and Sweet.  He can talk about personal conversations and I love turning his head upside down and challenging his views on life.  The woman is then reved up by that.  Then the Physical action comes into play.  My thing would be to meet a woman that is into seeing bands that we both love in the city and that's our starting point and she is into me physically.  I will admit I am in my head, but not in a scripted way.  

When I see my  Male friends with their Ladies.   I rarely see them flirting with their wives for the most part.  The men are very subdued and the women seem to like it that way for the most part. My Women friends are sort of the same.  I was very affectionate with my last GF.  So I am not a prude.  I have to rework how I go about myself with women.  Or at least stay out of friends zone.  So the future women I meet.  I can't hang and be chill.  I have to be more playful and flirtatious from the get go.  

 

I just feel like when I talk to women on Tinder or  just in general.  The Women come off as anything that leads to physical affection is a agitation.  I want a woman to actually have Interesting conversations and Laughs towards me.  That is a turn on for her towards me.  She then is attracted to me and it leads to lots of physical affection and we do Social and Recreational activities with each other.  Am I still in my Basil.  LOL.  No Timelines and rigid expectation in this last paragraph right.  LOL.

[chillii]

Man , any of the stuff your talking is just like anything else in any relationship , people are all different , there's no reason it has to be this or that in like all this stock standard crap and attitudes you read in forums , me and my woman would blow any of it completely out of the water , same with ex .  You try to find our like minded though , views and values and ways of looking at the world  , relationships , how you both like things to be. lt can be anything , however you both like things, you just gotta be on the same page is all and so you look for that someone that is.

Edited March 28, 2020 by chillii

[basil67]

17 hours ago, Mysterio said:

I don't have a script in my head that I try to plug into a date.  The Sex vibe for me is may be what I am missing.  How do you create a Sex Vibe?  All I am thinking is that I hope that the woman and I that are going out.  There is a great vibe between us.  Getting to Sex will happen in time.  I am not thinking about trying to bed her.  It's there. Yet its number 8 on my list of connecting with her.  I just feel like coming on like gangbusters with the Sex Vibe will turn her off.  

You don't create a sex vibe - it's more about you desiring her sexually and she desires you in return and the vibe will be there.   Generally speaking, women want to felt desired.    "Getting to Sex will happen in time" is more rules and plans.  Ditch the plan and go with the flow.   If you're sexually interested in her and she feels the same way for you, have sex.    Coming on gangbusters with a sex vibe will send her in the other direction if she's not into you.   But if she is into you, it will help secure you a place with her.

Quote

I have a Friend named MK.  He and his wife waited for about 2 yrs before they did the deed.  He told me.  They are rock solid to this day.   I just don't think that the Women around me are thinking something like( When am I gonna get laid).  To me its Conversations that will lead to Sex and fun and the formation of a Romantic Relationship.  Not just Sex from the start.   I can't imagine meeting a woman when I am out and about.  Then interaction #3 us straight sex.  Maybe Interaction 8 with 6 weeks of dating.  

You're right that the women around you aren't thinking of sex with you - that's because you don't show desire for them.  But I can guarantee there are other guys around who they would be interested in having sex with.   You say "To me, it's conversations and romantic relationship...not sex from the start...maybe Interaction 8 with 6 weeks of dating".  Again, more rules and plans.   How about go with the flow?  If you want to get out of the friendzone, you want to stop acting like a platonic friend.

Quote

I want things to be smooth.  Even if it does not last.  I am not the man that is lets talk about sex and what we like and what not.  I am more.  What do you think about this and that.  Adding and Subtracting factors when it comes to situations that affect our lives.  

FRIENDZONE.   A relationship starting out usually has all those complex factors plus sexual desire.

Quote

I want the woman to see me like this.  Mysterio is Cute and Sweet.  He can talk about personal conversations and I love turning his head upside down and challenging his views on life.  The woman is then reved up by that.  Then the Physical action comes into play.  

Cute and sweet = FRIENDZONE.  The woman is not revved up by this and physical action will not come into play.  You can argue the point with me, but I think your track record shows that generally speaking this theory doesn't work.

Quote

When I see my  Male friends with their Ladies.   I rarely see them flirting with their wives for the most part.  The men are very subdued and the women seem to like it that way for the most part. My Women friends are sort of the same.  I was very affectionate with my last GF.  So I am not a prude.  I have to rework how I go about myself with women.  Or at least stay out of friends zone.  So the future women I meet.  I can't hang and be chill.  I have to be more playful and flirtatious from the get go.  

Flirting is a subtle way to express sexual interest in someone we haven't yet made progress with.  This is why your male friends don't flirt with their partners - they don't need to because they are now in a relationship and having sex.      Yes, you absolutely need to be more playful and flirtatious from the get go.  But make no mistake, good flirting does have a sex vibe.  

Quote

I just feel like when I talk to women on Tinder or  just in general.  The Women come off as anything that leads to physical affection is a agitation.  I want a woman to actually have Interesting conversations and Laughs towards me.  That is a turn on for her towards me.  She then is attracted to me and it leads to lots of physical affection and we do Social and Recreational activities with each other.  Am I still in my Basil.  LOL.  No Timelines and rigid expectation in this last paragraph right.  LOL.

Sure, if a woman isn't into you, she will see talk of physical affection as an agitation.  But she's not into you, so it's no loss anyway.  But a woman who is open to you will put you in the friendzone if she doesn't feel you desire her sexually.    I do find interesting conversations and laughs to be a turn on to my husband, but that's because we had no sex barrier to start with.   If there had been no sex vibe, it would have been conversations and laughs with a friend.

Edited March 29, 2020 by basil67

[Mysterio]

I went out on a outing with a woman from my Buddhist Chanting group a long time ago.  There was a Funk boat cruise on our waterfront.  I had no romantic intentions toward her at all.  Just a Warm Friendship vibe.  We went on there and within an hour she told me she had a crush on me.  I was surprised.  So I went with he flow and made out with her.  After a couple of months we broke off.  We are still friends and I see her from time to time.  I guess to me.  I have this condition where to be overtly sexual is wrong in my head from the get go.  I do not feel that the women around me that I interact with.  Or see them interact with other men.  They don't come off to me as hot and bothered.  More Stoic.  

Not everyone is convertible with it comes to flirting.  Life is so dynamic.  When the woman I took to the Funk Boat.  It just came about that there was a romantic vibe and I was not even really thinking that.  When I go into the On-line thing or the real life situation of having a rapport.  There seems to be Hijinks involved.  Its never smooth.  

I am not overbearing.  I try to be lighthearted.  It almost feels like this to me.  A woman is sexually attracted to me.  Then things flow.  There is not sexual attraction.  It goes no where.  As I have said in the past.  If the woman likes me first and makes a move on me.  Things go our way with each other for a bit.  If I make the first move.  Its upside down at best.  In my head once a rapport is set up.  Going out should be no problem if they are un-attached.  Yes they can decline.  I don't see why a decline would happen.  Nothing heavy duty is going to happen on the outing.  Just Conversation of Lunch/Dinner.  No Sex or Romantic Proclamations towards her.  Maybe Date 4 it could happen.  

 

My attraction towards women are all over the place.  I don't think I have a set type.  I am more about conversation style than just straight to raw sex.  I want the physical to be brought through conversation.  I just can't imagine meeting a woman and having small talk and straight to sex.  

 

Edited March 30, 2020 by Mysterio